Do You Think "DARK BROTHERHOOD" is Last Chance of ZOS

Lysette · April 2016

Oldmanlawlor wrote: »

I'm rather happy with ESO, but the Thieves Guild was a laughable paid DLC.

I think it delivered on what it is about - thievery. If you are not into thievery, it will not please you, but that was to be expected. To expect more from Dark Brotherhood than to be about exactly that - assassinations - is in my opinion in vain. It will be exactly about what it says it will be about - Dark Brotherhood.

Lysette · April 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

While I don't believe ESO is as huge a success as I'd have liked it to be and that I feel ZOS is slowly failing their audience as time goes on, I don't think DB will be the nail in the coffin should it prove to be successful or not. For me, it is how well they balance everything out in the end that will determine whether or not I officially quit the game.

Balance of the game is just terrible. 2h is practically required for PvP if you're stamina, High Elf is the hands down greatest race for magic with the lone exception being Dunmer DKs in terms of DPS, all points into 1 stat for optimal DPS. It's all so stupid and has really dulled my enjoyment of the game over the course of time.

I did enjoy the TG and it gave me some degree of hope that ZOS would improve but not enough to sway my opinion that they are slowly killing what could have been an amazing game

And what is so surprising that Altmer is the perfect race for magic?- It always was this way in all of the TES games. It was to be expected.

Silver_Strider · April 2016

Lysette wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

While I don't believe ESO is as huge a success as I'd have liked it to be and that I feel ZOS is slowly failing their audience as time goes on, I don't think DB will be the nail in the coffin should it prove to be successful or not. For me, it is how well they balance everything out in the end that will determine whether or not I officially quit the game.

Balance of the game is just terrible. 2h is practically required for PvP if you're stamina, High Elf is the hands down greatest race for magic with the lone exception being Dunmer DKs in terms of DPS, all points into 1 stat for optimal DPS. It's all so stupid and has really dulled my enjoyment of the game over the course of time.

I did enjoy the TG and it gave me some degree of hope that ZOS would improve but not enough to sway my opinion that they are slowly killing what could have been an amazing game

And what is so surprising that Altmer is the perfect race for magic?- It always was this way in all of the TES games. It was to be expected.

It's not about being the perfect race for magic, it's about being the hands down best race for magic period. Other than Dunmer DK, All magic based characters are gimped if it is not a High Elf and that is terrible for a balance perspective. Breton is the closest in terms of being good magic chararcters however, you lose both damage and better sustain going Breton over Altmer because Altmers will always do more elemental damage as well as having 9% regen vs the Bretons laughable 4% cost reduction. The only time a Breton might be better than an Altmer is if they are a magic tank build and even that is questionable at best.

We have 3 magic races in the game but apart from 1 lone exception, playing anything but an Altmer gimps you and I don't feel that is balanced at all.

Lysette · April 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

While I don't believe ESO is as huge a success as I'd have liked it to be and that I feel ZOS is slowly failing their audience as time goes on, I don't think DB will be the nail in the coffin should it prove to be successful or not. For me, it is how well they balance everything out in the end that will determine whether or not I officially quit the game.

Balance of the game is just terrible. 2h is practically required for PvP if you're stamina, High Elf is the hands down greatest race for magic with the lone exception being Dunmer DKs in terms of DPS, all points into 1 stat for optimal DPS. It's all so stupid and has really dulled my enjoyment of the game over the course of time.

I did enjoy the TG and it gave me some degree of hope that ZOS would improve but not enough to sway my opinion that they are slowly killing what could have been an amazing game

And what is so surprising that Altmer is the perfect race for magic?- It always was this way in all of the TES games. It was to be expected.

It's not about being the perfect race for magic, it's about being the hands down best race for magic period. Other than Dunmer DK, All magic based characters are gimped if it is not a High Elf and that is terrible for a balance perspective. Breton is the closest in terms of being good magic chararcters however, you lose both damage and better sustain going Breton over Altmer because Altmers will always do more elemental damage as well as having 9% regen vs the Bretons laughable 4% cost reduction. The only time a Breton might be better than an Altmer is if they are a magic tank build and even that is questionable at best.

