General Rant, mostly about dungeon difficulty (WGT)... feel free to ignore but i just have to vent

Integral1900 · September 2016

I hate white gold tower! It looks so good, by far the best dungeon visually and I love the whole fractured reality thing.... but..... at last I have come to a conclusion. I GIVE UP :'(

I've been slogging away on that *** dungeon since it launched, on normal mind you, 158 attempts and 1219 deaths, approx. as I was not keeping track of the first dozen or so, I've never even seen the last boss, normally the group hits that planar inhibiter and dies on its arse. Stupid thing is like walking into a cliff that's on fire. Kill the portals, comes the cry, shortly followed by, why wont you kill the portals, etc., its so easy, blah, blah, blah... queue the usual flaming in group chat, I just stay quiet as I've reached a point in life where arguments are just an irritant... I know how to kill the portals but generally there is an ARMY IN THE WAY!!!!!! When I can reach them I do close them, shortly followed by 21000 health vanishing in 2 shots. I even tried it in full heavy, no difference, 2 shots even through shields and block... dead

Now I know there will be some saying oh its so easy, well consider this, the reason you find the dungeons too easy is not because its easy, its probably because your a really great player with reactions so far above someone like me it may as well be about a different game. Maybe you enjoy playing other games that are notorious for being super hard, personally id rather mash my hand in a revolving door.

I play to escape the real world not to be reminded of how monstrously sub par I am, I've played since launch and try to be as good as I can, get good advice and such, but we all have a skill celling and I've found mine. At this point I would happily pay for a super easy mode on the DLC dungeons, a version of the dungeon with no loot, no xp etc. but that I could stroll through on solo with no problem at all. As it stands though I just cant face it anymore. From now on I'm sticking to none dlc dungeons on normal, just thinking about WGT is setting of my anxiety. Does this make me a coward... perhaps, as I said, I'm at an age where image really doesn't matter anymore

Destruent · September 2016

Close the pinion as fast as possible, kill portals as fast as possible --> done.
Oh and if she is blue, move away from her, but don't forget to close the pinion.
I can't really believe, this is still a thing

Btw. if you set the dungeon to normal, you have a super-easy-mode but with loot

Zepiroth · September 2016

I m terrible sorry and never thought I would post this words and I honestly wish u any fun you can find in the game.... But just L2P!

bebynnag · September 2016

based on the comment "by the time i get to them" & "an army in the way" i am going to assume you run a melee build, the portals are much easier to close with a range attack, but not impossible with mellee weapons

use shield charge, critical strike, throwing daggers or your class gap closer to get over to the portals and close them before anything has time to come out of them

also take a look at your tv/monitors/in game settings.
the room goes gray if you are 'on portal duty' and you have time to close them before any eniemes have time to spawn

heavy armour is not a good idea for a DD in a dungeon, so use at least 5 medium or light (depending if you are stam or mag). if you have a hybrid build i am unable to offer any advice as to what armour to choose, hopefully someone else will be able to

and while it is said a lot, and im sure you have heard it before, but dungeon finder is NOT the best way to find a group to run content you struggle with, you will occasionally get luck & find someone helpful, but you will have far more success finding a guild that are happy to help not only with your build, but help run you through it

lolo_01b16_ESO · September 2016

Have you ever tried playing with people who know the dungeon and don't play together for the first time? Like some friends or in a guild?

Woeler · September 2016

How to get decent at playing eso:

1. Stop playing with random n00bs.
2. Use a decent build (not "play the way you want yolo")
3. Join a decent guild.
4. Join their voice chat (honestly, people doing group content without voice chat lmao).
5. Do the dungeon.

And you will see it is not hard at all. Completing that dungeons has nothing to do with being a great player. If everyone who completes VWGT knew what they were doing this game would look entirely different. People say the dungeon is easy, because it's easy. There are videos on youtube of people 2manning it and a group killing it with only light attacks, ONLY light attacks just to prove the point that it does not need to be nerfed because it is not hard. People make it hard by going in with terrible builds and random players without decent voice chat or communication (no, party chat is NOT a decent form of communication).

