What do people have against an AOE taunt?

kojou · October 2016

I could have been talked into having a AoE taunt ultimate for the Sword and Shield line. That way you would have it in a clutch situation if you really needed it, but wouldn't be able to spam it repeatedly and do nothing else. I would still probably slot War Horn and Magma Shell though.

All in all, it is not needed. There are only a few situations when I would even want it. For most battles you want to pick and choose what you are taunting, and for the trials where you need two tanks it would be undesirable to use anyway.

Now if you petition to lower the cost of Inner Fire/Inner Rage I will be 100% behind you.

Tan9oSuccka · October 2016

nordsavage wrote: »

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

The reason is that most tanks don't need it because they now what to control and when to control it. Also, if a tank had everything focused on it, the healer's job would be harder since now they have to keep the tank topped up repeatedly instead of making sure everyone is ok and assisting with the DPS. Also, the DPS need to learn not stand around so damn much and an AoE taunt does nothing to get them moving. It's not that would make tanking easier in all situations, it will make the jobs of the group members harder.

Unfounded, untrue and if this is your case as a tank or healer you are fit for neither role. I can hold it all and not bleed rivers.

I agree with you. I have two tanks, and I prefer when the healer and DD's aren't moving around like idiots.

Stay behind me, and keep out of AOE's. Enemies that aren't yet taunted will usually go after the shiny thing closest to them. I don't think that's the best place for a 13K health mage.

Yamenstein · October 2016

It's not the tanks job to taunt everything. If someone is giving you crap then please direct them to the forums so we can tell them that they are crap. Have a good day.

Woeler · October 2016

pronkg wrote: »

Tanking is already very easy.

If you think holding agro and blocking is tanking, yes that's very easy. You're also very simple minded.

Barbet · October 2016

aoe taunt would bore me to tears

notimetocare · October 2016

TheAngelofDeath99 wrote: »

It would be incredibly useful to us tanks. Allot of times we get hated on for someone getting killed, well you know what would solve this? An aoe taunt, so you wouldn't have to worry about getting killed as much. When you're facing a large group of mobs, we cannot simply puncture or inner fire each enemy. An aoe taunt would solve this issue. Another thing for those worried it would make tanking easier than it is, it would have a high cost. I'm not saying make it an ultimate, it's cost should be like that of rapid maneuver or purge.

Simple version:
AoE taunt is skillless gameplay.
AoE taunts are uninteresting.
AoE taunts are pointless in the gameplay style of this game.
AoE taunts would only be useful to the hyper-bad casuals for 5 seconds before they died because everything was hitting them.

Elijah_Crow · October 2016

I prefer the game as designed, without an AOE taunt. I'm very glad the trinity is alive and well in ESO, but that doesn't mean it has to play like SWTOR or WOW, etc.

With the ability to spam your single target taunt without a cool down, this makes game play for tanks very active. It also prevents DPS from being complete glass cannons in challenging content. I prefer game play where people play roles, however I think that to some extent it's fine for people to be responsible for their own dodging, healing, control, or other avoidance.

efster · October 2016

An AOE taunt would be useless in places like vet SO and vet MoL, so you're asking for a skill that would have zero utility in end-game content; there are already enough skills like that in the game tbh. If people die when you do everything right, that's their issue, not yours; them blaming you still doesn't make it your issue.

What I do wish they'd fix is for tab-target to actually work when I am targeting a Dreadstalker and Rakkhat decides to zoom into LoS with his enormous hitbox.

Medakon · October 2016

Been playing tank since day one of the release, tanked many years in other mmos. One of my biggest struggels in this game was to figure out how agro system worked. But after a while you get used to it, and managed to hold 90%+ of the mobs in packs while doing dungeons. However, due to recent update 12, I wouldnt mind seeing some kind of aoe taunt, maybe make it a set bonus? boss mask? if you use single target taunt it automaticly sends impulse taunting everything 10m of you?

Reason for this is Darkshade caveran 2, with the tentacle boss. It has a massiv spawn rate, and most of the time damage dealers has to low damage output, ending up with 20-40adds running around, pretty hard trying to controll all of these while trying to kite boss. So.. wouldnt mind seeing some kind of aoetaunt in the near future.

EDIT:typo

illuminousflux · October 2016

50k health blazing shield templar tanks actually do really well with lots of things attacking them, in my experience.

idk · October 2016

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

On my nightblade tank, you can kind of AOE taunt using caltrops, and path into puncture/power extract.