We have 3 magic races in the game but apart from 1 lone exception, playing anything but an Altmer gimps you and I don't feel that is balanced at all.

This is where PvP collides with role play. Balance. Classes and races are there to create an imbalance in the first place. If that is not wanted, why have classes and races in the first place. Altmer were always those with the highest talent for magic. Like other races are best suited for normal combat. If there is no variety, but balance, then races and classes are pretty pointless. But this is Elder Scrolls, those races are important and they should be different in their talents and they are. The request for balance is what is weird in a role playing game - and this is an online RPG, like Mr. Firor stated in an interview lately.

kevlarto_ESO · April 2016

No more than any other patch, I think there is a camp out there that claims any new update is the last straw for them. People on the fence often do not ne much to push them to one side or the other.

But ZOS needs to offer something to the community to get use excited, I am huge fan of the game have no plans on leaving the game for at least a year, and if the game has improved I might not go to Camelot Unchained.

I do not expect the Dark Brotherhood to be much different than the Thieves Guild, lean on content fun for a few days. But lets not forget there are a lot of base changes coming to the game, revamp of Stamina, removal of VR, Heavy Armor gets a work over, plus other things.

After DB, we know this year is suppose to bring us Barber Shop and Housing, I figure that is quarter 3 and 4, but I am hoping there is new locations, quests and things, not just here they are and this how they work, as nice as those things are they are
really not content they are features.

ZOs has made a beautiful game, with great story and awesome pvp when it is not lagged out, they just don't seem to know where to take us or get the player base excited, and give that burning desire to want to continue to play the game. Just my 2 cents.

Lysette · April 2016

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

No more than any other patch, I think there is a camp out there that claims any new update is the last straw for them. People on the fence often do not ne much to push them to one side or the other.

But ZOS needs to offer something to the community to get use excited, I am huge fan of the game have no plans on leaving the game for at least a year, and if the game has improved I might not go to Camelot Unchained.

I do not expect the Dark Brotherhood to be much different than the Thieves Guild, lean on content fun for a few days. But lets not forget there are a lot of base changes coming to the game, revamp of Stamina, removal of VR, Heavy Armor gets a work over, plus other things.

After DB, we know this year is suppose to bring us Barber Shop and Housing, I figure that is quarter 3 and 4, but I am hoping there is new locations, quests and things, not just here they are and this how they work, as nice as those things are they are
really not content they are features.

ZOs has made a beautiful game, with great story and awesome pvp when it is not lagged out, they just don't seem to know where to take us or get the player base excited, and give that burning desire to want to continue to play the game. Just my 2 cents.

I don't think that they do not know where it is going. I think they have a long term plan for regions to be added to the game. Thief guild and Dark Brotherhood are elemental parts of the last few TES games and I guess the vast majority of TES fans want those guilds to be in the game - well they should have been in the game from the very start, so it was really time that they added those to the game. And I guess we will see as well the Morag Tong in the future, at least I hope so. Otherwise the map of Tamriel has lots of provinces and regions left, which are not in the game yet - so there is material for years to come.

Edit: you do not have to be a prophet to expect that they will add more and more regions with the game being titled "Tamriel unlimited". This is to be expected and not really a complicated riddle, is it?

UndeadBlood · April 2016

As someone who spends hours and hours to look for rare loot to steal, I don't agree that the Thieves Guild update was bad. I mean I wish there was a little more content, and god darn it, When I saw Quen climb walls, I thought she would teach us to do that aswell.

Van_0S · April 2016

@Lysette,
What @Silver_Strider, is saying that why are there no diversity in this game?
Like why can't my dunmer surpass an altmer in some way?
But there is a way to make my dunmer have best DPS as a MagNB compared to altmer that is Spell crafting

,unfortunately its not there........

