Where is the completed Justice system?

Tandor · June 2016

arena25 wrote: »

MY TURN!

I think maybe we should do an experiment on the PTS before officially scrapping it...it's contentious content like this that makes the PTS viable, heck, that's what the PTS is for, right?

I mean, you don't know how something will go unless you TRY IT! Put it on the PTS, and if via the resulting test results in imbalances like ZoS described in their Year Ahead article, then you can scrap the content and explain why in a more detailed letter. You don't know how something will go unless you try it. A lot of hype has built up over this, so scrapping it now without at least testing and providing some numbers to show why it's a bad idea is a really bad move.

No, the purpose of the PTS is to test finished content before it goes live, not to act as an experimental server for trying out different things that aren't already slated for release. I'm sure any developer would love to have the resources to be able to develop fully stuff that may or may not work out, and then run it experimentally on a separate server, but that's not how the real world works unfortunately.

On the other hand, the purpose of the forums is to sound out the playerbase on ideas for the future, as well as getting feedback on existing content, and I've no doubt that the tensions caused by the feedback on IC and the split in attitudes and overall tension on the mooted change to the Justice System played a huge part in the eventual decision to drop that change.

Arato · June 2016

Tandor wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

There's absolutely no reason why "same faction good guy and bad guy" enforcement shouldn't be added to the Justice System - in PvP areas. However, no PvPer wants it in Cyrodiil or Imperial City, they want it in PvE areas for reasons that are all too obvious and which lie behind the decision not to go down that route.

You would have to rack up a bounty for someone to be able to kill you in a PVE area, and not just a "I accidentally clicked on a loaf of bread while trying to talk to an NPC" but a "I just murdered 3 people in broad daylight in front of the entire mage's guild and skipped town to avoid the guards"

To get attacked in PVP in a PVE area under the justice system, you would have to KNOWINGLY be breaking the law and deserve to be hunted down and executed.

There'd be no reasons to complain you were ganked, because you can either obey the law, or keep your bounty low.

I'm not a PVP player or a ganker, but I want the PVP portion of the justice system in game because I think it's creative, fair, and a good way to implement open world PVP that doesn't prey upon PVE players.

Not to mention, when the PVP elements are added in, the NPC guards will be rebalanced, making them not god mode.

This is precisely why PvP in PvE areas is wrong. You want to have it so that PvEers have a choice of not participating fully in PvE content or else being forced to PvP. I've nothing against PvP, but keep it in PvP areas. PvE crimes in PvE areas should have PvE penalties - severe ones by all means - and not be a way of letting in open world PvP through the back door thereby requiring those who want no part in PvP to have to forego PvE content in PvE areas. PvPers may not get that, but fortunately ZOS now do. Campaign for the Enforcement part of the Justice System to be implemented in Cyrodiil and Imperial City and you'll have my full and active support.

You CAN participate fully in the content. What you think fighting against god mode guards is any better? They kill you if you have too high of a bounty too, and them killing you is a lower threshold than players attacking you would be. You'd have to be already kill on sight to the guards and STILL actively getting caught at crimes to be someone that could be attacked by other players.

Also the goal of committing crimes under the justice system is to NOT GET CAUGHT AND HAVE A BOUNTY IN THE FIRST PLACE.

You can fully participate, steal, pick locks, tresspass, murder, just be aware of surroundings and not have witnesses to your crimes so you get a bounty.

Do you just enjoy having god mode guards killing you though you have no chance to even fight back against them? Do you enjoy forking over more money than you make fencing on bounties? Is that your desired experience that the full justice system would deprive you of? Cause that's not normal play. When I steal, murder, pickpocket, and tresspass, I try not to get caught and avoid having a bounty.

Arato · June 2016

Taisynn wrote: »

Introduce it into Cyrodil and Imperial City. Hell, make a new DLC and zone just for PVP aspects like the "complete justice system." But please leave current questing areas alone.

I enjoy the voiced quests; I do not want to be killed / ganked just because I want to experience the Thieves Guild or Dark Brotherhood storylines.

