Craglorn is being looked into.

Sausage · May 2016

Revisit Craglorn is great idea, and also put it to the Crown Store as DLC like IC or Orsinium etc. I really hope it stays as group-oriented though, they just need to make working group-finder for it.

Ep1kMalware · May 2016

paleobonesb14_ESO wrote: »

I hope they add the Yokudan motif to Craglorn. Have it drop in the delves either in urns like the dwemer or from bosses like Hew's bane with outlaw. I really want that motif!!

I really like craglorn, it looks great and the quests are interesting. The rewards though

I thought about this, like the idea, and then suffocated it. All of the trials gear,mfrom AA to MoL have their own special motif design. I really like this. I've been running a vr12 yokedan sword on my buff bar for ages. It's rare, I've yet to see another. I like this.

I see too many styles every day, it's neat to have some lesser common ones.

NewBlacksmurf · May 2016

Sausage wrote: »

Revisit Craglorn is great idea, and also put it to the Crown Store as DLC like IC or Orsinium etc. I really hope it stays as group-oriented though, they just need to make working group-finder for it.

Well here is the problem with that. Tamriel unlimited says specifically per the news article that it's included at no additional cost so that can't happen.

It just needs to be updated and stay under the base game

DRXHarbinger · May 2016

bedlom wrote: »

As said by the devs so I am very eager to hear more about this from the devs when the time comes.
But what do you expect them to do? I guess making it all more solo friendly and to bring it on par with the other zones is the obvious.
But for those that might have missed it, it is being worked on thankfully.

What sorcery is this? Where is the evidence of such works going on?

Plus wow proper excited if they do rework it.

Turelus · May 2016

I would like to see it have meaningful endgame content again. Scale it up to the max level like Wrothgar etc. and add some daily quests.

Remove the forced caps for number of players to run the content without lowering the difficulty, keep it aimed at a group but allow solo players or groups less than four to try.

Dubhliam · May 2016

I was so happy to read they had plans for Craglorn in the PAX manuscript.

There are many great places, dungeons and repeatable quests. An endgame content at it's finest.
But all of that goes to waste if there is no incentive for people to go there.

I propose they simply bump the difficulty to max level and add some new juicy BiS set in the daily quest rewards.

Poof! Done!

P.s. The questing can be a bit too restrictive, meaning quests generally want you to be in a 4 man group. Not smaller, not larger. This should be looked at.
Also, seeing as rewards should come mainly from daily quests, not mobs or bosses, there is no reason why a person should not be able to go to a dungeon more than once per day (to help a friend for example).
F.e. - A daily requires three players to have the quest active so that they can activate some quest related mechanic to progress. If there is a group of 4 with only two players that have the quest, they cannot progress. Yet if they take one more player that has a quest, it will make their group larger than 4, therefore one of the players will be left out of the next part of the quest, because it is instanced and restricted to 4 players.

Rev Rielle · May 2016

I really hope they keep it as a group content zone, increase it's difficulty and scale there rewards/enemies/levels so it's appropriate. Maybe even add some new content/dailies to the zone, that would be nice.

Personally I think it has far and away been the best zone in the game thus far (though Imperials City is close). But I'm beginning to understand that I'm an 'old-style' MMO player, so I'm biased more towards the games of yesterday where they were more difficult, required actually group interaction etc etc. Oh the nostalgia...

Fingers crossed they do a good job of it, I'm very happy they're looking into it.

Ep1kMalware · May 2016

Turelus wrote: »

I would like to see it have meaningful endgame content again. Scale it up to the max level like Wrothgar etc. and add some daily quests.

Remove the forced caps for number of players to run the content without lowering the difficulty, keep it aimed at a group but allow solo players or groups less than four to try.

Or just make it vr16 only >.>
Endgame content should never scale, that's what makes it (end)game. I like craglorn the way it is, so I do hope it ends up similar to how it is now.

altemriel · May 2016

bedlom wrote: »

As said by the devs so I am very eager to hear more about this from the devs when the time comes.
But what do you expect them to do? I guess making it all more solo friendly and to bring it on par with the other zones is the obvious.
But for those that might have missed it, it is being worked on thankfully.

I had an idea lately, to make whole Craglorn scale not to player level, but to group levelANDsize, so that it would become soloable and in groups it would still be fun, as the bigger the player group, the bigger the group of enemies and also higher level of them.

What do you say ZOS?

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_KaiSchober @zos

Flameheart · May 2016

Epona222 wrote: »

I hope that they will remove arbitrary requirements for having a certain number of people in a group for completing quests there. Like having to have 4 people standing in certain spots to open the last lower crag quest location. I've done most of lower and upper craglorn in a group of 3, I know some people like to try to solo stuff, it should be the difficulty of encounters that determines how many/makeup of group that you require, NOT having sufficient number to stand on pressure plates to get in.