Mojmir · April 2016

here's a question for the lore peeps,
after everything the vestige has accomplished in tamriel so far(if all quests in the game are completed),how much time has passed in the game world? How close are we to the first tes game in the timeline?

Lysette · April 2016

YurtTheSilentChief wrote: »

@Lysette,
What @Silver_Strider, is saying that why are there no diversity in this game?
Like why can't my dunmer surpass an altmer in some way?
But there is a way to make my dunmer have best DPS as a MagNB compared to altmer that is Spell crafting ,unfortunately its not there........

Yeah, not yet - but there might be poison crafting with the DB DLC. Something what Gina said made me think about that this might be a feature of the DLC or at least be worked on. Spell crafting is on the back burner for now, but I think, they will take it up again maybe next year - too many want this in the game and it was great in Oblivion.

On a side note - most heroes in the real world are ordinary people, not the best in anything, but just regular people with courage or who were gifted leaders and made their troops into a war machine, troops, which were as well just regular soldiers and not overly talented. To be a hero does not require to be the best, but to have courage and eventually leadership.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

lol last chance. Thats funny. Game is selling 100s of 1000s of copies and people keep posting this doom and gloom on the forums. Its really becoming tiresome. Is craglorn zos last chance? Is orsinium zos last chance? Is TG last chance? Fact is the game is VERY popular and the TG DLC has sold a ton. So sorry chicken littles. Sky isnt falling.

Lysette · April 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

lol last chance. Thats funny. Game is selling 100s of 1000s of copies and people keep posting this doom and gloom on the forums. Its really becoming tiresome. Is craglorn zos last chance? Is orsinium zos last chance? Is TG last chance? Fact is the game is VERY popular and the TG DLC has sold a ton. So sorry chicken littles. Sky isnt falling.

This - the game is very healthy at least in the PvE part and population-wise.

TheHsN · April 2016

thomas1970b16_ESO wrote: »

I love this game more and more :-)

when u started to play it?...

MaxwellC · April 2016

Yup this is ESOs last chance for me. If it's bad I'm done; I can't keep playing a game where each patch introduces new bugs that weren't even in the PTS, lag getting even worse, and bounce being single minded until they say "Oh don't worry we'll buff that style of class (Stamina vs Magicka) in the next 4 to 5 months with our new DLC.

I mean in what successful MMO tells you that they buff'd one style of class play but won't buff the other until 4 months.

ADarklore · April 2016

GaldorP wrote: »

I think financially they're doing pretty well (though I don't really know that, it's just based on my impressions in the game).
What worries me a bit is that there is currently very little content announced for the future. Dark Brotherhood has been announced as the next big update and DLC (Update 10). We know there will be crafting bags and that veteran ranks will be removed. From what I gathered it's not certain that the barber shop will be released at the same time. And that's pretty much all the concrete info I have about future updates of ESO (please tell me if I missed something). I assume Murkmire or Clockwork City will come after Dark Brotherhood, and at some point housing or arenas (but no sneak peek on any of those things) so not certain if or when those things will be released. I hope they post some more info about the Dark Brotherhood update soonish.

