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The Stormproof requirement for Trial guilds is stupid
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Joysheeped✭✭✭The best test is to bring someone into a vet trial and evaluate how they do.
But that's not always practical.
Requiring Stormproof isn't ideal. But as far as quick tests go, it's more useful than Blood Spawn, since it ensures a baseline of mechanical awareness and overall player skill and not just raw DPS. This is particularly important as vMoL and the rescaled trials are more mechanically demanding and no longer static stack-and-burns.
I agree with code. And to add, in my opinion, it also measures how well a player can tackle with the frustration with all the (one-shot) mechanics in vMA. Again, it doesn't prove everything for being a good DD in a 12-man trial but it is an understandable DD requirement for raiding guilds.
Just don't be too frustrated, I am sure there are raiding guilds which seeks nice players~Khajiit Magicka NB :O1 -
Acharnor✭✭✭✭I guess if it is a Raiding Guild they can have whatever requirements they want and that is ok, but they might be missing out on some good players. However, there are a bazillion guilds though and alot of them do trials, just maybe not all the time. You'll find a spot.Celebrate for life is short but sweet for certain.0 -
Mortehl✭✭✭
Except that it isn't. Once again, Maelstrom forces participants to learn excellent situational awareness of be crushed. Forget the stupid weapons and focus on what it takes to actually get through it.mdylan2013 wrote: »I don't want a Stormproof tank or healer in my trial, it's a completely irrelevant title for them.
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elium85✭✭✭It's amazing to me how contensious of an issue this has become! At the end of the day, it is our guild and we can run it how we like. There are loads of people on console who don't know what they are doing, don't grasp DPS rotations, trial mechanics, etc. and this is the best way we have to control for that without addons (DPS meters, etc.).
Also, we are not the best trials guild on Xbox NA by any stretch of the imagination and I welcome the OP to find somewhere else if he is that upset by the requirements we've set. However, to those who say we are noobs, this was our first clear and no one in this group had beaten it before (we weren't carried). It took us hundreds of hours of practice...
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Mortehl✭✭✭mdylan2013 wrote: »Valera Progib wrote: »L2P issue.
If you can't complete VMA - you are quite bad. People can decide their own rules on recruitment minimum requirements. As long as it is not sexist or/and racist, nobody cares.
Stormproof is actually proof that you have completed the most difficult solo content in the game. The end.
Exactly, the most difficult SOLO content in the game. Solo play is completely different to trials. You can be an amazing solo player but absolutely suck in a large group trial, it also works the other way.
Do you believe that a tank or a healer should have Stormproof?
On another character? Absolutely. Do you know why? Because once again, getting through the content is a potential indicator that the player in question has mastered advanced situational awareness, demonstrated the ability to adapt to changing environments, and still succeeded.
Folks, its not about being elitist. It really isn't. You CAN be a potentially great player and never beat maelstrom but that doesn't change a couple of factors: Maelstrom weapons increase your individual damage output exponentially. Maelstrom completes indicate that you eventually can learn complex mechanics.
You don't NEED maelstrom weapons to begin with. You NEED the ability to fight the RNG regularly in order to acquire them. You NEED the ability to not die in popcorn, to pull bolts from your neighbor quickly, to switch dps to atronachs ASAP, to cleanse yourself if you're cursed while never slacking DPS, to not get machine gunned by a boss because you didn't move when he takes a screwed up path from one platform to another. The list goes on.
Maelstrom completion is by an large a STRONG indicator that you're capable as a player of adapting and are going to at some point get your dps weapons.6 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »Burning_Talons wrote: »Since when is any gear required for any content?
To join a Trial guild...(All of the one i applied for apparently) requires stormproofWell they aren't worth your time if they act like that, just elitist being elitist.
I cant find anytimidobserver wrote: »So find a different guild.....
Cant find any
I personally would not make that a requirement for my guild, because it is a silly requirement, but I get why they did it if you are on console. There are probably a ton of completely inexperienced players trying to get into trial guilds on console. It's basically a way to screen players. You don't have to be the best player in the world to finish vMSA, but if you finish it you are guaranteed to have a basic understanding of how to play your class, a basic ability to do acceptable dps(unless you decided to tank it for 6 hours), and a basic ability to move out of the red.