Magic_Doogies · September 2016

Destruent wrote: »

I can't really believe, this is still a thing

I'm not necessarily picking on you or anything but this just shows how insular, minority, and out of touch a lot of people on this forum are to the general player base in ESO.
You have thread after thread in these forums of min/maxers and super players ranting about how """"easy""" vet dungeons are with zero regards to anyone who isn't them.
I distinctly remember the devs saying they nerfed the IC dungeons because the VAST majority of the ESO playerbase don't even bother doing it when it's gold pledge (those who dont have the DLC aren't counted in this) and the majority of people who do it never actually finish it. Even after nerf 8/10 when I ask guildies to run with me they flat out say they dont want to deal with these dungeons. Its easy to say 'its easy' when you're lucky enough to have good, patient, guilds and members showing you how to do it right to maximize success. But that isn't everyone or every guild for the vast majority of the players in this game.

OT: OP I understand your frustration. It seems that the issue you have with the boss stems from no designated pinion bouncers, members slacking on portal wiping (that is the only way you get overwhelmed by ads), and general bad evasion of blue flames which are instant OHKOs. My advice to you is unlock or slot shields to weather some of the more intense damage and find a guild or guild members who are willing to really show you the ropes and not deal with PUGS that try to run this like a boss melt with mechanics coming in second.
Don't give up. You will beat it eventually. These dungeons are hard for a reason.

Bigevilpeter · September 2016

vWGT is the easiest of the hard dungeons, try ICP or RoM or CoS.

Specially ICP the longest dungeon and the most annoying bosses in the game.

I do WGT when I want to relax

WGT as soon as you get the mechanics its should be very easy, its all about the mechanics more than skill

Destruent · September 2016

Magic_Doogies wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

I can't really believe, this is still a thing

I'm not necessarily picking on you or anything but this just shows how insular, minority, and out of touch a lot of people on this forum are to the general player base in ESO.

As @woeler already said, this dungeon got 2-manned, bosses got killed with light attacks. There are tons of videos on the internet, you can ask here for advice and you can even ask good players directly via pm, ingame or whatever about builds, strategies rotations or even for going with you to this dungeon to learn it.
What's the issue?
- DPS? there are nearly no DPS-checks
- Tactics/mechanics? look them up on youtube/forum whatsoever
- movement? learn it
- group? don't pug, get a guild with people who know the game. Doesn't have to be a progressguild, even casual-guilds farm those dungeons easily and people have no-death etc since months.
- build? look for them on forum/youtube or ask for advice

This is not meant to be rude...but in the current state i don't understand how they are still called extremely difficult.
Just an example:
At release bosses had 100% HP and we were happy about 40k-group-DPS (at the beginning it was lower on first boss) and DDs were dieing by autoattacks of the mobs
Now bosses have like 50...80% the HP (dunno how much they nerfed them exactly) and we have like 100k++ group-DPS when going with 2 DPS, but we don't even really need a tank bc most attacks are not able to oneshot a DPS.
I know these numbers don't apply for the vast majoririty of the groups. But even with only 20%...30% of our DPS those dungeons are now easier than at the beginning.

kuro-dono · September 2016

White gold tower pinion boss has very high level group coordination required.

Ofc you can skip most part if team dps is ridiculous.

the boss fight allows 1 person to be utter trash player provided he listens the group leader and does what he/she says.

first of all, stamina builds are damn stronk in the boss fight, if you are melee, just have gab closer in bar, and dual wield throw dagger is sweet aswell. situational awareness is important in this fight if you are the one who has to focus on portals, but if group leader knows, he can manipulate it so that the person with poorest capabilities to close portals, just 2-4 sec before portals start popping in, if that person uses the pinion he is 100% quaranteed to not get portal duty, which makes his miserable time in that boss fight suddenly pleasantly easy.

portals start opening soon after the pinionhas been first time closed, they actually propably time based, but never really bothered to check that. The way i have taught all to do it is> after inital attacks vs boss, someone near instantly use pinion, then the one with poorest abilitiest has to be nearby to shut it ASAP when it opens, if done fast enough, that person wont get portals for sure. After that, when all first 5 portals been shut, at that point its good to have someone close the pinion, so that just before the next set of portals start popping in, the weak matey will use pinion, and again if done correctly, he/she will miss portal duty, in this phase tho there is tiny risk which is when boss goes blue flame mode, so when the weak matey has used pinion, he has to get the hell out of the center or he gets grilled, and yes, when boss red flame mode, its best to keep her at middle for increased dps rate.