Edit: Speaking about the gameplay/game design perspective, I still think the game's main flaw is that it's mostly a single-player game with lots of one-time completion content, still too little repeatable stuff and meaningful reward systems for endgame (bind on pickup item rewards systems have too much randomization, players have too little control over what they get [Veteran Maelstrom Arena, Undaunted Shoulders, Wrothgar Dailies], there's not enough rare item rewards that are tradable; there's no near infinite time sink gear-wise in ESO [for example a system that adds random attributes to an item which you can reroll if you spend certain rare materials, or an over-enchant system]). There's no item reward mechanic that keeps someone who's reached Champion Rank 501 (and many long-time players on PC have reached it by now) and who has the gear they want playing. Having a few new motifs to grind out in every new DLC is not enough to keep every long-term player interested in the game.
The 2nd major flaw (that I consider to be a flaw but I know that some players like that about ESO) is that there's very little need to work together with other players in almost any area of the game. No mechanic that incentivizes joining a guild and working together on a common goal (there could be levels/ranks/or leaderboards for guilds, or at least an ingame guild database that shows how active a guild is in different areas of the game; there could also be special guild quests, guild passive skills, active skills that work only on guild members, etc.). There are also no dedicated crafting or material gathering classes in ESO, everyone can be a master of all professions and almost all skill lines at the same time. World boss quests in Wrothgar are pretty much the only non-instanced PvE content where you see random players do something together in PvE (because the game incentivizes it here: most players aren't strong enough to solo these bosses, you can only do all 6 quests if someone else shares them with you, you have a better chance to get loot from the boss, and you can finish the quest faster while in a group).

You do realize this game has a majority of solo players, right? You also know that there are some people still playing Skyrim today, repeating it over and over and over with new characters. You seem to approach this game as if it is a 'traditional' MMO, when Matt Firor came straight out and said that it is NOT a traditional MMO and in that same article he mentioned the word SOLO four times. He also mentioned how they know exactly what players are doing at all times in the game, which means they have the data which shows what the majority of players are doing and also how much each of them is contributing financially to the game. Thus, should it be a surprise that ZOS designs the game based upon what their majority is playing?

tinythinker · April 2016

Nothing this year will be the end of ESO. Still too new for consoles and still enough new PC players and old PC players who aren't burned out. Any decline and failure of the game will be a slow curve that people will observe for a while before that will become steeper over time and drop suddenly only at the last segment. There won't just be a sudden big drop off of a cliff.

People have been saying the game would die in the next 3-6 months for two years now even as numbers have been good for sales (see umpteen threads on such topics). ESO is still new enough and decent enough to keep getting $$$ for now and the foreseeable future, even if many players are frustrated with or tired of it. Some want to project that onto others ("If I think it sucks most other players must think so, too").

I'm not suggesting the game doesn't need a lot, or that it's my fav and all criticism is overblown bs, but rather than the doomcallers tend to be exaggerators.

Tandor · April 2016

I've no doubt there are a few PvPers for whom every next move by ZOS is the "last chance", but the game will carry on just fine regardless. I genuinely hope the performance issues get fixed for them, but even then there'll be plenty of other things for them to complain about - it's just the way of it with PvPers. The very nature of PvP is that for every winner there's a loser, and of course that leads to calls to buff the loser and nerf the winner plus a few other changes as well. 'Twas always thus.

Haxnschwammer · April 2016

ZO$ had a lot of chances. And yes, ESO is doomed. It dies a slow painful death but it isn't dead, yet.
A lot of players leave every day. But still there are enough here to keep it alive.

You know, I see players on bears or camels, I hear players talking about the motifs they got from crown store, I see players in costumes, I read players statement about "supporting" ZO$ with their subs.
There are enough players left to keep ESO alive. Far from enough to make it a success. Or to reach the potential. But they keep it alive. With any DLC people come back, flip over some cash to buy it or to sub a month. And then they are gone, until the next DLC comes.

The game is finished, developement has stopped, only the most important stuff is done. New things cost money. Bug fixes cost money. Balance costs money. And ZO$ doesn't invest any more. Numbers on an excel sheet are more to the "suits" than a million threads on their own forum.

Even the million dollar was just for marketing. A call for all old players to come back and maybe buy some DLC. 50.000 (from around 3 million sold) buying a DLC for 20 bucks, and the million is back.

Have a look at big guilds. Open the roster and just watch how long people haven't played. Whole guilds disband and the "survivors" join others every day. Even the popular guilds have more and more aggressive recruiting in zone chat.

