Biro123 wrote: »

I'm still enjoying PVP. Ball groups running multiple destro staff ulti's are what rules out there at the mo. Proc sets come second imho. They allow you to play dodgeball and have a chance at taking on the odd straggler before their TS buds turn around and roll over you. They certainly don't rule in open PVP - the only time they give a big advantage is in those rare instances where you catch someone alone who isn't running an up-to-date PVP build.

But it procs just happens to be the main BiS option for solo PVPers (and duellers I guess), and anyone who PVPs a lot is gonna go for whatever is current BiS.
It's nothing new for MMO's, gear evolves every few releases and those who get the new stuff have an advantage over those who don't.

You're right though, the random nature of the procs is terrible - for both the user and the victim. I kind of think they would be much better if procs were for a much, much lower amount but tied with another, smallish 5-piece bonus.

But consider this though - you got hit by Selene and Viper and see the difference between a burst you could vs couldn't have survived. Without these sets, there would likely have been clever alchemist/spriggarns thorns or something instead, making the poison injection/ambush/incap (and follow-up dawnbreaker etc.) hit considerably harder. Not saying that means the procs weren't the difference between life/death - but perhaps they are not quite as big a difference as many ppl think?

I went with the times and now run a proc build. I cannot touch the ball groups except from range (no procs - i'm not abusing poison enchants there) or if they get broken up. I still bump into tank that I can't scratch. I get a lot of fairly even (and often not quick) 1v1 fights with those who have built to cope with the new meta. I can still die very quickly to a gank if not buffed/actively defending (despite hvy armour/decent healthpool). Its VERY VERY rare I win against more than one opponent. It all seems about right balance-wise. Its just about building in enough survivability to cope with the possible proc burst and knowing that it aint gonna hit you for another 4 seconds and during that time their damage is lower than it would otherwise have been.

As I say - not a great fan of the proc mechanics, but I don't think its broken. Mag/Stam - there's definite differences there, but not all one-way. As per the ball-groups, magicka currently excels at organised AOE spam, stamina excels at single-target. Not sure I like the way they appear to be becoming polarised into those roles/playstyles though.

Alucardo wrote: »

Curragraigue wrote: »

How do you stop one shot PvP and get fights to last longer? Get everyone in heavy to lower damage and increase resistances and make the win or lose based on RNG'esus. #HeavyProcsOnline

I think that's what I'm doing wrong. I'm still living in the past and running medium armor. I need to get with the times and throw on some black rose.

Mayrael wrote: »

Not being able to 1vX is rly good sign of balance, but this state was achieved long time before proc sets online (no tanking 10 ppl without fighting back isnt 1vX).

Youre right in many points, I can respect your arguments as there is much logic in them, but there are some points that you miss. The biggest issues with proc sets like tremorscale/viper/widowmaker are that:
1. They dont scale with your resource pools and damage stats so you can totaly frack that stats and your proc sets will still do the job while you can upgrade your defences.
2. They stack and even proc of each other so they can be easly used to build unnatural burst (trust me that lethal arrow procing enachant which proc viper is broken enough, if you add to this tremorscale and widowmaker... I used this kind of setups and I feel bad about it, like I would exploiting or smth, its just not fair to kill someone who cant even defend him self)


Its not true that stam users are weaker in terms of aoe (my stam sorc with deadly cloak, hrricane and steel tornado can kill groups of mobs way faster than my mag sorc with overload HA or that super expensive destro ult), what we are its because most of us prefer quick vs 1 burst, which is more eficient in duels and smal scale pvp. Zergballs vs Zergballs are not fun if you have no TS.

Biro123 wrote: »

sodantokb16_ESO wrote: »

Spriggan vs avg medium armor is probably like 10% dmg increase. Even with selene running (but no viper) that would be around 2k dmg bonus in that death log. Viper hit for twice that. Most sets offering some bonuses like raw dmg, penetration, +% dmg are offering much less than proc damage

True, but the point is that Viper would do nothing for the next 4 seconds, while spriggarn would still benefit all other attacks in that period. I'm not arguing that its better than viper, cos I don't think it is - I just think that if you can deal with the burst, then the gap isn't as big as people make out.