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• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
Official Feedback Thread for Templars
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Zheg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Sad truth is that even if by some miracle Wrobel admits he done effed up with this change, I'd be flabbergasted if they were able to actually revert/fix the code by the time DB launches. The fact that we don't even know where ZOS stands on this weeks later from PTS launch is par for the course.
Also, never listen to this scrub.12 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...Edited by DDuke on May 9, 2016 2:25PM2 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Thanks for the feedback on the Templar changes so far. We appreciate the constructive arguments in this thread and agree with the feedback over the loss of Purifying Ritual (now Ritual of Retribution) that many of you have pointed out.
In today's PTS patch, you should see the following changes:- Extended Ritual: This morph now also removes 5 harmful effects from yourself when cast, in addition to increasing the duration of the skill.
- Ritual of Retribution: This morph has had its healing done to you and your allies increased by 20%. The damage done to enemies has been increased to match this value.
Our goal with this change is to make two clear and competitive morph choices for Templars using the Cleansing Ritual skill. Extended Ritual is now the more defensive and efficiency-focused morph, great for removing all those enemy debuffs in PvP (like poisons!) or healing allies in PvE without having to recast it as frequently. Ritual of Retribution is now the more offensive and power-focused morph, great for protecting your Templar house, pulling those sneaky Nightblades out of invisibility, or doing slightly more HPS at the cost of spending more Magicka and button-presses to maintain it.
WOW. Cant believe my eyes you've listened us.
Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]8 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Edited by timidobserver on May 9, 2016 2:40PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)3 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
The dmg on Retribution should double every 2 seconds they remain in our house. "Wrath of the light"1 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.Edited by DDuke on May 9, 2016 2:44PM0 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
The dmg on Retribution should double every 2 seconds they remain in our house. "Wrath of the light"
Would, be nice but I am satisfied with what we got. I won't be running that morph anyway until they make it stop proccing fasallas, assuming that the reports that it procs fasallas are true. The damage would be nice, but I need this have 5 debuffs removed when NBs start debuff spamming me.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)3 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Well let them templars have nice toys once in a while. I mean in the big picture..timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
Still it's not as good as the old glorious shield and blinding awesomeness, but it's ok i think. I like it.Edited by Soris on May 9, 2016 2:55PMWelkynd [Templar/AD/EU]0 -
Cinbri✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
Long time ago on forum when me and @Akinos tried to proove that heavy armor templar is strong, reply from other templars literally was "noobs". Glad to see those time passed.Edited by Cinbri on May 9, 2016 2:53PM1 -
danno8✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
The dmg on Retribution should double every 2 seconds they remain in our house. "Wrath of the light"
Would, be nice but I am satisfied with what we got. I won't be running that morph anyway until they make it stop proccing fasallas, assuming that the reports that it procs fasallas are true. The damage would be nice, but I need this have 5 debuffs removed when NBs start debuff spamming me.
Agreed. I'll gladly take the snare and 5 removed negative affects to the bank.
However, for the combat team, feedback. Keep in mind that in PvP at least, whenever you increase a skill by x% it is in fact increased by x/2. So that 20% more healing/damage is only 10% in Cyro.
What that means for this skill (Retribution) in particular that ticks every 2 seconds, is that the extra 10% does not even equate to one extra tick of damage/healing for the duration of the 12s skill. In fact it equates to basically one half of a tick of healing/damage over the course of the skill.4 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
With the exception of the 50k+ health blazing shield build, I don' t see anything too scary about a Templar in heavy armor next patch. Yeh it will be extremely viable for sure but far from scary. With poisons you are going to need like 25k-30k+ armor for it to be worth anything anyway.Edited by timidobserver on May 9, 2016 3:02PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
booksmcread✭✭✭✭This post from @ZOS_KNowak is indeed a positive one. Good to see some communication and a positive change to our abilities. This is definitely a step in the right direction, but by no means should it end here. There are still a lot of other fixes and tweaks that need to happen.
Off the top of my head, a few improvements I would like see are as follows (and by no means is this an all-inclusive list).- Fix Focused Charge so you don't get stuck in the animation.
- Increase the duration of Spear Shards and speed up the animation and travel time.
- Buff Spear Wall to include ranged attacks.
- Increase the initial damage hit of Vampire's Bane and add one more target to Reflective Light.
- Eclipse: In the last Templar feedback thread, someone proposed making one of the Eclipse morphs a self-cast and function like the Absorb Magic morph of Defensive Posture (like how DKs Scales functions like the Defensive Stance morph). I thought this was a pretty awesome suggestion. That would make a very strong defensive skill.
- Please make Rite of Passage a ground targeted ability like Negate so that we can still function while it is active.
