ZOS - Its Time- You have to instance Cyrodiil

RinaldoGandolphi · May 2016

Look we all love the PVP in this game, but at this point im convinced they are going to have to instance Cyrodiil.

The Imperial City, when the Arena District gets too laggy, you can go to another district and the lag goes away. In Cyrodiil everyone can be balled up in the last Emp keep, and even if you go clear on the other side of the map you can't get away from it.

Its time to cut Cyrodiil into 4 pieces of a pie

Each piece of the Pie is its own instance just like each Cyrodiil Delve is.

When you move from part of part of Cyrodiil you will have a short load screen.

This is a small price to pay to allow players to get away from this 1000 ping nonsense. We should be able to move to another part of the map and get away from it.

Literally just cut Cyrodiil into 4 large pie pieces, and simply put a door at each mile gate. You go though the door, your in a different instance of Cyrodiil.

Give the players that don't want to play that kind of slideshow an option to get away from it.

If the zergs want to zerg and cause a 1000 ping fine, give me and others the choice of moving to a different part of the map(instance) so we can get away from it and actually have our skills and stuff work without lag.....

_Chaos · May 2016

Load screens or lag?
... I can't believe I'm saying this, but I choose load screens.

The lag is horrendous. Playing for an objective based guild has really hurt my desire to play at prime time considering we have an emp to dethrone every.single.night these days. I can't even drop group and go play on my own terms because as you said, it bogs the server down as a whole. Then I get pissed off and pug out, guildies probably think I'm suicidal(in-game, settle down) lately with all the zerg diving. The spin offs because of bad performance go much deeper than many perceive.

*** this game right now. How do you continue to get increasingly worse since beta?

RinaldoGandolphi · May 2016

Yes load screens is better then lag BUT i do have a fix for the load screens though. PST me and i'll tell you what to do to fix those load screens for good. it won't help with the lag though.

Rohamad_Ali · May 2016

Before I throw tomatoes at this thread , I have to admit ... nothing else has worked . The extinction of the cyrodil torchbug , the flying cyrodil deer ... . I hate instancing but I also hate wildlife cruelty . Tough call .

frozywozy · May 2016

I had a conversation with a friend yesterday on TS suggesting the same idea. I'm up for it.

KenaPKK · May 2016

I made a thread about this the other day.

I am in favor of the idea.

Although picking the locations for the instance divisions would be really difficult. There will undoubtedly be sacrifice involved.

I'd prefer if they just put a bunch of substantial objectives in the IC districts and sewers for us to fight over. Then a ton of people would be down in IC fighting in lagless, instances combat while alleviating some population pressure on Cyrodiil.

Ghostbane · May 2016

The obvious borders of instancing would be where the borderline landmarks are for alliances (milegates, bridges etc) which would be disappointing, because a lot of interesting and sometimes faction-tactical points can happen at these places.

Biggest cause of concern is point of entry, to the scale of the population, and the potential farming pitfalls via enemies. I'm not sure the IC purple cloak system will do it here, not on this scale.

I would have worried about global system messages from the rest of Cyro ( keep status', map swords etc ), but this seems to be no problem in IC, as you can see swords in other districts (each apparently instanced)

Pchela · May 2016

I mostly play during oceanic prime time lately while I live in NA eastern... And what I experienced last night in the hour or so I was on during NA pt was abysmal ... Up for any sort of ideas at this point. How would you suggest the instancing work, x number of players per area or ..?

Ishammael · May 2016

Gonna be honest, the allure of Cyrodiil is its openness. Load screens at the mile gates (or wherever) would be sad panda.

RinaldoGandolphi · May 2016

Ghostbane wrote: »

The obvious borders of instancing would be where the borderline landmarks are for alliances (milegates, bridges etc) which would be disappointing, because a lot of interesting and sometimes faction-tactical points can happen at these places.

Biggest cause of concern is point of entry, to the scale of the population, and the potential farming pitfalls via enemies. I'm not sure the IC purple cloak system will do it here, not on this scale.

I would have worried about global system messages from the rest of Cyro ( keep status', map swords etc ), but this seems to be no problem in IC, as you can see swords in other districts (each apparently instanced)

Very good points Ghostbane

they may be able to add landmarks in each instance to allow the gatefighting we have now to occur there.

They would also have to have a system in place to prevent people from camping the entry points. Perhaps just putting a mechanism similiar to what happens if an enemy gets into an opposing factions starter gates(you instantly die) to prevent folks from camping the door?

I think they could put a de-militarized zone in a certain radius around the door that once you step outside of it, you can't go back to it...it would be a new challenge to get right, but i know some sacrifices would have to be made but i think it would help a lot with the lag complaints. I also think players knowing they could move to another place and get away from the lag may actually encourage people to spread out somewhat.

