I can see how race and class should be permanent: they affect starting stats and skill lines, so creating an alt is the right way to explore those other options. And alliance is tied to race and central to the PVP aspect of the game.

But, having come to identify with my main character as one does after hundreds of hours, I find it pretty dumb that the face I rushed to create when I was eager to start playing on day one is the one I'm stuck with forever. It's pretty simple programming, and it's already in the game.

I've heard that they will someday implement a "barbershop" or the like to allow cosmetic adjustments, but it seems to be somewhere near player housing in the priorities queue.

Elsterchen wrote: »

Electroheadz wrote: »

@Azurephoenix999 I agree with that all of these features should be available to us. The more options and freedom we have the better for us. And giving us these options at reasonable price will leave both sides, the devs and players happy.

And what about all those people that are against it ?

Well, it's quite easy to explain. You can split them into few groups. You either have a group of people that had to reroll multiple characters and they don't really care for You/Us since they already done it and are not in a need of such feature. It's called being an egoist.

The second group of people had probably done the same thing - rerolled a few times to fix their "mistakes". But their reason behind voting against it is that they envy the others will have an option to instantly do changes. Unlike our unfortunate group that had to put time and effort to achieve this.

Another one would be people that simply won't be able to or will not want to to pay extra money (considering that race change for example will be a crown store item) for it.

As for the group that screams: "PEOPLE WILL KEEP HOPPING TO FOTM". It's a dev job to avoid having such an imbalance in game so people won't "migrate" with each new patch. In reality we all know how most of the time that "balance" turns out, but should a player feel handicapped due to a game imperfections ? I'll leave that to answer for Yourself


So as You can see even thou we are all here to have some fun in virtual world, the difficulties we face are quite same as in everyday life. Majority of people You'll meet will be selfish, envious and stubborn mules that limit their vision only to one perspective.

BUT !

In regards to the topic - ability to change Your body/hair visuals is coming for sure as it was confirmed. And if You ask i'd say that race/class are coming here too sooner or later as it will a great way for ZoS to earn some more coin.

@Electroheadz Oh my ... you again

Hmm, you definately forgot the 3rd group those of us that never rerolled a character and do not see any need in doing so ... just out of curiosity... how would you call those?

Btw I think its really selfish, stuborn and dull to scream for a "I want to change this" and "i want to change that", because: I am not willing to think about what i got and what i can do with it. Or do you say people that "mess up" 8 characters are bright and visionary ?

... and, on top of all, instead of shamefully deleting their "failed" creations (and please note... I am not the one to judge that, everyone who wants to change XYZ on their character has done this judgement for the character they want to change already), they come to the forum and demand changes.

I do not think allowing changes makes these people any smarter in their choices... or is giving them a better experience.

I can see that You came to make a fool out of Yourself on another thread ? Need my help to achieve it yet again hmm ? Right away Sir !


Your question: "Hmm, you definately forgot the 3rd group those of us that never rerolled a character and do not see any need in doing so ... just out of curiosity... how would you call those? "

The answer: It would be called "people unaffected by the change" thus they should not be worried at all. If a snow starts falling in the middle of the summer in Canada it's not like You're going to hop on Your snowmobile while living in Germany right ? Simple huh ?

You wrote: "Btw I think its really selfish, stuborn and dull to scream for a "I want to change this" and "i want to change that", because: I am not willing to think about what i got and what i can do with it.Or do you say people that "mess up" 8 characters are bright and visionary ?"

Wait a moment, so You are going to tell me that You are against someone else's ability to make a change concerning only their account that has literally no impact on You at all ? And that is not being selfish ?! What makes You think You have a right to decide about anybody's personal choices ?

So if someone has a will to do something that is not considered "as any of Your needs", You are totally against it? It's like being against people who want to wear pink shirts on the other side of the globe just because "You never liked pink and refuse to wear it".

Daaaamn @Elsterchen , I bet You must be a real f*****g prince charming in real life.

OP your thread title and subject are actually 100% opposite of what an MMO stands for, they should be permanent... Oh you didn't save that person, you chose to do that now live with the consequences! There is no quicksave and reload if you don't like what you chose to do.

