Nightblades Ruining PVP Again...

Xarc · April 2016

hm, what fix ? I mean, nb works well.
- About proxy det, all classes can use it.
- About proxy det + cloack, yes it works well, and I assume using it. But, remember NB is the worst class about armour & protections. The only real protection is the cloack. When you're using it you must be in danger to be closer to ennemies, and after hitting you cloack to leave or hit more and more. This is exactly like an ambush.
This is NB class, we are like that, hit from cloack, re-cloack, re-hit, ambush... etc. You do not appreciate this kind of fight, maybe ye. I can understand it may be frustrating but after the first ambush many good players deal with it, once they know they're fighting a NB, sometimes they win, or the NB leaves, or not.
So what do you want ? Refound completely the NB class ? only fight against DK Sorcs or templars ?
Personnally i 'm a bit frustrating when i almost killed a templar and he heals himself completely but it's a part of the game, i deal with it.

pvp can be fixed without direct nb nerfs.

Perhaps we could also unnerf streak and roll.

What do you think of the suggestions made?

I don't know.

Zerok · April 2016

Here's my theory.

A lot of players had stamina nightblades for PvP.

ZOS removed the DoT purge from Dark cloak and nerfed the steel tornado range.

Those players converted their stamina nightblades to magicka nightblades to use the new Vicious death set and proximity detonation combo.

Now some players complain because the (magicka) nightblades are back.

...

Junkogen · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

Whats the difference between that and a shield stacking sorc who dashes away when they are in trouble?

templars who literally either stand there and heal themselves or just use jabs then executioner?

no creativity at all from most players and some will even blame ZOS for it haha

my build is MY build. Everything about it. I dont watch PVPers videos or copy anyone else I do my own thing which is very successful for me as its unpredictable.

...? What's the difference? Okay sure. The difference is, shield stacking does NOT deal damage to an enemy, while also applying crowd control. The difference is, every single time that Sorcerer uses Bolt Escape (or its morphs)? The cost goes up, if used back to back. Meaning they can't keep doing it nonstop. Last I checked Nightblades don't have this "penalty" with their abilities (specifically cloak and its morphs). The difference is, Jabs is damn channel.

C'mon now. You know just like I know that Nightblades are a very large problem, and have lied their way into this mess which is plaguing PVP right now. And ZOS as per usual were the simpletons who believed their nonsense and followed it up. And thus now? This broken combo.

How can you blame Nightblades for vicious death? Now you're just spinning lies to advance your agenda. The hypocrisy knows no end. ZOS created vicious death and proxy det, not any class or group of players.

Vicious Death has nothing to do with Cloak. I'm tired of the sorry attempts by many to nerf Nightblades. If you don't like vicious death and proxy det, that's one thing, but to go after Nightblades for skills and equipment that is available to everyone is ridiculous. Cloak got nerfed. Aim your complaints where they're deserved.

Samadhi · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. ...

See so much talk about this set on the forums, but rarely actually see it in Cyrodiil.

Not sure if it just does not show up in my death recaps, I don't get hit with it, or if players that use this combo just do not have quite enough damage to kill me.

Have only seen a Vicious Death in my recaps twice since TG hit PC servers. One appeared to be a Sorcerer, as it appeared to proc from Mages' Wrath.

Familiar with Nightblade zerg-diving though. Used to do it back when it was all about jumping into a zerg with sword and board and spamming Sap Essence + Ultimates before the Ultimate generation system got changed.
The new version of zerg-diving does not interest me as much though -- it was fun jumping in and sustaining, but do not think that this whole instagib everything or faceplant playstyle is to my liking.

makreth · April 2016

Junkogen wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

Whats the difference between that and a shield stacking sorc who dashes away when they are in trouble?

templars who literally either stand there and heal themselves or just use jabs then executioner?

no creativity at all from most players and some will even blame ZOS for it haha

my build is MY build. Everything about it. I dont watch PVPers videos or copy anyone else I do my own thing which is very successful for me as its unpredictable.

...? What's the difference? Okay sure. The difference is, shield stacking does NOT deal damage to an enemy, while also applying crowd control. The difference is, every single time that Sorcerer uses Bolt Escape (or its morphs)? The cost goes up, if used back to back. Meaning they can't keep doing it nonstop. Last I checked Nightblades don't have this "penalty" with their abilities (specifically cloak and its morphs). The difference is, Jabs is damn channel.

C'mon now. You know just like I know that Nightblades are a very large problem, and have lied their way into this mess which is plaguing PVP right now. And ZOS as per usual were the simpletons who believed their nonsense and followed it up. And thus now? This broken combo.

How can you blame Nightblades for vicious death? Now you're just spinning lies to advance your agenda. The hypocrisy knows no end. ZOS created vicious death and proxy det, not any class or group of players.