Just repeating those few tactics and even with damn low dps rate in group, the boss will go down fairly easily.

BUT before starting white gold tower, make sure the crown man knows what he is doing, if he doesnt, inform him of the tactics properly in the pinion boss fight. Rest of the bosses are just pathetic compared to this tacticly genious boss fight.

Buffler · September 2016

What server/platform are you on. I'll run you through with my guild. Then ICP/ROM and COS if you like. Never an issue helping ppl through content. We all had to at some point.

MerkzM8 · September 2016

In my opinion vet white gold is far too easy

Integral1900 · September 2016

That's a very kind offer, sadly I just cant face it anymore, the fun of running those dungeons has died. Perhaps one day I will feel differently but for the time being I'm spent

lolo_01b16_ESO · September 2016

Magic_Doogies wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

I can't really believe, this is still a thing

I'm not necessarily picking on you or anything but this just shows how insular, minority, and out of touch a lot of people on this forum are to the general player base in ESO.
You have thread after thread in these forums of min/maxers and super players ranting about how """"easy""" vet dungeons are with zero regards to anyone who isn't them.
I distinctly remember the devs saying they nerfed the IC dungeons because the VAST majority of the ESO playerbase don't even bother doing it when it's gold pledge (those who dont have the DLC aren't counted in this) and the majority of people who do it never actually finish it. Even after nerf 8/10 when I ask guildies to run with me they flat out say they dont want to deal with these dungeons. Its easy to say 'its easy' when you're lucky enough to have good, patient, guilds and members showing you how to do it right to maximize success. But that isn't everyone or every guild for the vast majority of the players in this game.

OT: OP I understand your frustration. It seems that the issue you have with the boss stems from no designated pinion bouncers, members slacking on portal wiping (that is the only way you get overwhelmed by ads), and general bad evasion of blue flames which are instant OHKOs. My advice to you is unlock or slot shields to weather some of the more intense damage and find a guild or guild members who are willing to really show you the ropes and not deal with PUGS that try to run this like a boss melt with mechanics coming in second.
Don't give up. You will beat it eventually. These dungeons are hard for a reason.

I guess the issue is not loosing touch with the general player base. It's the fact that if you have one person who knows the mechanics exactly, the dungeons become much easier. You can see this in kuro-dono's explaination how a leader with good calls can prevent a certain person from having to close portals.
I do those "harder" dungeons quite regularly with random people and sometimes it's really impressive how fast your group's performance increases when people learn how the boss works exactly.

Magic_Doogies · September 2016

Destruent wrote: »

As @woeler already said, this dungeon got 2-manned, bosses got killed with light attacks

I will never use ultra player min/maxers as any sort of litmus test for how easy or hard a dungeon is. That's not how it works. There will always be a small group of players maxed out like nobodies business who do Maelstrom like a warm up run ready to boast in videos about how they 2-man the hardest dungeons.
These people at most probably make up 4% of the general ESO playerbase and if I was a game dev I absolutely WOULD NOT base my game design and difficulty around these types of players.

. There are tons of videos on the internet, you can ask here for advice and you can even ask good players directly via pm, ingame or whatever about builds, strategies rotations or even for going with you to this dungeon to learn it.