This.

I have no issues with being and staying Craglorn a solo zone. It was actually fun to do ALL dungeons and main quests (except trials of course) solo in 99% of all cases with all my four V16 toons. The issue were just the few quests where you needed some people to pull a lever or or some "dead weight" to shift a base plate. Doing dungeons like Skyreach or Rhani'za solo was a really good mix of a bit of a challenge and fun.

Still missing Shada and Spell Scar on a few of my chars, because there you encounter the "lever-issue" again...

On another note, it's sad that such a beautiful zone never got the attention it should deserve. The zone, the dungeon visuals and the quest lines are unbelievable nice (especially if you play on almost ultra HD resolution - thx to Nvidia DSR - with all effects on max), but not every player is an achievement hunter who will do that just for that reason. The biggest issue for Craglorn was and is, that its loot was crap and is crap.

Dubhliam · May 2016

Abeille wrote: »

Including the scale mechanics used on DLC zones in Craglorn would help a lot.

With that, I mean:
Zone being scaled to CR160.
Scaling players to CR150.
Having CR150 and CR160 drops.
Scaling the nodes to player level and crafting skill.

So really, making it like any DLC zone.
I do not think they should make it more "solo friendly", except for maybe removing the artificial limits. I think there are at least two quests that need more than one people not because they are hard, but because the mechanics to progress require multiple players (I think one requires people to stand on plates to open a door? Bear with me, it's been forever since I did Craglorn). But the overall difficulty of the groups of enemies and bosses shouldn't change, in my opinion. And with it scaled to CR160, it would make a great challenge.

Maybe add a few cosmetic rewards. Content will be done if people find it to be rewarding, and cosmetic rewards are great because they don't get obsolete with new releases.

My thought were very much like yours but I've had a few concerns come up since I started thinking about it:

If they convert it into a DLC with the battle leveling, and node scaling, will that mean Craglorn will be accessible from levels lower than 50?
If we follow the logic, I'd say yes - they don't want to lock the content they just sold to their customers behind a level requirement.

If this happens, Craglorn will lose the one appealing thing it has - challenge and player grouping.
I anticipate the content will be laughably easy even compared to current v11/v13 mob difficulty, which would make some quests that REQUIRE a group of 3 or 4 even more frustrating than they already are.

I would also like nothing better than to reward ZOS' hard work with my money, but not if their hard work would result in a carebear version of today's Craglorn.

If they leave the lvl 50 requirement, it is an indication by itself that players entering that area should expect a challenge, and are at least somewhat ready to take that challenge on because they had time to level their skills.

That being said, the content is already there. It was done long ago, and already paid itself off. A simple bump to max level, some new sets put into the reward containers and some minor quest tweaking are not at all that hard to pull off.
After all, the major work on any new DLC is actually designing the map, creatures, creating a storyline, voice acting etc.

Reevster · May 2016

Make it a PvP zone

Ep1kMalware · May 2016

Reevster wrote: »

Make it a PvP zone

But I don't want craglorn to lag

Sausage · May 2016

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

Revisit Craglorn is great idea, and also put it to the Crown Store as DLC like IC or Orsinium etc. I really hope it stays as group-oriented though, they just need to make working group-finder for it.

Well here is the problem with that. Tamriel unlimited says specifically per the news article that it's included at no additional cost so that can't happen.

It just needs to be updated and stay under the base game

Stuff changes all the time. I think if they made Craglorn as DLC it'd add more value to the sub. If they revisit Craglorn, that works as mini-DLC as well.

ArchMikem · May 2016

Turelus wrote: »

I would like to see it have meaningful endgame content again. Scale it up to the max level like Wrothgar etc. and add some daily quests.

Remove the forced caps for number of players to run the content without lowering the difficulty, keep it aimed at a group but allow solo players or groups less than four to try.

Scaling it up to Level Cap and changing the mob count down to normal would be the best thing they could do for Craglorn.

When I finally finished Cadwell's Gold and had nothing much more to do in terms of Questing, there Craglorn was, teasing me with it's Stargazer questline that I had picked up ten vet levels ago. I don't have friends, and no Guild at the time, and I get my butt handed to me by random mobs. I get to the first Quest that's in a Dwemer ruin and all I could do was use Streak over and over to get myself past all the Mobs to the end where the Objective was, then let them kill me so I could respawn using a Soul Gem once they all ran back to their starting positions.

Yeah. So fun.

Dubhliam · May 2016

ArchMikem wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I would like to see it have meaningful endgame content again. Scale it up to the max level like Wrothgar etc. and add some daily quests.