Vicious Death has nothing to do with Cloak. I'm tired of the sorry attempts by many to nerf Nightblades. If you don't like vicious death and proxy det, that's one thing, but to go after Nightblades for skills and equipment that is available to everyone is ridiculous. Cloak got nerfed. Aim your complaints where they're deserved.

He has a point but he's also wrong. Nb benefits "more" if we can say that because he can be a sneaky kamikaze with a high burst. It's not hard to counter them though, i never had a problem, learn and adapt. But the problem lies elsewhere. It's not the NBs, its proxi and vicious death. This meta game inspired by ZOS is really ridiculous imo.

Junkogen · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Zyle wrote: »

Kelces wrote: »

Zyle wrote: »

You are clueless then. When IC came out if you didn't have Agility/Endurance/Willpower then you didn't have VR16 jewelry enchants. You just don't like that you're wrong.

Oh, I am completely aware of the "maximum efficiency" for competitiveness kind of play. Still, the player decides, if he/she feels the need for it. Got it?

You can use an outdated sure, but you'll stand 0 chance in PvP, which is what we're talking about here. You're delusional if you think that ZOS making only 3 sets VR16 equates to them not forcing people into using them. The difference between VR14 enchants and VR16 is substantial enough to lose to another player in PvP, so yeah maybe someone would use VR14 for a while, but eventually they'll be using VR16 jewelry like everyone else. Got it?

Actually I beg to differ. There's a quite a few people (thirty or so) in two of my PVP guilds (both over four hundred members) that run Necropotence for their pet build. And if memory serves me correctly, that's a veteran rank twelve set. Mind you, they're veteran rank sixteen themselves and at the champion point cap. How've they been doing in combat...? Well, they can do 1vX no problem as well as take resources by themselves in a timely fashion. So... Yeah. I've also seen them make swift work of tank Dragonknights.

But still! Back on topic. This Nightblade combo of: Proximity Detonation, sap essence, and soul tether in conjunction with the Vicious Death set needs to be balanced and checked. It's a very real problem in PVP and getting worse and worse by the day.

All I've read from you is how much Sorcs crush it in PvP...and then you say Nightblades are overpowered. I wish I could adequately put in writing how big an eye roll you deserve. Do you even read your posts to edit out the contradictions? If you're going to attempt to deflect attention from the real overpowered class in the game, sorcerers, you shouldn't boast about you and your guildies' sorcerer godliness in the same breath. You do a great job initially of acting like an innocent victim to the Nightblade overlords, but then it seems like your Sorc ego gets the better of you and you feel the need to flex your e-peen.

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

Junkogen wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Zyle wrote: »

Kelces wrote: »

Zyle wrote: »

You are clueless then. When IC came out if you didn't have Agility/Endurance/Willpower then you didn't have VR16 jewelry enchants. You just don't like that you're wrong.

Oh, I am completely aware of the "maximum efficiency" for competitiveness kind of play. Still, the player decides, if he/she feels the need for it. Got it?

You can use an outdated sure, but you'll stand 0 chance in PvP, which is what we're talking about here. You're delusional if you think that ZOS making only 3 sets VR16 equates to them not forcing people into using them. The difference between VR14 enchants and VR16 is substantial enough to lose to another player in PvP, so yeah maybe someone would use VR14 for a while, but eventually they'll be using VR16 jewelry like everyone else. Got it?

Actually I beg to differ. There's a quite a few people (thirty or so) in two of my PVP guilds (both over four hundred members) that run Necropotence for their pet build. And if memory serves me correctly, that's a veteran rank twelve set. Mind you, they're veteran rank sixteen themselves and at the champion point cap. How've they been doing in combat...? Well, they can do 1vX no problem as well as take resources by themselves in a timely fashion. So... Yeah. I've also seen them make swift work of tank Dragonknights.

But still! Back on topic. This Nightblade combo of: Proximity Detonation, sap essence, and soul tether in conjunction with the Vicious Death set needs to be balanced and checked. It's a very real problem in PVP and getting worse and worse by the day.

All I've read from you is how much Sorcs crush it in PvP...and then you say Nightblades are overpowered. I wish I could adequately put in writing how big an eye roll you deserve. Do you even read your posts to edit out the contradictions? If you're going to attempt to deflect attention from the real overpowered class in the game, sorcerers, you shouldn't boast about you and your guildies' sorcerer godliness in the same breath. You do a great job initially of acting like an innocent victim to the Nightblade overlords, but then it seems like your Sorc ego gets the better of you and you feel the need to flex your e-peen.

... I have no idea what my "e-peen" (cyber ***) has to do with this topic, but let's try and avoid discussing it.