And learning it is HARD. Learning it takes A LOT OF WORK. And even then, it's one thing to have someone tell you how to do it, it's another actually doing it. Point being it's not an easy dungeon, and people on here either outright or subtextually saying 'L2P' and 'lol, easy dungeon??!?' aren't really helping at all and it comes off as very callous. Hence my comment about how insular, the people who frequent this forum really are to the vast majority of the people who play this game.

even casual-guilds farm those dungeons easily

Haha, no. Do you have players in said casual guilds that have done this before and know how it works? Absolutely. When I run these dungeons I ask specific people within these casual guilds to do them with me. Unless a new person wants to try it out for the first/second/etc time. But these dungeons are most definitely not 'casual' friendly.

and people have no-death etc since months.

The existence of people getting no death runs is not an indicator at all over how EASY a dungeon is. Like I said in my previous comment, the devs has stated that according to their data most players DO NOT even bother trying these dungeons. The ones that do try it- the majority of them wipe and never finish. So clearly it's not a dungeon that you can do while your sleeping for a good amount of the playerbase.

This is not meant to be rude...but in the current state i don't understand how they are still called extremely difficult.

You don't understand because you aren't in the shoes of the vast majority of the playerbase. On top of that you are in a forum where a good chunk of the users on here are min/maxers, high CP players, or players that are blessed with really good reflex and above average builds.

At release bosses had 100% HP and we were happy about 40k-group-DPS (at the beginning it was lower on first boss) and DDs were dieing by autoattacks of the mobs

Yes, at release it was also notoriously hard and the devs own raw data on the matter showed that way too many people literally weren't even bothering playing the content.

Now bosses have like 50...80% the HP (dunno how much they nerfed them exactly) and we have like 100k++ group-DPS when going with 2 DPS, but we don't even really need a tank bc most attacks are not able to oneshot a DPS.

I'm glad that your group of super players can apparently tank direct hits from the likes of The Abomination and Harvesters without wiping after two hits or more if you can pull off a vigor and have good heals.
But do you honestly believe that the vast majority of the ESO player base has this mindset or can pull this off?

I know these numbers don't apply for the vast majoririty of the groups.

If you can recognize that the numbers your pulling isn't even realistic for the vast majority of people running this dungeon how can you also genuinely wonder why so many people STILL see this as a hard dungeon?

But even with only 20%...30% of our DPS those dungeons are now easier than at the beginning.

Well yeah it's easier for you now because you were one of the few players in the beginning before nerf that even managed to finish the damn thing. So of course when they nerf it it's going to be easier for you. You already were good at it to begin with. Not the vast majority of ESO players back then, and it's still the same thing now.

Buffler · September 2016

Integral1900 wrote: »

That's a very kind offer, sadly I just cant face it anymore, the fun of running those dungeons has died. Perhaps one day I will feel differently but for the time being I'm spent

Dont be put off by pug experiances. Running with guildies is totally different. We talk players through mechanics and dont go crazy dps so we can show ppl how the boss is done. Soon enough you'll be 4 man dps'ing WGT and wondering what all the fuss was about.

Destruent · September 2016

Magic_Doogies wrote: »

I know these numbers don't apply for the vast majoririty of the groups.

If you can recognize that the numbers your pulling isn't even realistic for the vast majority of people running this dungeon how can you also genuinely wonder why so many people STILL see this as a hard dungeon?

But even with only 20%...30% of our DPS those dungeons are now easier than at the beginning.

Well yeah it's easier for you now because you were one of the few players in the beginning before nerf that even managed to finish the damn thing. So of course when they nerf it it's going to be easier for you. You already were good at it to begin with. Not the vast majority of ESO players back then, and it's still the same thing now.

I wonder bc you need like 5k DPS from every DPS to finish this dungeon? everything else is mechanics. If you die for example from those skulls of teh first boss, go ranged to have more time to react. Just don't try to do stack and burn tactics if you don't have the DPS for it. Play the mechanics and play it safe and you will succeed. Maybe even slot a shield/vigor/whatever to protect yourself.
All of us had to learn the mechanics and i know that we were faster than most other players. But ZOS nearly completely eliminated the DPS-checks (we had to face in the beginning aswell), so just focus on mechanics and you will succeed.

akl77 · September 2016

It was crazy hard till the point I wanna cry the first few runs, but now it's an easy dungeon and very enjoyable, the bosses are great and interesting. Just practice and practice, and make sure you run with experienced players, otherwise the play will surely stops at this boss fight.