I agree that title requirement to join a guild is generally bad. I think one of the duties of a guild is to help players get better. That being said, most guilds have rankings. I have no issues whatsoever with people having tests (titles, bloodspawn, whatever) to move up in rank and run vet trials. Our guild does for sure. Personally, I think Stormproof should be required for "adept" status, but I dont make the rules. I will tell you right now, VMOL is way harder than VMA.
Yes VMA is a solo instance, but it is a solo instance geared around doing high damage and not dying. Nothing teaches you more about your class than working through that arena. As much as I love to bash that place, it made me a much better player. Obviously the bars and gear are different, but if someone tells me they cant clear the arena, I would have serious reservations about bringing them into a vet trial, especially VMOL or hardmodes of the other 3.3 -
mdylan2013✭✭✭✭✭mdylan2013 wrote: »Valera Progib wrote: »L2P issue.
If you can't complete VMA - you are quite bad. People can decide their own rules on recruitment minimum requirements. As long as it is not sexist or/and racist, nobody cares.
Stormproof is actually proof that you have completed the most difficult solo content in the game. The end.
Exactly, the most difficult SOLO content in the game. Solo play is completely different to trials. You can be an amazing solo player but absolutely suck in a large group trial, it also works the other way.
Do you believe that a tank or a healer should have Stormproof?
On another character? Absolutely. Do you know why? Because once again, getting through the content is a potential indicator that the player in question has mastered advanced situational awareness, demonstrated the ability to adapt to changing environments, and still succeeded.
Folks, its not about being elitist. It really isn't. You CAN be a potentially great player and never beat maelstrom but that doesn't change a couple of factors: Maelstrom weapons increase your individual damage output exponentially. Maelstrom completes indicate that you eventually can learn complex mechanics.
You don't NEED maelstrom weapons to begin with. You NEED the ability to fight the RNG regularly in order to acquire them. You NEED the ability to not die in popcorn, to pull bolts from your neighbor quickly, to switch dps to atronachs ASAP, to cleanse yourself if you're cursed while never slacking DPS, to not get machine gunned by a boss because you didn't move when he takes a screwed up path from one platform to another. The list goes on.
Maelstrom completion is by an large a STRONG indicator that you're capable as a player of adapting and are going to at some point get your dps weapons.
I agree, you need the ability to not stand in popcorn, to pull bolts from others, to cleanse etc... All of that will become fairly obvious when you take the person into a trial.
In my opinion if you are looking for someone that can pull their weight in a trial then you need to see how they are in a trial... Not just look for a title on their character which you have no way of knowing how long it took them to get that title.PS4/EU
CP-1300+
PSN - LookoutLuke
15 Max level toons
PVE/PVP0 -
Milvan✭✭✭✭✭
✭It's their guild and their run they can pick whoever they want. Stop complaing and start to set your own runs.“Kings of the land and the sky we are; proud gryphons.” Stalker stands, the epitome of pride. Naked and muscular, his wings widen and his feet dig in as if he alone holds down the earth and supports the heavens, keeping the two ever separate.”
Gryphons guild - @Milvan,1 -
Mortehl✭✭✭mdylan2013 wrote: »mdylan2013 wrote: »Valera Progib wrote: »L2P issue.
If you can't complete VMA - you are quite bad. People can decide their own rules on recruitment minimum requirements. As long as it is not sexist or/and racist, nobody cares.
Stormproof is actually proof that you have completed the most difficult solo content in the game. The end.
Exactly, the most difficult SOLO content in the game. Solo play is completely different to trials. You can be an amazing solo player but absolutely suck in a large group trial, it also works the other way.
Do you believe that a tank or a healer should have Stormproof?
On another character? Absolutely. Do you know why? Because once again, getting through the content is a potential indicator that the player in question has mastered advanced situational awareness, demonstrated the ability to adapt to changing environments, and still succeeded.
Folks, its not about being elitist. It really isn't. You CAN be a potentially great player and never beat maelstrom but that doesn't change a couple of factors: Maelstrom weapons increase your individual damage output exponentially. Maelstrom completes indicate that you eventually can learn complex mechanics.
You don't NEED maelstrom weapons to begin with. You NEED the ability to fight the RNG regularly in order to acquire them. You NEED the ability to not die in popcorn, to pull bolts from your neighbor quickly, to switch dps to atronachs ASAP, to cleanse yourself if you're cursed while never slacking DPS, to not get machine gunned by a boss because you didn't move when he takes a screwed up path from one platform to another. The list goes on.
