To all the people who are demanding compensation for server downtime

iRogue32 · September 2016

EDIT: TL;DR - According to the TOS, ZOS doesn't owe you anything

This is straight from the Terms of Service that you all agreed to when creating an account to play this game:

ZeniMax does not guarantee that any Services will be available at all times, in all countries and/or all geographic locations, at any given time, or that ZeniMax will continue to offer any particular Services for any particular length of time. Except as prohibited by applicable law and subject to the Statutory Obligations (as defined in Section 1), ZeniMax reserves the right to change and update Content without notice to You. ZeniMax also reserves the right to refuse Your request(s) to acquire Content, and to limit or block any request to acquire Content, including, but not limited to, Downloadable Content and Game Mods, for any reason.

ZeniMax may patch, update, or modify a Service at any time with or without notice to You. Notwithstanding the foregoing, ZeniMax has no obligation to make available any patches, updates or modifications or correct any errors or defects in the Services. ZeniMax makes no guarantees about the persistence or availability of any user names or other personas at any time and assumes no liability for lost or deleted Account data. Except as prohibited by applicable law and subject to the Statutory Obligations (as defined in Section 1), You agree that ZeniMax will not be liable for any interruption of the Services, delay or failure to perform, any loss of Content (including, but not limited to, UGC, Game Mods and Downloadable Content), and/or Account data (including, but not limited to, Character data) resulting from any causes whatsoever. ZeniMax reserves the right to offer new Services, change and/or discontinue certain Services at any time in its sole discretion.

Except as prohibited by applicable law and subject to the Statutory Obligations (as defined in Section 1), ZeniMax may restrict, suspend, or terminate Your access to some or any Services at any time. Should ZeniMax make a material change to the Services, it will provide You notice within the time period specified when You joined the particular Service, or if no time period for notice of material changes was specified, then within thirty (30) days of the date such notice is either (at ZeniMax's discretion) provided to You via email or is posted on the applicable product or ZeniMax Service or on Your "My Account" section.

In response to a violation of these Terms of Service, ZeniMax may issue You a warning, suspend or restrict certain features of Your Account (including, but not limited to, user names), selectively modify or remove or revoke Downloadable Content at an Account and/or device level, immediately terminate any and all Accounts that You have established and/or temporarily or permanently ban Your Account, device, and/or machine from accessing all or certain Services.

ZeniMax may terminate Your access to and/or use of the Services (i) for violating these Terms of Service, (ii) if ZeniMax, in its sole discretion, deems that Your information is untrue, inaccurate, not complete or incomplete; (iii) if Your use of such Services infringes on or is suspected of infringing on another's rights or any intellectual property; (iv) if You or Your Account reflects inappropriate Content and/or violates these Terms of Service. Any and all Content (including, but not limited to, Software, Content, and Downloadable Content) will be considered forfeit immediately in the event of any cancellation, closure, or termination of Your Account by ZeniMax.

If ZeniMax terminates an Account, it may terminate other Accounts that share the same characteristics, such as the name on the Account, email address, mailing address, Internet Protocol address, or credit card number or other Payment Method. ZeniMax reserves the right to use any means necessary and permitted under applicable law to identify and terminate Accounts.

You acknowledge that in such circumstances, ZeniMax is not required to provide You notice before taking action to restrict, suspend or terminate Your access to or use of Services, and/or Your Account. If ZeniMax terminates Your Account, You may not use any Service again without ZeniMax's express written permission. ZeniMax reserves the right to refuse to keep Accounts for, and provide Services to, any individual. You may not allow individuals whose Accounts have been terminated by ZeniMax to use Your Account.

If Your Account, or a particular subscription or membership for a Service associated with Your Account, is terminated or suspended and/or if any Downloadable Content is selectively removed, revoked or garnished from Your Account and/or if Your device is temporarily or permanently banned from accessing some or all of the Services, no refund will be granted, no Downloadable Content will be credited to You or converted to cash or other forms of reimbursement, and You will have no further access to Your Account or Downloadable Content associated with Your Account or the particular Service except where any action has been taken against Your Account or device in error and subject to the Statutory Obligations (as defined in Section 1). If You believe that any action has been taken against Your Account or device in error, please contact Customer Services at support.bethsoft.com.

https://account.elderscrollsonline.com/terms-of-service#_EN_Toc_06

Rohamad_Ali · September 2016

Ain't no one got time for all that

Wow · September 2016

This is why we can't have nice things, that mindset.

Gamers nowadays has turned degenerate and become very very satisfied with subpar services. Thanks to Steam Greenlight, Early Access, etc.

Now if you folks are fine with this, with this kind of server performance. With this kind of services. Then we will be forever doomed with unexpected downtimes and maintenances, and of course no refund or compensation!

