Official Feedback Thread for Imperial City Changes

Tillalarrien · May 2016

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

If something challanging is introduced to the game:
There should be a warning in the discription of the DLC.
Or
It should be free as it will sate the hardcore endgamers appetite to challanging content without making some DLC unaccessable to casual player as it will not lock casual players out of interesting content.

No.
I understand where are you coming from so I hope you will understand my point as well. I consider myself regular player, not casual but not far from it.

And so far there isnt a single zone that would have mobs /solo PVE content that would provide even a bit of challange after you figure out the basics of the game - meaning when you realise there is such thing as gear and foodbuffs.
I was on level 25 with green sets outleveled by 5 levels and with 0 CP... I still managed to farm NPCs in IC on live just fine and without dying.

If your not killing 20 mobs without even thinking about it, that doesnt mean content is hard and should had a warning for difficulty. If you say that it means rest of the game is apparently way to easy. If you need to stop and think for a second who out of 3 mobs you will engage 1st and how will you stun the other 2 it means its on the level of normal game and that fights will be challenging and fun. IC is only zone where this is even a little bit the case. If you want to steamroll 100 mobs while watching a movie you have other 500 hours of solo content that is in the game + all the other DLCs, so do it there..

If anything ZOS can take it as an example of what the difficulty of PvE zones should be.
In other solo games, and we are staying with TES here, you had a fun time fighting a wolf as a low lvl. You know how fun fighting a wolf is in eso? It requires me to press 1 button, and I am sorry but this isn't fun for me.

So yeah i'll say it, here it goes: L2P :P getting some basic green sets and buying a food will take you 30 min. You will see how much easier the content will be after. And If you are a new lvl 10 that planned to enter the zone without mundus, drinks and with random looted armor equipped then I am sorry, but you can't expect to beat everything you see without putting some tought and effort in the game. Take uor time, try and improve, join the guild, ask friend for help. You can play it on lvl 10, you just need to know basics of the game, and I dont think this is asking too much.

That sounded a bit harsher then I intended, I apologize but I am just trying to get my point across:

ZOS, keep some variety in the game for people that like it when mobs dont fall to the ground as soon as you look at them. Plys revert npc change to the state currently on live.

And as always: more flags! Plys, plys plys, make IC fun to PvP in, not another zone that promotes mindless farming of 100 mobs per pull and PvE trains!

The problem IC had was that it looked like it was designed as a grind zone. With extra vet levels, insane amounts of gear materials required ect. Grind keeps some ppl active for a while, but then they get everything and move on. With tvs gain bonus, one zergable flagg per district, limited respawns of the enemy, and insane costs of the polymorphs you are just making it into even bigger epidemy of ZERG&GRINDfest. Plys listen to the feedback here and act on it. Realize that if the zone is challangening and fun, it feels much more rewarding and ppl will stay forever! Even after they bought tvs sets - imagine that: ppl playing in IC because its fun!

And in the language of the guy that made v16 armor require 160 mats: People will tell their friends that don't yet own the DLC how amazing it is and that the guild will start running groups there. I know I will.

elven.were_wolf · May 2016

Tillalarrien wrote: »

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

If something challanging is introduced to the game:
There should be a warning in the discription of the DLC.
Or
It should be free as it will sate the hardcore endgamers appetite to challanging content without making some DLC unaccessable to casual player as it will not lock casual players out of interesting content.

No.
I understand where are you coming from so I hope you will understand my point as well. I consider myself regular player, not casual but not far from it.

And so far there isnt a single zone that would have mobs /solo PVE content that would provide even a bit of challange after you figure out the basics of the game - meaning when you realise there is such thing as gear and foodbuffs.
I was on level 25 with green sets outleveled by 5 levels and with 0 CP... I still managed to farm NPCs in IC on live just fine and without dying.

If your not killing 20 mobs without even thinking about it, that doesnt mean content is hard and should had a warning for difficulty. If you say that it means rest of the game is apparently way to easy. If you need to stop and think for a second who out of 3 mobs you will engage 1st and how will you stun the other 2 it means its on the level of normal game and that fights will be challenging and fun. IC is only zone where this is even a little bit the case. If you want to steamroll 100 mobs while watching a movie you have other 500 hours of solo content that is in the game + all the other DLCs, so do it there..

If anything ZOS can take it as an example of what the difficulty of PvE zones should be.
In other solo games, and we are staying with TES here, you had a fun time fighting a wolf as a low lvl. You know how fun fighting a wolf is in eso? It requires me to press 1 button, and I am sorry but this isn't fun for me.

So yeah i'll say it, here it goes: L2P :P getting some basic green sets and buying a food will take you 30 min. You will see how much easier the content will be after. And If you are a new lvl 10 that planned to enter the zone without mundus, drinks and with random looted armor equipped then I am sorry, but you can't expect to beat everything you see without putting some tought and effort in the game. Take uor time, try and improve, join the guild, ask friend for help. You can play it on lvl 10, you just need to know basics of the game, and I dont think this is asking too much.