Maelstrom completion is by an large a STRONG indicator that you're capable as a player of adapting and are going to at some point get your dps weapons.
I agree, you need the ability to not stand in popcorn, to pull bolts from others, to cleanse etc... All of that will become fairly obvious when you take the person into a trial.
In my opinion if you are looking for someone that can pull their weight in a trial then you need to see how they are in a trial... Not just look for a title on their character which you have no way of knowing how long it took them to get that title.
Guy I'm not saying that storm proof is the only indicator you're not dealing a mental potatoe. I'm saying its a strong indicator and that it means the person will eventually be able to acquire maelstrom weapons.
120 million health. Think about that a moment.0 -
mdylan2013✭✭✭✭✭mdylan2013 wrote: »mdylan2013 wrote: »Valera Progib wrote: »L2P issue.
If you can't complete VMA - you are quite bad. People can decide their own rules on recruitment minimum requirements. As long as it is not sexist or/and racist, nobody cares.
Stormproof is actually proof that you have completed the most difficult solo content in the game. The end.
Exactly, the most difficult SOLO content in the game. Solo play is completely different to trials. You can be an amazing solo player but absolutely suck in a large group trial, it also works the other way.
Do you believe that a tank or a healer should have Stormproof?
On another character? Absolutely. Do you know why? Because once again, getting through the content is a potential indicator that the player in question has mastered advanced situational awareness, demonstrated the ability to adapt to changing environments, and still succeeded.
Folks, its not about being elitist. It really isn't. You CAN be a potentially great player and never beat maelstrom but that doesn't change a couple of factors: Maelstrom weapons increase your individual damage output exponentially. Maelstrom completes indicate that you eventually can learn complex mechanics.
You don't NEED maelstrom weapons to begin with. You NEED the ability to fight the RNG regularly in order to acquire them. You NEED the ability to not die in popcorn, to pull bolts from your neighbor quickly, to switch dps to atronachs ASAP, to cleanse yourself if you're cursed while never slacking DPS, to not get machine gunned by a boss because you didn't move when he takes a screwed up path from one platform to another. The list goes on.
Maelstrom completion is by an large a STRONG indicator that you're capable as a player of adapting and are going to at some point get your dps weapons.
I agree, you need the ability to not stand in popcorn, to pull bolts from others, to cleanse etc... All of that will become fairly obvious when you take the person into a trial.
In my opinion if you are looking for someone that can pull their weight in a trial then you need to see how they are in a trial... Not just look for a title on their character which you have no way of knowing how long it took them to get that title.
Guy I'm not saying that storm proof is the only indicator you're not dealing a mental potatoe. I'm saying its a strong indicator and that it means the person will eventually be able to acquire maelstrom weapons.
120 million health. Think about that a moment.
I don't think you're a potato
Ultimately it's up to the guild to decide how they want to recruit players. Theres plenty of trial titles out there now anyway, so in my opinion they'd be the ones I'd be looking for if I'm going to recruit people based off a title.PS4/EU
CP-1300+
PSN - LookoutLuke
15 Max level toons
PVE/PVP1 -
Mortehl✭✭✭mdylan2013 wrote: »mdylan2013 wrote: »mdylan2013 wrote: »Valera Progib wrote: »L2P issue.
If you can't complete VMA - you are quite bad. People can decide their own rules on recruitment minimum requirements. As long as it is not sexist or/and racist, nobody cares.
Stormproof is actually proof that you have completed the most difficult solo content in the game. The end.
Exactly, the most difficult SOLO content in the game. Solo play is completely different to trials. You can be an amazing solo player but absolutely suck in a large group trial, it also works the other way.
Do you believe that a tank or a healer should have Stormproof?
On another character? Absolutely. Do you know why? Because once again, getting through the content is a potential indicator that the player in question has mastered advanced situational awareness, demonstrated the ability to adapt to changing environments, and still succeeded.
Folks, its not about being elitist. It really isn't. You CAN be a potentially great player and never beat maelstrom but that doesn't change a couple of factors: Maelstrom weapons increase your individual damage output exponentially. Maelstrom completes indicate that you eventually can learn complex mechanics.
You don't NEED maelstrom weapons to begin with. You NEED the ability to fight the RNG regularly in order to acquire them. You NEED the ability to not die in popcorn, to pull bolts from your neighbor quickly, to switch dps to atronachs ASAP, to cleanse yourself if you're cursed while never slacking DPS, to not get machine gunned by a boss because you didn't move when he takes a screwed up path from one platform to another. The list goes on.