So are you okay with this?

Feel free to call me self-entitled brats. Every company that provide services have ToS. ToS exists as their last barrier in case *** happens. The thing is, any decent companies in reality mostly outperformed their ToS. They do their best to deliver their services -> happy customers. When *** happens they would not even hesitate to compensate their customers (at least in place where I work), even though they could just hide behind ToS protection, customers satisfaction is more important.

Luigi_Vampa · September 2016

K. I didn't read all that, but I doubt it says people aren't allowed to complain on the forums... so what is your point?

XDragonDoomX · September 2016

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Ain't no one got time for all that

TL:DR

Forget any chance of compensation

Chew_Magna · September 2016

Entitled brats are entitled.

That and nobody ever reads the EULA.

Sallington · September 2016

That doesn't mean they don't need to be understanding and, god forbid, treat their player-base and fans to something that will lift their spirits.

Afortunado · September 2016

Wow wrote: »

This is why we can't have nice things, that mindset.

Gamers nowadays has turned degenerate and become very very satisfied with subpar services. Thanks to Steam Greenlight, Early Access, etc.

Now if you folks are fine with this, with this kind of server performance. With this kind of services. Then we will be forever doomed with unexpected downtimes and maintenances, and of course no refund or compensation!

So are you okay with this?

A bit thick with the hyperbole lol, but agreed.

People citing a ToS always make me laugh. Look at how unenforceable they are in actual legal matters. It's all irrelevant though. Because it's not a matter of what they have to do, it's a matter of what they should do.

Like follow industry standard best practices and compensate their subs and players when repeated unexpected maintenance occurs. As so many other MMO's do.

DivinityDay · September 2016

I believe some people never have had the chance to be compensated during inconveniences like these thus they miss out on nothing. But for people who have played other games where compensation is given during inconveniences like these you feel underappreciated as a customer when you don't get the same services elsewhere. In a nutshell.

Cously · September 2016

Ehh...it's a private company. It's your decision to pay ZOS. There is no gun held at your head telling you to play. If their TOS can be enforced on a legal matter or not is irrelevant. In case your parents didn't teach you, nobody gets anything with bitching. Adults protest with their wallets.

ThePaleItalian · September 2016

Sallington wrote: »

That doesn't mean they don't need to be understanding and, god forbid, treat their player-base and fans to something that will life their spirits.

Demanding doesn't get you a damn thing. Seriously, the player based cried about subs. So no sub..

Now you cry about crown store. How can they make money? Just a thought.

Lemme ask you this. If this game sub only. But bugs would not be an issues and lag was gone. Would you sub?

I would hate to see how half of you act if your internet or power went out because of a storm. Are you calling the meteorologist and demanding compensation because he didnt tell you about the storm? Or calling your power company out on it and QQing on forums because they cant fix your power right now?

Seriously, you need to step back, take a deep breath and get some sun. The game will be here tomorrow. Trust me I agree it sucks when you can't play but its life.

I_killed_Vivec · September 2016

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

That doesn't mean they don't need to be understanding and, god forbid, treat their player-base and fans to something that will life their spirits.

Demanding doesn't get you a damn thing. Seriously, the player based cried about subs. So no sub..

Now you cry about crown store. How can they make money? Just a thought.

Lemme ask you this. If this game sub only. But bugs would not be an issues and lag was gone. Would you sub?

I would hate to see how half of you act if your internet or power went out because of a storm. Are you calling the meteorologist and demanding compensation because he didnt tell you about the storm? Or calling your power company out on it and QQing on forums because they cant fix your power right now?

Seriously, you need to step back, take a deep breath and get some sun. The game will be here tomorrow. Trust me I agree it sucks when you can't play but its life.

Did you say that yesterday?

Because it ain't here today...

Afortunado · September 2016

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

That doesn't mean they don't need to be understanding and, god forbid, treat their player-base and fans to something that will life their spirits.

Demanding doesn't get you a damn thing. Seriously, the player based cried about subs. So no sub..

Now you cry about crown store. How can they make money? Just a thought.

Lemme ask you this. If this game sub only. But bugs would not be an issues and lag was gone. Would you sub?

I would hate to see how half of you act if your internet or power went out because of a storm. Are you calling the meteorologist and demanding compensation because he didnt tell you about the storm? Or calling your power company out on it and QQing on forums because they cant fix your power right now?

Seriously, you need to step back, take a deep breath and get some sun. The game will be here tomorrow. Trust me I agree it sucks when you can't play but its life.

Lol at your comparing acts of God to poorly implemented game patching.

Something those companies do provide? Good communication when an act of god does happen. Via telephone, social media, email, and even the news. And compensation? Sure my cable company offers it. So do directv and dish if you call.

