So apparently the Stalhrim Motif is a CS exclusive?

Number_51 · December 2016

Runs wrote: »

I just want to know what is going to be the standard cash to crown to gold conversion rate now that we can buy gold within the rules as opposed to outside of them.

i.e. what is the going rate for mimic stones in gold? I know one guildie is charging 10k gold per, but haven't seen any other mentions of it.

-edit to add... @biovitalb16_ESO this post is the connection to p2w

I did the conversion rates back when Grim Harlequin was released in the Crown Store. Crowns (for Mimic Stones) > USD$ > ESO Gold. I came up with something like 8k in game gold per mimic stone, so 10k for the additional mats/time sounds about right.

Ilsabet · December 2016

Troneon wrote: »

Also did you notice ZOS did NOT add achievements into the game for this motif unlike all others? Why? So they could not be accused of having Crown Store Exclusive In Game Achievements.....which would cross a whole other line....

This is an interesting point. We've seen how ZOS has avoided making achievements cash-shop-dependent, and many people who can excuse or justify things like cash-only motifs would be up in arms if achievements were tied to the spending of real money.

But one could just as easily argue that buying achievements is as meaningless as buying cosmetics. Dyes and titles are themselves cosmetic, after all, and achievement points don't get you anything other than an ego boost.

And yet you can't deny that there would be a special flood of outrage if ZOS were selling achievements via crown store purchases.

So where does the line get drawn? At what point does forcing people to spend real money on things they could obtain or achieve by playing the game become unacceptable?

Of course maybe this line of thought isn't that big a deal, considering that DLC achievements and their associated dyes, titles, and cosmetic rewards are already only available to those who pay. But I'd still like to know how many people who would object to achievements for $$$ have no such objection to crafting progression for $$$, and how they rationalize the difference.

ThePonzzz · December 2016

Motifs offer nothing but cosmetic looks. These cannot be classified as P2W. You win nothing. Status symbols for microtrans are the way of gaming these days.

ArchMikem · December 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

I still don't understand that logic either. ZOS could've made guar mounts be purchased anywhere in the Ebonheart Pact. The senche mounts be purchased anywhere in the Aldmeri Dominion. And the wolf mounts be purchasable anywhere in the Daggerfall Covenant.

The Dire Wolves are Colovian though, not Breton, Orc, or Redguard.

DHale · December 2016

I get that you don't like it. But falsifying the logic leap to pay to win when this horse does not go faster or do anything than any other horse in the game is ridiculous. You don't need the horse and it is a skin... cosmetic only.

magnusthorek · December 2016

OMG why some people can't understand that P2W is not ONLY something that will give direct advantage?

EVERYTHING that actively or passively gives some sort of advantage, like selling lots of Grimstones and making lots of money to buy tjose ultra-rare weapons from top traders if Rawl'kha or Deshaan, is P2W.

If you deny, 1) You're dumb or 2) You-re enjoying such benefit

DeadlyPhoenix · December 2016

bellanca6561n wrote: »

2. The crafting system of this game is too rudimentary to be inherently valuable. All it takes to achieve the highest crafting level is time. It's not Ultima Online with its complex crafting system, special, hard to obtain tools that - occasionally - add special bonuses, and crafting materials that have more than one property. Aside from alchemical reagents, crafting materials in this game have just one property: level.

And how much of a stretch would it be to have people doing dungeons for a chance at a special runic tool drop that could add a bonus, every [n] times it's used on an armor or jewelry piece in addition to the armor's existing set bonuses or altering an existing set bonus?

Sorry just gotta say, I played Ultima Online for over 15 years and the point in time you're referring to with runic hammer, bulk order deeds and the likes, is when the official game lost a lot of it's player base to free player ran servers. It was when EA bought them out and was a huge turning point for the game, albeit a bad one IMHO.

As far as p2w is and the Crown Store exclusive motifs, I believe it is p2w.

IMHO p2w is anything that allows a player who pays real money to advance quicker than someone who does not. ESO has been p2w since it went b2p with it's subscription allowing you more gold and xp. However it mainly just depends on the extent to which the person is given an advantage. The subscription is a very minor advantage.

Crown motifs on the other hand I think are already very p2w... Yes you can only get gold with them if you sell the stones or craft for people, but with that gold all items can be bought. It allows for them to gear up extremely quickly under the right circumstances selling for profit and buying gear/upgrade mats with the earnings.

For example, say a normal person has to grind for their gear/materials and it takes them an entire month(less or more for some people), selling the stones could take a few days at most if priced right. Allowing said person to gear up in a week vs. a month or more. Buying all of their gear and upgrade materials making it all legendary without working in game for it. Allowing them to advance quicker and spend time on other things while others are grinding away at either earning gold to buy items or gathering it themselves.

It is especially true for glitches with certain sets and such, excess money allowing you to gather these glitched or overpowered sets before others and abuse them for longer.

ESO isn't very p2w IMO and I have played tons of mmos that are. It does seem to be going down a very slippery slope all in the name of boosting sales though.

Love it or hate it, that's my 2 cents on p2w

*EDIT*

Also,I sub almost every month, own every DLC, have tons of cosmetic CS only items, such as costumes, mounts, a few pets, hairs, etc, and even the Grim motif. Simply because I am a crafter and don't want to miss out on any styles I can craft. I don't sell them, haven't sold a one, I craft for myself and my close friends since I am mostly a solo player. I support the game very much so, so I don't want free stuff, just no advantageous CS only items that allow for much quicker than average advancement for the more you spend.

acw37162 · December 2016

Every time I see a crown store motif I pop some popcorn and head to the forums.
It such a better class of complaining then wrobel balance, PVP issue of the week, or proc set posters.