Maelstrom completion is by an large a STRONG indicator that you're capable as a player of adapting and are going to at some point get your dps weapons.
I agree, you need the ability to not stand in popcorn, to pull bolts from others, to cleanse etc... All of that will become fairly obvious when you take the person into a trial.
In my opinion if you are looking for someone that can pull their weight in a trial then you need to see how they are in a trial... Not just look for a title on their character which you have no way of knowing how long it took them to get that title.
Guy I'm not saying that storm proof is the only indicator you're not dealing a mental potatoe. I'm saying its a strong indicator and that it means the person will eventually be able to acquire maelstrom weapons.
120 million health. Think about that a moment.
I don't think you're a potato
Ultimately it's up to the guild to decide how they want to recruit players. Theres plenty of trial titles out there now anyway, so in my opinion they'd be the ones I'd be looking for if I'm going to recruit people based off a title.
Fair man. I'm just making an argument that maelstrom is one of many good indicators, not that it's the only one0 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭
your correct ive not done the revamped or vet Mol. Did mol regular last night. but everything i said above does not change the fact that my afore mentioned mechanics do not exist in ESO. there are no pulling techniques waves are based on timers not what or how mobs are pulled. there is no aggro table, CC does not exist in a form that would equate to finishing a group of mobs then selectinng lets say the shaman form selceted CC group and killing him alone. the tank pulls a bunch of melee to him the group stacks on the shaman or casters burns it down then runs to tank.all the mechanics are based of DPS healing is probably secondary utility is an afterthought . The simple fact that the upper echelon guilds require you to meet the DPS check for VMA is the indicator of where ZOs game design flaw is. Im not critising the elite i am simply pointing oout the flaw in design, there is no tank check,heal check, or even utility check because those roles are minor compared to DPS production much of the vet content can be done with out a tank in heavy armor or CP built for the role. while i am not taking away there achievments. People who are completeing the trials are indeed good cordinated and work as a unit. Ive completed most of the 2 new Hist dungeons and there are a couple bosses where the Tank role is needed but for 85 % of the dungeons you could bring 4 dps that heal them selves. In addition it does not negate that you need 1 maybe 2 tanks on one boss2 heals and 10 dps. The game is centric around dps and . If it were not you would see additional mechanics in the game design. Like aggro tables true CC, and Tru classes or skill lines that focus on CC, and group buffingGiles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »Wifeaggro13 wrote: »Burning_Talons wrote: »Why do I need to complete a solo instance to DPS in a damn 12man raid? What if I dont even have the DLC are you just gonna gateway everyone without the DLC away? I killed Bloodspawn in around 40s but because Im stuck on Stage 9 boss on VMA. Its just dumb that Ill never complete a Trail because I refuse to finish VMA because I dont wanna have to do 5 rounds again just to get to the boss BC zeni doesnt wanna CP rounds. So again what does a solo instance have to do with a group play? Is it your way to feel special by having a dumb requirement just to say your guild is exclusive?
[Title changed for language]
Because the inherent design of all Zenis group dynamics is centered around DPS, not much group strategy , executing of roles , or true Team dynamics. Its morso in trials then anywhere. Its everyone stack on Boss 2 healers and produce 40 k DPS. You barely need a tank . Gone are the days of EQ2 that required CC, Controlled DPS,burst, slow burnand stop stop Buffing and Debuffing , correct execution of your job . No pulling technique, leash, solo or Line of sight. just an indivdual DPS check wow.
Have you even ran trials recently. That will not work in vet trials.0 -
elium85✭✭✭@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!0 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
Absloutely I intend too. And I am in no way disrepecting the community that worked on complex rotations to achieve high dps or the guilds that mow through the trials. I know it's not easy. But it does not change the fact there is a lot missing from Zos game design as far as group dynamics and group content complexity.0 -
xblackroxe✭✭✭✭✭mdylan2013 wrote: »mdylan2013 wrote: »Valera Progib wrote: »L2P issue.
If you can't complete VMA - you are quite bad. People can decide their own rules on recruitment minimum requirements. As long as it is not sexist or/and racist, nobody cares.
Stormproof is actually proof that you have completed the most difficult solo content in the game. The end.
Exactly, the most difficult SOLO content in the game. Solo play is completely different to trials. You can be an amazing solo player but absolutely suck in a large group trial, it also works the other way.