WGT is very fun in my opinion, ICP is truly hard, then vet mazzatun even harder, haven't been able to beat it yet and very hard to find good group running it.

Magic_Doogies · September 2016

Destruent wrote: »

I wonder bc you need like 5k DPS from every DPS to finish this dungeon? everything else is mechanics. If you die for example from those skulls of teh first boss, go ranged to have more time to react. Just don't try to do stack and burn tactics if you don't have the DPS for it. Play the mechanics and play it safe and you will succeed. Maybe even slot a shield/vigor/whatever to protect yourself.
All of us had to learn the mechanics and i know that we were faster than most other players. But ZOS nearly completely eliminated the DPS-checks (we had to face in the beginning aswell), so just focus on mechanics and you will succeed.

Personally I have already beaten this dungeon on quite a few occasions myself. So it's not like I personally don't know the mechanics of the dungeon or I'm lowkey QQ'ing because I can't beat it myself.
But just because I beat it a few times doesn't mean that I lose the bigger picture and start going 'it easy l2p' towards others that haven't had the luck or skill level to get there yet.

First you say it's mechanics based and as such it's easy. So if it's really all mechanics, why should ZoS bother implementing DPS checks?

Either its nothing but L2P easy mechanics or it's something that requires insane DPS, or both. But at the end of the day it's not 'easy' in the way you think it is for a lot of players of this game.

Magic_Doogies · September 2016

Integral1900 wrote: »

That's a very kind offer, sadly I just cant face it anymore, the fun of running those dungeons has died. Perhaps one day I will feel differently but for the time being I'm spent

I feel you OP. Take a break from those dungeons. Don't keep running them if they make you feel really bitter. As @Buffler stated PUG experiences doing these kinds of dungeons are oftentimes really negative and frustrating. ESPECIALLY if they refuse to even bother doing TS. I beat both vet versions of IC with guildies who were really patient to take the wipes, and explain everything to the group repeatedly until we got it and it felt really good.
You will get there. I can see it.

Destruent · September 2016

Magic_Doogies wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

I wonder bc you need like 5k DPS from every DPS to finish this dungeon? everything else is mechanics. If you die for example from those skulls of teh first boss, go ranged to have more time to react. Just don't try to do stack and burn tactics if you don't have the DPS for it. Play the mechanics and play it safe and you will succeed. Maybe even slot a shield/vigor/whatever to protect yourself.
All of us had to learn the mechanics and i know that we were faster than most other players. But ZOS nearly completely eliminated the DPS-checks (we had to face in the beginning aswell), so just focus on mechanics and you will succeed.

Personally I have already beaten this dungeon on quite a few occasions myself. So it's not like I personally don't know the mechanics of the dungeon or I'm lowkey QQ'ing because I can't beat it myself.
But just because I beat it a few times doesn't mean that I lose the bigger picture and start going 'it easy l2p' towards others that haven't had the luck or skill level to get there yet.

First you say it's mechanics based and as such it's easy. So if it's really all mechanics, why should ZoS bother implementing DPS checks?

Either its nothing but L2P easy mechanics or it's something that requires insane DPS, or both. But at the end of the day it's not 'easy' in the way you think it is for a lot of players of this game.

There is no DPS-Check in vWGT anymore...and if there is one, it's extremely low. And i never said it's easy for everyone, i just think it's doable for all players if they want to learn and practice this dungeon and do it with proper builds and groups.

Magic_Doogies · September 2016

Destruent wrote: »

And i never said it's easy for everyone,

You say that, but your initial comment came off as dismissive and head scratching about how in this day and age in the game ANYONE still sees these dungeons as hard.
That came off to me as thinking this dungeon is so easy that the fact someone is frustrated at it's difficulty must be some kind of idiotic or pathetic and L2P.

i just think it's doable for all players if they want to learn and practice this dungeon and do it with proper builds and groups.

