So they announce PVP arenas and battlegrounds are coming and noone talks about it?
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jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I can tell you havent played BDO. It could not be more different from a theme park mmo like ESO.0 -
FENGRUSH✭✭✭✭✭
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We'll take it as unsubstantiated opinion then.
I'm all in favour of ZOS fixing the PvP issues and adding more PvP content in PvP areas, but not PvPers exaggerating their numbers and importance.
Apparently you failed to see or remember the PVP promos for ESO. As Fengrush stated, it was for large scale pvp hence that was the main focus of their promotional videos. He doesn't need to say it, nor do I or anyone but the promotional videos they created were focused on that. Evidence?
Go to their Youtube channel and watch the promos from way back then.
I'm well aware of the videos, that's not what I was disputing - which was Fengrush's claim that most players bought the game for the large scale PvP, but he has since confirmed he meant most PvPers, not most players. That's the sort of difference that represents exaggeration unless clarified.
I wasnt trying to mislead or something.... it was a thread about BGs, and I wrote a couple paragraphs about Cyro and BGs/arenas and just said most people bought it for cyro large scale (not to come for BGs/arena). Its not to say the new content isnt good, but I consider having the main one functional to be of more importance. If it cant be, I dont see the other one gaining much traction or the games pvp being taken seriously.0 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
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We'll take it as unsubstantiated opinion then.
I'm all in favour of ZOS fixing the PvP issues and adding more PvP content in PvP areas, but not PvPers exaggerating their numbers and importance.
Apparently you failed to see or remember the PVP promos for ESO. As Fengrush stated, it was for large scale pvp hence that was the main focus of their promotional videos. He doesn't need to say it, nor do I or anyone but the promotional videos they created were focused on that. Evidence?
Go to their Youtube channel and watch the promos from way back then.
I'm well aware of the videos, that's not what I was disputing - which was Fengrush's claim that most players bought the game for the large scale PvP, but he has since confirmed he meant most PvPers, not most players. That's the sort of difference that represents exaggeration unless clarified.
I wasnt trying to mislead or something.... it was a thread about BGs, and I wrote a couple paragraphs about Cyro and BGs/arenas and just said most people bought it for cyro large scale (not to come for BGs/arena). Its not to say the new content isnt good, but I consider having the main one functional to be of more importance. If it cant be, I dont see the other one gaining much traction or the games pvp being taken seriously.
I do not agree the main component of ESO is pvp. Seems to me if the main aspect of the game was pvp there woudlnt be so many PVE zones.0 -
apostate9✭✭✭✭✭GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »I'd rather a lag free cryodill. Unlike most people, i like siege warfare and everything that come's with it (Guerrilla warfare, etc). I did not buy this game to "duel". I bought it for the huge open world pvp experience i saw in the trailer. Nothing against duelers, it's just kind of boring and limited to meta builds/setups. I'd rather fight open world 1v1's with terrain i can work with.
EDIT
I had to comment on all the agree's. Holy moly. Glad so many people agree with me.
THIS.
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film✭✭✭I am a little numb to ESO announcements. I will admit being an avid fan of Matt's work I expected more considering he's replicated mistakes from DFC and DAOC.
Follow the stream if you like the stream. Marry the stream if you love the stream.0 -
a1i3nz✭✭✭✭Ideally there would be more than one game mode for the BGs and Arena than just dueling, something that lets all builds be effective.0 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »I can tell you havent played BDO. It could not be more different from a theme park mmo like ESO.
Where did I say it was? I said it has a PVP system and ESO has a PVP system and even said it's a sandbox.0 -
Lord_Chonus✭✭I personally like the idea. It would be good for players like myself who struggle in pvp to get practice and hone their builds and skills.Edited by Lord_Chonus on March 29, 2016 3:09AM1 -
Farorin✭✭✭✭✭While I am all for arena's dueling, etc. I would MUCH prefer they put more resources into fixing the lag so that we can have those intense, epic, massive battles of old. Nothing was more fun than those.1 -
SlayerTheDragon✭✭✭✭✭While I am all for arena's dueling, etc. I would MUCH prefer they put more resources into fixing the lag so that we can have those intense, epic, massive battles of old. Nothing was more fun than those.
Wait, are you saying there was a time when there was no lag in Cyrodiil? If it worked at one point, then why is it broken??
¤═══¤ People don't like it when you talk to them with your weapon drawn ¤═══¤0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »Since it is a legitimate concern, can someone who is against Arenas and Battlegrounds tell me how it will make the game worse??
Look at swtor and wow. All focus on large scale pvp vanished after arenas were introduced and the pvp populace dwindled to nothing quickly. Its pretty simple really. Arenas are the death of popular mmo pvp.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭mzapkeneb18_ESO wrote: »I'm pretty sure the guys was asked for this, are also those who wanted no cp campagin and we all know it ended.