That sounded a bit harsher then I intended, I apologize but I am just trying to get my point across:

ZOS, keep some variety in the game for people that like it when mobs dont fall to the ground as soon as you look at them. Plys revert npc change to the state currently on live.

And as always: more flags! Plys, plys plys, make IC fun to PvP in, not another zone that promotes mindless farming of 100 mobs per pull and PvE trains!

The problem IC had was that it looked like it was designed as a grind zone. With extra vet levels, insane amounts of gear materials required ect. Grind keeps some ppl active for a while, but then they get everything and move on. With tvs gain bonus, one zergable flagg per district, limited respawns of the enemy, and insane costs of the polymorphs you are just making it into even bigger epidemy of ZERG&GRINDfest. Plys listen to the feedback here and act on it. Realize that if the zone is challangening and fun, it feels much more rewarding and ppl will stay forever! Even after they bought tvs sets - imagine that: ppl playing in IC because its fun!

And in the language of the guy that made v16 armor require 160 mats: People will tell their friends that don't yet own the DLC how amazing it is and that the guild will start running groups there. I know I will.

I understand, but not everyone is a skilled as you and can complete the content. Look, I know where you players are coming from when you say you want challanging content introduced to the game, but I don't think this is the way to do this. Imagine you paid for DLC only to find that you can't complete it. You'll consider it a waste of money, won't you. For example Bloodborn is a hard game but they warn you before purchasing it that it's hard so you know what you paid for.

And I thought the main focus of IC anyway is to balance PvP and PvE in an area. But if all the mobs are challanging it's more of a PvE experiance where you have to concentrate on not getting killed by the mobs instead of the players that are lurking in the city. It's supposed to be a balanced experiance.

And anyway isn't Craglorn supposed to be that hard zone where it's difficult to solo? I've never completed craglorn on any of my characters. But there, it's free. It's challanging and they kinda warn you a bit before going there.

Ok, sure maybe I need to hone my skills more. But I don't think it's a good idea to introduce such challange in a DLC.
I want to ask a few questions,though.
-What class are you playing on?
-Have you tried playing in IC as a stamina nightblade?
-Are all your builds magicka oriented?

That's all

elven.were_wolf · May 2016

I agree, though.
More flags=less zerging.
Lesser cost polymorphes= lesser grinding+ more playing.

Sotha_Sil · May 2016

Just use Vicious Death and get all the TVS stones from the zergs yay. Districts capture as it is now is a waste : nobody cares about tel var except PvE players : what a waste of development. Just put some pvp buffs or fun objectives.... Cyrodiil hasn't changed (where is the town capture that was promised two months ago ??). I'm really disappointed and bitter right now about what ZOS said and what they did with IC and Cyrodiil in general. It's a shame, really.

Tillalarrien · May 2016

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

Ok, sure maybe I need to hone my skills more. But I don't think it's a good idea to introduce such challange in a DLC.
I want to ask a few questions,though.
-What class are you playing on?
-Have you tried playing in IC as a stamina nightblade?
-Are all your builds magicka oriented?

That's all

As it happens the lvl 25 character that I mentioned is a stamina nightblade

I had some green sets I crafted for leveling. If this is your 1st stam char I'd recommend you the classic hundings + nighmothers for a start. Ask for the crafter in 2nd zone.
I do have vigor already tough. So if you were trying without any proper heal and with random looted gear then I understand that the content is impossible to beat.

You must understand tought that as soon as u get heal/low gear and you are a bit carefull you can kill mobs there. Now imagine a v16 with golen gear, all skill buffs, passives + 501 CP.
They are adjusting the content so that lvl10 with random looted gear can beat it. Where are all the rest supposed to find any fun If they can wipe the entire district in one pull?

And thinking that they are doing it so the NPC won't meddle with PvP - I suggested in one of my previous post lowering the numbers of NPCs in the districts, while keeping the difficulty. That coupled with removal of the come-on-this-is-so-obviously-promoting-PVE-grind- 33%TVS bonus I think they should do and adding multiple flaggs, would turn districts into nice smallscale PvP area.

All the changes right now look like they are intended for PvP but are really not. They are keeping IC a PvE grindzone, as it already is right now.. Come ZOS I heard nice things about other PvE DLCs.. IC is supposed to be at least part PvP and your trying to push PvPers out even here.. IC is THE iconic TES zone. Plys get it right! Make at least districts the ideal PvP place that I tough we are gettine when IC was announced, not just another PvE grind.

elven.were_wolf · May 2016

Tillalarrien wrote: »

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

Ok, sure maybe I need to hone my skills more. But I don't think it's a good idea to introduce such challange in a DLC.
I want to ask a few questions,though.
-What class are you playing on?
-Have you tried playing in IC as a stamina nightblade?
-Are all your builds magicka oriented?