Paying for a service and having it unexpectedly interrupted repeatedly (and that is key, this sin't a one of event here), and not expecting compensation is silly.

Noisivid · September 2016

Just because the TOS says Zeni doesn't have to provide compensation doesn't mean it's not a good idea from a customer service perspective. It's more of an issue of showing that they value their customers time and money.

iRogue32 · September 2016

Afortunado wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

That doesn't mean they don't need to be understanding and, god forbid, treat their player-base and fans to something that will life their spirits.

Demanding doesn't get you a damn thing. Seriously, the player based cried about subs. So no sub..

Now you cry about crown store. How can they make money? Just a thought.

Lemme ask you this. If this game sub only. But bugs would not be an issues and lag was gone. Would you sub?

I would hate to see how half of you act if your internet or power went out because of a storm. Are you calling the meteorologist and demanding compensation because he didnt tell you about the storm? Or calling your power company out on it and QQing on forums because they cant fix your power right now?

Seriously, you need to step back, take a deep breath and get some sun. The game will be here tomorrow. Trust me I agree it sucks when you can't play but its life.

Lol at your comparing acts of God to poorly implemented game patching.

Something those companies do provide? Good communication when an act of god does happen. Via telephone, social media, email, and even the news. And compensation? Sure my cable company offers it. So do directv and dish if you call.

Paying for a service and having it unexpectedly interrupted repeatedly (and that is key, this sin't a one of event here), and not expecting compensation is silly.

ZoS has an entire forum post that they are keeping updated with the status of the maintenance as well as a banner at the top of forums to let everyone know.

craybest · September 2016

why couldn't this go in the compensation topic? what's with people creating hundreds of new topics each time we have an offline server?

Sallington · September 2016

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

That doesn't mean they don't need to be understanding and, god forbid, treat their player-base and fans to something that will life their spirits.

Demanding doesn't get you a damn thing. Seriously, the player based cried about subs. So no sub..

Now you cry about crown store. How can they make money? Just a thought.

Lemme ask you this. If this game sub only. But bugs would not be an issues and lag was gone. Would you sub?

I would hate to see how half of you act if your internet or power went out because of a storm. Are you calling the meteorologist and demanding compensation because he didnt tell you about the storm? Or calling your power company out on it and QQing on forums because they cant fix your power right now?

Seriously, you need to step back, take a deep breath and get some sun. The game will be here tomorrow. Trust me I agree it sucks when you can't play but its life.

Just to be clear: I was a very vocal supporter of the subscription model from back in beta, and thought everyone who said it was/should go B2P was a crazy person. I still think it should be a P2P sub model, but maybe I'm just old school and hate when devs need to spend energy on crap like crown stores, and need to worry about how to monetize their game when the sub model has already provided the best gaming experiences for me personally in the past.

Preyfar · September 2016

Nobody owes anyone anything. That's true. But sometimes it's a warm gesture just to say "Hey, we know this sucks, and we're sorry. While this doesn't make up for lost time, here's a sweetroll that gives 25% extra experience." or something. Again, I don't want/need compensation, but from a business standpoint, it can be a zero loss item that reassures customers that you understand their frustration and care.

iRogue32 · September 2016

Preyfar wrote: »

Nobody owes anyone anything. That's true. But sometimes it's a warm gesture just to say "Hey, we know this sucks, and we're sorry. While this doesn't make up for lost time, here's a sweetroll that gives 25% extra experience." or something. Again, I don't want/need compensation, but from a business standpoint, it can be a zero loss item that reassures customers that you understand their frustration and care.

True, and if ZOS decides to compensate people then good on them. However, people should not storm the forums every time the servers go down, demanding that ZOS give them crowns.

Afortunado · September 2016

Preyfar wrote: »

Nobody owes anyone anything. That's true. But sometimes it's a warm gesture just to say "Hey, we know this sucks, and we're sorry. While this doesn't make up for lost time, here's a sweetroll that gives 25% extra experience." or something. Again, I don't want/need compensation, but from a business standpoint, it can be a zero loss item that reassures customers that you understand their frustration and care.

Exactly.

Soundwave · September 2016

Lets put it in terms that u can understand, ZoS owns eso and u own nothing. They let u play on their servers.

mlstevens42_ESO · September 2016

There is a difference between the company offering some form of apology (compensation of some form) for unexpected downtime and the demand that they do so.

Many as soon as there is a hiccup in service start shouting for compensation immediately. Sometimes even when the company they are demanding compensate them are not at fault for the outage.

ThePaleItalian · September 2016

Afortunado wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

That doesn't mean they don't need to be understanding and, god forbid, treat their player-base and fans to something that will life their spirits.

