Subbed in June Not Knowing RNG Boxes Coming, Can I Get Full Refund??

Wow · August 2016

@cjthibs

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has craps in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps in there, but now it's there... in your food.
Yes you can!

Can you walk into a ESO+ Subscription and ask for a refund for the subscription you are enjoying right now has craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in there, but now it's there... in your game that you love

cjthibs · August 2016

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has craps in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps in there, but now it's there... in your food.
Yes you can!

Can you walk into a ESO+ Subscription and ask for a refund for the subscription you are enjoying right now has craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in there, but now it's there... in your game that you love

The RNG boxes are actually optional if you hadn't noticed.
I seriously SERIOUSLY hate them, I really do, but they're not going to interfere with my game.

It's kind of like the bowl of chips that didn't ask for, but they bring to every table. Just leave them there, or say, "No thanks."

Now, if you had to buy them to be competitive or something, that'd be like having a craps in your entree.

See the difference?

Asata · August 2016

If you're gonna ask for a refund, don't ask for a refund for something that hasn't even happened yet. There are plenty of reasons that someone would want to unsub (or get a refund) over.

Like all the maintenance, downtime, lag, and other things that make the game unplayable for various portions of time. Those are quantifiable because you pay to play for a certain amount of days and if you can't access the game for a third of that (which looks to be likely for August), it's certainly reasonable that someone would expect compensation, or just write it off as a loss and not do it anymore.

I got a 90 day sub in June as well. I've had a crafting bag, increased exp, gold, and inspiration, and access to all DLC's for the past two months. When I got a 3 month sub I knew it was possible I wouldn't even still be playing in 3 months but I got it anyways because I wanted more crowns up front. That's just the risk you take when you do that. You can't know what the future holds. It's best to just do one month at a time if you can't just write it off as a loss if something comes up that changes how you feel about the game.

thesilverball_ESO · August 2016

Wait and see. Until we see what really happens this entire thread is just guesswork and un-necessary (though entertaining) drama.

Miszou · August 2016

Wow wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you ate there last Tuesday because you're worried you might not enjoy tonight's meal?

(For the record, I absolutely RNG boxes and will probably unsub as well, but this is just dumb.)

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has cockroach in it?

Yes you can!

Do you know what a false equivalence is?

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has craps in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps in there, but now it's there... in your food.
Yes you can!

Can you walk into a ESO+ Subscription and ask for a refund for the subscription you are enjoying right now has craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in there, but now it's there... in your game that you love

Worst analogy ever.

I don't like mushrooms, so if this hypothetical meal I ordered contains mushrooms, I don't freak out and refuse to pay or demand my money back and swear never to eat there again.

I just put the mushrooms on the side of the plate and ignore them. And I still tip the waiter, because I'm not a child.

helgewjb16_ESO · August 2016

To the OP: If you have spent any of the crowns you got while subbing you cannot get a refund. At least that's what I was told when I opened a ticket the other day. If you haven't spent any you might have a chance.

I've played other mmo's who had lootboxes and I will never play a game with the same mechanic again. This mechanic is so profitable that development shifts more and more over time to focus on putting unique stuff in these boxes. The more unique stuff they have in them, the more people gamble to get it. It's such a bad way to run a game and not something I want to be part of.

Wow · August 2016

cjthibs wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has craps in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps in there, but now it's there... in your food.
Yes you can!

Can you walk into a ESO+ Subscription and ask for a refund for the subscription you are enjoying right now has craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in there, but now it's there... in your game that you love

The RNG boxes are actually optional if you hadn't noticed.
I seriously SERIOUSLY hate them, I really do, but they're not going to interfere with my game.

It's kind of like the bowl of chips that didn't ask for, but they bring to every table. Just leave them there, or say, "No thanks."

Now, if you had to buy them to be competitive or something, that'd be like having a craps in your entree.

See the difference?

They don't now, but what you can tell in the future? @cjthibs Are you Jyggalag? Lot's of MMO I have experienced playing, once they start dropping RNG boxes at first it was COSMETICS only. Then they start adding upgrade materials, and stuffs that has something to do with the game, p2win stuffs. They all follow this patterns. What makes you think it will be any different here?

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

First they said No plans for P2Win stuffs.
Now you can tell it by yourself

If you SERIOUSLY hate them, just say no.

rotaugen454 · August 2016

Wow wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has craps in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps in there, but now it's there... in your food.
Yes you can!