Onto the topic however, I would really love to know where all the complaints about Sorcerers are since the TG update. I really do. Whether here on forums or on the game. Because, I've seen and heard of complaints nonstop of Nightblades — and the occasional complaint of Templars spamming Radiant Destruction. Besides those two, I've yet to really see it/hear it. Am I saying that they don't exist? Absolutely not. No. I'm more than certain that there are people out there who've complained about Sorcerers since the TG update. It's just that I personally haven't heard/read them.

Also, if it's alright with you — I would prefer we stay on the topic at hand. Nightblades role in PVP, and their influence on it's (PVP's) meta.

Kalfis · April 2016

Every rogue like sneaky class always ruins PvP in any game, apparently.

I agree.

Junkogen · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Junkogen wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Zyle wrote: »

Kelces wrote: »

Zyle wrote: »

You are clueless then. When IC came out if you didn't have Agility/Endurance/Willpower then you didn't have VR16 jewelry enchants. You just don't like that you're wrong.

Oh, I am completely aware of the "maximum efficiency" for competitiveness kind of play. Still, the player decides, if he/she feels the need for it. Got it?

You can use an outdated sure, but you'll stand 0 chance in PvP, which is what we're talking about here. You're delusional if you think that ZOS making only 3 sets VR16 equates to them not forcing people into using them. The difference between VR14 enchants and VR16 is substantial enough to lose to another player in PvP, so yeah maybe someone would use VR14 for a while, but eventually they'll be using VR16 jewelry like everyone else. Got it?

Actually I beg to differ. There's a quite a few people (thirty or so) in two of my PVP guilds (both over four hundred members) that run Necropotence for their pet build. And if memory serves me correctly, that's a veteran rank twelve set. Mind you, they're veteran rank sixteen themselves and at the champion point cap. How've they been doing in combat...? Well, they can do 1vX no problem as well as take resources by themselves in a timely fashion. So... Yeah. I've also seen them make swift work of tank Dragonknights.

But still! Back on topic. This Nightblade combo of: Proximity Detonation, sap essence, and soul tether in conjunction with the Vicious Death set needs to be balanced and checked. It's a very real problem in PVP and getting worse and worse by the day.

All I've read from you is how much Sorcs crush it in PvP...and then you say Nightblades are overpowered. I wish I could adequately put in writing how big an eye roll you deserve. Do you even read your posts to edit out the contradictions? If you're going to attempt to deflect attention from the real overpowered class in the game, sorcerers, you shouldn't boast about you and your guildies' sorcerer godliness in the same breath. You do a great job initially of acting like an innocent victim to the Nightblade overlords, but then it sc ego gets the better of you and you feel the need to flex your e-peen.

... I have no idea what my "e-peen" (cyber ***) has to do with this topic, but let's try and avoid discussing it.

Onto the topic however, I would really love to know where all the complaints about Sorcerers are since the TG update. I really do. Whether here on forums or on the game. Because, I've seen and heard of complaints nonstop of Nightblades — and the occasional complaint of Templars spamming Radiant Destruction. Besides those two, I've yet to really see it/hear it. Am I saying that they don't exist? Absolutely not. No. I'm more than certain that there are people out there who've complained about Sorcerers since the TG update. It's just that I personally haven't heard/read them.

Also, if it's alright with you — I would prefer we stay on the topic at hand. Nightblades role in PVP, and their influence on it's (PVP's) meta.

Your obvious bias is relevant to the topic. It exposes your true agenda and flawed arguments. You're a charlatan. I hope ZOS is wise enough to see through this charade.

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

Junkogen wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Junkogen wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Zyle wrote: »

Kelces wrote: »

Zyle wrote: »

You are clueless then. When IC came out if you didn't have Agility/Endurance/Willpower then you didn't have VR16 jewelry enchants. You just don't like that you're wrong.

Oh, I am completely aware of the "maximum efficiency" for competitiveness kind of play. Still, the player decides, if he/she feels the need for it. Got it?

You can use an outdated sure, but you'll stand 0 chance in PvP, which is what we're talking about here. You're delusional if you think that ZOS making only 3 sets VR16 equates to them not forcing people into using them. The difference between VR14 enchants and VR16 is substantial enough to lose to another player in PvP, so yeah maybe someone would use VR14 for a while, but eventually they'll be using VR16 jewelry like everyone else. Got it?

Actually I beg to differ. There's a quite a few people (thirty or so) in two of my PVP guilds (both over four hundred members) that run Necropotence for their pet build. And if memory serves me correctly, that's a veteran rank twelve set. Mind you, they're veteran rank sixteen themselves and at the champion point cap. How've they been doing in combat...? Well, they can do 1vX no problem as well as take resources by themselves in a timely fashion. So... Yeah. I've also seen them make swift work of tank Dragonknights.