Open World PVP, even if it's the Justice System, breaks my immersion into the stories portrayed by ZOS. The last thing I want is to be enjoying a conversation with an NPC and then be shot in the back by some jerk who likes to camp questing areas just wanting for some poor sap with a bounty to show up.

Forcing one group of players to be part of another group removes the relaxing aspect of ESO for me... It removes consent, and after a long day of dealing with people, sometimes I just want to quest and do what the quests tell me to.

And why are you all so defensive about NPC's in the game They aren't real and they come back in 5 minutes anyway.

How often do you run around with a 1000g + bounty on your head? I mean the guards are already killing you at that point and you're probably spending more money than you're making. Get better at sneaking.

Arato · June 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

There's absolutely no reason why "same faction good guy and bad guy" enforcement shouldn't be added to the Justice System - in PvP areas. However, no PvPer wants it in Cyrodiil or Imperial City, they want it in PvE areas for reasons that are all too obvious and which lie behind the decision not to go down that route.

You would have to rack up a bounty for someone to be able to kill you in a PVE area, and not just a "I accidentally clicked on a loaf of bread while trying to talk to an NPC" but a "I just murdered 3 people in broad daylight in front of the entire mage's guild and skipped town to avoid the guards"

To get attacked in PVP in a PVE area under the justice system, you would have to KNOWINGLY be breaking the law and deserve to be hunted down and executed.

There'd be no reasons to complain you were ganked, because you can either obey the law, or keep your bounty low.

I'm not a PVP player or a ganker, but I want the PVP portion of the justice system in game because I think it's creative, fair, and a good way to implement open world PVP that doesn't prey upon PVE players.

Not to mention, when the PVP elements are added in, the NPC guards will be rebalanced, making them not god mode.

This is precisely why PvP in PvE areas is wrong. You want to have it so that PvEers have a choice of not participating fully in PvE content or else being forced to PvP. I've nothing against PvP, but keep it in PvP areas. PvE crimes in PvE areas should have PvE penalties - severe ones by all means - and not be a way of letting in open world PvP through the back door thereby requiring those who want no part in PvP to have to forego PvE content in PvE areas. PvPers may not get that, but fortunately ZOS now do. Campaign for the Enforcement part of the Justice System to be implemented in Cyrodiil and Imperial City and you'll have my full and active support.

If we consider that players will get flagged for PvP when reaching lvl 3 bounty (and PvP Justice can be implemented in a lot of other ways) that does not mean players cannot participate in the Justice system.
They just have to be good at it.

There are so many tools at your disposal for being a better outlaw, and erasing bounty:
-Clemency
-Swiftly Forgotten
-Veil of Shadows
-Light Fingers
-Bounty erasing tickets
etc.

There is no excuse for having high bounty other than: you suck at being an outlaw.

This so much. I want the PVP end of the justice system but I will probably never be killed under it, because if I get more than a 500g bounty I get it paid off or use a leniency ticket.

If I do get killed under it, it's because I intentionally went on a crime spree to make myself a target.

I want that to happen, I want people who are PVP players to rack up huge bounties and say "come at me bro!" That'd be kind of exciting to have, you'd have a manhunt in zone chat looking for this wanted outlaw. Remember, under this system you have to attack them first as an enforcer or they can't do anything to you. Don't want PVP? Keep your bounty low and don't flag yourself as an enforcer.

But this game needs some more sandbox elements to it. It can't be all themepark (and it shouldn't be all sandbox.. a mix of elements of both I think would end up being the best game)

Korah_Eaglecry · June 2016

Phinix1 wrote: »

sadownik wrote: »

My i ask what are you on? Yolo generation? Epeens?

Take for example, the recent launch of Black Desert Online. Here is an example of a great engine, excellent graphics, fun active combat, and yet the game flopped in the first month due to terrible decisions that led to horrible imbalance and masses of players leaving in droves.