I think it's doable too. The issue I have isn't the advice to beat it so much as the pervasive attitude that everything in this game is baby mode because you min/max or utilize a template build and personally find the dungeons cake walks.
Then when you have users who basically are part of the majority of players on ESO rant about how hard these vet dungeons are they get nothing but snark, L2P dismissive answers, and advice thickly layered with a 'git gud' overtone.

I think like maybe 3 posters in this thread so far were genuinely helpful and kept their smugness at the damn door- asking what platform they were on and offering to run with them and show them the ropes for how it's really done. This- to me is what helpful criticism and advice is for these kinds of threads.

Destruent · September 2016

he didn't specifically ask for advice or help or gave us any information about his character/group and so on. What do you expect? We don't even know where to start giving advice exactly....so we just start with general tips like i did...

edit: oh and i have to laugh at this "you guys run cookie-cutter builds, fotm bla"...you know, those who find those dungeon easy (not all of them, but many) are usually those who create the builds/meta ...

mad0ni0n · September 2016

You just need a better group, if you get two DD with good dps you won't have any problem. You can dps through the planar inhibitor mechanics.

Peekachu99 · September 2016

mad0ni0n wrote: »

You just need a better group, if you get two DD with good dps you won't have any problem. You can dps through the planar inhibitor mechanics.

Yup. I grabbed the pinion, spammed absorb magika and the occasional heal on myself and stood still while DPS nuked her through the phases (Planar Inhibitor). During the blue fire phase the healer, who was dosing, tossed me a few heals. Admittedly, the mechanics of that fight are confusing when you first see the dungeon, but they'd almost exploitable after a while once you have people who know what they're doing and are competent (not excellent, even) at their roles. Likewise, you can also just obliterate the Flesh Sculptors Atros now in ICP, and again ignore mechanics.

OP, I would recommend either joining a guild or running with people who are familiar with the content till you get a feel for it. These dungeons are a semi-gear and skill check, too, just like VMSA. You need to have a finely tuned character to complete them. Also, I pug the IC dungeons through group finder all the time (console) and I never have an issue as long as everyone is CP 400ish and up and has their mic on. Hectic communication can be more of an issue on PC, where everyone usually types in pugs (yes, they can hop into any number of voice programs, but rarely do from what I've seen on PC ESO).

P.S. This was on a full light armor tank, btw.

Magic_Doogies · September 2016

Destruent wrote: »

he didn't specifically ask for advice or help or gave us any information about his character/group and so on. What do you expect?

Of course not because it was a vent thread. I expected people to at least not stoop to the level of l2P when OP was clearly just frustrated and tired with the whole ordeal.

so we just start with general tips like i did...

and if you read the rest of my comment I had no issues with people giving general advice.

edit: oh and i have to laugh at this "you guys run cookie-cutter builds, fotm bla"...you know, those who find those dungeon easy (not all of them, but many) are usually those who create the builds/meta ...

I never actually SLAMMED people using template builds. I said that those who generally find these dungeons 'easy' use template builds, are min/maxers and high reflex players. If you're gonna 'laugh' at my comment at least do so in context.

Destruent · September 2016

Magic_Doogies wrote: »

I never actually SLAMMED people using template builds. I said that those who generally find these dungeons 'easy' use template builds, are min/maxers and high reflex players. If you're gonna 'laugh' at my comment at least do so in context.

it just sounded kinda negative for me...people sometimes forget that someone has to create those so called "fotm/meta"-builds which requires some effort, testing calculations and such...
it sometimes feels like people wont to penalize those wo think about mechanics/builds more than others....

Dymence · September 2016

vWGT is the easiest DLC dungeon there is right now, as has been said before.

For you who say you ask specific experienced people just to do this, can't help but laugh.

When this is pledge I take whatever comes my way. How else do you want people to learn how to do this?

I've done it with several groups of first timers already. Sure you're gonna have a couple of wipes/deaths here and there, but it's really not that hard...

ConterK · September 2016

Man a solo version of EVERY instance would be an AMAZING idea that i always wanted from the beginning..