Skcarkden · December 2016

itehache wrote: »

It is official though? Where did you read this?

(Cosmetics don't affect the gameplay it should not be considered pay to win, but yeah, it sucks if it becomes a trend to get crown store exclusive motifs)

It's not pay to win yet, but give it time.

Just as ZOS said they'll never do gamble boxes and lied, they say they'll never be pay to win, but they will.

It's called greed, even Runescape did this, they all do it. "We'll never do gambling", "okay so we'll now do gambling, but it'll only ever be something cosmetic only", "Okay so a lot of people are making topics screaming about the fact our latest gambling item has a really really OP item, and wish to know why we lied about only being cosmetic, Ya'll need to calm down, we just redefined what cosmetic means to 'look like a good deal' "

They all do this.

Even games you'd never expect, like destiny has gamble boxes and it's not really an MMO, it won't be long before they do powerful items too.

They. All. Do. They all say it won't be pay to win, then they start releasing exclusive items that can only be obtained via the gambling method they installed that have some actually use beyond looking nice.

AzuraKin · December 2016

Osteos wrote: »

Yep this is already known and I plan on buying it to! It's not p2w.

Also you can only get senche, wolf and Guar mounts in the crown store so you point doesn't hold a drop of water

actually it does, to be competitive crafter, one must know ALL motiffs.

dday3six · December 2016

And you're surprised by this?

Iluvrien · December 2016

dday3six wrote: »

And you're surprised by this?

Disappointed? Yes.

Surprised? No.

I can only speak for myself, but I really was hoping that ZOS (with Bethesda and the looming shadow of TES standing behind them) was going to be better than this. Too many cases where they used letter-of-the-law interpretations to sidestep player expectations (e.g. Adventurers vs. Explorers packs) have changed that view.

So no, not surprised. Disappointed.

Banana · December 2016

Ill be getting it. Although I'm still waiting on the transmog or whatever so I can change my stuff and use it. Maybe that will be in the next batch of thievery crates.

BenevolentBowd · December 2016

Sallington wrote: »

KriHavok wrote: »

What is your source of information for this being a CS exclusive?

Common sense.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2016/11/30/crown-store-showcase--november-30th-2016

"Crown Crafting Motif: Stalhrim Frostcaster Style
The Stalhrim Frostcaster Style will be available on all platforms for a limited time during the New Life Festival, from December 15 to January 4."

Enslaved · December 2016

What is next? Con crates exclusive motifs?

Lylith · December 2016

if i like a motif, i'll buy it.

i don't feel the need to collect them all, but craftable, visually pleasing armor is joy to put together.

Fodore · December 2016

It's not p2w, simply because this style has no advantage over anything else, it would be against the eula to sell superior things in cs that you can't get in game. This is purely cosmetic

altemriel · December 2016

code65536 wrote: »

Probably, yes...

And while I would like for it to be obtainable in-game, there are a lot of mitigating factors here:
These Holiday events include in-game cosmetics (for New Life, there's a hat and a costume), in-game recipes, in-game motifs (Hollowjack, Skinchanger), and in-game activities. All for free. Last Halloween, the only "celebration" were some time-limited Crown Store items. This year, they added a whole bunch of free in-game material instead.

The Grim Harlequin motif, which includes 54 mimic stones, costs 2200 crowns and is actually cheaper than buying 54 stones individually (2400 crowns). You can spin this as them cutting the stone cost by 200 and throwing in a free motif. It seems likely that Frostcaster will follow the same pattern.

One Tamriel is not a paid DLC, which means ZOS has no paid DLC income for the 4th quarter.

wait, 2 quarters, no?

last was Shadow of Hist
then 1T
then housing
then again paid dls probably, right? (Vvanderfell or Clockwork City, or Spiralskein)

altemriel · December 2016

Magicka_DK wrote: »

This is just sad if thats the case. Slowly adding more and more exclusives to the game when you promised things obtaining In CS would be obtainable in game. I am very close to quitting as I feel this game game slowly progress into a P2W game that requires me to pay $50 to enter cyrodil and month.

Edit: Learn to read never did I say this sas P2W I said I feel its slowly progressing there step by step. Wont be too long until Mats are sold in the store

well, let`s hope that that time will never come, when ZOS would completely screw up and kill this game, if they would make it pay to win (adding mats to crown store). they have many times declared, that crown store will be cosmetic stuff ONLY, so let`s hope they keep their words

Kaizokugari · December 2016

Sorry to bring this one back from the dead, but since the New Life holiday has officialy arrived, is the Stalhrim one available in game or in store only?

Stopnaggin · December 2016

Kaizokugari wrote: »

Sorry to bring this one back from the dead, but since the New Life holiday has officialy arrived, is the Stalhrim one available in game or in store only?

Store only, frostcaster is the in game one

Recremen · December 2016

Kaizokugari wrote: »

Sorry to bring this one back from the dead, but since the New Life holiday has officialy arrived, is the Stalhrim one available in game or in store only?

Store only. Skinchanger is the one you can get from the event. It only comes with 5 Mimic Stones, too, so it's not like the Grim Harlequin deal.

Stopnaggin · December 2016

Recremen wrote: »

Kaizokugari wrote: »

Sorry to bring this one back from the dead, but since the New Life holiday has officialy arrived, is the Stalhrim one available in game or in store only?

Store only. Skinchanger is the one you can get from the event. It only comes with 5 Mimic Stones, too, so it's not like the Grim Harlequin deal.

Yeah what he said I don't know why I said frostcaster