But still! Back on topic. This Nightblade combo of: Proximity Detonation, sap essence, and soul tether in conjunction with the Vicious Death set needs to be balanced and checked. It's a very real problem in PVP and getting worse and worse by the day.

All I've read from you is how much Sorcs crush it in PvP...and then you say Nightblades are overpowered. I wish I could adequately put in writing how big an eye roll you deserve. Do you even read your posts to edit out the contradictions? If you're going to attempt to deflect attention from the real overpowered class in the game, sorcerers, you shouldn't boast about you and your guildies' sorcerer godliness in the same breath. You do a great job initially of acting like an innocent victim to the Nightblade overlords, but then it sc ego gets the better of you and you feel the need to flex your e-peen.

... I have no idea what my "e-peen" (cyber ***) has to do with this topic, but let's try and avoid discussing it.

Onto the topic however, I would really love to know where all the complaints about Sorcerers are since the TG update. I really do. Whether here on forums or on the game. Because, I've seen and heard of complaints nonstop of Nightblades — and the occasional complaint of Templars spamming Radiant Destruction. Besides those two, I've yet to really see it/hear it. Am I saying that they don't exist? Absolutely not. No. I'm more than certain that there are people out there who've complained about Sorcerers since the TG update. It's just that I personally haven't heard/read them.

Also, if it's alright with you — I would prefer we stay on the topic at hand. Nightblades role in PVP, and their influence on it's (PVP's) meta.

Your obvious bias is relevant to the topic. It exposes your true agenda and flawed arguments. You're a charlatan. I hope ZOS is wise enough to see through this charade.

Are you a Nightblade by a chance? I'm just wondering. If you are, that's fine. And I have this question for you, are you using the combo/sequence of skills that are being discussed in this thread (Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, etc.)? And if yes, are you using the Vicious Death set? And if yes to all of those questions, how do you feel about using it?

vamp_emily · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Ayalaya wrote: »

Quit your whining, please.

... You must be that guy at the lunch table growing up, that nobody shared their fruit snacks or cookies with. I just know it. No need to tell me otherwise.

Oh my.

And you must be the guy at the gym that stands in front of the mirror posing/flexing. The one with new workout clothes and not a drop of sweat on his body. The one that stands in mirror for 30 minutes then leaves and tells everyone he had a good workout.

L2P

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

vamp_emily wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Ayalaya wrote: »

Quit your whining, please.

... You must be that guy at the lunch table growing up, that nobody shared their fruit snacks or cookies with. I just know it. No need to tell me otherwise.

Oh my.

And you must be the guy at the gym that stands in front of the mirror posing/flexing. The one with new workout clothes and not a drop of sweat on his body. The one that stands in mirror for 30 minutes then leaves and tells everyone he had a good workout.

L2P

Edit: Sigh... I can't post pics of people in the gym I suppose...

RinaldoGandolphi · April 2016

Its not Nightblades ruining PVP, its the meta and class imbalance issues that are ruining PVP.

The classes right now are worse balanced then they were in betas...

you add VD and Proxy to the mix and well...yup. Every single class in this game is broken from a balance perspective...at this point they just need to take the current class and chuck them in the trash and bring back the traditional TES skill lines like illusion, Alteration, Destruction, etc and lets folks mix and match and this time actually get the balance things right...what we have currently is just a straight failure...its worse now then it was when DK were broken for over a year, its shameful that class imbalance is worse then ever after 2 years...

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Its not Nightblades ruining PVP, its the meta and class imbalance issues that are ruining PVP.

The classes right now are worse balanced then they were in betas...

you add VD and Proxy to the mix and well...yup. Every single class in this game is broken from a balance perspective...at this point they just need to take the current class and chuck them in the trash and bring back the traditional TES skill lines like illusion, Alteration, Destruction, etc and lets folks mix and match and this time actually get the balance things right...what we have currently is just a straight failure...its worse now then it was when DK were broken for over a year, its shameful that class imbalance is worse then ever after 2 years...

... Is it bad I preferred that meta compared to this mess currently? I mean seriously. I'd prefer dealing with "Block-Knights" and all of the other DK variants, than this new bs with Nightblades. Seriously. >_>

vamp_emily · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Edit: Sigh... I can't post pics of people in the gym I suppose...

Smiles, I thought I seen you post a pic of someone dancing. ( I think you removed it )

I was going to leave a comment like "That is now how you PvP. That is not how you PvP"

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

vamp_emily wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Edit: Sigh... I can't post pics of people in the gym I suppose...

Smiles, I thought I seen you post a pic of someone dancing. ( I think you removed it )

I was going to leave a comment like "That is now how you PvP. That is not how you PvP"

Lol.

Xael · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Actually all I see is zergs, lag, and more zergs.