Remove the forced caps for number of players to run the content without lowering the difficulty, keep it aimed at a group but allow solo players or groups less than four to try.

Scaling it up to Level Cap and changing the mob count down to normal would be the best thing they could do for Craglorn.

When I finally finished Cadwell's Gold and had nothing much more to do in terms of Questing, there Craglorn was, teasing me with it's Stargazer questline that I had picked up ten vet levels ago. I don't have friends, and no Guild at the time, and I get my butt handed to me by random mobs. I get to the first Quest that's in a Dwemer ruin and all I could do was use Streak over and over to get myself past all the Mobs to the end where the Objective was, then let them kill me so I could respawn using a Soul Gem once they all ran back to their starting positions.

Yeah. So fun.

Craglorn is a group zone.
Meaning you should group with people.

That being said, Craglorn IS, and WILL BE soloable. I soloed much of the Craglorn content, up to the extent where the game requires more people to progress - these group requirements should be removed.

Reasoning is simple:
If you cannot solo a group zone you have two options:
1. get a group
2. get better

ArchMikem · May 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

1. get a group

Stand at the Wayshrine and spam group invites until eventually one or two say yes and then hope they just tag along until I'm done? Got it.

2. get better

Get Gud is not a valid suggestion.

daemonios · May 2016

I think Craglorn should keep the group-walls. It's one zone in the whole game that has this. It was always meant to be a group zone, and it wasn't really soloable until the character power creep caught up with it. I know it isn't a popular opinion but I like the game to have diversity.

ArchMikem wrote: »

Get Gud is not a valid suggestion.

Why not? I think it's perfectly valid in a number of cases, this being one of them.

NewBlacksmurf · May 2016

Sausage wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

Revisit Craglorn is great idea, and also put it to the Crown Store as DLC like IC or Orsinium etc. I really hope it stays as group-oriented though, they just need to make working group-finder for it.

Well here is the problem with that. Tamriel unlimited says specifically per the news article that it's included at no additional cost so that can't happen.

It just needs to be updated and stay under the base game

Stuff changes all the time. I think if they made Craglorn as DLC it'd add more value to the sub. If they revisit Craglorn, that works as mini-DLC as well.

@Sausage

I have to strongly disagree that charging for it and locking any base game updates behind ESO plus is a good idea. It's a big no, no. It also doesn't add value because right now access exists. If you're seeking ESO plus value, ZOS can start with drastically increasing the current benefits or making them meaningful for all player types.

I do agree that the entire zone needs meaningful updates and would prefer it stay as a top tier group zone

Dubhliam · May 2016

ArchMikem wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

1. get a group

Stand at the Wayshrine and spam group invites until eventually one or two say yes and then hope they just tag along until I'm done? Got it.

2. get better

Get Gud is not a valid suggestion.

1. If you got to level 50 (requirement for Craglorn) and did not get into a guild, you chose to gimp yourself. While solo play might be valid at some places, don't expect to come into a lvl 50+ group zone and solo it. Guilds (and buddy lists) exist for a reason. There are always people willing to help and teach you.
2. Why is "get gud" not a valid suggestion? There are plenty of people that can solo Craglorn content easily, if you can't that only means you have a lot of room for improvement.

ZOS can only help people to an extent. If players refuse to learn, group, adapt... then there is nothing anyone can do for them.

Emma_Overload · May 2016

1) Remove artificial "group walling".

2) Scale mobs, loot and XP to CP160.

3) Make Scaled Court motif available.

4) Keep difficulty the same.

GreenhaloX · May 2016

I hope they work on giving much more XP and better reward drops in Craglorn. For it being at V11, it is much harder than fighting those V16 enemies. We should get more XP for that. I can take out 6-8 V16 enemies ganging up on me in Wrothgar, but 3 in Craglorn gave me a freaking challenge. Those enemies you would get from 445 to 660 XP a piece in Wrothgar, you only get from 34 to 114 in Craglorn, and you're pretty much fighting for your life in Craglorn, even though you're at V16. What is up?? I would love to do more in Craglorn, but it is not fun or worth the effort for such low XP and lesser reward drops.

vyndral13preub18_ESO · May 2016

Whatever it is im sure they will find a way to sell it to us.

For example a revamp of craglorn that lines up with a dlc. So while crag is revamped most of the new goodies in it actually start as quest in the new dlc.

Anyway i just bought a reskinned cat for 40$ i doubt they will 'reskin' a whole zone and not sell it.

Unless it is a selling point of the expansion....

Lunerdog · May 2016

I've always liked the Craglorn environment, I like just being there, making it soloable plus scale to group would be great.

But I get the feeling that if Zos puts effort into it then they'll want paying for doing so.

