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No idea why people find exploration enjoyable in eso

Prof_Bawbag
Prof_Bawbag
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Don't get me wrong, there are many places to see and many things to do, but as soon as you wander off the beaten path you're constantly tripping up over hostile npcs or creatures. It actually puts me right off spending any great amount of time veering off the path when I'm going from A to B.

Oblivion suffered with the same issue as did FO3 to a lesser extent, but I thought things improved greatly in both FO4 and Skyrim regarding clusters of enemies. I love combat as much as the next person, but when you're constantly running into enemies every 2ft, it soon becomes a chore rather than fun. The enemies aren't challenging, just annoying. Especially when they follow you for miles just because you haven't stopped and hit them with some inane spell/skill so they leave you alone.
  • AzuraKin
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    and your point is? couple seconds of aoe and 80% of mobs are dead if you have the proper build(s)
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  • Asardes
    Asardes
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    It's normal to have more enemies in ESO, compared to single player games, because there are more people who can kill them. If the density and spawn rate was the same as those, the world would be empty in a couple of hours.
    Beta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
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    Fendar Khodwin | 50 Redguard Sorcerer | DC AR 20 |
    Surilanwe of Lillandril | 50 High Elf Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
    Joleen the Swift | 50 Redguard Templar | DC AR 20 |
    Draynor Telvanni | 50 Dark Elf Warden | EP AR 20 |
    Claudius Tharn | 50 Necromancer | DC AR 20 |
    Nazura-la the Bonedancer | 50 Necromancer | AD AR 20 |

    Tharkul gro-Shug | 50 Orc Dragonknight | DC AR 4 |
    Ushruka gra-Lhurgash | 50 Orc Sorcerer | AD AR 4 |
    Cienwen ferch Llywelyn | 50 Breton Nightblade | DC AR 4 |
    Plays-with-Sunray | 50 Argonian Templar | EP AR 4 |
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  • Prof_Bawbag
    Prof_Bawbag
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    Asardes wrote: »
    It's normal to have more enemies in ESO, compared to single player games, because there are more people who can kill them. If the density and spawn rate was the same as those, the world would be empty in a couple of hours.

    I fully appreciate that, but almost everyone I have seen just run past those creatures/npcs. They're wasted. I don't mind a higher number of enemies out in the wilderness for the reasons you have given, but at the same time, do we really need a cluster of enemies every 2ft? When you're running over the same path for the 20th time and can't get on your mount because some enemy is still aggro'd miles away, it's annoying, then you run into more and more.
  • Necrelios
    Necrelios
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    Weird, I was just wondering the other day if they actually thinned some of the mobs out in some areas. You get into some zones like Malal Tor or Greenshade and it can be hard to find mobs. Wrothgar is nice for exploring, the mobs are always in the same places and have good clearance around them so you can mostly avoid them if you want.
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  • Prof_Bawbag
    Prof_Bawbag
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    AzuraKin wrote: »
    and your point is? couple seconds of aoe and 80% of mobs are dead if you have the proper build(s)

    Oh please "proper builds". This isn't a vet dungeon we're on about, it's overland skeevers etc. I'd rather focus my build on something more specific that actually warrants the time and effort.
  • RoyalPink06
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    Agree with OP, but that's probably because at this point in time I am currently questing with a new character in Shadowfen and I am sooooooo sick to death of crocodiles. Can't get anywhere fast in Shadowfen because of them.

    But I do get the reasoning behind having so many enemies to fight.
    NA PS4
  • Asardes
    Asardes
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    They could make fewer enemies, but tougher. For example in stead of 3 wolves with 15K health that hit for 2K to have a wolf with 50K health that hits for 5K health and has some special attacks.
    Beta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
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    Veronique Nicole | 50 Breton Templar | DC AR 20 |
    Sabina Flavia Cosades | 50 Imperial Warden | EP AR 20 |
    Ervesa Neloren | 50 Dark Elf Dragonknight | EP AR 20 |
    Fendar Khodwin | 50 Redguard Sorcerer | DC AR 20 |
    Surilanwe of Lillandril | 50 High Elf Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
    Joleen the Swift | 50 Redguard Templar | DC AR 20 |
    Draynor Telvanni | 50 Dark Elf Warden | EP AR 20 |
    Claudius Tharn | 50 Necromancer | DC AR 20 |
    Nazura-la the Bonedancer | 50 Necromancer | AD AR 20 |