You are being extremely dishonest:
You imply Nightblades are the only class using Prox Det. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a gap closer. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a point blank AoE. You imply Nightblades are the only class with an AoE ult and what's more hilarious is that you imply all Nightblades spam Lotus Fan? Really? Lotus Fan is one of the worst abilities to spam considering it does not have a mini stun (like Ambush did) and its damage outside of stealth does less than a fully charged heavy attack with an Inferno staff. Abilities like Force Pulse/Crushing Shock do more damage and even give you the option to keep your distance where it's safe. I can do all this cheese on a Magicka Templar and Sorc just as easily as a Nightblade...

Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of Prox Det.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all gap close.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all point blank AoE.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all AoE ult.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of these skills/tactics in conjunction with the Vicious Death set.

You say PvP is dying and you blame Nightblades and VD making it worse? Yeah ok... because it's clearly not Stam (insert any class) using Shuffle, dodge rolling around objects while mashing Vigor cheesing everything up. It's not hordes of players running in zergs from A-Z trying to find safety in numbers right? As usual lets blame Nightblades and ask for more nerfs because we are misinformed and fueled by our misinformed state and otherwise can't be bothered to change up the way we play...

Lastly the greatest threat to this game are the developers who refuse to fix the lag in Cyrodiil caused by coding which started in v.1.2.3 that is exacerbated by players like yourself that pull the "safety in numbers" zerg nonsense. In fact this set (VD), used by any class, is one of the best things ZOS has done to counter all zergball aoe cap abusers.

If you are worried so much about VD spread out. Stop abusing AoE caps and spread out. Stop running in a zerg and play better. The problem isn't nightblades and it sure as hell isn't VD. The problem is people who think they are otherwise good at PvP in this game remove themselves and their bs tactics from the equation, pick a scapegoat and cry for nerfs while postulating false information to facilitate change. If you care so much about the state of PvP, stop posting threads like these and focus on the true problem that is lag and fps drops. It's been almost 2 years since 1.2.3 and it has only got worse. In fact I dare say the PvP has become the same PvP of the first weekend beta stress tests that occured in late 2013 where you had constant rubber bands and 2-3 second delay.

I'm going to go ahead and assume you're a Nightblade. I'm also going to go ahead and assume you use the VD set and combo being spoken about here. If I'm wrong, then I accept being wrong.

However, let's be honest here. The VD set? Is a bandaid fix. What they did to Proximity Detonation? You guessed it. Is a bandaid fix. The cheesy combo? I think you get what it is. Lol.

And it is Nightblades which are the main source of a lot of things. It was actually proven a while ago that most of the lag generated was due to Nightblades, as well as numerous other things. But in particular Nightblades were generating crazy lag and frame issues. Also, which class do you think is the most hated to encounter in PVP (overall)? Nightblades. In fact, there was a poll here on the forums which asked which class they dislike seeing the most in PVP. And the number one choice was Bightblade. Why do you think that is? C'mon now. Lol.

You're going to assume I am a nightblade because I disagree with your thread and the nonsense in it? Since we are assuming, I am going to assume you are a novice at PvP and myopic because you are unwilling to see reason. This is ridiculous. I was one of the first popular Stam Sorcs streaming on Twitch and I happen to play all classes but main a sorc. So yeah, accept being wrong.

Since we are on to "being honest", whether or not it's a bandaid fix is neither here nor there. It works fine and I never get killed by it... ever. Newsflash, Prox Det has a big red circle. Magelight, Flare, and Pots kill invisibility. Use them and get out of the way. Standing in a group abusing the lack of AoE caps... well you deserve whatever happens.

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

It was actually proven a while ago that most of the lag generated was due to Nightblades, as well as numerous other things. But in particular Nightblades were generating crazy lag and frame issues.

This... is... comedy gold? What's next? Nightblades killed JFK and are responsible for 9/11? Do you not know how ridiculous and reaching you sound? If this doesn't expose you as having a bias and agenda here, I don't know what could.

What is the most hated to encounter? That would be unkillable DKs who have damn near perma dodge with Shuffle and dodge roll all over the screen while vigor mashing. There is a reason why you often see 10 people chasing around one stam dk. The other would be a shield stacking Sorc. Nightblades are ridiculously easy to kill. Thanks Wrobel for making the game easier with the nerf to cloak and the buff to magelight. Nightblades are by far the easiest class to kill followed by Stamina Sorcs. But yeah, I can tell you spend a lot of time on the forum and you put a lot of stock into what you read. It's not like everyone parrots everyone on here or anything... if you spent as much time in Cyrodiil playing the game as you do posting on the forum or reading posts, you would likely have a different mindset. Then again, all it takes is one Streamer to post a video and all of sudden the sky is falling and it becomes the magical scapegoat that is allegedly ruining pvp.

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

Xael wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Actually all I see is zergs, lag, and more zergs.