Permanent character attributes are only good when the game has some consistency. Truth is the gameplay has been turned upside down so many times in such short amount of time that you can't have build consistency. Should I have to reroll my character or rely on alt gameplay to circumvent that? It's not like one wakes up and think they want to try something new today, some people got screwed up because they min/max their mains or only chars and 2 weeks later ZOS change the whole game etc. What is it to anyone what other player changes their character stuff, you have nothing to do with their choice so stay out of the way. I'm perfectly satisfied with my race/class combo since day 1 but I will stand for the right of people to choose if they can afford. Plus think of the revenues. Again, nobody has nothing to do with other people's choices.

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

Race has relatively little impact on a character's playstyle, and people should be able to make their character any race they want it to be.

As of now, there is only one race which has little to none impact on a character's playstyle - Nords. Other races have pretty decent passives

I can't believe people are still arguing over this. If there is race change then that means every single update everyone will just change to whatever race is best for their class on that update.

If there were race changes, I would want it to be a one time deal; but the sad thing is, that still wouldn't satisfy the people pushing for this; because the people who want this so badly to the point of arguing, are people who are indecisive and constantly changing their minds.

So basically, I see no way in making everyone happy. Implement it and allow unlimited use, then everyone picks the same race and there's no diversity. Limit to one use per character, and people still complain because they changed their mind yet again one week later.

WhoThenNow7 wrote: »

I can't believe people are still arguing over this. If there is race change then that means every single update everyone will just change to whatever race is best for their class on that update.

If there were race changes, I would want it to be a one time deal; but the sad thing is, that still wouldn't satisfy the people pushing for this; because the people who want this so badly to the point of arguing, are people who are indecisive and constantly changing their minds.

So basically, I see no way in making everyone happy. Implement it and allow unlimited use, then everyone picks the same race and there's no diversity. Limit to one use per character, and people still complain because they changed their mind yet again one week later.

Rofl. Why does it matter how many times someone wants to change their race? It's their money, it doesn't effect your gameplay. And changing races based on updates is totally legitimate. Some players like to min/max, that's not a problem.

Everyone won't be the same race. You're being over dramatic.

WhoThenNow7 wrote: »

Sogreth wrote: »

WhoThenNow7 wrote: »

I can't believe people are still arguing over this. If there is race change then that means every single update everyone will just change to whatever race is best for their class on that update.

If there were race changes, I would want it to be a one time deal; but the sad thing is, that still wouldn't satisfy the people pushing for this; because the people who want this so badly to the point of arguing, are people who are indecisive and constantly changing their minds.

So basically, I see no way in making everyone happy. Implement it and allow unlimited use, then everyone picks the same race and there's no diversity. Limit to one use per character, and people still complain because they changed their mind yet again one week later.

Rofl. Why does it matter how many times someone wants to change their race? It's their money, it doesn't effect your gameplay. And changing races based on updates is totally legitimate. Some players like to min/max, that's not a problem.

Everyone won't be the same race. You're being over dramatic.

I'm sorry but I just don't see the point in having multiple character slots if you can just change everyone about one character. Maybe they should just limit it to one slot and enable the player to change anything any time they want.

Hard to think? I understand, it's not for everyone.

I don't agree with changing class, I think that one is too great of a change. But anything cosmetic, including race, should be changeable. So that's what your other character slots are for. By your logic, we only need 4 character slots, one for each class.

Sogreth wrote: »

Rofl. Why does it matter how many times someone wants to change their race? It's their money, it doesn't effect your gameplay. And changing races based on updates is totally legitimate. Some players like to min/max, that's not a problem.

Everyone won't be the same race. You're being over dramatic.

No one payed for this, it was not included in the price, unless it's bought separately.
And I for one do not agree on having this.
There IS a perfect system for all this: DELETE and restart.
Use what you have.

Electroheadz wrote: »

Elsterchen wrote: »

Electroheadz wrote: »

@Azurephoenix999 I agree with that all of these features should be available to us. The more options and freedom we have the better for us. And giving us these options at reasonable price will leave both sides, the devs and players happy.

And what about all those people that are against it ?

Well, it's quite easy to explain. You can split them into few groups. You either have a group of people that had to reroll multiple characters and they don't really care for You/Us since they already done it and are not in a need of such feature. It's called being an egoist.

The second group of people had probably done the same thing - rerolled a few times to fix their "mistakes". But their reason behind voting against it is that they envy the others will have an option to instantly do changes. Unlike our unfortunate group that had to put time and effort to achieve this.