Can you walk into a ESO+ Subscription and ask for a refund for the subscription you are enjoying right now has craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in there, but now it's there... in your game that you love

The RNG boxes are actually optional if you hadn't noticed.
I seriously SERIOUSLY hate them, I really do, but they're not going to interfere with my game.

It's kind of like the bowl of chips that didn't ask for, but they bring to every table. Just leave them there, or say, "No thanks."

Now, if you had to buy them to be competitive or something, that'd be like having a craps in your entree.

See the difference?

They don't now, but what you can tell in the future? @cjthibs Are you Jyggalag? Lot's of MMO I have experienced playing, once they start dropping RNG boxes at first it was COSMETICS only. Then they start adding upgrade materials, and stuffs that has something to do with the game, p2win stuffs. They all follow this patterns. What makes you think it will be any different here?

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

First they said No plans for P2Win stuffs.
Now you can tell it by yourself

If you SERIOUSLY hate them, just say no.

Exactly what crafting materials are P2W? You can't get those in game yourself, or buy from a guild store?

cjthibs · August 2016

Wow wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has craps in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps in there, but now it's there... in your food.
Yes you can!

Can you walk into a ESO+ Subscription and ask for a refund for the subscription you are enjoying right now has craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in there, but now it's there... in your game that you love

The RNG boxes are actually optional if you hadn't noticed.
I seriously SERIOUSLY hate them, I really do, but they're not going to interfere with my game.

It's kind of like the bowl of chips that didn't ask for, but they bring to every table. Just leave them there, or say, "No thanks."

Now, if you had to buy them to be competitive or something, that'd be like having a craps in your entree.

See the difference?

They don't now, but what you can tell in the future? @cjthibs Are you Jyggalag? Lot's of MMO I have experienced playing, once they start dropping RNG boxes at first it was COSMETICS only. Then they start adding upgrade materials, and stuffs that has something to do with the game, p2win stuffs. They all follow this patterns. What makes you think it will be any different here?

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

First they said No plans for P2Win stuffs.
Now you can tell it by yourself

If you SERIOUSLY hate them, just say no.

I've been playing MMO's since 1997.

And I am saying no. They will not get one cent of mine for these horrible RNG lockboxes.

However, I'm not going to waste my time or my breath demanding a refund for the rest of the game, which I enjoy.

Wow · August 2016

rotaugen454 wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has craps in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps in there, but now it's there... in your food.
Yes you can!

Can you walk into a ESO+ Subscription and ask for a refund for the subscription you are enjoying right now has craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in there, but now it's there... in your game that you love

The RNG boxes are actually optional if you hadn't noticed.
I seriously SERIOUSLY hate them, I really do, but they're not going to interfere with my game.

It's kind of like the bowl of chips that didn't ask for, but they bring to every table. Just leave them there, or say, "No thanks."

Now, if you had to buy them to be competitive or something, that'd be like having a craps in your entree.

See the difference?

They don't now, but what you can tell in the future? @cjthibs Are you Jyggalag? Lot's of MMO I have experienced playing, once they start dropping RNG boxes at first it was COSMETICS only. Then they start adding upgrade materials, and stuffs that has something to do with the game, p2win stuffs. They all follow this patterns. What makes you think it will be any different here?

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

First they said No plans for P2Win stuffs.
Now you can tell it by yourself

If you SERIOUSLY hate them, just say no.

Exactly what crafting materials are P2W? You can't get those in game yourself, or buy from a guild store?

On other game they promised it was Cosmetics only, then later down in the road they start adding upgrade materials, and costume with added stats bonus. Those are not P2Win I guess?

Silver_Strider · August 2016

There's a lot more negatives to the loot box than some people realize.

Considering that gambling is illegal in parts of Europe, that could potentially cause the European server to be shut down, which could potentially cause all those players to never play again. With all those people lost, ZOS will have to make up that revenue another way, which will result in higher costing items overall, namely the items in the Crown Store and DLCs. Whereas DLC thus far have been within the $10-30 ranges, this could in turn raise these prices to $40-60. To make the Crown store items more lucrative, they might start making powerful items completely exclusive to the Crown Store or removing items in-game to fill the Crown Store. Imagine if SPC became available exclusively thru Crown Store, the riots would be massive.

This is all hypothetical, of course, but it has happened with past games in similar fashion and I really cannot see anything good coming from this decision

Wow · August 2016

@cjthibs @rotaugen454 Sure they said Lootboxes cosmetics only. But you can't tell what is going happen in the future. The existence of Lootboxes itself is a step towards Pay to win. It has happened with past games in similar fashion, with same exact initial promises.