Do you believe that a tank or a healer should have Stormproof?
On another character? Absolutely. Do you know why? Because once again, getting through the content is a potential indicator that the player in question has mastered advanced situational awareness, demonstrated the ability to adapt to changing environments, and still succeeded.
Folks, its not about being elitist. It really isn't. You CAN be a potentially great player and never beat maelstrom but that doesn't change a couple of factors: Maelstrom weapons increase your individual damage output exponentially. Maelstrom completes indicate that you eventually can learn complex mechanics.
You don't NEED maelstrom weapons to begin with. You NEED the ability to fight the RNG regularly in order to acquire them. You NEED the ability to not die in popcorn, to pull bolts from your neighbor quickly, to switch dps to atronachs ASAP, to cleanse yourself if you're cursed while never slacking DPS, to not get machine gunned by a boss because you didn't move when he takes a screwed up path from one platform to another. The list goes on.
Maelstrom completion is by an large a STRONG indicator that you're capable as a player of adapting and are going to at some point get your dps weapons.
I agree, you need the ability to not stand in popcorn, to pull bolts from others, to cleanse etc... All of that will become fairly obvious when you take the person into a trial.
In my opinion if you are looking for someone that can pull their weight in a trial then you need to see how they are in a trial... Not just look for a title on their character which you have no way of knowing how long it took them to get that title.
Ofc that is ultimately what you are lokking for in a player. The problem is you just don't have the time to test everybody that applies if you dontset base requirements.
I'll use the raidguild I'm in as an example. We have around 25-30 active members split in 2 groups each raiding 2-3 evenings in a week. We don't overlap raidnights of groups so we can replace people if someone can't come. That means most of the time 6 raids a week. Now you want to play with a stable team to progress and get good scores. But if we would test every applicant we would never have a stable team as you can't test more than 2-3 people tops at the same time (if you take more ir will just become a mess if people don't know mechanics yet)
Thats why requirements are necessary. And for a guild that is average and higher stormproof is actually a really good way to filter out the people that could fit for the guild.
Member of HODOR
Dro-m'Athra Destroyer0 -
Trashyratchet✭✭✭Burning_Talons wrote: »Why do I need to complete a solo instance to DPS in a damn 12man raid? What if I dont even have the DLC are you just gonna gateway everyone without the DLC away? I killed Bloodspawn in around 40s but because Im stuck on Stage 9 boss on VMA. Its just dumb that Ill never complete a Trail because I refuse to finish VMA because I dont wanna have to do 5 rounds again just to get to the boss BC zeni doesnt wanna CP rounds. So again what does a solo instance have to do with a group play? Is it your way to feel special by having a dumb requirement just to say your guild is exclusive?
[Title changed for language]
I would run as fast as possible from a guild like that. It would never be fun. I've been real lucky on PS4 to find a guild that doesn't get wrapped up in that mentality. Everyone does a Bloodspawn to get an idea of were they lie as far as just basic rotation skills, and a baseline for improvement but no one has ever been kicked or not allowed in because of gear, dps test times, or especially titles. The only thing that gets you kicked is being an arrogant d bag. You'll have a lot better experience taking the time to find a group that wants to progress, but have fun doing it.0 -
xblackroxe✭✭✭✭✭Trashyratchet wrote: »Burning_Talons wrote: »Why do I need to complete a solo instance to DPS in a damn 12man raid? What if I dont even have the DLC are you just gonna gateway everyone without the DLC away? I killed Bloodspawn in around 40s but because Im stuck on Stage 9 boss on VMA. Its just dumb that Ill never complete a Trail because I refuse to finish VMA because I dont wanna have to do 5 rounds again just to get to the boss BC zeni doesnt wanna CP rounds. So again what does a solo instance have to do with a group play? Is it your way to feel special by having a dumb requirement just to say your guild is exclusive?