Another one would be people that simply won't be able to or will not want to to pay extra money (considering that race change for example will be a crown store item) for it.

As for the group that screams: "PEOPLE WILL KEEP HOPPING TO FOTM". It's a dev job to avoid having such an imbalance in game so people won't "migrate" with each new patch. In reality we all know how most of the time that "balance" turns out, but should a player feel handicapped due to a game imperfections ? I'll leave that to answer for Yourself


So as You can see even thou we are all here to have some fun in virtual world, the difficulties we face are quite same as in everyday life. Majority of people You'll meet will be selfish, envious and stubborn mules that limit their vision only to one perspective.

BUT !

In regards to the topic - ability to change Your body/hair visuals is coming for sure as it was confirmed. And if You ask i'd say that race/class are coming here too sooner or later as it will a great way for ZoS to earn some more coin.

@Electroheadz Oh my ... you again

Hmm, you definately forgot the 3rd group those of us that never rerolled a character and do not see any need in doing so ... just out of curiosity... how would you call those?

Btw I think its really selfish, stuborn and dull to scream for a "I want to change this" and "i want to change that", because: I am not willing to think about what i got and what i can do with it. Or do you say people that "mess up" 8 characters are bright and visionary ?

... and, on top of all, instead of shamefully deleting their "failed" creations (and please note... I am not the one to judge that, everyone who wants to change XYZ on their character has done this judgement for the character they want to change already), they come to the forum and demand changes.

I do not think allowing changes makes these people any smarter in their choices... or is giving them a better experience.

I can see that You came to make a fool out of Yourself on another thread ? Need my help to achieve it yet again hmm ? Right away Sir !


Your question: "Hmm, you definately forgot the 3rd group those of us that never rerolled a character and do not see any need in doing so ... just out of curiosity... how would you call those? "

The answer: It would be called "people unaffected by the change" thus they should not be worried at all. If a snow starts falling in the middle of the summer in Canada it's not like You're going to hop on Your snowmobile while living in Germany right ? Simple huh ?

You wrote: "Btw I think its really selfish, stuborn and dull to scream for a "I want to change this" and "i want to change that", because: I am not willing to think about what i got and what i can do with it.Or do you say people that "mess up" 8 characters are bright and visionary ?"

Wait a moment, so You are going to tell me that You are against someone else's ability to make a change concerning only their account that has literally no impact on You at all ? And that is not being selfish ?! What makes You think You have a right to decide about anybody's personal choices ?

So if someone has a will to do something that is not considered "as any of Your needs", You are totally against it? It's like being against people who want to wear pink shirts on the other side of the globe just because "You never liked pink and refuse to wear it".

Daaaamn @Elsterchen , I bet You must be a real f*****g prince charming in real life.

You wrote: The answer: It would be called "people unaffected by the change" thus they should not be worried at all.

Are you telling me changes made in patches affect players differently? I always thought we play the same game. Did it ever occur to you that instead of whinning, some people might sit down and have a look at what is changed, how it affects them, possible workarounds/adaptations to their playstyle/build ... and instead of whinning on the forum and demanding silly obidience by Zeni (bc they can make noise and annoy everyone and get many annoying noisemakers in one thread, and they will tell their friends and their wife to be equally annoying bc they CAN), ... they just play on?

... (let that linger a moment pls, its a long sentence) ... (maybe read it again - I know your sight isn't the best...)...

You wrote: Wait a moment, so You are going to tell me that You are against someone else's ability to make a change concerning only their account that has literally no impact on You at all ? And that is not being selfish ?!

And this is where you are plain wrong (... or delusional?).
The OP and any other person wanting to change their class do not want to do so because they want to participate in non-competetive questing.
They want to do it because they like to take part in competitive endgame content.
i.e They want to be able to quickly change their needs to whatever they heard is giving them "the best chances in the competition", regardless of the fact that one needs to adept a playstyle to make full potential of any build.

Is it really "selfish" to point out that not only what you play ... but more often then not... how you play is making a build successfull?

Mind you, anyone actually building their character and learning to play it to successfully compete, did an investment (thinking and learning) none of the "changers" is willing to make. Anyone searching for competition and making investments of this kind is beeing impacted by "changers" directly (e.g. PVP) as well as indirectly (e.g. trials).

Is it really "selfish" to want an accomplishment/competion in a competitive environment have a value/meaning?