    Tharkul gro-Shug | 50 Orc Dragonknight | DC AR 4 |
    Ushruka gra-Lhurgash | 50 Orc Sorcerer | AD AR 4 |
    Cienwen ferch Llywelyn | 50 Breton Nightblade | DC AR 4 |
    Plays-with-Sunray | 50 Argonian Templar | EP AR 4 |
    Milariel | 50 Wood Elf Warden | AD AR 4 |
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  • Glaiceana
    Glaiceana
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    I really enjoy exploring in this game actually. The mobs are only a problem, I find, when I have accidentally pulled them and maybe not realised, which causes me to get interupted in some way, like picking up a node. But if I am not collecting things at all and doing pure exploration, it's extremely easy to just keep running on your mount around the mobs or even through them when you have no choice to go around. They will never catch up and eventually retreat. :)
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  • Iselin
    Iselin
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    Compared to many other MMOs the mob density in ESO is actually on the thin side. You should try some Korean grinders if you really want to see thick densities.
  • Elsonso
    Elsonso
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    AzuraKin wrote: »
    and your point is? couple seconds of aoe and 80% of mobs are dead if you have the proper build(s)

    Even if you have an "average" build that does 5000-15000 DPS during an encounter, most wilderness encounters are non-deadly and take only a few seconds to complete.
    The enemies aren't challenging, just annoying. Especially when they follow you for miles just because you haven't stopped and hit them with some inane spell/skill so they leave you alone.

    So, don't run past them.

    I have spent most of my game time in the wilderness studying various harvest nodes. There are only a few reasons why I bother to get close to some monster.

    1. It is too much work to go around them
    2. They are guarding something I want
    3. I am looking for what they are carrying.

    I don't kill for XP. I kill for what they are foolish enough to be dragging around with them. Someday, they will learn not to carry such valuable stuff.

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  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    AzuraKin wrote: »
    and your point is? couple seconds of aoe and 80% of mobs are dead if you have the proper build(s)

    That's not the point. The point is, it takes only waving your hand to get rid of a fly that's humming around your ears. But if that fly comes back every ten seconds, you can't concentrate on whatever it is you're actually doing. That's how overland trash mobs feel in ESO.

  • lagrue
    lagrue
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    The enemies aren't challenging, just annoying. Especially when they follow you for miles just because you haven't stopped and hit them with some inane spell/skill so they leave you alone.

    All of this. I actually don't mind destroying the mobs I come across - very little inconvenience and free XP - so that doesn't hurt my exploration.

    The second part though is so true... nothing is more stupid than trying to flee in this game. Enemies will walk halfway across the world to hit you once or so you hit them once - they have literally no sense of disengaging and I've complained about it since Day 1 of this game. There should be reasonable limits - if the enemy gets more than 25m out of their spawn area, they should go back on their own.

    Too many times have I lost resources or chests because an enemy was following me - and I had no idea - only to be hit mid-interaction and have another player scoop in to steal the good? And the worst part? I can't even punish and kill the enemy because they run away! It's pathetic.
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  • Rune_Relic
    Rune_Relic
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    The most annoying part for me is....
    ..you see a book...get attacked....kill the mobs...start reading a book....get one sentence before attacked again..read another sentence.
    ..then just say...you know what....never mind reading the damn book !

    So yeah I can appreciate exactly where @Prof_Bawbag is coming from.

    There is a place and a time for everything.
    The time for combat is not always the time for exploring and they often conflict with each other.