I wouldn't mind having a true AOE taunt. There's quite a few Pug damage dealers that get pretty butthurt if trash mobs touches them.

Just the other day, an DC Pug whisper stalked me wanting to "meet in Cyrodiil" because he died and it was my fault.

His death was probably his fault. Personal responsibility is primary in this game.

Everyone can move while using almost all skills in this game and everyone can block to greatly reduce the damage one takes.

It's his this game was designed. It's his this game is intended to be played.

Zero need to an AoE taunt in this game and no one has provided a worthy justification for adding one. Fortunately the Devs do not want the game played with an AoE taunt so no worries about it being added.

Liofa · October 2016

I think an AOE taunt would be useful . We can understand quicker when tank is bad . If AOE taunt gets implemented , I also want a scrubfilter addon that kicks the tank when he uses the AOE taunt . This way , everyone can be happy !

NewBlacksmurf · October 2016

Ppl most often can only see things one way and those persons are very adverse to change.

Technically there's nothing wrong other than ppl hearing it and trying to make it what they can only think of vs realizing there are many other opportunities that have the ability to vastly improve this functionality that to be honest....is silly coneidering how different combat is in this game as well as healing and any trinity roles.

Tan9oSuccka · October 2016

Medakon wrote: »

Been playing tank since day one of the release, tanked many years in other mmos. One of my biggest struggels in this game was to figure out how agro system worked. But after a while you get used to it, and managed to hold 90%+ of the mobs in packs while doing dungeons. However, due to recent update 12, I wouldnt mind seeing some kind of aoe taunt, maybe make it a set bonus? boss mask? if you use single target taunt it automaticly sends impulse taunting everything 10m of you?

Reason for this is Darkshade caveran 2, with the tentacle boss. It has a massiv spawn rate, and most of the time damage dealers has to low damage output, ending up with 20-40adds running around, pretty hard trying to controll all of these while trying to kite boss. So.. wouldnt mind seeing some kind of aoetaunt in the near future.

EDIT:typo

Well said. The Netch boss really shows how good your damage dealers are.

notimetocare · October 2016

illuminousflux wrote: »

50k health blazing shield templar tanks actually do really well with lots of things attacking them, in my experience.

You mean the tanks that run out of resources pretty fast and cant taunt? Cuz an aoe taunt would end up very expensive and they probably couldnt use it

Elijah_Crow · October 2016

Medakon wrote: »

Been playing tank since day one of the release, tanked many years in other mmos. One of my biggest struggels in this game was to figure out how agro system worked. But after a while you get used to it, and managed to hold 90%+ of the mobs in packs while doing dungeons. However, due to recent update 12, I wouldnt mind seeing some kind of aoe taunt, maybe make it a set bonus? boss mask? if you use single target taunt it automaticly sends impulse taunting everything 10m of you?

Reason for this is Darkshade caveran 2, with the tentacle boss. It has a massiv spawn rate, and most of the time damage dealers has to low damage output, ending up with 20-40adds running around, pretty hard trying to controll all of these while trying to kite boss. So.. wouldnt mind seeing some kind of aoetaunt in the near future.

EDIT:typo

As a dps using Steel Tornado in this scenario, I'm the one who usually group these by doing massive damage and circling the boss and I never stop moving. Imagine a spinning top of blades circling the boss and grouping up every group of adds to chase me. Unless I accidentally get stunned by the boss, they never touch me.

Definitely not needed in this encounter and I'm sure there are a dozen other ways to handle it.

CombatPrayer · October 2016

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

The game designers have said that their not really interested in giving it, and quite frankly the design is set up to go "If you taunt too many guys, your gonna die." This game was never designed for glass cannon builds in an -extreme- capacity, but quite frankly it's geting harder and harder and it's intentional. Giving an AOE taunt would give too much to that extent.

The game might not be designed for glass cannon builds but I have seen them quite regularly and even more so as time passes. I regularly waste tons of mag on healing them because clearly they can't be bothered to learn how to roll or dodge or get vigor or whatever other self heal they have. They want to hit like a truck and then they die like they have been hit like a truck.