Just before the big ESO unlimited launch copies of ESO were stapled in local shops for 10 Euros.
One day they were gone. Never seen copies again, or time cards. Sure, there are some who still
buy the game, but those are rare.

For now ESO is alive. As long there are enough players left to pay more than servers cost it will survive.
But it will never live up to its potential. And that's sad.

vyrusb23 · April 2016

No.

Lysette · April 2016

ADarklore wrote: »

GaldorP wrote: »

I think financially they're doing pretty well (though I don't really know that, it's just based on my impressions in the game).
What worries me a bit is that there is currently very little content announced for the future. Dark Brotherhood has been announced as the next big update and DLC (Update 10). We know there will be crafting bags and that veteran ranks will be removed. From what I gathered it's not certain that the barber shop will be released at the same time. And that's pretty much all the concrete info I have about future updates of ESO (please tell me if I missed something). I assume Murkmire or Clockwork City will come after Dark Brotherhood, and at some point housing or arenas (but no sneak peek on any of those things) so not certain if or when those things will be released. I hope they post some more info about the Dark Brotherhood update soonish.

Edit: Speaking about the gameplay/game design perspective, I still think the game's main flaw is that it's mostly a single-player game with lots of one-time completion content, still too little repeatable stuff and meaningful reward systems for endgame (bind on pickup item rewards systems have too much randomization, players have too little control over what they get [Veteran Maelstrom Arena, Undaunted Shoulders, Wrothgar Dailies], there's not enough rare item rewards that are tradable; there's no near infinite time sink gear-wise in ESO [for example a system that adds random attributes to an item which you can reroll if you spend certain rare materials, or an over-enchant system]). There's no item reward mechanic that keeps someone who's reached Champion Rank 501 (and many long-time players on PC have reached it by now) and who has the gear they want playing. Having a few new motifs to grind out in every new DLC is not enough to keep every long-term player interested in the game.
The 2nd major flaw (that I consider to be a flaw but I know that some players like that about ESO) is that there's very little need to work together with other players in almost any area of the game. No mechanic that incentivizes joining a guild and working together on a common goal (there could be levels/ranks/or leaderboards for guilds, or at least an ingame guild database that shows how active a guild is in different areas of the game; there could also be special guild quests, guild passive skills, active skills that work only on guild members, etc.). There are also no dedicated crafting or material gathering classes in ESO, everyone can be a master of all professions and almost all skill lines at the same time. World boss quests in Wrothgar are pretty much the only non-instanced PvE content where you see random players do something together in PvE (because the game incentivizes it here: most players aren't strong enough to solo these bosses, you can only do all 6 quests if someone else shares them with you, you have a better chance to get loot from the boss, and you can finish the quest faster while in a group).

You do realize this game has a majority of solo players, right? You also know that there are some people still playing Skyrim today, repeating it over and over and over with new characters. You seem to approach this game as if it is a 'traditional' MMO, when Matt Firor came straight out and said that it is NOT a traditional MMO and in that same article he mentioned the word SOLO four times. He also mentioned how they know exactly what players are doing at all times in the game, which means they have the data which shows what the majority of players are doing and also how much each of them is contributing financially to the game. Thus, should it be a surprise that ZOS designs the game based upon what their majority is playing?

Very true - and not just Skyrim, as well Oblivion and Morrowind. These games have still their fans playing it. I personally play Oblivion and Skyrim on a weekly bases of 2 hours each - scheduled, that I do not forget about it.

Necrelios · April 2016

Last chance for ZoS? Nope. There's several MMO's in a far worse state and people still play those for some reason. You would be surprised what some people will play and put up with in a game. However, a game is just that. As long as it affords access to an enjoyable medium of entertainment, people will continue to play and support it for whatever their reasons might be.

I wish there was more of a social aspect to ESO, like player built towns or large scale open world events. It still has a lot going for it, but after this much time and so little quality of life improvements and basic features accomplished there comes a time when even the most loyal players have to wonder where all their support goes towards and which direction the game is heading.