Specifically, they built the game around this same sort of forced PVP mindset, where one group of players (PVE players, by far the majority in any MMO), were forced to be flagged for open world PVP whether they wanted to participate or not. Players with tons of money or time to grind had gear with 3 or 4 times the stats of average level gear and would stalk questing players and annihilate them. Why? Because that's what people do!

Literally within the first month the top 4 streamers posted videos about why they were leaving, and this was among the top 3 reasons.

Were ESO to implement such a system, it would be to cater to a very small demographic of players that want the PVP elements of the game to be forced onto the PVE elements of the game. I am saying I am glad ZOS reconsidered not making this same foolish mistake.

So much of this game is build around stealing, getting bounty, then trading off leniency items or waiting it out, in order to make gold, experience content, etc. Two whole DLC's have been built around this.

To introduce a system where getting bounty during the normal course of playing the bulk of recent content would result in you being subjected to quest hub camping and forced PVP by "guard" players in superior gear 1-shot ganking you, would be a TERRIBLE decision, regardless of how it was marketed.

Besides, this was always a "maybe" thing as far as I am aware.

Like I said if they find a compromise to make it optional for both the PVP AND PVE players, meaning you don't automatically get flagged as bait just for having a certain bounty, but only if you WANT to, as a sort of dueling option for open world, and IF they could make it forbidden in cities and trade areas so people didn't constantly make more of a mess of crafting hubs with their PVP antics, then I wouldn't be 100% against it.

It's just something I personally have zero interest in even in a perfect scenario and if forced or done badly or made exploitable or unbalancing, it destroys games.

It would honestly be an even smaller demographic than that of the PvP Community. Much like Gankers make up a small portion of the PvP Community its likely those that would have been more than a casual involvement with the Justice System PvP would have been a very small group of players capitalizing on PvEers committing crimes.

The sad truth is that even with such a small portion of the PvP playerbase actively participating in it it would still garner a great deal of animosity between the PvP and PvE community. And we have more than enough of that going around as it is.

Arato · June 2016

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Phinix1 wrote: »

sadownik wrote: »

My i ask what are you on? Yolo generation? Epeens?

Take for example, the recent launch of Black Desert Online. Here is an example of a great engine, excellent graphics, fun active combat, and yet the game flopped in the first month due to terrible decisions that led to horrible imbalance and masses of players leaving in droves.

Specifically, they built the game around this same sort of forced PVP mindset, where one group of players (PVE players, by far the majority in any MMO), were forced to be flagged for open world PVP whether they wanted to participate or not. Players with tons of money or time to grind had gear with 3 or 4 times the stats of average level gear and would stalk questing players and annihilate them. Why? Because that's what people do!

Literally within the first month the top 4 streamers posted videos about why they were leaving, and this was among the top 3 reasons.

Were ESO to implement such a system, it would be to cater to a very small demographic of players that want the PVP elements of the game to be forced onto the PVE elements of the game. I am saying I am glad ZOS reconsidered not making this same foolish mistake.

So much of this game is build around stealing, getting bounty, then trading off leniency items or waiting it out, in order to make gold, experience content, etc. Two whole DLC's have been built around this.

To introduce a system where getting bounty during the normal course of playing the bulk of recent content would result in you being subjected to quest hub camping and forced PVP by "guard" players in superior gear 1-shot ganking you, would be a TERRIBLE decision, regardless of how it was marketed.

Besides, this was always a "maybe" thing as far as I am aware.

Like I said if they find a compromise to make it optional for both the PVP AND PVE players, meaning you don't automatically get flagged as bait just for having a certain bounty, but only if you WANT to, as a sort of dueling option for open world, and IF they could make it forbidden in cities and trade areas so people didn't constantly make more of a mess of crafting hubs with their PVP antics, then I wouldn't be 100% against it.

It's just something I personally have zero interest in even in a perfect scenario and if forced or done badly or made exploitable or unbalancing, it destroys games.