[Title changed for language]
I would run as fast as possible from a guild like that. It would never be fun. I've been real lucky on PS4 to find a guild that doesn't get wrapped up in that mentality. Everyone does a Bloodspawn to get an idea of were they lie as far as just basic rotation skills, and a baseline for improvement but no one has ever been kicked or not allowed in because of gear, dps test times, or especially titles. The only thing that gets you kicked is being an arrogant d bag. You'll have a lot better experience taking the time to find a group that wants to progress, but have fun doing it.Trashyratchet wrote: »Burning_Talons wrote: »Why do I need to complete a solo instance to DPS in a damn 12man raid? What if I dont even have the DLC are you just gonna gateway everyone without the DLC away? I killed Bloodspawn in around 40s but because Im stuck on Stage 9 boss on VMA. Its just dumb that Ill never complete a Trail because I refuse to finish VMA because I dont wanna have to do 5 rounds again just to get to the boss BC zeni doesnt wanna CP rounds. So again what does a solo instance have to do with a group play? Is it your way to feel special by having a dumb requirement just to say your guild is exclusive?
[Title changed for language]
I would run as fast as possible from a guild like that. It would never be fun. I've been real lucky on PS4 to find a guild that doesn't get wrapped up in that mentality. Everyone does a Bloodspawn to get an idea of were they lie as far as just basic rotation skills, and a baseline for improvement but no one has ever been kicked or not allowed in because of gear, dps test times, or especially titles. The only thing that gets you kicked is being an arrogant d bag. You'll have a lot better experience taking the time to find a group that wants to progress, but have fun doing it.
Maybe it is not fun for many people to start over again everytime with new people where many don't even begin zo grasp a fleeing for mechanics.
Maybe people want to actually play with other on their level and simply don't have the time and nerve to test everybody that wants to join.
Also what exactly does bloodspawn show? That you can keep up your rotation for 30-40 sec on a completely static boss? GJ you have learned absolutely nothing about the capability of this person after a blood spawn "test"
Member of HODOR
Dro-m'Athra Destroyer0 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
The only other inherent problem is trial guilds have 8 dps 2 healers and 2 tanks. The imbalance of a dps centric design is now there is less opportunity to get spots in trials as there is less need for a tank. And if you CP your build for tanking you'll never hit the numbers required for a dps role even if you have the gear and build0 -
Mojmir✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭next up:a trade guild that requires master angler and a thieving guild that wants black market mogul.1 -
Mortehl✭✭✭Wifeaggro13 wrote: »@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
The only other inherent problem is trial guilds have 8 dps 2 healers and 2 tanks. The imbalance of a dps centric design is now there is less opportunity to get spots in trials as there is less need for a tank. And if you CP your build for tanking you'll never hit the numbers required for a dps role even if you have the gear and build
Fortunately, it's easy to max level another Dragonknight and swap characters.0 -
Mortehl✭✭✭Trashyratchet wrote: »Burning_Talons wrote: »Why do I need to complete a solo instance to DPS in a damn 12man raid? What if I dont even have the DLC are you just gonna gateway everyone without the DLC away? I killed Bloodspawn in around 40s but because Im stuck on Stage 9 boss on VMA. Its just dumb that Ill never complete a Trail because I refuse to finish VMA because I dont wanna have to do 5 rounds again just to get to the boss BC zeni doesnt wanna CP rounds. So again what does a solo instance have to do with a group play? Is it your way to feel special by having a dumb requirement just to say your guild is exclusive?
[Title changed for language]
I would run as fast as possible from a guild like that. It would never be fun. I've been real lucky on PS4 to find a guild that doesn't get wrapped up in that mentality. Everyone does a Bloodspawn to get an idea of were they lie as far as just basic rotation skills, and a baseline for improvement but no one has ever been kicked or not allowed in because of gear, dps test times, or especially titles. The only thing that gets you kicked is being an arrogant d bag. You'll have a lot better experience taking the time to find a group that wants to progress, but have fun doing it.
I wish you luck. It's possible to have fun while playing with quality players. Having fun is not coupled with being lazy, ignorant or obstinate and your passive aggressive way of describing your guild while talking down about others who require the trial team to meet basic requirements just tells me you're justifying your own laziness.Edited by Mortehl on August 17, 2016 7:26PM0 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Wifeaggro13 wrote: »@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
The only other inherent problem is trial guilds have 8 dps 2 healers and 2 tanks. The imbalance of a dps centric design is now there is less opportunity to get spots in trials as there is less need for a tank. And if you CP your build for tanking you'll never hit the numbers required for a dps role even if you have the gear and build
Fortunately, it's easy to max level another Dragonknight and swap characters.