That's all

As it happens the lvl 25 character that I mentioned is a stamina nightblade
I had some green sets I crafted for leveling. If this is your 1st stam char I'd recommend you the classic hundings + nighmothers for a start. Ask for the crafter in 2nd zone.
I do have vigor already tough. So if you were trying without any proper heal and with random looted gear then I understand that the content is impossible to beat.

You must understand tought that as soon as u get heal/low gear and you are a bit carefull you can kill mobs there. Now imagine a v16 with golen gear, all skill buffs, passives + 501 CP.
They are adjusting the content so that lvl10 with random looted gear can beat it. Where are all the rest supposed to find any fun If they can wipe the entire district in one pull?

And thinking that they are doing it so the NPC won't meddle with PvP - I suggested in one of my previous post lowering the numbers of NPCs in the districts, while keeping the difficulty. That coupled with removal of the come-on-this-is-so-obviously-promoting-PVE-grind- 33%TVS bonus I think they should do and adding multiple flaggs, would turn districts into nice smallscale PvP area.

All the changes right now look like they are intended for PvP but are really not. They are keeping IC a PvE grindzone, as it already is right now.. Come ZOS I heard nice things about other PvE DLCs.. IC is supposed to be at least part PvP and your trying to push PvPers out even here.. IC is THE iconic TES zone. Plys get it right! Make at least districts the ideal PvP place that I tough we are gettine when IC was announced, not just another PvE grind.

Actually, lol I am using 5 piece hundings rage. 2 affliction. And there all gold with either health or stamina enchantments on them with a v16 bosmer nightblade. And Imperial city is really tough for me still. I also run a two handed and bow build with vigor. But my build lacks AoE damage and is a single enemy based damage dealer so I always get outnumbered by the odds unfortunately

Solariken · May 2016

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

I just want to clarify why I like the reduced difficulty of the mobs.
I bought Imperial City when I was at vet2 and died to the first mob I fought. So I ended up waiting till I was vet16. When I finally reached there, guess what, I died again.meaning that you need to have a top dps build or tanking build to survive in imperial city.

Anyway, I bought the DLC thinking I could just enter, play, do the main questline and PvP in between but was very disappointed when I found out that I have to wait until I get vigor and reach vet16 to stand a chance against the mobs.

I think that anything that requires such challange should give us a warning before purchasing it.

I also think that a whole zone that you need to pay for to get access to shouldn't be too difficult so that all players, either PvE'rs, PvP's or just casual players can enjoy the new content.

If something challanging is introduced to the game:
There should be a warning in the discription of the DLC.
Or
It should be free as it will sate the hardcore endgamers appetite to challanging content without making some DLC unaccessable to casual player as it will not lock casual players out of interesting content.

I understand where you are coming from here, but I don't think it's a good idea to nerf the PvE mobs. When I first entered IC, I died A LOT to those mobs. But, like anything else in PvE you just have to have some patience and learn the mechanics and get better. Currently, I can solo kill whole rooms of adds and even some of the bosses on fresh level 10 characters because I know it so well.

I love the feeling of danger IC invokes, and I think nerfing the mobs will take away from that. Also, you can't expect to walk into a place like IC, the most contested area in all of Tamriel, without good gear and a basic knowledge of the area and expect to do well. I feel that the difficulty should be consistent with the importance of IC and its lore, and the Daedra invading here should be the biggest and baddest in all of Oblivion/Cold Harbour.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler I really hope you guys don't reduce the difficulty of the PvE there (with the exception of the Bannerman one-shot mechanics - that's a little silly on live). I think you got it right the first time - don't fix what isn't broken.

Jaronking · May 2016

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

Tillalarrien wrote: »

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

If something challanging is introduced to the game:
There should be a warning in the discription of the DLC.
Or
It should be free as it will sate the hardcore endgamers appetite to challanging content without making some DLC unaccessable to casual player as it will not lock casual players out of interesting content.

No.
I understand where are you coming from so I hope you will understand my point as well. I consider myself regular player, not casual but not far from it.

And so far there isnt a single zone that would have mobs /solo PVE content that would provide even a bit of challange after you figure out the basics of the game - meaning when you realise there is such thing as gear and foodbuffs.
I was on level 25 with green sets outleveled by 5 levels and with 0 CP... I still managed to farm NPCs in IC on live just fine and without dying.

If your not killing 20 mobs without even thinking about it, that doesnt mean content is hard and should had a warning for difficulty. If you say that it means rest of the game is apparently way to easy. If you need to stop and think for a second who out of 3 mobs you will engage 1st and how will you stun the other 2 it means its on the level of normal game and that fights will be challenging and fun. IC is only zone where this is even a little bit the case. If you want to steamroll 100 mobs while watching a movie you have other 500 hours of solo content that is in the game + all the other DLCs, so do it there..

If anything ZOS can take it as an example of what the difficulty of PvE zones should be.
In other solo games, and we are staying with TES here, you had a fun time fighting a wolf as a low lvl. You know how fun fighting a wolf is in eso? It requires me to press 1 button, and I am sorry but this isn't fun for me.