It would honestly be an even smaller demographic than that of the PvP Community. Much like Gankers make up a small portion of the PvP Community its likely those that would have been more than a casual involvement with the Justice System PvP would have been a very small group of players capitalizing on PvEers committing crimes.

The sad truth is that even with such a small portion of the PvP playerbase actively participating in it it would still garner a great deal of animosity between the PvP and PvE community. And we have more than enough of that going around as it is.

You act like people just accidentally rack up 1000g bounties in normal play.

Doesn't the deaths from Godmode guards already impede your gameplay if you accidentally get that high of a bounty?

Phinix1 · June 2016

@Arato racking up a 1000g bounty is really easy to do accidentally during the course of a single Dark Brotherhood mission. I don't want to get camped (because the griefers will know that is where people most likely get bouties) every time I try and turn one in.

Also, guards should only kill you if you're dumb enough to try and fight them. It is really easy to run away from guards. Once you get a certain distance away just sneak and they stop chasing you.

NewBlacksmurf · June 2016

The only way this works is on a completely seperate campaign cause it's PvP but not in Cyrodil

Aeladiir · June 2016

Delegator wrote: »

Back when Legerdemain was added as a skill line, we were told that it was the first part in what would be a fleshed-out "justice system" that would include bounties collectible by players, in-faction PVP between good guys and bad guys, and so on. Instead we have a melange of three parts: LEgerdemain (free), Thieves Guild (DLC) and Dark Brotherhood (DLC). None of these have any negative consequences to stealing or killing -- not any of note, anyway. The player-based bounty hunting has been officially scrapped, and the sum of the parts doesn't have any cohesion.

It seems to me that the three parts really should be one -- or at least that TG & DB should be one DLC because they complement each other thematically. And I would like to see the other side of Legerdemain filled out at some point.

All this is said as an ESO Plus subscriber, BTW. It is not at all about cost, but about cohesion and completeness. Now that players are encouraged to murder in addition to steal, will there ever be another side added to the Justice system?

That's Paul Sage's/Nick Konkle's vision of The Elder Scrolls Online. They had zero knowledge of how this stuff would be balanced and have never come up with a plan that would actually offer some kind of actual balance. It's the same with spellcrafting. It's going to be a long time untill we see something like that in the game.

Sure, it sounds nice and all, but can turn into living hell if not done properly. And Sage and "The Konk" failed at many things regarding ESO. Too many.

Smitch_59 · June 2016

Hasn't this poor dead horse been beaten long enough?

ADarklore · June 2016

I love the flawed logic of those on here saying that PvP 'justice system' would be fair because "if you're breaking the law you deserve to be hunted down and executed" and yet, ZOS just releases TWO DLCs that force players to break the law... so people are paying to play content and yet you have players here saying that it would be OK to disrupt the content they paid to play just so they could get their kicks. You know just like the gankers in Cyrodiil, you'd have these same players camping out in TG and DB areas griefing other players... although with the 'justice system' it wouldn't be griefing now would it... and that is EXACTLY WHY ZOS will never implement it in this game, specially because of those type of people.

Arato · June 2016

ADarklore wrote: »

I love the flawed logic of those on here saying that PvP 'justice system' would be fair because "if you're breaking the law you deserve to be hunted down and executed" and yet, ZOS just releases TWO DLCs that force players to break the law... so people are paying to play content and yet you have players here saying that it would be OK to disrupt the content they paid to play just so they could get their kicks. You know just like the gankers in Cyrodiil, you'd have these same players camping out in TG and DB areas griefing other players... although with the 'justice system' it wouldn't be griefing now would it... and that is EXACTLY WHY ZOS will never implement it in this game, specially because of those type of people.

ZOS doesn't force you to get caught.

C0wrex · June 2016

Shame that the PvP justice system is scrapped

( Would have been fun playing the bounty hunter...

Nova Sky · June 2016

The second part of the Justice System died on the executioner's block.

Arato · June 2016

For those of you trying to say that the enforcer system should be in Cyrodiil, let me spell out to you why that makes no sense.