I always hated that everyone in this game is so engulfed into Lvling and getting the best gear and doing their "dailies" quick.. that you cant really *** enjoy the dungeon runs quests.. or anything really.. everyone just wants to rush past everything to finish it just so they can jump to the next one and do the same.. never mind if you have new players in the group that have no idea where to run or how to fight the bosses.. they just rush in and most of the times get themselves and everyone else killed..
is ridiculous..

Shad0wfire99 · September 2016

Poison Injection is a one-shot on the portals. If you don't use a bow, level one a bit just for that. It'll make your life easier.

Humatiel · September 2016

Magic_Doogies wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

As @woeler already said, this dungeon got 2-manned, bosses got killed with light attacks

I will never use ultra player min/maxers as any sort of litmus test for how easy or hard a dungeon is. That's not how it works. There will always be a small group of players maxed out like nobodies business who do Maelstrom like a warm up run ready to boast in videos about how they 2-man the hardest dungeons.
These people at most probably make up 4% of the general ESO playerbase and if I was a game dev I absolutely WOULD NOT base my game design and difficulty around these types of players.

. There are tons of videos on the internet, you can ask here for advice and you can even ask good players directly via pm, ingame or whatever about builds, strategies rotations or even for going with you to this dungeon to learn it.

And learning it is HARD. Learning it takes A LOT OF WORK. And even then, it's one thing to have someone tell you how to do it, it's another actually doing it. Point being it's not an easy dungeon, and people on here either outright or subtextually saying 'L2P' and 'lol, easy dungeon??!?' aren't really helping at all and it comes off as very callous. Hence my comment about how insular, the people who frequent this forum really are to the vast majority of the people who play this game.

even casual-guilds farm those dungeons easily

Haha, no. Do you have players in said casual guilds that have done this before and know how it works? Absolutely. When I run these dungeons I ask specific people within these casual guilds to do them with me. Unless a new person wants to try it out for the first/second/etc time. But these dungeons are most definitely not 'casual' friendly.

and people have no-death etc since months.

The existence of people getting no death runs is not an indicator at all over how EASY a dungeon is. Like I said in my previous comment, the devs has stated that according to their data most players DO NOT even bother trying these dungeons. The ones that do try it- the majority of them wipe and never finish. So clearly it's not a dungeon that you can do while your sleeping for a good amount of the playerbase.

This is not meant to be rude...but in the current state i don't understand how they are still called extremely difficult.

You don't understand because you aren't in the shoes of the vast majority of the playerbase. On top of that you are in a forum where a good chunk of the users on here are min/maxers, high CP players, or players that are blessed with really good reflex and above average builds.

At release bosses had 100% HP and we were happy about 40k-group-DPS (at the beginning it was lower on first boss) and DDs were dieing by autoattacks of the mobs

Yes, at release it was also notoriously hard and the devs own raw data on the matter showed that way too many people literally weren't even bothering playing the content.

Now bosses have like 50...80% the HP (dunno how much they nerfed them exactly) and we have like 100k++ group-DPS when going with 2 DPS, but we don't even really need a tank bc most attacks are not able to oneshot a DPS.

I'm glad that your group of super players can apparently tank direct hits from the likes of The Abomination and Harvesters without wiping after two hits or more if you can pull off a vigor and have good heals.
But do you honestly believe that the vast majority of the ESO player base has this mindset or can pull this off?

I know these numbers don't apply for the vast majoririty of the groups.

If you can recognize that the numbers your pulling isn't even realistic for the vast majority of people running this dungeon how can you also genuinely wonder why so many people STILL see this as a hard dungeon?

But even with only 20%...30% of our DPS those dungeons are now easier than at the beginning.

Well yeah it's easier for you now because you were one of the few players in the beginning before nerf that even managed to finish the damn thing. So of course when they nerf it it's going to be easier for you. You already were good at it to begin with. Not the vast majority of ESO players back then, and it's still the same thing now.

your mindset makes me glad I stopped running with PuGs.