So yeah i'll say it, here it goes: L2P :P getting some basic green sets and buying a food will take you 30 min. You will see how much easier the content will be after. And If you are a new lvl 10 that planned to enter the zone without mundus, drinks and with random looted armor equipped then I am sorry, but you can't expect to beat everything you see without putting some tought and effort in the game. Take uor time, try and improve, join the guild, ask friend for help. You can play it on lvl 10, you just need to know basics of the game, and I dont think this is asking too much.

That sounded a bit harsher then I intended, I apologize but I am just trying to get my point across:

ZOS, keep some variety in the game for people that like it when mobs dont fall to the ground as soon as you look at them. Plys revert npc change to the state currently on live.

And as always: more flags! Plys, plys plys, make IC fun to PvP in, not another zone that promotes mindless farming of 100 mobs per pull and PvE trains!

The problem IC had was that it looked like it was designed as a grind zone. With extra vet levels, insane amounts of gear materials required ect. Grind keeps some ppl active for a while, but then they get everything and move on. With tvs gain bonus, one zergable flagg per district, limited respawns of the enemy, and insane costs of the polymorphs you are just making it into even bigger epidemy of ZERG&GRINDfest. Plys listen to the feedback here and act on it. Realize that if the zone is challangening and fun, it feels much more rewarding and ppl will stay forever! Even after they bought tvs sets - imagine that: ppl playing in IC because its fun!

And in the language of the guy that made v16 armor require 160 mats: People will tell their friends that don't yet own the DLC how amazing it is and that the guild will start running groups there. I know I will.

I understand, but not everyone is a skilled as you and can complete the content. Look, I know where you players are coming from when you say you want challanging content introduced to the game, but I don't think this is the way to do this. Imagine you paid for DLC only to find that you can't complete it. You'll consider it a waste of money, won't you. For example Bloodborn is a hard game but they warn you before purchasing it that it's hard so you know what you paid for.

And I thought the main focus of IC anyway is to balance PvP and PvE in an area. But if all the mobs are challanging it's more of a PvE experiance where you have to concentrate on not getting killed by the mobs instead of the players that are lurking in the city. It's supposed to be a balanced experiance.

And anyway isn't Craglorn supposed to be that hard zone where it's difficult to solo? I've never completed craglorn on any of my characters. But there, it's free. It's challanging and they kinda warn you a bit before going there.

Ok, sure maybe I need to hone my skills more. But I don't think it's a good idea to introduce such challange in a DLC.
I want to ask a few questions,though.
-What class are you playing on?
-Have you tried playing in IC as a stamina nightblade?
-Are all your builds magicka oriented?

That's all

Well I am going to correct you on a few things since you sound like you mainly PVE and for some reason a Person ZOS will listen to more then all the people who disagree with you.

So am going to try to respond to you the nicest way possible and not to try be mean.

Their is no Solo content in this game other then Vet MA that is difficult. What really make Vet MA even harder is that it just a laggy mess.If you have a trouble with any solo content in this game then your not trying.Well without trying you can still complete the game easy.Its not about being skilled to do the solo content all you have to is spam a AOE and you kill everything,wait you can just heavy attack and kill things no problem.

Now to your point about if you buy a DLC and can't complete it would I be upset hell no I know I need to become a better player so I can compete the content. I don't wait for them to Nerf the content I learn how everything works and then learn to overcome that challenge.The thing about IC and the majority of the content they release their no need for those messages. If you learn how to play you will be fine. The biggest problem with Solo zones main story with Caldwell is that it doesn't teach you how to play the game like at or at least be decent enough to be able to do some of the end game content.That's the reason why content gets Nerf people don't want to listen and learn and so they Nerf it so people can learn it.

Now on the part where I come on slightly mean.The mobs in IC for most PVPERS I know are not challenging at all their just annoying as hell to deal with when you are just trying to kill People.I have heard more PVER complain about IC mob strength then PVPers.Most player I know can kill the mobs easy their just annoying to deal with.Keep their current strength just make less mobs.

To your point about Craglorn is that it only hard to solo because their content stopping you from progressing without a group.Personally I have completed every Delve and each Skyshard their solo.Craglorn is not difficult if you know what you are doing.

Just so you know I am also a Stam blade and mainly a PVPer IC or craglorn is not difficult. Just you need to learn how to play.