- Remove movement speed penalty while channeling Healing Ritual.
- Allow Radiant Aura to stack with buffs from potions.
- Increase the duration of effects after leaving the area of Rune Focus to 10 seconds from 8.
4 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
The dmg on Retribution should double every 2 seconds they remain in our house. "Wrath of the light"
Would, be nice but I am satisfied with what we got. I won't be running that morph anyway until they make it stop proccing fasallas, assuming that the reports that it procs fasallas are true. The damage would be nice, but I need this have 5 debuffs removed when NBs start debuff spamming me.
Agreed. I'll gladly take the snare and 5 removed negative affects to the bank.
However, for the combat team, feedback. Keep in mind that in PvP at least, whenever you increase a skill by x% it is in fact increased by x/2. So that 20% more healing/damage is only 10% in Cyro.
What that means for this skill (Retribution) in particular that ticks every 2 seconds, is that the extra 10% does not even equate to one extra tick of damage/healing for the duration of the 12s skill. In fact it equates to basically one half of a tick of healing/damage over the course of the skill.
Basically this.
What it boils down to me is that the "Purifying Ritual" I am using in PvP on Live will work the same way it does in DB, last longer, and now add a little snare. Can't complain, it's a better ability!
However, if the goal was to make the morphs compelling, to indeed "pulling those sneaky Nightblades out of invisibility," I am pretty sure those templar who experiment with this morph in PvP will switch back. Those sneaky Nightblades have a single, common skill that puts 3 debuffs, and that does not get into the constant snares, maims, heal, and resistance debuffs NBs constantly put on opponents (indeed, every single surprise attack inflicts an armor and spell debuff). That's going to be way too many button presses for minor buffs that are already being reduced by 50%.
Now ... if I was a pure PvE player, my fellow raid-mates are going to like those 20% extra heals as well as the passive large area DPS on trash pulls, which are basically free additions to the cleansing ritual spell they use now, since they won't go with exteneded as even PvE bosses don't stack debuffs that players have to cleanse.
In a vacuum I'd say the morphs are relatively about the same level of effectiveness, but I think the choice a templar makes will almost be predetermined whether or not they primarily PvP or PvE.Edited by Joy_Division on May 9, 2016 3:15PMMake Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.5 -
Zheg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
The increase to skill costs from vet level removal hit Templars hard because our skills are some of the most expensive among the 4 classes. I was not a fan of heavy armor on PTS simply because of how expensive everything was in magicka. I feel tankier with a bigger hp and stam pool on 5 light than I do switching to heavy armor now.timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
Long time ago on forum when me and @Akinos tried to proove that heavy armor templar is strong, reply from other templars literally was "noobs". Glad to see those time passed.
I also feel like TG made our skills a bit more spam-necessary for healing because there is so much damage flying around and many heal debuffs. This, with the increased costs, yick.
0 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
With the exception of the 50k+ health blazing shield build, I don' t see anything too scary about a Templar in heavy armor next patch. Yeh it will be extremely viable for sure but far from scary. With poisons you are going to need like 25k-30k+ armor for it to be worth anything anyway.
It is already not only "extremely viable", but one of the best builds in PvP.
You don't need Blazing Shield to tank zergs, you can do that with sweeps & enough impen, mitigation & spell dmg/magicka.
All while still being capable of beating anyone (or forcing a tie) in 1v1 fights, or acting as a group support healing allies with Honor the Dead.
Next patch, it's all of that but more.Edited by DDuke on May 9, 2016 3:20PM2 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
The increase to skill costs from vet level removal hit Templars hard because our skills are some of the most expensive among the 4 classes. I was not a fan of heavy armor on PTS simply because of how expensive everything was in magicka. I feel tankier with a bigger hp and stam pool on 5 light than I do switching to heavy armor now.timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
Long time ago on forum when me and @Akinos tried to proove that heavy armor templar is strong, reply from other templars literally was "noobs". Glad to see those time passed.
I also feel like TG made our skills a bit more spam-necessary for healing because there is so much damage flying around and many heal debuffs. This, with the increased costs, yick.
Magicka sustain shouldn't ever be an issue for magicka templar - not if you have the right skills on bar. Next patch, Constitution buff should more than make up for the higher skill costs.Edited by DDuke on May 9, 2016 3:23PM0 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
✭
<--- Heavy armor templar since november 2014. Proud and looks badass in steel. And ofc with a khajiit helm as always.timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
Long time ago on forum when me and @Akinos tried to proove that heavy armor templar is strong, reply from other templars literally was "noobs". Glad to see those time passed.
Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]0 -
Zheg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
You try healing a raid against 60+reds permarooting with bombard spam and pelting you with siege the while time
The increase to skill costs from vet level removal hit Templars hard because our skills are some of the most expensive among the 4 classes. I was not a fan of heavy armor on PTS simply because of how expensive everything was in magicka. I feel tankier with a bigger hp and stam pool on 5 light than I do switching to heavy armor now.timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
Long time ago on forum when me and @Akinos tried to proove that heavy armor templar is strong, reply from other templars literally was "noobs". Glad to see those time passed.
I also feel like TG made our skills a bit more spam-necessary for healing because there is so much damage flying around and many heal debuffs. This, with the increased costs, yick.
Magicka sustain shouldn't ever be an issue for magicka templar - not if you have the right skills on bar. Next patch, Constitution buff should more than make up for the higher skill costs.
magicka sustain is definitely an issue you need to be mindful of in those situations.
If you're talking magplar, then yeah, you have the option to pull off and conserve magicka as you reposition.
I also did not find HtD viable for a main healer in a mid-large sized group. The burst damage is too much to keep up with, and blessing of resto is awkward and niche depending on environment. HtD is far more appropriate for small groups though. I can see a heavy armor Templar excelling in that environment, but still think LA wins out.0 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Thanks for the feedback on the Templar changes so far. We appreciate the constructive arguments in this thread and agree with the feedback over the loss of Purifying Ritual (now Ritual of Retribution) that many of you have pointed out.
In today's PTS patch, you should see the following changes:- Extended Ritual: This morph now also removes 5 harmful effects from yourself when cast, in addition to increasing the duration of the skill.
- Ritual of Retribution: This morph has had its healing done to you and your allies increased by 20%. The damage done to enemies has been increased to match this value.
Our goal with this change is to make two clear and competitive morph choices for Templars using the Cleansing Ritual skill. Extended Ritual is now the more defensive and efficiency-focused morph, great for removing all those enemy debuffs in PvP (like poisons!) or healing allies in PvE without having to recast it as frequently. Ritual of Retribution is now the more offensive and power-focused morph, great for protecting your Templar house, pulling those sneaky Nightblades out of invisibility, or doing slightly more HPS at the cost of spending more Magicka and button-presses to maintain it.
Thank you!
Both morphs now look viable, which is as it should be.0 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
You try healing a raid against 60+reds permarooting with bombard spam and pelting you with siege the while time
The increase to skill costs from vet level removal hit Templars hard because our skills are some of the most expensive among the 4 classes. I was not a fan of heavy armor on PTS simply because of how expensive everything was in magicka. I feel tankier with a bigger hp and stam pool on 5 light than I do switching to heavy armor now.timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
Long time ago on forum when me and @Akinos tried to proove that heavy armor templar is strong, reply from other templars literally was "noobs". Glad to see those time passed.
I also feel like TG made our skills a bit more spam-necessary for healing because there is so much damage flying around and many heal debuffs. This, with the increased costs, yick.
Magicka sustain shouldn't ever be an issue for magicka templar - not if you have the right skills on bar. Next patch, Constitution buff should more than make up for the higher skill costs. magicka sustain is definitely an issue you need to be mindful of in those situations.
If you're talking magplar, then yeah, you have the option to pull off and conserve magicka as you reposition.
I also did not find HtD viable for a main healer in a mid-large sized group. The burst damage is too much to keep up with, and blessing of resto is awkward and niche depending on environment. HtD is far more appropriate for small groups though. I can see a heavy armor Templar excelling in that environment, but still think LA wins out.
Yeah, for large groups LA should be much better.
Heavy Armor excels in smallscale, where there's more than a decent chance that you'll be heavily focused by opponents. If you aren't being focused at all, then light armor will by default be always better.
Still, you can spam Honor the Dead pretty much endlessly while standing in Channeled Focus, as long as you are healing people below 75% health 0 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
With the exception of the 50k+ health blazing shield build, I don' t see anything too scary about a Templar in heavy armor next patch. Yeh it will be extremely viable for sure but far from scary. With poisons you are going to need like 25k-30k+ armor for it to be worth anything anyway.
It is already not only "extremely viable", but one of the best builds in PvP.
You don't need Blazing Shield to tank zergs, you can do that with sweeps & enough impen, mitigation & spell dmg/magicka.
All while still being capable of beating anyone in 1v1 fights, or acting as a group support healing allies with Honor the Dead.