Lysette · April 2016

Haxnschwammer wrote: »

ZO$ had a lot of chances. And yes, ESO is doomed. It dies a slow painful death but it isn't dead, yet.
A lot of players leave every day. But still there are enough here to keep it alive.

You know, I see players on bears or camels, I hear players talking about the motifs they got from crown store, I see players in costumes, I read players statement about "supporting" ZO$ with their subs.
There are enough players left to keep ESO alive. Far from enough to make it a success. Or to reach the potential. But they keep it alive. With any DLC people come back, flip over some cash to buy it or to sub a month. And then they are gone, until the next DLC comes.

The game is finished, developement has stopped, only the most important stuff is done. New things cost money. Bug fixes cost money. Balance costs money. And ZO$ doesn't invest any more. Numbers on an excel sheet are more to the "suits" than a million threads on their own forum.

Even the million dollar was just for marketing. A call for all old players to come back and maybe buy some DLC. 50.000 (from around 3 million sold) buying a DLC for 20 bucks, and the million is back.

Have a look at big guilds. Open the roster and just watch how long people haven't played. Whole guilds disband and the "survivors" join others every day. Even the popular guilds have more and more aggressive recruiting in zone chat.

Just before the big ESO unlimited launch copies of ESO were stapled in local shops for 10 Euros.
One day they were gone. Never seen copies again, or time cards. Sure, there are some who still
buy the game, but those are rare.

For now ESO is alive. As long there are enough players left to pay more than servers cost it will survive.
But it will never live up to its potential. And that's sad.

It is not doomed, it is changing to what it should have been in the first place. And the more it does this, the more it will thrive.

Edit.: as far as empty older guilds go - people's real life does not stop, they have a career, they have a family and other things become important to them, rather than gaming. Life goes on, interests change.

Jules · April 2016

yes.

Silver_Strider · April 2016

Lysette wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

While I don't believe ESO is as huge a success as I'd have liked it to be and that I feel ZOS is slowly failing their audience as time goes on, I don't think DB will be the nail in the coffin should it prove to be successful or not. For me, it is how well they balance everything out in the end that will determine whether or not I officially quit the game.

Balance of the game is just terrible. 2h is practically required for PvP if you're stamina, High Elf is the hands down greatest race for magic with the lone exception being Dunmer DKs in terms of DPS, all points into 1 stat for optimal DPS. It's all so stupid and has really dulled my enjoyment of the game over the course of time.

I did enjoy the TG and it gave me some degree of hope that ZOS would improve but not enough to sway my opinion that they are slowly killing what could have been an amazing game

And what is so surprising that Altmer is the perfect race for magic?- It always was this way in all of the TES games. It was to be expected.

It's not about being the perfect race for magic, it's about being the hands down best race for magic period. Other than Dunmer DK, All magic based characters are gimped if it is not a High Elf and that is terrible for a balance perspective. Breton is the closest in terms of being good magic chararcters however, you lose both damage and better sustain going Breton over Altmer because Altmers will always do more elemental damage as well as having 9% regen vs the Bretons laughable 4% cost reduction. The only time a Breton might be better than an Altmer is if they are a magic tank build and even that is questionable at best.

We have 3 magic races in the game but apart from 1 lone exception, playing anything but an Altmer gimps you and I don't feel that is balanced at all.

This is where PvP collides with role play. Balance. Classes and races are there to create an imbalance in the first place. If that is not wanted, why have classes and races in the first place. Altmer were always those with the highest talent for magic. Like other races are best suited for normal combat. If there is no variety, but balance, then races and classes are pretty pointless. But this is Elder Scrolls, those races are important and they should be different in their talents and they are. The request for balance is what is weird in a role playing game - and this is an online RPG, like Mr. Firor stated in an interview lately.

Classes and races should be balanced in the sense that no 1 Race/Class is perfect. Altmer + ANY magic build is perfect and that isn't right.