Tillalarrien · May 2016

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

Actually, lol I am using 5 piece hundings rage. 2 affliction. And there all gold with either health or stamina enchantments on them with a v16 bosmer nightblade. And Imperial city is really tough for me still. I also run a two handed and bow build with vigor. But my build lacks AoE damage and is a single enemy based damage dealer so I always get outnumbered by the odds unfortunately

That seems good enought setup to me.. Then your problem lies in how you are approaching the npcs.
And thats where I agree PvPers will have much easier time, just cause they are used to higher difficulty of the single enemy (talking about 1v1 here, no group bosses)

You see in PvP you approach an enemy mostly like they are on the same level as you. You dont expect them to die after u press the same button twice. You stay alert trought the fight, healing, dodging, heal debiffing, CCing, interrupting accordingly. So harder mobs are more like players in this regard as they require your attention. But even with current "difficulty" mobs are much easier then players for one simple reason: predictibility. After you fight one you know exactly what skills, hp pool ect you are going against and what combos. There is no suprises with ultimates, excelent combos, CCs ect that all PvPers are used to, and thats why mobs are easy. Im still positive content is far from too hard for PvEers tough, it just takes a step up from other soloable content and i honestly dont see anything wrong with that

Now to the approach you should take in IC live. Respect the enemy, dont think they will fall just cause you came near. Same as in PvP and unlike PvE dungeons when soloing I always focus down the target that will fall the quickest. Incidently in IC these are lightarmored mages that also do most dmg. So buff yourself, get in, fear everyone and burst down 1st target - healer or dmg dealing mage. Leave highest hp meele tanks for the end. As stamblade you should be able to burst quickly enough. If your going against 2 minibosses (unCCable) no worries.. Kite daedroth and Xyvkyn when they stop to aoe, avoid it and go for the dmg. Rest of the time dodge, heal, cloak or get some dots going. If you pull too many, withdraw, thats one more advantage to PvE.

And now back to the topic on IC as I really want this zone to become great and now Im starting to fear they will just tweak npc difficulty.

Mobs difficulty is one of the LOWER priorities here for me.
More flaggs > adjust the spawning based on the new flaggs > remove 33% bonus > add PvP based rewards > harder mobs, less of them!

timidobserver · May 2016

Do districts have AP ticks? If not, they should.

Also, tie IC into overall Cyrodiil scoring even if it is just a slight advantage.

Enodoc · May 2016

timidobserver wrote: »

Do districts have AP ticks? If not, they should.

Yes. At least, for attack. They're quite small ticks though. Not sure about defence ticks, since capture goes so quickly defending never really happens. Theoretically I would assume they exist too. That's another thing that extra flags would do; increase the potential for the controlling alliance to actually arrive in time to defend. Since they would be alerted to the attack when one flag is targeted, it would give them time to set up defence at the other flags.

Caff32 · May 2016

1) Were you able to capture a District? If so, how long did your alliance hold it for?

I captured two pretty easily solo when not many people were on so I can't say how long it was held. The odd thing was the way the guards spawned. For example, I killed two guards but brought a mob with me and died to the third guard/daedra. I quickly ran back up the ladder and across the district to the flag and only one guard was left and I quickly dispatched him. While on the flag waiting for the flip, the other two guards respawned and I had to kill them again. I'm not sure if that's the way it always works with guard respawns on a timer, but it just seemed like they respawned rather quickly. Three guards didn't pose much of a threat solo.

2) Did capturing Districts seem worthwhile?

I do like the added TV stone bonus, but I don't generally go to the districts to farm. If I want TV, I usually just farm the sewers. There was no bonus for holding the district beyond the TV increase so if I'm not looking buy anything with TV, I don't really care about the districts.

3) How does capturable Districts change the feel of PvP combat in these areas?

I can see the potential if there were big battles going on over a flag, but I just don't see the motivation. I doubt you'll ever have large enough groups to make it all that exciting or different than it is now. Frankly, I don't see the difference at all in that if you died in a district, you respawned at you camp in the district. However, now, you just respawn in the sewer and head up the ladder to the exact same spot. It's just an extra step that I can't see making a whole lot of difference.

4) Were you hit for more than 20k damage by any Imperial City bosses? If so, was the damage avoidable?

n/a

5) Did you feel that killing bosses in the Imperial City and Sewers was more rewarding?

n/a
6) How did the respawn rates and overall basepop feel while traveling around Imperial City?

PTS was too empty to give real feedback on that at this point.

7) How many Tel Var Stones did you end up collecting?

Not many.

8) Do you have any other general feedback?

Without any real rewards, I don't think this change will mean much to PvP. I get that we can purchase polymorphs, but I prefer how my character looks now so it's not much of a motivation.

elven.were_wolf · May 2016

Tillalarrien wrote: »

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

Actually, lol I am using 5 piece hundings rage. 2 affliction. And there all gold with either health or stamina enchantments on them with a v16 bosmer nightblade. And Imperial city is really tough for me still. I also run a two handed and bow build with vigor. But my build lacks AoE damage and is a single enemy based damage dealer so I always get outnumbered by the odds unfortunately

That seems good enought setup to me.. Then your problem lies in how you are approaching the npcs.
And thats where I agree PvPers will have much easier time, just cause they are used to higher difficulty of the single enemy (talking about 1v1 here, no group bosses)

You see in PvP you approach an enemy mostly like they are on the same level as you. You dont expect them to die after u press the same button twice. You stay alert trought the fight, healing, dodging, heal debiffing, CCing, interrupting accordingly. So harder mobs are more like players in this regard as they require your attention. But even with current "difficulty" mobs are much easier then players for one simple reason: predictibility. After you fight one you know exactly what skills, hp pool ect you are going against and what combos. There is no suprises with ultimates, excelent combos, CCs ect that all PvPers are used to, and thats why mobs are easy. Im still positive content is far from too hard for PvEers tough, it just takes a step up from other soloable content and i honestly dont see anything wrong with that