The OP is crying because of all those "wasted time" invested in a build that doesn't work for him/her in competitive endcontent...

Is it "selfish" to say: Hey never mind, try a new character, learn from what you did wrong? (After all everyone has 7 free-of-charge characterslots to retry ... 12 if he/she is willing to pay for it)
Maybe try using this weapon/respecing the attribute points this way/ try this skills rather then that/don#t just stand in stupid/... ?

There are so many helpfull people in the forum, giving advice ... even more help can be accquired from guildies, ingame.


You wrote: What makes You think You have a right to decide about anybody's personal choices ?

What do you mean "decide about anybodys personal choice"?
Was anyone forced to invest time playing a specific character/class/build?
Have they been forced to keep playing it?
Don't they have the choice to make 8 characters the way they like ?
Don't they have the choice to change their attributes and skills?

Please elaborate.

You wrote: So if someone has a will to do something that is not considered "as any of Your needs", You are totally against it? It's like being against people who want to wear pink shirts on the other side of the globe just because "You never liked pink and refuse to wear it".

Absolutely not. "Live and let live" is my motto for anything that doesn't affect me. But (see above) that isn't the case here, allowing fast acess to class/fraction changes will effect my experience in competitive endgame content directly as well as indirectly. ... I do think I have the right to be vocal about something affecting me, anyone has this right.



You wrote: Daaaamn @Elsterchen , I bet You must be a real f*****g prince charming in real life.

Princess... but yeah, amazing you are able to notice, given how short-sighted you are!

Well, see, that can go 2 ways: I mean, why don't you get over it? :P

It's not that hard to be a tad smarter or patient before you start something.
Put in a second to think of what you want, then go for it.
There's google to help you in case it's not that simple, or do like I do: not happy?
Re-roll.

FAR more advanteges re-rolling/restarting a new character!
Oh, and, hey, there's google, too, y'know. XD

Elsterchen wrote: »

Electroheadz wrote: »

Elsterchen wrote: »

Electroheadz wrote: »

@Azurephoenix999 I agree with that all of these features should be available to us. The more options and freedom we have the better for us. And giving us these options at reasonable price will leave both sides, the devs and players happy.

And what about all those people that are against it ?

Well, it's quite easy to explain. You can split them into few groups. You either have a group of people that had to reroll multiple characters and they don't really care for You/Us since they already done it and are not in a need of such feature. It's called being an egoist.

The second group of people had probably done the same thing - rerolled a few times to fix their "mistakes". But their reason behind voting against it is that they envy the others will have an option to instantly do changes. Unlike our unfortunate group that had to put time and effort to achieve this.

Another one would be people that simply won't be able to or will not want to to pay extra money (considering that race change for example will be a crown store item) for it.

As for the group that screams: "PEOPLE WILL KEEP HOPPING TO FOTM". It's a dev job to avoid having such an imbalance in game so people won't "migrate" with each new patch. In reality we all know how most of the time that "balance" turns out, but should a player feel handicapped due to a game imperfections ? I'll leave that to answer for Yourself


So as You can see even thou we are all here to have some fun in virtual world, the difficulties we face are quite same as in everyday life. Majority of people You'll meet will be selfish, envious and stubborn mules that limit their vision only to one perspective.

BUT !

In regards to the topic - ability to change Your body/hair visuals is coming for sure as it was confirmed. And if You ask i'd say that race/class are coming here too sooner or later as it will a great way for ZoS to earn some more coin.

@Electroheadz Oh my ... you again

Hmm, you definately forgot the 3rd group those of us that never rerolled a character and do not see any need in doing so ... just out of curiosity... how would you call those?

Btw I think its really selfish, stuborn and dull to scream for a "I want to change this" and "i want to change that", because: I am not willing to think about what i got and what i can do with it. Or do you say people that "mess up" 8 characters are bright and visionary ?

... and, on top of all, instead of shamefully deleting their "failed" creations (and please note... I am not the one to judge that, everyone who wants to change XYZ on their character has done this judgement for the character they want to change already), they come to the forum and demand changes.

I do not think allowing changes makes these people any smarter in their choices... or is giving them a better experience.

I can see that You came to make a fool out of Yourself on another thread ? Need my help to achieve it yet again hmm ? Right away Sir !