You are being extremely dishonest:
You imply Nightblades are the only class using Prox Det. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a gap closer. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a point blank AoE. You imply Nightblades are the only class with an AoE ult and what's more hilarious is that you imply all Nightblades spam Lotus Fan? Really? Lotus Fan is one of the worst abilities to spam considering it does not have a mini stun (like Ambush did) and its damage outside of stealth does less than a fully charged heavy attack with an Inferno staff. Abilities like Force Pulse/Crushing Shock do more damage and even give you the option to keep your distance where it's safe. I can do all this cheese on a Magicka Templar and Sorc just as easily as a Nightblade...

Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of Prox Det.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all gap close.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all point blank AoE.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all AoE ult.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of these skills/tactics in conjunction with the Vicious Death set.

You say PvP is dying and you blame Nightblades and VD making it worse? Yeah ok... because it's clearly not Stam (insert any class) using Shuffle, dodge rolling around objects while mashing Vigor cheesing everything up. It's not hordes of players running in zergs from A-Z trying to find safety in numbers right? As usual lets blame Nightblades and ask for more nerfs because we are misinformed and fueled by our misinformed state and otherwise can't be bothered to change up the way we play...

Lastly the greatest threat to this game are the developers who refuse to fix the lag in Cyrodiil caused by coding which started in v.1.2.3 that is exacerbated by players like yourself that pull the "safety in numbers" zerg nonsense. In fact this set (VD), used by any class, is one of the best things ZOS has done to counter all zergball aoe cap abusers.

If you are worried so much about VD spread out. Stop abusing AoE caps and spread out. Stop running in a zerg and play better. The problem isn't nightblades and it sure as hell isn't VD. The problem is people who think they are otherwise good at PvP in this game remove themselves and their bs tactics from the equation, pick a scapegoat and cry for nerfs while postulating false information to facilitate change. If you care so much about the state of PvP, stop posting threads like these and focus on the true problem that is lag and fps drops. It's been almost 2 years since 1.2.3 and it has only got worse. In fact I dare say the PvP has become the same PvP of the first weekend beta stress tests that occured in late 2013 where you had constant rubber bands and 2-3 second delay.

I'm going to go ahead and assume you're a Nightblade. I'm also going to go ahead and assume you use the VD set and combo being spoken about here. If I'm wrong, then I accept being wrong.

However, let's be honest here. The VD set? Is a bandaid fix. What they did to Proximity Detonation? You guessed it. Is a bandaid fix. The cheesy combo? I think you get what it is. Lol.

And it is Nightblades which are the main source of a lot of things. It was actually proven a while ago that most of the lag generated was due to Nightblades, as well as numerous other things. But in particular Nightblades were generating crazy lag and frame issues. Also, which class do you think is the most hated to encounter in PVP (overall)? Nightblades. In fact, there was a poll here on the forums which asked which class they dislike seeing the most in PVP. And the number one choice was Bightblade. Why do you think that is? C'mon now. Lol.

You're going to assume I am a nightblade because I disagree with your thread and the nonsense in it? Since we are assuming, I am going to assume you are a novice at PvP and myopic because you are unwilling to see reason. This is ridiculous. I was one of the first popular Stam Sorcs streaming on Twitch and I happen to play all classes but main a sorc. So yeah, accept being wrong.

Since we are on to "being honest", whether or not it's a bandaid fix is neither here nor there. It works fine and I never get killed by it... ever. Newsflash, Prox Det has a big red circle. Magelight, Flare, and Pots kill invisibility. Use them and get out of the way. Standing in a group abusing the lack of AoE caps... well you deserve whatever happens.

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

It was actually proven a while ago that most of the lag generated was due to Nightblades, as well as numerous other things. But in particular Nightblades were generating crazy lag and frame issues.

This... is... comedy gold? What's next? Nightblades killed JFK and are responsible for 9/11? Do you not know how ridiculous and reaching you sound? If this doesn't expose you as having a bias and agenda here, I don't know what could.

What is the most hated to encounter? That would be unkillable DKs who have damn near perma dodge with Shuffle and dodge roll all over the screen while vigor mashing. There is a reason why you often see 10 people chasing around one stam dk. The other would be a shield stacking Sorc. Nightblades are ridiculously easy to kill. Thanks Wrobel for making the game easier with the nerf to cloak and the buff to magelight. Nightblades are by far the easiest class to kill followed by Stamina Sorcs. But yeah, I can tell you spend a lot of time on the forum and you put a lot of stock into what you read. It's not like everyone parrots everyone on here or anything... if you spent as much time in Cyrodiil playing the game as you do posting on the forum or reading posts, you would likely have a different mindset. Then again, all it takes is one Streamer to post a video and all of sudden the sky is falling and it becomes the magical scapegoat that is allegedly ruining pvp.