I think instancing it could be good as long as its done correctly and a few key points your mentioning are properly addressed. You can still have large fights going on in each slice of the pie, GvG is still a thing, taking keeps and large battles will still be a thing, I don't want that to go away as that's a big part of the game people enjoy and folks have every right to have that. I just think if this is done right its a solid option to help performance while at the same time keeping the large scale battles that folks want.

As always great points!

Rohamad_Ali · May 2016

Does anyone know anything about recoding game areas ? I don't so I'm asking if this is ever a possibility to accomplish . I have this distinct gut feeling some group of players running to the rescue of some keep or outpost on the boarder of one of these instances is gonna hit a load screen and disconnect . Also , as a ganker myself , I would be waiting right at the loading area to take full opportunity at that ambush . There would need to be a safe zone like in Imperial City to load in . There would no doubt be many kinks to iron out and new exploits to worry about .

I'm just leery of this right now .

RinaldoGandolphi · May 2016

Pchela wrote: »

I mostly play during oceanic prime time lately while I live in NA eastern... And what I experienced last night in the hour or so I was on during NA pt was abysmal ... Up for any sort of ideas at this point. How would you suggest the instancing work, x number of players per area or ..?

Each piece of Cyrodiil is treated like a Cyrodiil delve or like the IPC is currently.

As for the number of players, I think you could keep that the same...performance would be far better having 140 people fighting over 4 instances instead of 140 people all fighting in just one...this is why IPC lags much less then Cyrodiil does.

I think if done correctly it would be really good, and i also think this is something within ZOS reach that wouldn't cost them many many many thousands of dollars to implement and it would ahve pretty good tangible results.

As long as the passing between zones is seemless which they have shown us with IC and the Cryrodiil delves it is, its something we could work with that would most certainly help big time.

RinaldoGandolphi · May 2016

Roehamad_Ali wrote: »

Does anyone know anything about recoding game areas ? I don't so I'm asking if this is ever a possibility to accomplish . I have this distinct gut feeling some group of players running to the rescue of some keep or outpost on the boarder of one of these instances is gonna hit a load screen and disconnect . Also , as a ganker myself , I would be waiting right at the loading area to take full opportunity at that ambush . There would need to be a safe zone like in Imperial City to load in . There would no doubt be many kinks to iron out and new exploits to worry about .

I'm just leery of this right now .

Yup they would have to have to have a mechanism in place to prevent people from camping the doors. Such as some period of immunity after loading on the other side. It could be done though. Its something that would have to be tested and what not, good news is though they have learned a lot about how to do this since the IPC launch so that's on our side there, they already have experience doing it.

KenaPKK · May 2016

Here: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/260539/would-you-support-separating-cyrodiil-into-instances-at-the-gates-and-bridges-if-it-fixed-the-lag#latest

WalkingLegacy · May 2016

Sounds like another band aid fix that will ultimately kill the fun of Cyrodiil behind more load screens.

RadioheadSh0t · May 2016

I don't think this could be done.

I would rather them use the resources to changing this and put that towards actual instances like BGs and Arenas.

If I can get lag-free, PvE-free BGs/Arenas in the next four quarters after DB, I might return to playing this game regularly.

Minno · May 2016

RadioheadSh0t wrote: »

I don't think this could be done.

I would rather them use the resources to changing this and put that towards actual instances like BGs and Arenas.

If I can get lag-free, PvE-free BGs/Arenas in the next four quarters after DB, I might return to playing this game regularly.

Tbh, they just need to place door locations. The code already exists in IC, but I would imagine at least one major DLC update to pull it into the end-zone.

Either way, they would need to say 100% it reduces lag. If 24v24v24 lags one IC district, I can't say it would be better for large cyro. Better to give us free crowns instead.

KenaPKK · May 2016

Minno wrote: »

RadioheadSh0t wrote: »

I don't think this could be done.

I would rather them use the resources to changing this and put that towards actual instances like BGs and Arenas.

If I can get lag-free, PvE-free BGs/Arenas in the next four quarters after DB, I might return to playing this game regularly.

Tbh, they just need to place door locations. The code already exists in IC, but I would imagine at least one major DLC update to pull it into the end-zone.

Either way, they would need to say 100% it reduces lag. If 24v24v24 lags one IC district, I can't say it would be better for large cyro. Better to give us free crowns instead.

Endless 40v40v40 potato battles happen in Had Arboretum district in the evenings, and those don't lag one bit. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever experienced lag in IC, and I've witnessed some pretty big fights. I expect the upcoming district capture system to generate some nice stress tests on the instance system, although if the districts don't contribute as significant PvP objectives, I doubt PvP there will last long term.

zyk · May 2016

I think the problem with this idea is the same as every other solution to performance issues: It requires an investment of resources from ZOS to complete.