Now to the approach you should take in IC live. Respect the enemy, dont think they will fall just cause you came near. Same as in PvP and unlike PvE dungeons when soloing I always focus down the target that will fall the quickest. Incidently in IC these are lightarmored mages that also do most dmg. So buff yourself, get in, fear everyone and burst down 1st target - healer or dmg dealing mage. Leave highest hp meele tanks for the end. As stamblade you should be able to burst quickly enough. If your going against 2 minibosses (unCCable) no worries.. Kite daedroth and Xyvkyn when they stop to aoe, avoid it and go for the dmg. Rest of the time dodge, heal, cloak or get some dots going. If you pull too many, withdraw, thats one more advantage to PvE.

And now back to the topic on IC as I really want this zone to become great and now Im starting to fear they will just tweak npc difficulty.

Mobs difficulty is one of the LOWER priorities here for me.
More flaggs > adjust the spawning based on the new flaggs > remove 33% bonus > add PvP based rewards > harder mobs, less of them!

Thank you for the advice@Tillalarrien I will try this new advice you have given me. I just want to clarify that now with my current build I don't die instantly. I manage to get a few kills but when I am up against one of those banner dremora or more than five I die, mostly. And that quest were you have to defend the imperial outpost In the " Nobles" district. When three flame atronaches spawn at the gate I die. I already beat the other doors.
Anyway, Thanks.

Edit: Never mind. Beat them today solo. Yay!

fred4 · May 2016

Hi elven.were_wolf. It sounds like you're enjoying IC and you're halfway there with getting to grips with it!

I'm one of the people who'd rather keep IC as it is. I can totally understand your point about not being able to play something straightaway that you paid for and I agree a warning about the difficulty would be appropriate.

I currently play a V16 Magicka Nightblade with 477 CP and, I have to say, IC has become easy for me. The bosses in the Nobles district are something that can be done solo. Other bosses, such as the arena fight, IMO cannot or would at any rate be so tedious that I'd rather have a group with me. The big blue portals in the sewers and in the Arena district used to be a stumbling block for me. I saw other people solo them and I can now do them too as a Magicka NB in a DPS setup.

I'd echo what someone else has said: The PvE content through level 50 and Cadwell's silver / gold doesn't prepare you for IC. This is completely understandable. Speaking for myself, I only work hard on my gameplay when that becomes necessary. For the longest time I didn't learn to block. My biggest "aha" moment came when I tried tanking silver Undaunted pledges solo and discovered the extreme protection from blocking. I was using tanking gear then. Now I solo most content in 5 light / 1 medium / 1 heavy, including IC, Craglorn and some silver pledges. Not vMA, mind you. That has me beat. I run a very basic V16 crafted setup consisting of:

5 purple Julianos (the magicka equivalent of Hunding's)
3/4 purple Magnus (gives magicka, magicka regen and some more damage)
3 Arcane Willpower (the equivalent of Agility) with Spell Damage enchants
Gold weapons
Atronach mundus (magicka recovery)

As you can see this is fairly aggressive DPS-focused setup, but there's nothing special here. My only concession to defense is using 1H + shield on bar 1 and having a resto staff / Healing Ward on bar 2. I do not consider myself a very good player. PvP shows me every day that I'm not! For me, what made all the difference for PvE (and PvP) was learning to block. Typically I block-cast everything these days, but I watch my stamina carefully in case I need to open up. There's actually not a lot of skill in that.

By the way, I started the game with a Nord stamina DK. I haven't played her in a while and will concede that I found IC harder with her. However that was when it first came out and I had far less CP and knowledge. I didn't know to block then, but again I had a sort of "aha" moment when I played the DK, which was using Dragon Scales (the DK damage reflect ability). I talked to a friend recently who said he doesn't use Scales, because it's only 4 seconds and a lot of hassle keeping it up inbetween other attacks. This is exactly how I felt at the beginning of the game. It looked kind of "meh" on paper. It's actually one of the best abilities in the game. This is especially true in IC. Scales protect you from adds shooting from a distance. Scales might kill those adds and that's a lot of fun. Most importantly, when I'm about to die, what's the most effective thing to do? Not healing! Nope. I run away and pop Scales, because it saves me more consistently.

I'm sorry I have no experience with stamina NBs, so I added my experience with a stam. DK just to say how I fared with a less optimal Race / Class combination. (My Magicka NB is a Breton).

Oh and, by the way, I change my build depending on where I am. If you're gaming on a PC there's an add-on Wykkyd Outfitter for that. It's true you will want an AOE ability. There must be something you can use? Power Extraction (class), Steel Tornado (dual-wield), Brawler (2H), Bombard + Arrow Barrage (Bow), only 1H + Shield doesn't have AOE, I think.