For magic builds, we generally have 3 races in terms of optimal DPS. Bretons, Dunmer and Altmer.
Altmer have great sustain, great damage and high magic
Bretons has high magic, some sustain and has survivability
Dunmer does more Fire Damage and has survivability
However, the benefit to being magic based is that you have a great number of methods to boost your survivability thru the use healing abilities and shields thus making survivability almost a non-issue in most cases and making the extra survivability of Bretons and Dunmer mostly moot. This applies to ALL situations, not just PvP.

Lets compare this to Stamina. We have Redguards, Imperials, Bosmer and Khajiit, all of which are great for stamina builds
Redguards have great sustainability and high stamina
Imperials have high stamina and has survivability
Bosmers have greater sustainability than Reguards and survivability but less stamina.
Khajiit has a balance of survivability, sustain and damage. They have the least amount of stamina but make up for that with their extra chance at critical damage.
Stamina has great damage, however, struggle in the survivability department because they only have 2 heals, one of which is locked behind 2h, and that our main resource for damage is also tied in to blocking, dodging and sneaking, all of which limit our stamina in some way (no stamina regen while sneaking or blocking and dodging gets more costly if used in quick succession)

Races should matter, in terms that that they offer something different than one another, however, in regards to Altmer, they offer everything you could want, leaving the other 2 magic races almost entirely pointless. The sustain of Altmer trumps the sustain of Bretons. The resistances of both Bretons and Dunmer is limited by the cap to resistances, whereas there isn't a damage cap meaning that the extra damage of Altmer trumps those stats as well, with only the extra Fire damage of Dunmer making them slightly better in that 1 area.

Callous2208 · April 2016

I should necro all the threads like this today just for laughs. "IC is ZoS last Chance!!!" "Orsinium is ZoS last chance!!" "TG is ZoS last chance!!!" About a year from now I'll assume there will be at least 4 more to giggle at.

TheValkyn · April 2016

The Thieves Guild was a bad quarterly DLC? No, it wasn't. The patch was buggy and might not have fixed as much as we deserved but it wasn't a bad DLC per se.

NewBlacksmurf · April 2016

I do not think the DLC has any bearing at all

I do believe that the base game changes will have a lasting impact such as:
-removal of VR
-changes to Craglorn, Silver and Gold as results of removal of VR (these are the only post 50 zones that don't scale)
-grouping tool changes

Van_0S · April 2016

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

I do not think the DLC has any bearing at all

I do believe that the base game changes will have a lasting impact such as:
-removal of VR
-changes to Craglorn, Silver and Gold as results of removal of VR (these are the only post 50 zones that don't scale)
-grouping tool changes

Its not that only!!
For guys like us that have finished every quest( I still have that Maw trail, to do) the only thing left is PvP.
Now, once the player house,barber shop,DB,etc comes then it becomes interesting...
For now, its really boring

Mainly,due to slow patches that come after 6 months that also leads to a big disappointment of lags,crashes and imbalance as well a crap story........

DRXHarbinger · April 2016

Alcast wrote: »

What makes you think Thieves Guild is not successful?

In the few thousand hours I've chucked at this game I have never been to hews bane. No interest in it at all. Never liked TG stuff ever. Tons of other people say the same on console. Never even touched the sets, only ever gone at the trial. It made no impact at all for me and most of my guilds.

vyrusb23 · April 2016

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

What makes you think Thieves Guild is not successful?

In the few thousand hours I've chucked at this game I have never been to hews bane. No interest in it at all. Never liked TG stuff ever. Tons of other people say the same on console. Never even touched the sets, only ever gone at the trial. It made no impact at all for me and most of my guilds.

So, let me get this straight ... The Thieves Guild DLC isn't successful because you've never been to Hews Bane? Makes sense.

With this same line of logic I will say this: I've been to Hews Bane many, many, many times just like others have. Therefore it is successful.

How can this paradox be?