Cyrodiil and IC are Alliance vs Alliance, it's a war zone. Normal civil law tends not to get observed in a war zone, maybe they'll have a tribunal and convict some war criminals if they find officers who ordered certain crimes done during the war, but that happens after the war is done. During the war? All kinds of crimes get committed, and there's really no law enforcement. Besides, you need all the fighters in your alliance fighting, not being executed for petty thievery or locked up. As it stands right now, there is no justice system at all in Cyrodiil, you can take anything from any container, like the entire game was before the justice system was added.

Where something like the justice system belongs lorewise, is in relatively peaceful areas, where rule of law is maintained, where you have kings and dukes and jarls and vicecannons and magistrates upholding and enforcing the law. Your character is charged by some of these people to investigate crimes as part of normal PVE gameplay.

So yes, it is fitting that if someone goes on a murder spree in Elden Root, that King Camoran would give an edict to have this madman taken, dead or alive, to end their crime spree.

C0wrex · June 2016

On an off note though....

GIVE US DUELS PL0X! kthxbai!!!

Arato · June 2016

Phinix1 wrote: »

@Arato racking up a 1000g bounty is really easy to do accidentally during the course of a single Dark Brotherhood mission. I don't want to get camped (because the griefers will know that is where people most likely get bouties) every time I try and turn one in.

Also, guards should only kill you if you're dumb enough to try and fight them. It is really easy to run away from guards. Once you get a certain distance away just sneak and they stop chasing you.

so visit the hideouts and pay your bounty before it gets too high, or use a counterfeit leniency writ or whatever they're called, they reduce your bounty by 500 and you get them from pretty much every thieves guild repeatable quest.

Arato · June 2016

C0wrex wrote: »

On an off note though....

GIVE US DUELS PL0X! kthxbai!!!

No, while hunting down criminals may enhance immersion, having a bunch of people dueling outside the entrance of major towns is an eyesore. I don't want the front gates of Ironforge or Orgrimmar in TESO.

bedlom · June 2016

This again. A simple Google search will confirm that its been canned.
But its not all bad. Duelling and battlegrounds are being added at some point.
PVP is getting attention despite the amount of comments that suggest otherwise.
And knowing ZOS I am sure you will be free to duel wherever you like so you will have plenty of opportunities to be an annoyance.

STEVIL · June 2016

Arato wrote: »

Roehamad_Ali wrote: »

Inner faction PvP , while fun to some is not fun to many . We've asked for an "option in" ability to give those that don't want to participate . Still , no dice . The number one concern seems to be the arguments this would start . Players yelling at other players for not optioning in . The fact that same faction can read each other's messages and don't want the PvP back and forth toxicity ruining their play . Even though I myself would enjoy this and not be a pest , I know they have a point and others will . So in short , I doubt ZOS will implement the second installment ...

You can't force players to break the law.

Really? Ever looked at Tg or Db DLCs? try finishing those DLc questlines without ever pickpocketing or killing innocents.

IIRC some of the houses in stonefalls content now are red-locked so breaking in for the quaest would trigger bounty etc if someone was nearby - like say for instance PCs who know that is a quest point.

No matter how many layers of sheep's clothing people want to throw around it, the ability to PVP ambush PVErs who never intend to PVP for easy pickin's, turning the entire world to one gigantic ambush in waiting never let you guard down and relax or you are DEAD DEAD DEAD DEAD DEAD DEAD DEAD (having fun yet?) is likely not coming to ESO.

Taisynn · June 2016

Seriously, this feels like punishing players who are still learning to thieve better. If I wanted the anxiety that comes with PVP, I'll go to Cyrodill. The OP God Guards are enough; seriously, I've been one hit killed by some of these if I let my bounty get high enough. So with high bounty I have to keep out of town.

I really don't want 10 players playing bounty hunter jumping on me like gankers in Cyrodil do. Plus there's achivements tied to high bounty that people would never be able to obtain due to bounty hunter gankers.