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

Now they said No plans for P2Win stuffs inside the RNG Boxes.
Later you can tell it by yourself

There's many way to generate income for the game. How about selling some real good contents in crown shops? How about putting extra sweats in designing real good costumes, pets, or mounts? (You know the stuffs that make you goes like OMG that is very sexy on my toon I must get those!) If it's not enough put them behind Premium cosmetics price, if it's not enough put them behind bundle pack or something. Not enough? Put them behind time limit.

But instead we are getting Crown RNG Boxes.

cjthibs · August 2016

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs @rotaugen454 Sure they said Lootboxes cosmetics only. But you can't tell what is going happen in the future. The existence of Lootboxes itself is a step towards Pay to win. It has happened with past games in similar fashion, with same exact initial promises.

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

Now they said No plans for P2Win stuffs inside the RNG Boxes.
Later you can tell it by yourself

There's many way to generate income for the game. How about selling some real good contents in crown shops? How about putting extra sweats in designing real good costumes, pets, or mounts? (You know the stuffs that make you goes like OMG that is very sexy on my toon I must get those!) If it's not enough put them behind Premium cosmetics price, if it's not enough put them behind bundle pack or something. Not enough? Put them behind time limit.

But instead we are getting Crown RNG Boxes.

Ok...so is this even more absurd if your reason is 'I want a refund because of what you MIGHT do later ZoS!'

Now you're not even asking for a refund based on today's meal being crappy, you're asking for a refund based on the suspicion that a meal three months from now might be bad.

rotaugen454 · August 2016

Wow wrote: »

rotaugen454 wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you are eating right now has craps in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps in there, but now it's there... in your food.
Yes you can!

Can you walk into a ESO+ Subscription and ask for a refund for the subscription you are enjoying right now has craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in it? Of course they weren't originally planning to put craps (AKA RNG BOXES) in there, but now it's there... in your game that you love

The RNG boxes are actually optional if you hadn't noticed.
I seriously SERIOUSLY hate them, I really do, but they're not going to interfere with my game.

It's kind of like the bowl of chips that didn't ask for, but they bring to every table. Just leave them there, or say, "No thanks."

Now, if you had to buy them to be competitive or something, that'd be like having a craps in your entree.

See the difference?

They don't now, but what you can tell in the future? @cjthibs Are you Jyggalag? Lot's of MMO I have experienced playing, once they start dropping RNG boxes at first it was COSMETICS only. Then they start adding upgrade materials, and stuffs that has something to do with the game, p2win stuffs. They all follow this patterns. What makes you think it will be any different here?

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

First they said No plans for P2Win stuffs.
Now you can tell it by yourself

If you SERIOUSLY hate them, just say no.

Exactly what crafting materials are P2W? You can't get those in game yourself, or buy from a guild store?

On other game they promised it was Cosmetics only, then later down in the road they start adding upgrade materials, and costume with added stats bonus. Those are not P2Win I guess?

Upgrade mats are available ingame or from guilds for purchase, so no.

Costumes with stat raises? You mean like all those they have now? Oh wait, they don't.

Saying they COULD do something is meaningless. My wife COULD secretly be a multi-millionaire that married me to have kids and will take the kids and leave me penniless. They COULD put a staff of non-ESO+ sub insta kill in the crown store or the RNG boxes. Doesn't mean it will happen. I prefer to deal with what is, not fanciful "what if" scenarios.

MaxwellC · August 2016

I don't see why the RNG boxes are such a big issue for many players, honestly I could careless infact I think it'll be a good thing since more money that's consistent = more updates which = me having more fun.

mad0ni0n · August 2016

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs @rotaugen454 Sure they said Lootboxes cosmetics only. But you can't tell what is going happen in the future. The existence of Lootboxes itself is a step towards Pay to win. It has happened with past games in similar fashion, with same exact initial promises.

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

Now they said No plans for P2Win stuffs inside the RNG Boxes.
Later you can tell it by yourself

There's many way to generate income for the game. How about selling some real good contents in crown shops? How about putting extra sweats in designing real good costumes, pets, or mounts? (You know the stuffs that make you goes like OMG that is very sexy on my toon I must get those!) If it's not enough put them behind Premium cosmetics price, if it's not enough put them behind bundle pack or something. Not enough? Put them behind time limit.

But instead we are getting Crown RNG Boxes.

Maybe just wait until the things you describe actually happen and then stop playing the game rather than complaining on the forums about possible hypothetical futures.