... Dude. The search feature would say it all about Nightblades' popularity and respect. Also, that's cute you're a streamer. I don't care about your Twitch rep, nor if you were the first to do something or not. Also, if I spent as much time in Cyrodiil as I do on the forums...? I've been playing ESO since the beta. Spending the majority of said time playing PVP. Lol. I also play on console. On the console of the game, I have all VR16 characters and PVP with them all. Same with the Mac version. However, I primarily use my magicka Sorcerers. Also, I've had well over 500 champion points way before the cap was introduced. So... Yeah. I have spent, and still do spend tons of time on the battlefield and in this game in general.

By the way, I don't mind being wrong. You said you aren't a Nightblade primarily, and that's fine. I accept that.

LiquidSchwartz · April 2016

loooool it makes my magicka dk so much stronger tho using det,invasion/chains, then leaping into the group
i literally can wipe 15 people in an instant where with out VD i struggle to 1v3

i like it and want it to stay
if youre dying to a nb bombing you then dont sit next to someone
it isnt hard to spread out

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

loooool it makes my magicka dk so much stronger tho using det,invasion/chains, then leaping into the group
i literally can wipe 15 people in an instant where with out VD i struggle to 1v3

i like it and want it to stay
if youre dying to a nb bombing you then dont sit next to someone
it isnt hard to spread out

Interesting... So with VD's help, you are capable of doing 1v15. But without it, you struggle to 1v3? That says a lot about the set, as well as what it's capable of doing. Also, big respect to you for using a DK in Cyrodiil. I love seeing them. They're the most balanced class (due to skill versatility and skill requirement), in my opinion. I main magicka Sorcerers, and I never had a problem doing 1vX. Even without the VD set. And yes, I seldom ever die to this cheesy Nightblade combo in this thread. It's just that it's hard to hear and see so many people complain about it, and see nothing be done to check it.

Katahdin · April 2016

Its not NB. Templars, Sorc and MagDK are running VD and prox det as well.

Literally every death I have is from VD, prox det, Rad destruction or usually a combo of them. Pretty much all the majicka builds are running one or more of these skills. Im literally thinking of taking one of my magicka characters, leveling or converting one of my stamblades and running the skills as well because if you cant fight them, join them. I need AP too and its too slow as a stam blade only killing one at a time when I can kill 10-20 at once. In fact we should all just run magicka and run these builds, maybe they will get it then.

Tholian1 · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

LiquidSchwartz wrote: »

loooool it makes my magicka dk so much stronger tho using det,invasion/chains, then leaping into the group
i literally can wipe 15 people in an instant where with out VD i struggle to 1v3

i like it and want it to stay
if youre dying to a nb bombing you then dont sit next to someone
it isnt hard to spread out

And yes, I seldom ever die to this cheesy Nightblade combo in this thread. It's just that it's hard to hear and see so many people complain about it, and see nothing be done to check it.

Forgive my skepticism.

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO · April 2016

Volkodav wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Why does this not surprise me. Everyone bi-tched about Cloaking skills,so they nerfed them. NOW you want the class nerfed even more because you still get killed by NB"s?
Could it be your playing style that needs an upgrade rather than the nerfing of another class?
What you might want to see is that Nightblades are overall a solid class that can get the job done,..without cloaking skills working as well as they once did.They have more than that one deadly skill to work with. And now,..you have to deal with them and you need to step it up and figure out how to do so.
Nightblades arent ruining PvP,they have just relearned how to use their other skills to their best advantage,now that non-NBs demanded they be drought down a peg.. They have adapted,and the class still kick's other players tails.

What? You want to make it to where NBs have NO skills they can use in PvP? You dont want them to be able to attack,or kill you? Then work around their skills.I dont see NBs whining about other classes killing them in PvP.

PS,
My NB is doing great with the newest patch. I dont feel any nerfs,as I never used those cloaking skills.

Funny that NB's say people whine about them using cloak when it was fine in the PTS before they listened to the NB's whining and crying so much most of tamriel was underwater for a while.

rfennell_ESO · April 2016

Junkogen wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

Whats the difference between that and a shield stacking sorc who dashes away when they are in trouble?

templars who literally either stand there and heal themselves or just use jabs then executioner?

no creativity at all from most players and some will even blame ZOS for it haha

my build is MY build. Everything about it. I dont watch PVPers videos or copy anyone else I do my own thing which is very successful for me as its unpredictable.

...? What's the difference? Okay sure. The difference is, shield stacking does NOT deal damage to an enemy, while also applying crowd control. The difference is, every single time that Sorcerer uses Bolt Escape (or its morphs)? The cost goes up, if used back to back. Meaning they can't keep doing it nonstop. Last I checked Nightblades don't have this "penalty" with their abilities (specifically cloak and its morphs). The difference is, Jabs is damn channel.