I almost forgot about that Bombard + Arrow Barrage combo. It is so effective and safe for taking out IC mobs (most of them) that people switch away from it, because it's boring! My DK used 2H / Bow. Whenever I had trouble handling something in IC, the bow was by far the safer bet. It seems to be a general theme in ESO that ranged attacks are safer but then Bombard is another level. Spamming it freezes the lesser mobs in place. As a DK you combine that with Scales and it's all you need to do.

fred4 · May 2016

Silly question for elven.were_wolf. A lot of stamina players use 2H just for Rally. You know how to get the big heals out of Rally when you want them, right? (In other words, don't spam Rally, but you don't have to wait for it to expire either).

elven.were_wolf · May 2016

fred4 wrote: »

Silly question for elven.were_wolf. A lot of stamina players use 2H just for Rally. You know how to get the big heals out of Rally when you want them, right? (In other words, don't spam Rally, but you don't have to wait for it to expire either).

Just wanted to say thanks on all the info and for sharing your build. It's really helpful. And you're right blocking does save your life

Anyway, to answer your question :
Yes, I do use rally that's my major brutallity buff ( weapon damage buff ) and massive heal. Combined with vigor I get all my health back!

Though, I think I started leading the thread to an off-topic conversation

Sorry, Gina!

fred4 · May 2016

Don't be sorry! If this helps and maybe ZOS sees we're helping each other, then there will be no need to nerf IC mobs, right? RIGHT?

elven.were_wolf · May 2016

After finally getting the hang of Imperial city a bit, I still think that the difficulty should be lowered.

My reasoning behind this is that lower difficulty will encourage lower level players to join in in the action; because all I ever see in Imperial City are veteran players. Rarely do I see players at lower levels.

Also It will incourage the begginer PvE'r to try out some PvP action. And anyway Imperial City is kind of dead as of now. So we could use all the players we can get.

I already have difficulty getting enough players to do the Barathrum Centrata event or let alone just a few extra player to kill some of the patrolling horrors and sewer bosses.
Goodbye to that beatiful gold dye I wanted, soul-shriven skin and that scamp I long to get

fred4 · May 2016

Grrr! Don't say that! Are you sure that V16 you saw wasn't a level 16 player? I fell into that trap, you know.

People go there at low levels, if not new players then certainly ones who level their alts. And since you now get battle-leveled to V15 things are already easier than when you(?) and I first went to IC.

Do there need to be huge numbers of players in IC? I'm not so sure. We have the big battles in Cyrodiil and what do we get? Lag, lag, lag, unplayable lag, and unless maybe you're on Teamspeak, not a great sense of accomplishment. Why bring that to IC? I'm there to escape that stuff! Duelling, ganking, playing in small groups, I find that much more satisfying. You can probably guess I'm not too fond of Molag Bal runs either. A big group, steamrolling everything, I only found that exciting once or twice. No sense of individual accomplishment and not much learning either. I feel it's almost a race for me to damage something before the other group members have killed everything already. Until you get to Molag Bal and it gets a little more interesting.

You're obviously already playing on the most populated campaign? That would be Trueflame or Azura on EU. You want to find action? For some reason I see a lot of fights in the Temple District. Something about the architecture, the mixture of open spaces and derelict houses maybe. Follow that guy who just respawned on your platform and he'll lead you to the fight. Or, if not, harvest some Monstrous Teeth and sell them. You won't loose those if you get ganked.

Sorry, I I'm rambling. But what is IC really? I've talked to some friends for whom IC couldn't be empty enough, because they just wanted to quest or farm. Personally, as long as there is some PvP there, I'm happy. And for duelling I only see things getting worse, because a lot of players either don't recognise it or they don't respect it. I was in a group on Teamspeak and have been guilty of steamrolling duelers myself. It took us a while to watch out for them and fill everyone in on what they were doing. And that was on Teamspeak.

Tillalarrien · May 2016

Can we get back on lack of flaggs plys? xD

Cathexis · May 2016

I heard now you have to go through a load screen if you don't occupy a district.

Bravo on making IC less appealing. You could at least make the IC flags contribute to the campaign in a meaningful way so players would want to capture them.

Epona222 · May 2016

I don't honestly play a lot of IC on live, so I'll leave most of the questions to be answered by others who do - but I did go in on PTS and found the mobs disappointingly trivial compared to the difficulty on live. The ordinary NPC mobs are no more difficult than ones in Wrothgar, and the ones with slightly fancy health bars are similarly disappointing. I could solo most stuff I came across, and if I can solo most stuff (because, let's face it, I'm a bit rubbish), then it is too easy.