Just putting it out there, most competitive players are constantly changing their CP. I use slightly different setups for Trials and VMA and far different setups for PVP. It is part of the game. I wouldnt mind if they introduced dual spec, but when tanks and healers claim they cant do VMA because their build wont let them, I find it to be a pretty lame excuse. At most its like 5 or 6k to change your morphs and CP, and getting a 5 piece of julianos or hundings is pretty trivial.0 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wifeaggro13 wrote: »@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
The only other inherent problem is trial guilds have 8 dps 2 healers and 2 tanks. The imbalance of a dps centric design is now there is less opportunity to get spots in trials as there is less need for a tank. And if you CP your build for tanking you'll never hit the numbers required for a dps role even if you have the gear and build
Fortunately, it's easy to max level another Dragonknight and swap characters.
I don't need to re roll I have a sorc too. I just do not enjoy the dps role enough to invest time into gearing him up. If anything I would rather heal other then tank as there is no true utility or cc role in this game0 -
raidentenshu_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Burning_Talons wrote: »Why do I need to complete a solo instance to DPS in a damn 12man raid? What if I dont even have the DLC are you just gonna gateway everyone without the DLC away? I killed Bloodspawn in around 40s but because Im stuck on Stage 9 boss on VMA. Its just dumb that Ill never complete a Trail because I refuse to finish VMA because I dont wanna have to do 5 rounds again just to get to the boss BC zeni doesnt wanna CP rounds. So again what does a solo instance have to do with a group play? Is it your way to feel special by having a dumb requirement just to say your guild is exclusive?
[Title changed for language]
Some trial guilds are probably very competitive, and don't always do normal trial runs. By completing vMA you further prove that you can fight on your own, and not die. You can always find another guild to join that doesn't require such title.
Every guildmaster has the right to dictate what goes on in their guilds. You can either accept it or go on and find another one.1 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭
The biggest issue is no dual spec. At almost 3 years post launch and 2 post the champion system it's not acceptable . Gear change is easy with wicked morphs needs work.Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »Wifeaggro13 wrote: »@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
The only other inherent problem is trial guilds have 8 dps 2 healers and 2 tanks. The imbalance of a dps centric design is now there is less opportunity to get spots in trials as there is less need for a tank. And if you CP your build for tanking you'll never hit the numbers required for a dps role even if you have the gear and build
Fortunately, it's easy to max level another Dragonknight and swap characters.
Just putting it out there, most competitive players are constantly changing their CP. I use slightly different setups for Trials and VMA and far different setups for PVP. It is part of the game. I wouldnt mind if they introduced dual spec, but when tanks and healers claim they cant do VMA because their build wont let them, I find it to be a pretty lame excuse. At most its like 5 or 6k to change your morphs and CP, and getting a 5 piece of julianos or hundings is pretty trivial.
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Minute_Waltz✭✭✭Burning_Talons wrote: »Minute_Waltz wrote: »Just having a stormproof title requirement is stupid.. it just takes time to grind out round 9 over and over until you kill the boss. It doesn't mean that player is geared or skilled enough to compete in vet trials.
For those who complain or can't compete in vma, I'm sorry but you are simply not good enough for vet trials or vDSA. I had people complain about vma being solo and how they enjoyed vdsa group arena etc, and then when vDSA gets scaled to cp160, they have no idea what they are doing in there and unless they get carried by good player/groups, there is no way for them to complete it.
I think its better for the elite guilds to set it as a certain score requirement and adjust accordingly to different classes. (ie 400k min. for mag sorc, 300k min for mag dk etc) Because if people are able to achieve this they are likely to be skilled enough for any mechanics thrown at them, as well as higher chance of being geared with vma weapons. Even with that requirement, you still shouldn't be guarenteed a spot in the core unless you can prove to be a team player AND pulling high dps AND ability to adapt and survive.Valera Progib wrote: »L2P issue.
If you can't complete VMA - you are quite bad. People can decide their own rules on recruitment minimum requirements. As long as it is not sexist or/and racist, nobody cares.
Stormproof is actually proof that you have completed the most difficult solo content in the game. The end.