C'mon now. You know just like I know that Nightblades are a very large problem, and have lied their way into this mess which is plaguing PVP right now. And ZOS as per usual were the simpletons who believed their nonsense and followed it up. And thus now? This broken combo.

How can you blame Nightblades for vicious death? Now you're just spinning lies to advance your agenda. The hypocrisy knows no end. ZOS created vicious death and proxy det, not any class or group of players.

Vicious Death has nothing to do with Cloak. I'm tired of the sorry attempts by many to nerf Nightblades. If you don't like vicious death and proxy det, that's one thing, but to go after Nightblades for skills and equipment that is available to everyone is ridiculous. Cloak got nerfed. Aim your complaints where they're deserved.

The problem you are missing or intentionally missing is no other class has dark cloak + instant teleport + spammable aoe+aoe stun ultimate to go with proxy and vd.

Most of the time the noobs trying this tactic are easy to get away from and all you really need to do is spam aoe on top of their heads and they will rage whisper you when they are broken out of their macroed dark cloak every .5 seconds routine they use to get away. The real problem is some of them are obviously up to hijinks so that a little bit of artificial lag and bam all those things are firing at once. It's one part animation cancelling abuse and two parts automation of attack sequence with a dash of Soul tether forcing the kneel animation on you whether or not you break it.

Every other class can be dealt with before they get to you with proxy or at the very least you have some warning of it.

Anti_Virus · April 2016

I play a stam nightblade but with a bow as my main Hand weapon and it's tough, but it's better than the other 'Metablades' with proxy and VD or Ambush,Fear, SA.

So please dont get NBs nerfed not all follow the meta

Wollust · April 2016

It's not NB that are ruining PvP.

It's Wrobel.

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Why does this not surprise me. Everyone bi-tched about Cloaking skills,so they nerfed them. NOW you want the class nerfed even more because you still get killed by NB"s?
Could it be your playing style that needs an upgrade rather than the nerfing of another class?
What you might want to see is that Nightblades are overall a solid class that can get the job done,..without cloaking skills working as well as they once did.They have more than that one deadly skill to work with. And now,..you have to deal with them and you need to step it up and figure out how to do so.
Nightblades arent ruining PvP,they have just relearned how to use their other skills to their best advantage,now that non-NBs demanded they be drought down a peg.. They have adapted,and the class still kick's other players tails.

What? You want to make it to where NBs have NO skills they can use in PvP? You dont want them to be able to attack,or kill you? Then work around their skills.I dont see NBs whining about other classes killing them in PvP.

PS,
My NB is doing great with the newest patch. I dont feel any nerfs,as I never used those cloaking skills.

Funny that NB's say people whine about them using cloak when it was fine in the PTS before they listened to the NB's whining and crying so much most of tamriel was underwater for a while.

Tell 'em! Truth x100!

Kelces · April 2016

Love it or leave it, simple as that.

Sure, constructive criticism is a necessary part of progress. But if it's futile, as many suggest, then the only option remains the one above.

CP5 · April 2016

OtarTheMad wrote: »

The bombs you see NBs do (proxy+tether+sap... added in VD) any class can do really... well maybe not Templars. Dragonknights- Proxy+Leap+Draw Essence/Talons. Sorcs- Proxy+Meteor+Streak+Impulse. Templars... hm... not sure.... probably Proxy+Meteor+Shards (stun)+Jabs.

All you have to do is be a Glass Cannon and do 5pc Julianos or Alchemist or Vicious Death and you're set. Need to get high spell damage (3k+) and high max magicka (35k+) so obviously all gear is v16 and purple at least.

Not really. When a NB cloaks, they could be getting a 100% crit rate, when a NB cloaks they gain a damage buff on their attacks while exiting cloak, add in that NB crits deal more damage and they can stack pure spell damage (something your dk example lacks since leap works on physical damage) and NB's have a clear and significant advantage over all other classes running this combo.

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

I just got finished in a long conference chat, and I heard a few people say that they were planning on PVP'ing. As in finally attempting to try it, and give it a shot... Only to say otherwise. And how the rumors they've heard of Nightblades terrorizing PVP has completely turned them away the idea. . .

...

Damn...

Do you know what it's like being a hardcore PVP'er and hearing this? To be a person who tries to encourage people to give PVP a chance, and hearing the ways they describe the PVP atmosphere and mentality...?

Is this what you wanted, magicka Nightblades who do this and its supporters? Is this really what you wanted? To ruin the experience of those who haven't gotten their feet wet in Cyrodiil? Damn... And I'm not even one of the people getting lit-up from this combo, but the feels... The feels, y'all... It's just wrong.... Man, this new combo and meta of Nightblades is some whack s***. . .