Wow · August 2016

cjthibs wrote: »

Wow wrote: »

@cjthibs @rotaugen454 Sure they said Lootboxes cosmetics only. But you can't tell what is going happen in the future. The existence of Lootboxes itself is a step towards Pay to win. It has happened with past games in similar fashion, with same exact initial promises.

First they said No plans for RNG Boxes.
Now they had plans for RNG Boxes.

Now they said No plans for P2Win stuffs inside the RNG Boxes.
Later you can tell it by yourself

There's many way to generate income for the game. How about selling some real good contents in crown shops? How about putting extra sweats in designing real good costumes, pets, or mounts? (You know the stuffs that make you goes like OMG that is very sexy on my toon I must get those!) If it's not enough put them behind Premium cosmetics price, if it's not enough put them behind bundle pack or something. Not enough? Put them behind time limit.

But instead we are getting Crown RNG Boxes.

Ok...so is this even more absurd if your reason is 'I want a refund because of what you MIGHT do later ZoS!'

Now you're not even asking for a refund based on today's meal being crappy, you're asking for a refund based on the suspicion that a meal three months from now might be bad.

No I'm not cancelling my subs... it's the OP.

I'm not Jyggalag like you @cjthibs who can see the future. But All I see are other MMORPG companies share same exact initial promises about no P2Win stuffs, but guess what? They all broke it. And I could not see ZoS would be any different.

Loves_guars · August 2016

I don't understand why people complain so much about a cosmetic box? If you don't like gambling and you want to show your discontent, have some strength and ignore it /don't buy it.
Apparently there is a market for this in the 1st world, some people who need to waste money I guess. But hey. they are supporting the game I like, so, it's not that bad for me.

Recremen · August 2016

Supersnake_Lx wrote: »

People's reaction to loot box announcement: "ZOS, how dare you offer a RNG way to players spending their money willingly to acquire cosmetic items that DO NOT affect my gameplay experience in any way shape or form, that I can choose to not participate in; providing another source of funding for future contents that could potentially make the game better. HOW DARE YOU? UNINSTALLING, CANCELLING SUBSCRIPTION TO THIS @!%"

FFS

@Supersnake_Lx

Actually, locking things in as incentives for gambling does negatively impact peoples' play experience. We have to this point been able to make our own decision about how much we're willing to spend on Crown Store items. The gambling service is a complete divorce from what we've come to expect from the service provider and literally prevents us from even making a determination about what price we're willing to pay for an item. Mathematically, there is no amount of boxes we can ever buy which would guarantee getting the items we want, so we can't make informed decisions. That's why you're buying a gambling service and not an item. We're supposed to find entertainment in the gambling itself, but all players actually want are the items.

Tandor · August 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

There's a lot more negatives to the loot box than some people realize.

Considering that gambling is illegal in parts of Europe, that could potentially cause the European server to be shut down, which could potentially cause all those players to never play again. With all those people lost, ZOS will have to make up that revenue another way, which will result in higher costing items overall, namely the items in the Crown Store and DLCs. Whereas DLC thus far have been within the $10-30 ranges, this could in turn raise these prices to $40-60. To make the Crown store items more lucrative, they might start making powerful items completely exclusive to the Crown Store or removing items in-game to fill the Crown Store. Imagine if SPC became available exclusively thru Crown Store, the riots would be massive.

This is all hypothetical, of course, but it has happened with past games in similar fashion and I really cannot see anything good coming from this decision

In that hugely hypothetical scenario, I'm quite clear what would happen. ZOS would not want to lose their European business and so would disable lockboxes on the European servers so as to comply with European laws.

As a result, of course, this forum would be flooded with European players complaining about losing out on their "entitlement"

!

socivL · August 2016

whats an RNG box?

Dojohoda · August 2016

The context matters, right? The reply was an answer to this question. I could be mistaken but this seems refer to buying undaunted keys with cash.

""Hopefully the cash shop model doesn't introduce Locked RNG boxes where you have to pay money to buy the key...""

https://m.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/2t6g9i/please_no_locked_rng_boxes/

Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't the crown store boxes purely cosmetic, meaning items such as mounts, costumes, ... ? And if so, what is the problem with that? Cosmetics are not game changing.

waterfairy · August 2016

cjthibs wrote: »

oxxalejandroxxo wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you ate there last Tuesday because you're worried you might not enjoy tonight's meal?

(For the record, I absolutely RNG boxes and will probably unsub as well, but this is just dumb.)

If I had bought a half year buffet pass somewhere near my workplace, and then discovered dead flies in their soup, of course I will ask for full refund!

How many times would you say, in a given year, do you send a meal back?