As it is ZOS has a system where higher dps pulls aggro pretty regularly. I have seen it quite often. The tank should be able to counter that but at times it's kind of a joke. And then there are bosses that are not tauntable at all or the ones that waste tanks time because they have that teleport which is really annoying. Because of all this, searching for a tank has become a tedious thing. Add to that the fact that tanks really can't go off into the game and do much else because they do crap for damage and you create a massive shortage of tanks. The system is truly awful. Some can defend it and see the logic in it, but tanks are only needed in certain situations in certain dungeons. Giving them an AOE taunt would at bare minimum make them more useful than they currently are. Sure the tank would have to use taunts more intelligently to not die to mobs, but nothing wrong with that. Right now, their utility is so small it's sad. Only certain dungeons truly require them. Lots of bosses don't even need them at all....

xX_NachtJager_xx · October 2016

I'm a tank, and while I wouldn't mind an aoe taunt, it isn't necessary. Like someone else says, dps shouldn't stand around and just take hits. A good dps should be able to self sustain to an extent. And the tank should know what to pull, and what to not pull.

BEZDNA · October 2016

i dislike the idea of AoE taunt and i think it's not needed in ESO, howeawer i would like to have an AoE RETAUNT ability, which would reaplay taunt on already taunted enemies in a small 5 meter radius around tank

pronkg · October 2016

Woeler wrote: »

pronkg wrote: »

Tanking is already very easy.

If you think holding agro and blocking is tanking, yes that's very easy. You're also very simple minded.

If you're gonna assume I'm simple minded then I'm just gonna assume you're a bad player if you think tanking is difficult.

xX_NachtJager_xx · October 2016

nordsavage wrote: »

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

The reason is that most tanks don't need it because they now what to control and when to control it. Also, if a tank had everything focused on it, the healer's job would be harder since now they have to keep the tank topped up repeatedly instead of making sure everyone is ok and assisting with the DPS. Also, the DPS need to learn not stand around so damn much and an AoE taunt does nothing to get them moving. It's not that would make tanking easier in all situations, it will make the jobs of the group members harder.

Unfounded, untrue and if this is your case as a tank or healer you are fit for neither role. I can hold it all and not bleed rivers.

Well, can you do it without a healer focusing on you 80% of the time? I believe that is what he was talking about.

Elijah_Crow · October 2016

autumnsongbird wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

The game designers have said that their not really interested in giving it, and quite frankly the design is set up to go "If you taunt too many guys, your gonna die." This game was never designed for glass cannon builds in an -extreme- capacity, but quite frankly it's geting harder and harder and it's intentional. Giving an AOE taunt would give too much to that extent.

The game might not be designed for glass cannon builds but I have seen them quite regularly and even more so as time passes. I regularly waste tons of mag on healing them because clearly they can't be bothered to learn how to roll or dodge or get vigor or whatever other self heal they have. They want to hit like a truck and then they die like they have been hit like a truck.

As it is ZOS has a system where higher dps pulls aggro pretty regularly. I have seen it quite often. The tank should be able to counter that but at times it's kind of a joke. And then there are bosses that are not tauntable at all or the ones that waste tanks time because they have that teleport which is really annoying. Because of all this, searching for a tank has become a tedious thing. Add to that the fact that tanks really can't go off into the game and do much else because they do crap for damage and you create a massive shortage of tanks. The system is truly awful. Some can defend it and see the logic in it, but tanks are only needed in certain situations in certain dungeons. Giving them an AOE taunt would at bare minimum make them more useful than they currently are. Sure the tank would have to use taunts more intelligently to not die to mobs, but nothing wrong with that. Right now, their utility is so small it's sad. Only certain dungeons truly require them. Lots of bosses don't even need them at all....

If DPS can't handle being hit, then they can change their build to add some survivability. That's not an issue for tanks, it's a L2P issue for DPS.

As for the tanks not being able to "go off into the game and do much else because they do crap for damage", that's complete bull. There are so many options for alternate gear setups, other skills that can be changed outside dungeons, etc and from someone who tanked the first 1.5 years of the game, that's just untrue.

If you are playing a tank and you think you have no utility, and only certain dungeons require you, you have a lot more to learn about the game.

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but It's a fact. With all the gear and skill lines in this game, if you are having these issues you haven't explored all of your options.