What definition of Zerg are you using? This is false unless you that type of player that considers any group of multiple players to be a zerg. Blazing Shield Templar is the most effective build for tanking large groups. For example, most groups just leave Yegorian alone at this point whereas a sweeps Templar just gets steamrolled.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)2 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
With the exception of the 50k+ health blazing shield build, I don' t see anything too scary about a Templar in heavy armor next patch. Yeh it will be extremely viable for sure but far from scary. With poisons you are going to need like 25k-30k+ armor for it to be worth anything anyway.
It is already not only "extremely viable", but one of the best builds in PvP.
You don't need Blazing Shield to tank zergs, you can do that with sweeps & enough impen, mitigation & spell dmg/magicka.
All while still being capable of beating anyone in 1v1 fights, or acting as a group support healing allies with Honor the Dead.
What definition of Zerg are you using? This is false unless you that type of player that considers any group of multiple players to be a zerg. Blazing Shield Templar is the most effective build for tanking large groups. For example, most groups just leave Yegorian alone at this point whereas a sweeps Templar just gets steamrolled.
Well, any amount with LoS really - I've had up to 20 people hitting me in one of those small rooms in keeps. It all comes down to how effectively you use Empowering Sweep.
But in open field, you can easily infinitely survive 5 people hitting you - when there's more than that you'll die, eventually.
Still, Blazing Shield templar is more effective for tanking large groups I agree - though it's weaker in 1v1 or vs smaller groups than a more conventional sweeps utilizing templar and can't act as group support.Edited by DDuke on May 9, 2016 3:53PM0 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Heavy Armor excels in smallscale, where there's more than a decent chance that you'll be heavily focused by opponents. If you aren't being focused at all, then light armor will by default be always better.
I'm theorycrafting a heavy armor magicka templar for DB; full house version. Not a tank, but with sustain and good defense, because I usually play in small groups where we are almost always outnumbered. It's loads of fun to play against PvE bosses on PTS, but whether or not it works in PvP remains to be seen. Your house is only going to be but so good against 3 or 4 archers sniping from the back.0 -
Zheg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭As wonderful as today's news was, I'd point out that we're mostly back to where we started. A bad change was remedied, but we still need a fix (note, not buff, a FIX) for eclipse, ritual, remembrance, dawn passives, being tethered to your focus for the benefit, radiant aura, and our shield. We've been waiting and saying the same things for about a year now.4 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
With the exception of the 50k+ health blazing shield build, I don' t see anything too scary about a Templar in heavy armor next patch. Yeh it will be extremely viable for sure but far from scary. With poisons you are going to need like 25k-30k+ armor for it to be worth anything anyway.
It is already not only "extremely viable", but one of the best builds in PvP.
You don't need Blazing Shield to tank zergs, you can do that with sweeps & enough impen, mitigation & spell dmg/magicka.
All while still being capable of beating anyone in 1v1 fights, or acting as a group support healing allies with Honor the Dead.
What definition of Zerg are you using? This is false unless you that type of player that considers any group of multiple players to be a zerg. Blazing Shield Templar is the most effective build for tanking large groups. For example, most groups just leave Yegorian alone at this point whereas a sweeps Templar just gets steamrolled.
Well, any amount with LoS really - I've had up to 20 people hitting me in one of those small rooms in keeps.
But in open field, you can easily survive 5 people hitting you - even 10~ for quite a while.
Still, Blazing Shield templar is more effective for tanking large groups I agree - though it's weaker in 1v1 or vs smaller groups than a more conventional sweeps utilizing templar and can't act as group support.
You are claiming to be able to tank "any" amount of players with LOS using sweep and you consider 5 to 10 people hitting on you in open field a zerg? Okay then.
V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭As wonderful as today's news was, I'd point out that we're mostly back to where we started. A bad change was remedied, but we still need a fix (note, not buff, a FIX) for eclipse, ritual, remembrance, dawn passives, being tethered to your focus for the benefit, radiant aura, and our shield. We've been waiting and saying the same things for about a year now.
Yeah, there are definitely a lot of underutilized and to some extent useless Templar skills still around
*Looks at Eclipse, Healing Ritual, Radiant Aura (not Repentance, the other morph) & Rite of Passage*
For Eclipse, I wonder how balanced it'd be if it became like Negate - but with cast time.
1,5 seconds cast time
Puts unbreakable silence effect on target for 2-3 seconds.0 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
With the exception of the 50k+ health blazing shield build, I don' t see anything too scary about a Templar in heavy armor next patch. Yeh it will be extremely viable for sure but far from scary. With poisons you are going to need like 25k-30k+ armor for it to be worth anything anyway.
It is already not only "extremely viable", but one of the best builds in PvP.
You don't need Blazing Shield to tank zergs, you can do that with sweeps & enough impen, mitigation & spell dmg/magicka.