I understand that ZOS wants more people to go to IC, but I don't feel it is the mob difficulty that keeps people (like me) away - I think it's the feeling of hopelessness when in a smallish group faced with a large zerg, and THE LAG. I like the idea of district capture, but as others have rightly pointed out, having multiple flags would reduce the zerg factor (whereas having one flag encourages it). And also sort out the lag, last time I was in IC on live it was unplayable. Life's too short to spend time in an area where I am getting abysmal performance.

americansteel · May 2016

i like this idea however pvp should not be rewarded with AP due to the fact IC holds 0 relevance to the 6 keeps required for a terrible emperor system.

take AP out of IC buff the pve content stop making pve too easy.

Ajax_22 · May 2016

americansteel wrote: »

i like this idea however pvp should not be rewarded with AP due to the fact IC holds 0 relevance to the 6 keeps required for a terrible emperor system.

take AP out of IC buff the pve content stop making pve too easy.

Bad Idea. They are trying to get more people to want to fight in IC. Taking AP out of IC would do exactly the opposite of that.

fred4 · May 2016

Epona222 wrote: »

The ordinary NPC mobs are no more difficult than ones in Wrothgar, and the ones with slightly fancy health bars are similarly disappointing.

Zenimax, please listen. As I've said before, Orsinium was a huge disappointment to me because the mobs were too easy. In short, I haven't played it. There is nothing worse than content that is too easy. Yes, Orsinium offered Maelstrom, but that is ultra hard on veteran. Two extremes. Nothing inbetween.

People will moan and complain. Let them. Joss Whedon, who made a TV show called "Buffy the Vampire Slayer", once remarked that the more the titular heroine suffered, the more people would tune in. They didn't say that's what they wanted. Quite the opposite. But it seemed to be what they needed. "Give them what they need, not what they want" is a quote that's been stuck in my head ever since.

By the same token, please give us what we need! You won't hear me complaining about vet Maelstrom, even though I can't complete it (yet). But what is there, below vet Maelstrom, for solo players? It's the IC! Craglorn is group content. There are too many quests you can't progress without a group, so I gave up on that long ago. I only go there for play testing new builds and for a bit of gardening.

Seriously, I have supported the game by buying bank space and vanity items. Rather a lot of them. But I haven't bought the Thieves Guild, because Orsinium was such a disappointment. Besides, I feel PvP is really where it's at for endgame content, as a solo player. It's where people will still surprise you, because all complaints to the contrary, there is a large variety of builds, play-styles and competency. I guess I should therefore be supporting the flags and stuff. Well, I have to say, I'm fond of the mobs in IC as well. They are a yardstick as to how well I'm doing with my build. They keep me entertained when there's no one else around. And, as someone else has said, they can be annoying during a PvP fight, but at 501 CP they are just that. A nuisance, no more. And something we need!

You have to give us something to do when we're V16 with 501 CP! You have to give people a reason to get to 501 CP! The mobs in IC are part of that! Let us complain! Ignore us! Just give us what we need!

elven.were_wolf · May 2016

fred4 wrote: »

You have to give us something to do when we're V16 with 501 CP! You have to give people a reason to get to 501 CP! The mobs in IC are part of that! Let us complain! Ignore us! Just give us what we need!

Wait. Isn't the populated campaigns such as Azura's star and Trueflame no CP anyway? How will having no CP to 501 CP make a difference? It all depends on the gear in those campains.

americansteel · May 2016

Ajax_22 wrote: »

americansteel wrote: »

i like this idea however pvp should not be rewarded with AP due to the fact IC holds 0 relevance to the 6 keeps required for a terrible emperor system.

take AP out of IC buff the pve content stop making pve too easy.

Bad Idea. They are trying to get more people to want to fight in IC. Taking AP out of IC would do exactly the opposite of that.

ic holds no relevance to cyrodiil either way pvpers will continue up top. ic will be for those who farm.

Tillalarrien · May 2016

americansteel wrote: »

Ajax_22 wrote: »

americansteel wrote: »

i like this idea however pvp should not be rewarded with AP due to the fact IC holds 0 relevance to the 6 keeps required for a terrible emperor system.

take AP out of IC buff the pve content stop making pve too easy.

Bad Idea. They are trying to get more people to want to fight in IC. Taking AP out of IC would do exactly the opposite of that.

ic holds no relevance to cyrodiil either way pvpers will continue up top. ic will be for those who farm.

IC IS for those who farm, and even with changes on PTS it will continue to be so. But with suggestions ppl are giving here implemented the district could become the perfect PvP zone.

Funny story, I tried starting a IC PvP guild when it launched in September. You can guess how that went..
Now I have dreams of expanding the Cyro guild into IC once more - plys ZOS dont crash and burn my dreams again

fred4 · May 2016

elven.were_wolf wrote: »

Wait. Isn't the populated campaigns such as Azura's star and Trueflame no CP anyway? How will having no CP to 501 CP make a difference? It all depends on the gear in those campains.

ONLY Azura's is no CP.

fred4 · May 2016

ZOS, here's an interesting idea: Nerf IC mobs in Azura's Star and in the non-vet campaign only! Those campaigns are already the best place for people coming up the ranks who maybe have trouble with the mobs. But please don't touch the difficulty in the other campaigns!