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Why "Healing Done" is a terrible Argonian passive
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susmitds✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »As for you point about vigor its a stamina ability and stamina characters mostly only self heal thats why so you point is moot.
I don't know what that has to do with anything. I have an Argonian Stam DK that uses Vigor.
Or is the pigeonholing of Argonians already complete?
i never said argonians dont use vigor i was reponding to the OP of why no one ever picks healing the teamates morph
I'm the OP.... and no-one picks the "heal others" morph of vigor, because healing received is better.
That's my point.
Healing received is better for stamina players who would always choose the self healing as it is the only good self heal for them and healing done is mainly for healers. So, healing received > healing done for stamina DPS and tanks.
On the other hand, magicka has a plethora of heals already and don't need the extra self healing as much as stamina. You would see that most magicka nightblades, as well templars, choose morphs with extra healing over morphs providing extra healing received, for e.g. Funnel Health>Swallow Soul. For that reason, healing done > healing received for magicka DPS and healers.
Argonians are now mostly being stereotyped as Magicka race so it makes more sense with healing done.0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Your poll asks people which vigor morph is better, so they have the choice between increased range and a self heal buff. That does not exactly answer the question of if healing done is better than healing taken for Argonians, especially since vigor is not really used for group healing and is instead more widely used as the go-to stamina self-heal. Of course people who primarily use it as a self heal are going to pick the morph that heals them more.
I disagree with your premise that healing done is "completely useless," I'm quite looking forward to it. Yes, my main is an Argonian Templar healer, but so what? The healing taken passive has been quite useless to me so far, why pigeonhole all Argonians into the tank role?
I thought what they did by making it 5% healing done and 5% healing taken was a nice compromise: tanks get a tiny healing taken nerf, healers get a small healing done buff, and those who rely on self-heals don't see too much of a change. If anything this makes Argonians more flexible in their role choice, not less.
I sympathized with my tank-speced egg brothers and sisters when the entire healing taken passive was removed, however many of us Argonian healers are looking forward to having a passive that actually does something for us. What we have now is a good place to meet in the middle, I vote to leave it as it is on PTS.
I agree with this completely - even my Argonian is not a healer per se, he is using a restoration staff once in a while, when with a friend for example, and it is nice when I can help out a friend and he can benefit from this bonus indirectly as well. I am not in the healer role, but as long as he is in range and I use healing for myself, my friend will get as well the benefit of the bonus.0 -
kendellking_chaosb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »its should actually all be healing done so that argonians could have a niche in something, argonian tanks really didnt make a lot of sense and they werent the best tanks anyways.
As for you point about vigor its a stamina ability and stamina characters mostly only self heal thats why so you point is moot.
i actually considered playing argonian after they got 9% healing done then changed my mind when they changed it to 5 and 5%
The point of being up Vigor is that show how pointless the healing done buff is the current min/max races both magic and stamina will still out heal Argonians. Nerfing tanks and DPS on heals to make healer a bit better when other races will still out heal us.
Let's just give up on this healing talk and make Argonian the Sneaky, Gorilla tactic masters and magically gifted bad*ss that we are in the lore. You know the lore from all the other games and even the damn home page of this game.Chaos Shadow-Scale: Shadow Archer
Chaos Death-Scale: Shadow Knight
Tanks-With-Sap-Essence: Dark Mage
Dark Brotherhood Listener: Blade of Argonia
Chaos Dragon-Scale: Draconic Shield Master
Chaos Light-Scale: Marsh Paladin
Chaos Lightning-Scale: Daedric Master
Hurricane Chaos: Storm Archer
Bask-In-My-Light: Warrior of The Light
Forged-In-Dragon-Fire: Pyro Mage
Guardian of The Hist: Light Mender
Chaos of Black Marsh: Master of The Burning Sword
Star of Chaos: Frost Blade Champion
Chaos-Lightning-Tower: Lightning Shield Master
For the King of Argonia
May Sithis hold back his Void1 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »its should actually all be healing done so that argonians could have a niche in something, argonian tanks really didnt make a lot of sense and they werent the best tanks anyways.
As for you point about vigor its a stamina ability and stamina characters mostly only self heal thats why so you point is moot.
i actually considered playing argonian after they got 9% healing done then changed my mind when they changed it to 5 and 5%
The point of being up Vigor is that show how pointless the healing done buff is the current min/max races both magic and stamina will still out heal Argonians. Nerfing tanks and DPS on heals to make healer a bit better when other races will still out heal us.
Let's just give up on this healing talk and make Argonian the Sneaky, Gorilla tactic masters and magically gifted bad*ss that we are in the lore. You know the lore from all the other games and even the damn home page of this game.
hahahaha - you made me laugh - Gorilla tactic - it is Guerilla
Edited by Lysette on July 30, 2016 11:49PM0 -
Bigevilpeter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »As for you point about vigor its a stamina ability and stamina characters mostly only self heal thats why so you point is moot.
I don't know what that has to do with anything. I have an Argonian Stam DK that uses Vigor.
Or is the pigeonholing of Argonians already complete?
i never said argonians dont use vigor i was reponding to the OP of why no one ever picks healing the teamates morph
I'm the OP.... and no-one picks the "heal others" morph of vigor, because healing received is better.
That's my point.
well you missed my point, that stamina characters arent meant to heal others, its has nothing to do with healing done vs healing recieved.
As for magika characters things are totally different also with the faster resto leveling and the extra 3% magika, Argonians are meant to be healers not tanks
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Jar_Ek✭✭✭✭✭The Argonian passives are a mismash of half thought through changes that leave the race in nomans land. They aren't first choice tanks or healers or dps, or even hybrids. They are decent self healers of any persuasion (10.05%) and thats about it.
The healing received and done passive is generally worse than either of the other two options for min max, and only very marginally better for solo/self healing.
The poison/disease resistances only add to your current resistances up to resistance caps and dont do anything vs player poisons that don't do damage but apply debuffs. Making it completely useless for tanks and pretty poor for everyone else - partly due to being situational, partly because they don't help with another primary role, and partly due to being quite a small boost.
The potion passive is extremely annoying rather than really bad. The resource return would be very good, but for the fact that potions are not generally used solely as a resource regeneration mechanism. They are used for buffs/prebuffs, emergencies, cc immunity and invisibility/detection as well. Meaning a chug on 45s cooldown to get the passive bonuses is a gameplay limitation as you can no longer situationally apply them. This may be okay for some situations and bad in others (pvp). Of course potions cost money and currently have no working cooldown reduction which doesn't help.
Finally a max health bonus mostly helps tanks more than anyone else, and the small magicka bonus won't push Argonians to be anyones first magicka race choice.
This therefore leaves an unfocused passive mess that is not great for anything and hence why Argonians are probably the least populace race in Tamriel. The current passives certainly don't encourage shadowscales and sneak thieves (which has been the traditional view of Argonians), but as can be seen they are not really evocative of hist born sentient marsh lizards either... except for swim speed (which is mechanically nearly the worst flavour passive as it grants nothing actually useful to gameplay).0