Yamenstein · October 2016

As said before. AOE taunts aren't needed, tanking is already pretty easy. I don't mean just taunting and blocking either. Yes sometimes it can get frustrating but that's only when your DPS can't DPS fast enough. No content requires an AOE taunt. At least not yet. End game trials don't require it, the new DLC dungeons don't require it. The only thing that comes close is the DS2 netch fight but even then, when I DPS the adds go down fast. It's your DPSs problem to DPS them down fast. "Oh but you can't say that, it's not the DPSs goal to hold agro". Yeah that's right, but if you dps them down fast is it really considered holding agro. Some bosses don't even require a tank to fully tank as well, and they have to start dpsing more.

Woeler · October 2016

pronkg wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

pronkg wrote: »

Tanking is already very easy.

If you think holding agro and blocking is tanking, yes that's very easy. You're also very simple minded.

If you're gonna assume I'm simple minded then I'm just gonna assume you're a bad player if you think tanking is difficult.

I'm so bad I got the world first kill of Maw of Lorkhaj Hard Mode.

CombatPrayer · October 2016

eh, not worth the time. No I don't play a tank. I just run with them from time to time in overland and have to kill stuff because they can't.

ronrobaina · October 2016

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

nordsavage wrote: »

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

The reason is that most tanks don't need it because they now what to control and when to control it. Also, if a tank had everything focused on it, the healer's job would be harder since now they have to keep the tank topped up repeatedly instead of making sure everyone is ok and assisting with the DPS. Also, the DPS need to learn not stand around so damn much and an AoE taunt does nothing to get them moving. It's not that would make tanking easier in all situations, it will make the jobs of the group members harder.

Unfounded, untrue and if this is your case as a tank or healer you are fit for neither role. I can hold it all and not bleed rivers.

I agree with you. I have two tanks, and I prefer when the healer and DD's aren't moving around like idiots.

Stay behind me, and keep out of AOE's. Enemies that aren't yet taunted will usually go after the shiny thing closest to them. I don't think that's the best place for a 13K health mage.

Mages aren't supposed to be 13 k health....

Elijah_Crow · October 2016

autumnsongbird wrote: »

eh, not worth the time. No I don't play a tank. I just run with them from time to time in overland and have to kill stuff because they can't.

Then they need more skills or a more flexible build and should invest more in their character. This again isn't a tank issue, this is a player issue.

pronkg · October 2016

Woeler wrote: »

pronkg wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

pronkg wrote: »

Tanking is already very easy.

If you think holding agro and blocking is tanking, yes that's very easy. You're also very simple minded.

If you're gonna assume I'm simple minded then I'm just gonna assume you're a bad player if you think tanking is difficult.

I'm so bad I got the world first kill of Maw of Lorkhaj Hard Mode.

Ah so you're an elitist feeling offended cause many people here are saying tanking is easy.

Elijah_Crow · October 2016

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

nordsavage wrote: »

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

The reason is that most tanks don't need it because they now what to control and when to control it. Also, if a tank had everything focused on it, the healer's job would be harder since now they have to keep the tank topped up repeatedly instead of making sure everyone is ok and assisting with the DPS. Also, the DPS need to learn not stand around so damn much and an AoE taunt does nothing to get them moving. It's not that would make tanking easier in all situations, it will make the jobs of the group members harder.

Unfounded, untrue and if this is your case as a tank or healer you are fit for neither role. I can hold it all and not bleed rivers.

I agree with you. I have two tanks, and I prefer when the healer and DD's aren't moving around like idiots.

Stay behind me, and keep out of AOE's. Enemies that aren't yet taunted will usually go after the shiny thing closest to them. I don't think that's the best place for a 13K health mage.

If you think that DPS should stand still, you might be in the wrong game.

Mobility in this game is key and as a DPS I am always in motion, usually spinning with steel tornado while I lead a group of trash around the room as the key is not to be touched while cutting them down. I can understand that a tank and healer might prefer less active combat, but for a dps, it's a must.

Woeler · October 2016

pronkg wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

pronkg wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

pronkg wrote: »

Tanking is already very easy.

If you think holding agro and blocking is tanking, yes that's very easy. You're also very simple minded.

If you're gonna assume I'm simple minded then I'm just gonna assume you're a bad player if you think tanking is difficult.

I'm so bad I got the world first kill of Maw of Lorkhaj Hard Mode.

Ah so you're an elitist feeling offended cause many people here are saying tanking is easy.

Well that's rather the problem with many people, they have no clue how to play this game at a decent level. But sure, tanking is easy, I'm sure you tanked darkshade caverns normal and had no problems at all.