Demanding doesn't get you a damn thing. Seriously, the player based cried about subs. So no sub..

Now you cry about crown store. How can they make money? Just a thought.

Lemme ask you this. If this game sub only. But bugs would not be an issues and lag was gone. Would you sub?

I would hate to see how half of you act if your internet or power went out because of a storm. Are you calling the meteorologist and demanding compensation because he didnt tell you about the storm? Or calling your power company out on it and QQing on forums because they cant fix your power right now?

Seriously, you need to step back, take a deep breath and get some sun. The game will be here tomorrow. Trust me I agree it sucks when you can't play but its life.

Lol at your comparing acts of God to poorly implemented game patching.

Something those companies do provide? Good communication when an act of god does happen. Via telephone, social media, email, and even the news. And compensation? Sure my cable company offers it. So do directv and dish if you call.

Paying for a service and having it unexpectedly interrupted repeatedly (and that is key, this sin't a one of event here), and not expecting compensation is silly.

So it happened. What the hell. There is like 10 posts going on about " GIMME SOMETHING BECAUSE THE GAME IS BUGGY"

You are owed nothing. You do not deserve a single thing. I agree with people that it sucks not being able to play this game. I agree that it can suck with lag and bugs. I was frustrated when the 50 load screens were going on while playing in the Gold Coast and Wrothgar..... but guess what? They fixed it. I never DC from either location and its plays like a champ.

ZOS does have to fix issues, I agree. But no one is entitled to anything. Sorry you cant play the game today.

Here is a question. What if they do compensation? What if they are sorry and give you some crowns? When what will you say?

About damn time ZOS? Even a thank you for giving a generation of entitled players some fantasy currency to buy a costume and a new set of eye lashes?

The answer is no. People will back to crying about something else. Magicka, stam, PvP... PvE, gear sets...

DarknessShallFall · September 2016

Chew_Magna wrote: »

Entitled brats are entitled.

That and nobody ever reads the EULA.

This is 100% true, I don't read those because it's too long and i'd forget it all within a week xD

But I still know the general rules and don't beg for anything.

JungleBoot · September 2016

If you paid for X amount of time in the Playboy mansion and the lights went out, water went out, the pool was empty, the liquor cabinets were empty, and all the models went home because things generally sucked during your paid time of the Playboy experience, would you feel cheated and want some sort of compensation even though in small print your contract stated if things go south, tough?

Soundwave · September 2016

Every mmo is the same, every maintenance they always cry. They do it in wow, they do I guild wars, they do it the division, they do it in swtor, they do for every game that server content base. No matter what people will whine, cry, complain and scream I deserve something for free. Because thats the new thing to do. The new generation of gamers r a bunch of cries babies.

iRogue32 · September 2016

JungleBoot wrote: »

If you paid for X amount of time in the Playboy mansion and the lights went out, water went out, the pool was empty, the liquor cabinets were empty, and all the models went home because things generally sucked during your paid time of the Playboy experience, would you feel cheated and want some sort of compensation even though in small print your contract stated if things go south, tough?

False equivalency! This game is Buy to Play, which means you don't buy game time.

Wow · September 2016

Soundwave wrote: »

Every mmo is the same, every maintenance they always cry. They do it in wow, they do I guild wars, they do it the division, they do it in swtor, they do for every game that server content base. No matter what people will whine, cry, complain and scream I deserve something for free. Because thats the new thing to do. The new generation of gamers r a bunch of cries babies.

Yeah swtor, division, gw2, gw, and all every other mmorpgs in existence always do maintenance after maintenance completed then after that maintenance completed another unexpected maintenance every week.

JungleBoot · September 2016

iRogue32 wrote: »

JungleBoot wrote: »

If you paid for X amount of time in the Playboy mansion and the lights went out, water went out, the pool was empty, the liquor cabinets were empty, and all the models went home because things generally sucked during your paid time of the Playboy experience, would you feel cheated and want some sort of compensation even though in small print your contract stated if things go south, tough?

False equivalency! This game is Buy to Play, which means you don't buy game time.

No, you buy the base game to play the base game. You upgrade to access additional features like any race any alliance and a horse. You subscribe for a month (that's paid time) for access to 10% boosts, all DLCs, and the crafting bag. If you loose a day to your crafting bag, that's one day less you had to fill it with as much as you could collect in the time you devoted to it.

The game isn't just pay to play. That's only one component of it.

CapnPhoton · September 2016

I am thinking that a better use of time instead of complaining about necessary maintenance to repair or keep servers running, is probably just about anything. Surely this game isn't the only thing people have to do in their day. Or is it?

Nysara · September 2016

We will see this EULA and TOS works still after couple of players unsub and quit the game lol.

There will be no players left to EULA or TOS apply on them soon. lol...