Seriously, I'm glad they scrapped this.

Dubhliam · June 2016

bedlom wrote: »

This again. A simple Google search will confirm that its been canned.
But its not all bad. Duelling and battlegrounds are being added at some point.
PVP is getting attention despite the amount of comments that suggest otherwise.
And knowing ZOS I am sure you will be free to duel wherever you like so you will have plenty of opportunities to be an annoyance.

First of all: the attention PvP is getting is nowhere nearly enough. TWO years since launch, there are still no duels or an arena.

Second, to counter your "simple google search":
If you only took the time to read the first page of this thread (a two page thread), you would see that they still consider doing it.

dwtdwtdwt · June 2016

The issue I have with this is that players are able to kill NPCs indiscriminately, with very little consequences. I go into a city and see dead bodies laying all over the place. I see players (especially now with the Blade of Woe at their disposal) easily murdering continuously, over and over, and nothing happens to them except for a measly bounty. Not only that, players can continue to accept and complete quests, buy and sell from Guild Store vendors, and go on about there merry way, no matter what their bounty is.

My suggestion is to not let them do any of this. If players want to kill or rack up a high bounty, by all means do so. But, don't let them have privileges for doing so. If a player wants to kill an NPC in town and be witnessed, they should get at least a 100,000gold bounty and not be allowed to speak to any quest-giver or vendor. At the very least, there needs to be something close to that type of punishment, instead of a 200gold bounty, or whatever it is now. I feel that would deter players from acting like jerks in the city.

Taisynn · June 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

bedlom wrote: »

This again. A simple Google search will confirm that its been canned.
But its not all bad. Duelling and battlegrounds are being added at some point.
PVP is getting attention despite the amount of comments that suggest otherwise.
And knowing ZOS I am sure you will be free to duel wherever you like so you will have plenty of opportunities to be an annoyance.

First of all: the attention PvP is getting is nowhere nearly enough. TWO years since launch, there are still no duels or an arena.

Second, to counter your "simple google search":
If you only took the time to read the first page of this thread (a two page thread), you would see that they still consider doing it.

I don't read from it that they are still considering it. I got from it that their efforts are better spent elsewhere in the game, as such a system could have massive inbalances and exploits. They also want to preserve the PVE safe areas. PVP doesn't belong in the PVE questing areas. Period. They just said they want to preserve (keep, keep sacred) the safeness of questing.

Tandor · June 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

bedlom wrote: »

This again. A simple Google search will confirm that its been canned.
But its not all bad. Duelling and battlegrounds are being added at some point.
PVP is getting attention despite the amount of comments that suggest otherwise.
And knowing ZOS I am sure you will be free to duel wherever you like so you will have plenty of opportunities to be an annoyance.

First of all: the attention PvP is getting is nowhere nearly enough. TWO years since launch, there are still no duels or an arena.

Second, to counter your "simple google search":
If you only took the time to read the first page of this thread (a two page thread), you would see that they still consider doing it.

Simply not true. They couldn't have been clearer in their main announcement and again on ESO Live that it isn't going to happen. However, when a developer is fielding requests for something they have no intention of providing it is standard PR speak to keep the players concerned happy by telling them "it's not impossible" without giving the slightest indication that it's ever going to happen.

Dubhliam · June 2016

Tandor wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

bedlom wrote: »

This again. A simple Google search will confirm that its been canned.
But its not all bad. Duelling and battlegrounds are being added at some point.
PVP is getting attention despite the amount of comments that suggest otherwise.
And knowing ZOS I am sure you will be free to duel wherever you like so you will have plenty of opportunities to be an annoyance.

First of all: the attention PvP is getting is nowhere nearly enough. TWO years since launch, there are still no duels or an arena.

Second, to counter your "simple google search":
If you only took the time to read the first page of this thread (a two page thread), you would see that they still consider doing it.

Simply not true. They couldn't have been clearer in their main announcement and again on ESO Live that it isn't going to happen. However, when a developer is fielding requests for something they have no intention of providing it is standard PR speak to keep the players concerned happy by telling them "it's not impossible" without giving the slightest indication that it's ever going to happen.