Skyy · May 2016

It might have already been said, but I would like to see the activities that currently have 4-man locks to have those removed and bring the difficulty up to where it actually takes 4 people, or at least where it isn't a snooze fest for just 1.

Sausage · May 2016

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

Revisit Craglorn is great idea, and also put it to the Crown Store as DLC like IC or Orsinium etc. I really hope it stays as group-oriented though, they just need to make working group-finder for it.

Well here is the problem with that. Tamriel unlimited says specifically per the news article that it's included at no additional cost so that can't happen.

It just needs to be updated and stay under the base game

Stuff changes all the time. I think if they made Craglorn as DLC it'd add more value to the sub. If they revisit Craglorn, that works as mini-DLC as well.

@Sausage

I have to strongly disagree that charging for it and locking any base game updates behind ESO plus is a good idea. It's a big no, no. It also doesn't add value because right now access exists. If you're seeking ESO plus value, ZOS can start with drastically increasing the current benefits or making them meaningful for all player types.

I do agree that the entire zone needs meaningful updates and would prefer it stay as a top tier group zone

Well, of course they would give it for free for all current players, but for future players they need to pay.

DPShiro · May 2016

Please remove the silly buttons that I need other people for, I should be able to do the main quests without these stopping me.

jcaceresw · May 2016

paleobonesb14_ESO wrote: »

I hope they add the Yokudan motif to Craglorn. Have it drop in the delves either in urns like the dwemer or from bosses like Hew's bane with outlaw. I really want that motif!!

I really like craglorn, it looks great and the quests are interesting. The rewards though

Oh yes!!! I want that motif too!!! I love the "Air" set design (not the boring ones on last motifs)

Abeille · May 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

Abeille wrote: »

Including the scale mechanics used on DLC zones in Craglorn would help a lot.

With that, I mean:
Zone being scaled to CR160.
Scaling players to CR150.
Having CR150 and CR160 drops.
Scaling the nodes to player level and crafting skill.

So really, making it like any DLC zone.
I do not think they should make it more "solo friendly", except for maybe removing the artificial limits. I think there are at least two quests that need more than one people not because they are hard, but because the mechanics to progress require multiple players (I think one requires people to stand on plates to open a door? Bear with me, it's been forever since I did Craglorn). But the overall difficulty of the groups of enemies and bosses shouldn't change, in my opinion. And with it scaled to CR160, it would make a great challenge.

Maybe add a few cosmetic rewards. Content will be done if people find it to be rewarding, and cosmetic rewards are great because they don't get obsolete with new releases.

My thought were very much like yours but I've had a few concerns come up since I started thinking about it:

If they convert it into a DLC with the battle leveling, and node scaling, will that mean Craglorn will be accessible from levels lower than 50?
If we follow the logic, I'd say yes - they don't want to lock the content they just sold to their customers behind a level requirement.

If this happens, Craglorn will lose the one appealing thing it has - challenge and player grouping.
I anticipate the content will be laughably easy even compared to current v11/v13 mob difficulty, which would make some quests that REQUIRE a group of 3 or 4 even more frustrating than they already are.

I would also like nothing better than to reward ZOS' hard work with my money, but not if their hard work would result in a carebear version of today's Craglorn.

If they leave the lvl 50 requirement, it is an indication by itself that players entering that area should expect a challenge, and are at least somewhat ready to take that challenge on because they had time to level their skills.

That being said, the content is already there. It was done long ago, and already paid itself off. A simple bump to max level, some new sets put into the reward containers and some minor quest tweaking are not at all that hard to pull off.
After all, the major work on any new DLC is actually designing the map, creatures, creating a storyline, voice acting etc.

Craglorn is not being sold, though, so I think it is very possible that they make it like a DLC on every regard but access. They can opt to go that way, but I don't think it will hurt if they keep the restriction. Craglorn is part of the base game, even if it was released after the game went live. It was advertised like it when there was the B2P conversion. I don't see them making it into a paid DLC and selling it to new players.

And if they are not selling it, there is not such a big reason to make access unrestricted by level. They still might decide to do so just so that everyone can experience the "New and Improved Craglorn" from the get go, but if they decide to do that, it won't be for the same reason they do it to DLCs, since they are not selling it (I hope).

I imagined the scaling only including CP scaling (which would mean an increase on HP/Magicka/Stamina and not on the CP passives), not level.

kojou · May 2016

I support scaling Craglorn to CP160.

I support removing levers and pads that require groups.

I don't support anything to make it easier content. If anything it needs to be made harder. There is already enough easy content. We need more moderately difficult content. Ideally I would like the whole zone somewhere between Veteran Dungeons and vMoL. If it was scaled properly and gave decent rewards then you would have no problems finding groups.