No cp campaigns are the most popular campaigns in EU megaserver. Dunno what you are talking about. CPs just make balancing 999999999 x more difficult.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭There isn't really any real good reason not to have some sort of arena combat, as far as I can tell. A lot people say "balance" but I don't really buy that, why would putting an equal amount of players against each other create imbalances? It's almost like ZOS is afraid of the amount of statistical data that could be used from arenas, to help balance the game..
The IC districts are worthless, make them into the small scale everyone wants.
Obviously, after Cyro's lag is fixed...........
Look at other games that have done it. Going from more numbers of players fighting to a smaller amount amplifies balance issues. In SWTOR right now, all 8 classes are viable in warzones. In arenas, 3 are actually competitive but I think 1 of those got needed out, another 3 are meh, and 2 are absolutely intolerable to play unless you're group actively protects the bell out of you.
Oh, and I too came to ESO for the PVP. Found the game awful in beta until I hit level 10. And it's the reason I linger is its the only game that's really doing it now with a good siege engine.
This. People wanting arenas are probably the ones that played the ultra fotm classes in swtor and wow and in this game as well tbh. If they played the classes that got ultra shafted in arenas they would have a different tone.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Lord_Chonus wrote: »I personally like the idea. It would be good for players like myself who struggle in pvp to get practice and hone their builds and skills.
Thats not how it works. In arenas your lack of experience would be even more glaring as you constantly get focused downby 4 fotm dps players.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭While I am all for arena's dueling, etc. I would MUCH prefer they put more resources into fixing the lag so that we can have those intense, epic, massive battles of old. Nothing was more fun than those.
Wait, are you saying there was a time when there was no lag in Cyrodiil? If it worked at one point, then why is it broken??
When they switched from client side to server side connections. Went from hardly any lag to lag fest instantly.1 -
Abob✭✭✭Battlegrounds will kill Cyrodiil... I guess they mean lag can't be fixed, just like AC, it's here to stay.
Lore friendly arenas are welcome.0 -
skillastat✭✭✭✭Lord_Chonus wrote: »I personally like the idea. It would be good for players like myself who struggle in pvp to get practice and hone their builds and skills.
That is exactly what a lot of people would ask of such a concept. They did good with Imperial City Districts for quick respawns, but the mobs are an unnecesary addition. My first thought when I saw IC was coming was "Arena District in TES4 Oblivion remake, I'll have a lot of fun PvP'in in there."
But again, the mobs ruins it.
Do you want an Arena in ESO ? Let's all ask the devs to Remove the Bosses in the center of the Arena District, and make the upper floor accessible so people can go /sitchair and watch others fight.
EDIT
TyposEdited by skillastat on March 29, 2016 11:36AM(PC NA)
-Saulo Stamina Sorcerer
-skillastat Stamina Nightblade
-a blade spirit Stamina Templar
-Ultima Online I Magicka Dragonknight
-'Solo DC* Stamina Sorcerer
-'Ultima Online Stamina Dragonknight
-Nerd Dk Tank Dragonknight
-Solochi Magicka Sorcerer
-Solo Lucci Magicka Nightblade
-Sølomon Magicka Warden
*All characters are EP, except for one DC.
French Canadian!2 -
Lucious90✭✭✭skillastat wrote: »Lord_Chonus wrote: »I personally like the idea. It would be good for players like myself who struggle in pvp to get practice and hone their builds and skills.
That is exactly what a lot of people would ask of such a concept. They did good with Imperial City Districts for quick respawns, but the mobs are an unnecesary addition. My first thought when I saw IC was coming was "Arena District in TES4 Oblivion remake, I'll have a lot of fun PvP'in in there."
But again, the mobs ruins it.
Do you want an Arena in ESO ? Let's all ask the devs to Remove the Bosses in the center of the Arena District, and make the upper floor accessible so people can go /sitchair and watch others fight.
EDIT
Typos
If they do the Arenas and BGs right then it would be awesome for people to get into pvp fresh, give us AP or a new token to earn pvp gear and mats through vendors. I loved wows system for that, warhammer online also had a system though no arena system. If you are going to run these, there has to be incentive for it. Make participating worth it, MWO does this perfect. You get rewards for killing others, but you get multipliers base on your team participation, dpsing down others, objective completion etc
As for lore specific, it could fall in line with the retaking of IC, or battles for resources and Key locations within Cyro incorporate different game variants so its not the same, zerg to the center kill everything and repeat. Make participating worth it. MWO does this perfect. You get rewards for killing others, but you get multipliers base on your team participation, dpsing down others, objective completion etc make it a LFG style or else it will become IC arena district, minus the boss mobsXbox/NA
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mattymaats✭✭✭Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »Since it is a legitimate concern, can someone who is against Arenas and Battlegrounds tell me how it will make the game worse??