You interpret it any way you want.

I know that ever since their "clear announcement" there are people opening forum threads and demanding for PvP Justice.
As long as there is a slightest possibility of implementing it, people won't stop asking for it.
And the answer Lambert provided started and ended with "nothing is impossible".

Tandor · June 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

bedlom wrote: »

This again. A simple Google search will confirm that its been canned.
But its not all bad. Duelling and battlegrounds are being added at some point.
PVP is getting attention despite the amount of comments that suggest otherwise.
And knowing ZOS I am sure you will be free to duel wherever you like so you will have plenty of opportunities to be an annoyance.

First of all: the attention PvP is getting is nowhere nearly enough. TWO years since launch, there are still no duels or an arena.

Second, to counter your "simple google search":
If you only took the time to read the first page of this thread (a two page thread), you would see that they still consider doing it.

Simply not true. They couldn't have been clearer in their main announcement and again on ESO Live that it isn't going to happen. However, when a developer is fielding requests for something they have no intention of providing it is standard PR speak to keep the players concerned happy by telling them "it's not impossible" without giving the slightest indication that it's ever going to happen.

You interpret it any way you want.

I know that ever since their "clear announcement" there are people opening forum threads and demanding for PvP Justice.
As long as there is a slightest possibility of implementing it, people won't stop asking for it.
And the answer Lambert provided started and ended with "nothing is impossible".

Fine, but contrast that comment with the comment on spellcrafting which people also regularly ask for. That's something they clearly aren't working actively on but equally clearly want to do so they talk encouragingly about it, whereas with PvP and the Justice System they just say that it isn't going to happen and that PvE and PvP are going to be kept separate with no indication that they are still considering it.

RebornV3x · June 2016

Its real sad we can't have nice things in this game is it really that hard to make a passive system similar to GTA Online where other players can't kill you anyways we don't want to overwork ZOS reskinning senche mounts and new zones won't build themselves. so I'm glad this and spell crafting got axed.

NewBlacksmurf · June 2016

ADarklore wrote: »

I love the flawed logic of those on here saying that PvP 'justice system' would be fair because "if you're breaking the law you deserve to be hunted down and executed" and yet, ZOS just releases TWO DLCs that force players to break the law... so people are paying to play content and yet you have players here saying that it would be OK to disrupt the content they paid to play just so they could get their kicks. You know just like the gankers in Cyrodiil, you'd have these same players camping out in TG and DB areas griefing other players... although with the 'justice system' it wouldn't be griefing now would it... and that is EXACTLY WHY ZOS will never implement it in this game, specially because of those type of people.

Thanks for this
Ppl that want this system (not all) seem to be those players that are partly why I don't enjoy PvP in this game. The rest I blame on the design as it entices ppl to play certain ways.

Digiman · June 2016

arkansas_ESO wrote: »

"We will not be adding in the previously discussed PvP component of the Justice System. We caveated this many times - as I said at the ESO QuakeCon presentation in 2014, it was always going to be very difficult making it fun, but not exploitable. When introducing new systems to the game, our number one goal is to make sure that we don't introduce new problems. Having players enforce justice on the criminal activity of other players has the potential to introduce imbalances and other issues that greatly outweigh any potential gameplay benefits. The game's central concept of "PvP in PvP areas and be safe in safe areas" needs to stay the way it is."
http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2016/01/12/eso--the-year-ahead

This ^

Generally the problem with introducting this system is that other players could make extremely difficult with those who don't want to be involved in it. Think about, players who want to simply level being ganked and camped around quest givers they want need to complete or players who want to level "stealing" being killed by players who now the easy hot spots for players to go to level.

It wouldn't be fun and would divide the community. I agree on paper it seems cool, to have a cops and robbers type mechanic but exploitation is rife with this scenario and it was easier to scrape the fact that players could kill players in "safe spaces"