Don't do it or you risk this happening.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjNuuBAANBk

Wolfpaw · August 2016

Unsent.Soul wrote: »

What's wrong with the boxes? How will it affect your gameplay? Why does people spending their own money/crowns for boxes matter to you?

If anything it's supporting the game, can you actually be butthurt that someone bought a box and got a costume or some other cosmetic item?

All I see is a sucker, not a cool mount or outfit.

MornaBaine · August 2016

oxxalejandroxxo wrote: »

I subbed for 180 days in June. At that time if I had known RNG boxes were coming I would not only have not subscribed ESO+, but I would also have deleted and left the game for good. Now, to my surprise, they decided to add RNG boxes to the game despite the fact that they have promised they have no such plan. Therefore, for me personally, the game will soon become a product, on principle, totally different from the product that I have subscribed to. Can I get full refund for the 180 day subscription fee I have paid??

Note the ingenious way that quote is worded. A year ago they had no plans to do this to us. Just like originally they had no plans to abandon the subscription model. But as we all know by now, their plans can change at the drop of a hat. And I guarantee you that the TOS you signed says it's perfectly okay for them to do this to us. Do I like it? No. I can't word that strongly enough to show my displeasure without incurring a permanent forum ban. But there's no way they are refunding you. That said, I'd ask anyway...and explain why... at great length.

JKorr · August 2016

socivL wrote: »

whats an RNG box?

Random Number Generator

Random items from computer rolled dice to pick items. If you know for sure you will get a Well-fitted Molag Kena helm from the fight, it is NOT rng. If you go fishing and fillet 500 fish and get one perfect roe, that *is* rng. Other people might fillet 500 fish and end up with 30. RNG. :shrug:

SanTii.92 · August 2016

ZOS_PeterT wrote: »

As you may have noticed we have removed some posts from his thread.

This was done because we never allow insulting/bashing comments on our forums.

Please be respectful and constructive of other users, and review our forums rules to understand fully what is expected when posting.

Shouldnt this be closed Peter?

iRogue32 · August 2016

oxxalejandroxxo wrote: »

I subbed for 180 days in June. At that time if I had known RNG boxes were coming I would not only have not subscribed ESO+, but I would also have deleted and left the game for good. Now, to my surprise, they decided to add RNG boxes to the game despite the fact that they have promised they have no such plan. Therefore, for me personally, the game will soon become a product, on principle, totally different from the product that I have subscribed to. Can I get full refund for the 180 day subscription fee I have paid??

No.

BlackEar · August 2016

laced wrote: »

oxxalejandroxxo wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Can you walk into a restaurant and ask for a refund for the meal you ate there last Tuesday because you're worried you might not enjoy tonight's meal?

(For the record, I absolutely RNG boxes and will probably unsub as well, but this is just dumb.)

If I had bought a half year buffet pass somewhere near my workplace, and then discovered dead flies in their soup, of course I will ask for full refund!

This was the best metaphore ever. =D

One of the worst, actually.

On topic, no, you cannot get a refund. You are paying for access to DLC as well as ESO+ benefits. You are not paying for RNG boxes and you are not paying for them NOT to implemented either. You can throw all the metaphors you want to stray from the topic. These are the facts presented to you.

I believe if we take a look at the TOS it also states somewhere that they are allowed to do changes of this nature without alerting the players.

Oakmontowls_ESO · August 2016

Tandor wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

There's a lot more negatives to the loot box than some people realize.

Considering that gambling is illegal in parts of Europe, that could potentially cause the European server to be shut down, which could potentially cause all those players to never play again. With all those people lost, ZOS will have to make up that revenue another way, which will result in higher costing items overall, namely the items in the Crown Store and DLCs. Whereas DLC thus far have been within the $10-30 ranges, this could in turn raise these prices to $40-60. To make the Crown store items more lucrative, they might start making powerful items completely exclusive to the Crown Store or removing items in-game to fill the Crown Store. Imagine if SPC became available exclusively thru Crown Store, the riots would be massive.

This is all hypothetical, of course, but it has happened with past games in similar fashion and I really cannot see anything good coming from this decision

In that hugely hypothetical scenario, I'm quite clear what would happen. ZOS would not want to lose their European business and so would disable lockboxes on the European servers so as to comply with European laws.

As a result, of course, this forum would be flooded with European players complaining about losing out on their "entitlement" !

I'm.pretty sure they can get around the gambling laws since you receive something everytime. From what I know of the laws they only prohibit paying money if there's a chance you receive nothing. Now the "something" might be useless crown potions that really aren't worth the crowns, but it's still something.