Your question: "Hmm, you definately forgot the 3rd group those of us that never rerolled a character and do not see any need in doing so ... just out of curiosity... how would you call those? "

The answer: It would be called "people unaffected by the change" thus they should not be worried at all. If a snow starts falling in the middle of the summer in Canada it's not like You're going to hop on Your snowmobile while living in Germany right ? Simple huh ?

You wrote: "Btw I think its really selfish, stuborn and dull to scream for a "I want to change this" and "i want to change that", because: I am not willing to think about what i got and what i can do with it.Or do you say people that "mess up" 8 characters are bright and visionary ?"

Wait a moment, so You are going to tell me that You are against someone else's ability to make a change concerning only their account that has literally no impact on You at all ? And that is not being selfish ?! What makes You think You have a right to decide about anybody's personal choices ?

So if someone has a will to do something that is not considered "as any of Your needs", You are totally against it? It's like being against people who want to wear pink shirts on the other side of the globe just because "You never liked pink and refuse to wear it".

Daaaamn @Elsterchen , I bet You must be a real f*****g prince charming in real life.

You wrote: The answer: It would be called "people unaffected by the change" thus they should not be worried at all.

Are you telling me changes made in patches affect players differently? I always thought we play the same game. Did it ever occur to you that instead of whinning, some people might sit down and have a look at what is changed, how it affects them, possible workarounds/adaptations to their playstyle/build ... and instead of whinning on the forum and demanding silly obidience by Zeni (bc they can make noise and annoy everyone and get many annoying noisemakers in one thread, and they will tell their friends and their wife to be equally annoying bc they CAN), ... they just play on?

... (let that linger a moment pls, its a long sentence) ... (maybe read it again - I know your sight isn't the best...)...

You wrote: Wait a moment, so You are going to tell me that You are against someone else's ability to make a change concerning only their account that has literally no impact on You at all ? And that is not being selfish ?!

And this is where you are plain wrong (... or delusional?).
The OP and any other person wanting to change their class do not want to do so because they want to participate in non-competetive questing.
They want to do it because they like to take part in competitive endgame content.
i.e They want to be able to quickly change their needs to whatever they heard is giving them "the best chances in the competition", regardless of the fact that one needs to adept a playstyle to make full potential of any build.

Is it really "selfish" to point out that not only what you play ... but more often then not... how you play is making a build successfull?

Mind you, anyone actually building their character and learning to play it to successfully compete, did an investment (thinking and learning) none of the "changers" is willing to make. Anyone searching for competition and making investments of this kind is beeing impacted by "changers" directly (e.g. PVP) as well as indirectly (e.g. trials).

Is it really "selfish" to want an accomplishment/competion in a competitive environment have a value/meaning?

The OP is crying because of all those "wasted time" invested in a build that doesn't work for him/her in competitive endcontent...

Is it "selfish" to say: Hey never mind, try a new character, learn from what you did wrong? (After all everyone has 7 free-of-charge characterslots to retry ... 12 if he/she is willing to pay for it)
Maybe try using this weapon/respecing the attribute points this way/ try this skills rather then that/don#t just stand in stupid/... ?

There are so many helpfull people in the forum, giving advice ... even more help can be accquired from guildies, ingame.


You wrote: What makes You think You have a right to decide about anybody's personal choices ?

What do you mean "decide about anybodys personal choice"?
Was anyone forced to invest time playing a specific character/class/build?
Have they been forced to keep playing it?
Don't they have the choice to make 8 characters the way they like ?
Don't they have the choice to change their attributes and skills?

Please elaborate.

You wrote: So if someone has a will to do something that is not considered "as any of Your needs", You are totally against it? It's like being against people who want to wear pink shirts on the other side of the globe just because "You never liked pink and refuse to wear it".

Absolutely not. "Live and let live" is my motto for anything that doesn't affect me. But (see above) that isn't the case here, allowing fast acess to class/fraction changes will effect my experience in competitive endgame content directly as well as indirectly. ... I do think I have the right to be vocal about something affecting me, anyone has this right.



You wrote: Daaaamn @Elsterchen , I bet You must be a real f*****g prince charming in real life.

Princess... but yeah, amazing you are able to notice, given how short-sighted you are!

You're right with everything. I agree with everything You wrote. You've won ! Good job !

I have created more chars and deleted more chars than most of you combined believe me... That's why up until 19 Dec 2015 my highest lvl char was still only level 21 or 22. The point is if you don't like what you have made make a new main. That's what MMO's like.