This coming from a sorc ha
Well no.. this comes from someone who completed vma on multiple classes with 500k+ score and 45k+ blood spawn dps test and still couldnt get into core guild raids.0 -
Decado✭✭✭✭Wifeaggro13 wrote: »@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
The only other inherent problem is trial guilds have 8 dps 2 healers and 2 tanks. The imbalance of a dps centric design is now there is less opportunity to get spots in trials as there is less need for a tank. And if you CP your build for tanking you'll never hit the numbers required for a dps role even if you have the gear and build
Actually the best tank I know can switch his build from tank to DPS in about 2 minutes and still pulls amazing numbers, granted it costs him 3000 gold to do so but it is doable I see it done all the time,
And someone mentioned about healers and tanks with the titles, what I said earlier about being pretty sure everyone in the raid had flawless that includes the tank and healers, not saying it's good or bad etc just saying they have it on those characters
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Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wifeaggro13 wrote: »@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
The only other inherent problem is trial guilds have 8 dps 2 healers and 2 tanks. The imbalance of a dps centric design is now there is less opportunity to get spots in trials as there is less need for a tank. And if you CP your build for tanking you'll never hit the numbers required for a dps role even if you have the gear and build
Actually the best tank I know can switch his build from tank to DPS in about 2 minutes and still pulls amazing numbers, granted it costs him 3000 gold to do so but it is doable I see it done all the time,
And someone mentioned about healers and tanks with the titles, what I said earlier about being pretty sure everyone in the raid had flawless that includes the tank and healers, not saying it's good or bad etc just saying they have it on those characters
I don't doubt it does not change the design flaws of the game though. As I said my personal choice is to tank , not dps . I realy don't enjoy dodging circles while keeping up a rotation and making sure dots are up to maintain DPS. I enjoy the tank role. Not saying that there is anything wrong with people who enjoy Dpsing. Most of this is Zos ignoring the inequity of armor's and stam builds for so long. Now the dps flavor of the month is stam .0 -
Mortehl✭✭✭Wifeaggro13 wrote: »@Wifeaggro13
Actually, there are timed waves in vMoL that do require tanks and healers to coordinate and swap elite mobs back and forth while keeping certain ones interrupted. I'd recommend you find a guild and start running vMoL if you are looking for those types of encounters!
The only other inherent problem is trial guilds have 8 dps 2 healers and 2 tanks. The imbalance of a dps centric design is now there is less opportunity to get spots in trials as there is less need for a tank. And if you CP your build for tanking you'll never hit the numbers required for a dps role even if you have the gear and build
Actually the best tank I know can switch his build from tank to DPS in about 2 minutes and still pulls amazing numbers, granted it costs him 3000 gold to do so but it is doable I see it done all the time,
And someone mentioned about healers and tanks with the titles, what I said earlier about being pretty sure everyone in the raid had flawless that includes the tank and healers, not saying it's good or bad etc just saying they have it on those characters
This is how I was. I love to tank and modestly I consider myself a damn good one, but I also love pvp. I was spending... I dunno 50-90k a week or more some times just respeccing cp, and huge periods of time wasted swapping gear (ps4 user) and swapping skills on my bars.
Its very frustrating, so I wound up with -3- dragonknights lol.0 -
Mortehl✭✭✭Minute_Waltz wrote: »Burning_Talons wrote: »Minute_Waltz wrote: »Just having a stormproof title requirement is stupid.. it just takes time to grind out round 9 over and over until you kill the boss. It doesn't mean that player is geared or skilled enough to compete in vet trials.
For those who complain or can't compete in vma, I'm sorry but you are simply not good enough for vet trials or vDSA. I had people complain about vma being solo and how they enjoyed vdsa group arena etc, and then when vDSA gets scaled to cp160, they have no idea what they are doing in there and unless they get carried by good player/groups, there is no way for them to complete it.
I think its better for the elite guilds to set it as a certain score requirement and adjust accordingly to different classes. (ie 400k min. for mag sorc, 300k min for mag dk etc) Because if people are able to achieve this they are likely to be skilled enough for any mechanics thrown at them, as well as higher chance of being geared with vma weapons. Even with that requirement, you still shouldn't be guarenteed a spot in the core unless you can prove to be a team player AND pulling high dps AND ability to adapt and survive.Valera Progib wrote: »L2P issue.
If you can't complete VMA - you are quite bad. People can decide their own rules on recruitment minimum requirements. As long as it is not sexist or/and racist, nobody cares.
Stormproof is actually proof that you have completed the most difficult solo content in the game. The end.
This coming from a sorc ha
Well no.. this comes from someone who completed vma on multiple classes with 500k+ score and 45k+ blood spawn dps test and still couldnt get into core guild raids.
Now that just sucks donkey parts. I'm not defending individual guilds or people, but I definitely defend the practice of using VMA as one of several criteria for evaluating a potential trial member.0