    Personally the first thing I did in wrothgar was just sit next to a waterfall.
    Listened to the wind whistling.
    Watched the leaves blowing around and the squirrels hopping between logs.
    Some moments are so precious.....then someone shouts...'oy! dinner!'...or you get smacked over the head by an NPC some other player thought you should meet personally.

    We need the "look of death" passive/aggresive.
    No NPC would be stupid enough to attack you unless you give them no choice.
    Effect scales with experience + NPC danger level.
    Edited by Rune_Relic on November 14, 2016 2:08PM
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  • DRXHarbinger
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    They should just have the perk from FO and Skyrim that makes animals etc non hostile. With the DB passive you get a lot less aggro from them but it's painfully annoying at times...tries to loot enchanting node...oh look another harpy wants me to skin it...
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  • Dark_Claw
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    Skyrim's dragons are more annoying than any of the enemies in ESO, Oblivion or Fallout 3. At least in those games you're safe once you enter a settlement.
  • NewBlacksmurf
    NewBlacksmurf
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    It's an MMO server so the idea is to allow content spread all around with interesting situations, sites as well as beneficial and hidden opportunities.

    The game allows for a great deal of role playing and for adventurers to escape the hustle and bustle of the beaten path.

    Many who like to explore like me are always looking for something that's out of place or just cool.
    It's what makes content quality vs rails.

    People like large sandboxes so this is not really a large sandbox but it gives that feel
    Edited by NewBlacksmurf on November 14, 2016 3:02PM
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  • ItsGlaive
    ItsGlaive
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    Used to at least enjoy exploring delves, in VR zones you'd often have it to yourself so it'd feel genuinely like a skyrim delve, now with One Tamriel, that never happens.

    Please ZOS, make those instanced, people could still go in with friends in a group etc, but it'd bring back the feeling of discovering and exploring a long-abandoned cave or barrow.
    Allow cross-platform transfers and merges
  • idk
    idk
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    @Prof_Bawbag

    Really not sure if the point your trying to make. Is it you hate that wayshrines do not get your closer to your destination or that it's such an inconvenience to kill some trash mobs on the way.

    Just ride past the trash mobs and Your fine as long as you have some stam on your horse.
  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    @Prof_Bawbag

    Really not sure if the point your trying to make. Is it you hate that wayshrines do not get your closer to your destination or that it's such an inconvenience to kill some trash mobs on the way.

    Just ride past the trash mobs and Your fine as long as you have some stam on your horse.

    That's not the point either. It's not about going from point A to point B quicker or more conveniently. It's about discovery and immersion. Relaxed, looking for details. That's best done on foot - even walking. Quick respawning trash mobs everywhere are a hindrance to that kind of discovery and immersion, and what you suggest is not an adequate solution, unfortunately.

  • Narvuntien
    Narvuntien
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    I don't know I just murder all the mobs or sneak past... it certainly a little inconvient. Its not terrible but a noticable hinderance to my exploring.

    I think I just like exploring so much I'll take a little inconvience sometimes.
  • Prof_Bawbag
    Prof_Bawbag
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    @Prof_Bawbag

    Really not sure if the point your trying to make. Is it you hate that wayshrines do not get your closer to your destination or that it's such an inconvenience to kill some trash mobs on the way.

    Just ride past the trash mobs and Your fine as long as you have some stam on your horse.

    As the person above me stated, it's not about that. It's about taking in your surroundings, exploration etc (after all that's what exploration is all about). You can't do that if you're busy collecting mobs to kill or running into another cluster a step or two further on. I don't mind enemies, it's just the sheer amount of scattered enemies kinda takes any immersion out of exploration. In fact, that's my point, I don't want to just get to A to B quickly, I would like to explore, but it becomes a pain after the umpteenth skeever, troll or npc in quick succession.