Dividing Cyrodiil into instances would likely cost way more than simply changing the game design; and they're already unwilling to do the latter.

Minno · May 2016

KenaPKK wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RadioheadSh0t wrote: »

I don't think this could be done.

I would rather them use the resources to changing this and put that towards actual instances like BGs and Arenas.

If I can get lag-free, PvE-free BGs/Arenas in the next four quarters after DB, I might return to playing this game regularly.

Tbh, they just need to place door locations. The code already exists in IC, but I would imagine at least one major DLC update to pull it into the end-zone.

Either way, they would need to say 100% it reduces lag. If 24v24v24 lags one IC district, I can't say it would be better for large cyro. Better to give us free crowns instead.

Endless 40v40v40 potato battles happen in Had Arboretum district in the evenings, and those don't lag one bit. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever experienced lag in IC, and I've witnessed some pretty big fights. I expect the upcoming district capture system to generate some nice stress tests on the instance system, although if the districts don't contribute as significant PvP objectives, I doubt PvP there will last long term.

40v40v40 recently or at IC launch?
I don't remember lag either. Just assuming any lag will translate at any scale map.

DjSolJAH · May 2016

The server zones are cut into wayyy more than 4 zones as it is.

zZzleepyhead · May 2016

Something needs to be done. I know Cyrodiil is a difficult beast to contain, but it's also the only option to PvP. My friend was playing League at 20ms. Can we at least expect the upcoming "pvp battlegrounds" to be below 100ms?

DannyLV702 · May 2016

Lag so bad I actually did a god damn quest yesterday

Soris · May 2016

I too can't believe I'm saying this but I prefer instanced area and loading screens over this lag nonsense. I used to be a zealous defender of open world system since I play games, but time has changed I guess, this lag is unbearable.

Anazasi · May 2016

Cryo is already instanced as you described. The map is cut up in zones that rest on different server blades and are seamless for player transition. The issue is how the servers interact as a whole when load sharing. The design is solid the execution is in need of work. The biggest change that they could make is removing IC and making it a totally different zone with complete separation from the cryo map. This would help only in that numbers would actually be representative of the actual players in cryo.

Jules · May 2016

Honestly, not a terrible idea.

MichYodias · May 2016

See the thing isssss say cyro was instanced and EP nightcapped emp like they do every night. The entire pop of cyro will still be in whatever instance Chal would be on for last emp keep. For this to work your assuming the population is spread out. If people actaully played like that we wouldnt need instances. If we spread out, the smaller scale fights would likely be handled adequetly. That will not happen unless players have more reason to do stuff.

DjKahun · May 2016

I do like this idea

_Chaos · May 2016

MichYodias wrote: »

See the thing isssss say cyro was instanced and EP nightcapped emp like they do every night. The entire pop of cyro will still be in whatever instance Chal would be on for last emp keep. For this to work your assuming the population is spread out. If people actaully played like that we wouldnt need instances. If we spread out, the smaller scale fights would likely be handled adequetly. That will not happen unless players have more reason to do stuff.

But at least you have a choice in whether to participate or not. As it stands currently, you have no choice but to expedite the dethrone because Chal is lagging up a storm for your fight at Roe or Farra or Brindle. The reality is that while a dethrone is going on, no other action occurs on the map because the latency hits Cyrodiil as a whole.

KenaPKK · May 2016

Minno wrote: »

KenaPKK wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RadioheadSh0t wrote: »

I don't think this could be done.

I would rather them use the resources to changing this and put that towards actual instances like BGs and Arenas.

If I can get lag-free, PvE-free BGs/Arenas in the next four quarters after DB, I might return to playing this game regularly.

Tbh, they just need to place door locations. The code already exists in IC, but I would imagine at least one major DLC update to pull it into the end-zone.

Either way, they would need to say 100% it reduces lag. If 24v24v24 lags one IC district, I can't say it would be better for large cyro. Better to give us free crowns instead.

Endless 40v40v40 potato battles happen in Had Arboretum district in the evenings, and those don't lag one bit. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever experienced lag in IC, and I've witnessed some pretty big fights. I expect the upcoming district capture system to generate some nice stress tests on the instance system, although if the districts don't contribute as significant PvP objectives, I doubt PvP there will last long term.

40v40v40 recently or at IC launch?
I don't remember lag either. Just assuming any lag will translate at any scale map.

Pretty much every evening right now. Go check it out. It's our way of escaping prime time lag. lol