All while still being capable of beating anyone in 1v1 fights, or acting as a group support healing allies with Honor the Dead.
What definition of Zerg are you using? This is false unless you that type of player that considers any group of multiple players to be a zerg. Blazing Shield Templar is the most effective build for tanking large groups. For example, most groups just leave Yegorian alone at this point whereas a sweeps Templar just gets steamrolled.
Well, any amount with LoS really - I've had up to 20 people hitting me in one of those small rooms in keeps.
But in open field, you can easily survive 5 people hitting you - even 10~ for quite a while.
Still, Blazing Shield templar is more effective for tanking large groups I agree - though it's weaker in 1v1 or vs smaller groups than a more conventional sweeps utilizing templar and can't act as group support.
You are claiming to be able to tank "any" amount of players with LOS using sweep and you consider 5 to 10 people hitting on you in open field a zerg? Okay then.
Well, if you know of a build capable of tanking better while also being good in 1v1 & smaller scale fights - do let me know
I'm not saying my build does large scale zerg tanking better than Blazing Shieldplar - but it's still pretty damn tanky and one of the best builds in the duel scene capable of competing with even the best stam DKs & magicka Sorcs.
This has lead me to the realization that magicka templar isn't as weak as some people like to claim/think.Edited by DDuke on May 9, 2016 4:03PM0 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »Wow... Actually I'm a bit scared now of how strong magicka templars are going to be next patch
And it's not even that clear choice which morph to pick, as they are both very powerful. The DoT might seem small, but for one button click it's a lot of potential damage that is going to help get through the healing of opponents.
If it doesn't work out, I guess there's always Extended Ritual to fall back to now...
The 20% buff is nice, but it is still going to do less damage than most other ground dots like Eruption, Caltrops, Liquid Lightning, ect because ritual ticks every 1 seconds whereas everything else ticks every one second.
There is nothing to be scared of.
Well, I didn't just mean that morph & Purify changes, but the big picture... If you look at how much heavy armor got buffed you'll understand how it might affect magicka templar which is currently one of the most viable builds for heavy armor.
With the exception of the 50k+ health blazing shield build, I don' t see anything too scary about a Templar in heavy armor next patch. Yeh it will be extremely viable for sure but far from scary. With poisons you are going to need like 25k-30k+ armor for it to be worth anything anyway.
It is already not only "extremely viable", but one of the best builds in PvP.
You don't need Blazing Shield to tank zergs, you can do that with sweeps & enough impen, mitigation & spell dmg/magicka.
All while still being capable of beating anyone in 1v1 fights, or acting as a group support healing allies with Honor the Dead.
What definition of Zerg are you using? This is false unless you that type of player that considers any group of multiple players to be a zerg. Blazing Shield Templar is the most effective build for tanking large groups. For example, most groups just leave Yegorian alone at this point whereas a sweeps Templar just gets steamrolled.
Well, any amount with LoS really - I've had up to 20 people hitting me in one of those small rooms in keeps. It all comes down to how effectively you use Empowering Sweep.
But in open field, you can easily infinitely survive 5 people hitting you - when there's more than that you'll die, eventually.
Still, Blazing Shield templar is more effective for tanking large groups I agree - though it's weaker in 1v1 or vs smaller groups than a more conventional sweeps utilizing templar and can't act as group support.
I see you've never faced with a half a decent nightblade in those groups who have a slight knowledge about how to build properly.
In those rare times when i play this game, whenever a stamblade attacks me from stealth with sa+weave+ulti combo while im fighting with 2 people, im dead, end of the story. That thing hits 20k in total when not blocked and it stuns. It will hit much harder in this patch since that ulti become physical damage now.
Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]0 -
Neoauspex✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Thanks for the feedback on the Templar changes so far. We appreciate the constructive arguments in this thread and agree with the feedback over the loss of Purifying Ritual (now Ritual of Retribution) that many of you have pointed out.
In today's PTS patch, you should see the following changes:- Extended Ritual: This morph now also removes 5 harmful effects from yourself when cast, in addition to increasing the duration of the skill.
- Ritual of Retribution: This morph has had its healing done to you and your allies increased by 20%. The damage done to enemies has been increased to match this value.
Our goal with this change is to make two clear and competitive morph choices for Templars using the Cleansing Ritual skill. Extended Ritual is now the more defensive and efficiency-focused morph, great for removing all those enemy debuffs in PvP (like poisons!) or healing allies in PvE without having to recast it as frequently. Ritual of Retribution is now the more offensive and power-focused morph, great for protecting your Templar house, pulling those sneaky Nightblades out of invisibility, or doing slightly more HPS at the cost of spending more Magicka and button-presses to maintain it.
Fantastic.0