    I know this is an MMO and not a single player game and I fully appreciate as others have pointed out, that there has to be mobs due to the very nature of the game, but a happy medium could be struck. That's why they changed things up in Skyrim because Oblivion was teeming with enemies everywhere you went which in turn ruined the exploration.
    Edited by Prof_Bawbag on November 14, 2016 4:00PM
  • Asardes
    Asardes
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    With fully trained riding and retreating maneuver I barely notice the trash mobs. I'm more in danger of accidentally falling from a cliff than being caught and killed by the mobs I'm skipping.
    Beta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
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    Draynor Telvanni | 50 Dark Elf Warden | EP AR 20 |
    Claudius Tharn | 50 Necromancer | DC AR 20 |
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    Tharkul gro-Shug | 50 Orc Dragonknight | DC AR 4 |
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  • Uriel_Nocturne
    Uriel_Nocturne
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    Different strokes for different folks, OP.

    I can't fathom how anyone could enjoy any type of PvP in an MMO, but they do, and that's their prerogative.

    Myself? I love the exploration and Questing in MMO's, so that's what I do in ESO.

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  • Prof_Bawbag
    Prof_Bawbag
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    Different strokes for different folks, OP.

    I can't fathom how anyone could enjoy any type of PvP in an MMO, but they do, and that's their prerogative.

    Myself? I love the exploration and Questing in MMO's, so that's what I do in ESO.

    @Uriel_Nocturne I love exploration too and not a huge fan of PvP either. In fact, Since I've began playing eso 2 years ago, I have never had any character over the rank of volunteer. It's what i would love to do to, but after the 2nd or 3rd character, the spread of enemies just off the main paths become tiresome. Especially so because they follow you for long distances unless you deal with them as and when you stumble upon them, which would be every 3 or 4 seconds in a lot of areas. I'm not against huge clusters of enemies, but there seems to be clusters everywhere with one or two exceptions. For example, most of Coldharbor is fine because you're not tripping up over enemies at every turn, whereas you can't move 2ft in the likes of Reaper's March for Scorpions, skeevers, Wisps, Trolls, Ogres, those annoying things with wings and a host of other enemies.
  • Lightninvash
    Lightninvash
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    I mean without enemies the game would be boring. Wandering around aimlessly is not super fun as is without any enemies it is like FO4 and granted fun but I wish there were more random encounters with enemies like in ESO.
  • Rouven
    Rouven
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    (...) things with wings (...)

    Love it!

    Thus far I'm not annoyed with the mob density yet. I found the aggro range to be acceptable. I however do like scanning for material nodes, hidden caves - chests etc and the odd damsel in distress.

    The mobs following you around forever is annoying though.
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  • DeadlyRecluse
    DeadlyRecluse
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    I just want mobs to not aggro if I've already started interacting with a node or chest.
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  • ItsGlaive
    ItsGlaive
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    I think I get what OP is trying to say. Part of the problem is that while each zone map is a decent size, they're all rammed-to-bursting with mobs and other stuff. There's no distance between anything, so no feeling of discovery (similar to skyrim) where you wander into a wood and come across a REMOTE tower or shack or something, because nothing in this game is really remote.
    Allow cross-platform transfers and merges
  • lagrue
    lagrue
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    Xabien wrote: »
    I think I get what OP is trying to say. Part of the problem is that while each zone map is a decent size, they're all rammed-to-bursting with mobs and other stuff. There's no distance between anything, so no feeling of discovery (similar to skyrim) where you wander into a wood and come across a REMOTE tower or shack or something, because nothing in this game is really remote.

    I think it's a matter of how you perceive the scale of the game. What you say is true - but on the reverse, some of prefer that more crammed map as opposed to Skyrim's.

    Now don't get me wrong, I loved Skyrim and exploring - but there was times where it felt like I wasn't exploring, it felt like I was wandering empty wilderness with nothing to show for it. Atleast in ESO I know I won't go more than 60 seconds without doing something. ESO gives me the illusion that I'm discovering "more" - when realistically each zone has the roughly the same amount of content as Vanilla skyrim - it's just you can burn through it that little bit faster than you would in Skyrim.
    "You must defeat me every time. I need defeat you only once"
  • TheSeer
    TheSeer
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    “Focus on the journey, not the destination. Joy is found not in finishing an activity but in doing it.” - Greg Anderson

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