Look at swtor and wow. All focus on large scale pvp vanished after arenas were introduced and the pvp populace dwindled to nothing quickly. Its pretty simple really. Arenas are the death of popular mmo pvp.
The only world pvp that used to happen on wow before the battle arenas come out was at Hillsbrad foothills which consisted of big groups of players rushing into each others town and being chased back to their own town. On rare occasions someone would muster a raid of players to storm Kalimoor but it would just be zerged back into the elf kingdoms. I do remember a few rare raids into the main cities but it was rare. I do not see how the battleground ruined pvp in wow as the pvp was pretty boring to start with and I played it from release date for a good few years. The battleground had to be introduced as WoW didn't have a pvp system and the world pvp was boring and if enough people rushed a main city it totally lagged the server forcing a restart most of the time.
EoS is different though as it already has a functioning pvp system in place so there's less of a reason to add battlegrounds and it will divide the players between the 2 systems so I can see how it might reduce the numbers in Cyrodill but maybe EoS want this to happen as it's cheaper than having to recode or upgrade hardware. I think it will be a nice addition as it will add something new to pvp and another area for people to try and wave around their Epeen to see who has a bigger one.
All I will say is if they are going to put in battleground/arenas then they had better do it bloody properly or not at all, with a proper ranking system in place and a reward system that's worth the time investment.0 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Am I the only one who enjoys SWTOR pvp? Hutt ball?
I still play swtor only for the pvp. The story is meh and pve is meh. 0 -
VincentBlanquin✭✭✭so what about let players decide what kind of pvp will they play? i can imagine many players came back for instanced pvp and cyrodiil become less ganking place and more tactics war. more opportunities are always better then less.
gaming market is starving for good pvp so if zenimax can surprise with good execution everything is possibleEdited by VincentBlanquin on March 29, 2016 1:28PMIrwen Vincinter - Nord - Dragonknight
Irw´en - Bosmer - Nightblade1 -
Lucious90✭✭✭jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »Am I the only one who enjoys SWTOR pvp? Hutt ball? I still play swtor only for the pvp. The story is meh and pve is meh.
I loved HuttBall!!!! I only played while they were a monthly sub game, havent played sinceXbox/NA
Naturegoat - Stam Warden
Healgoat- Mag temp
Staticgoat- Stam Sorc1 -
If they do the Arenas and BGs right then it would be awesome for people to get into pvp fresh, give us AP or a new token to earn pvp gear and mats through vendors.
Arenas/BGs shouldn't award AP, there should be a completely different award system. AP should be exclusive to Cyrodiil and IC. This will keep both areas relevant as long as Zenimax maintains the upkeep with varied incentives for each. A small task.
I really just want Arenas/BGs for a different option to PvP. I love Cyrodiil but it's been 2 years and vet campaigns are overrun with AP farming Ball groups. And now suicide bombing Proxy/VD dummies.
My solution to Champion Point System here2 -
Lucious90✭✭✭Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »
If they do the Arenas and BGs right then it would be awesome for people to get into pvp fresh, give us AP or a new token to earn pvp gear and mats through vendors.
Arenas/BGs shouldn't award AP, there should be a completely different award system. AP should be exclusive to Cyrodiil and IC. This will keep both areas relevant as long as Zenimax maintains the upkeep with varied incentives for each. A small task.
I really just want Arenas/BGs for a different option to PvP. I love Cyrodiil but it's been 2 years and vet campaigns are overrun with AP farming Ball groups. And now suicide bombing Proxy/VD dummies.
Agreed, I can take not having AP as that would be a good way to keep Cyro relative, Maybe rework the TV stones?Xbox/NA
Naturegoat - Stam Warden
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Staticgoat- Stam Sorc0 -
jamesharv2005ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I just hope they put the arenas/battlegrounds in their own area someplace. instanced or something. Not in cyrodill.0 -
SneaK✭✭✭✭✭
✭There isn't really any real good reason not to have some sort of arena combat, as far as I can tell. A lot people say "balance" but I don't really buy that, why would putting an equal amount of players against each other create imbalances? It's almost like ZOS is afraid of the amount of statistical data that could be used from arenas, to help balance the game..
The IC districts are worthless, make them into the small scale everyone wants.
Obviously, after Cyro's lag is fixed...........
Look at other games that have done it. Going from more numbers of players fighting to a smaller amount amplifies balance issues. In SWTOR right now, all 8 classes are viable in warzones. In arenas, 3 are actually competitive but I think 1 of those got needed out, another 3 are meh, and 2 are absolutely intolerable to play unless you're group actively protects the bell out of you.
Oh, and I too came to ESO for the PVP. Found the game awful in beta until I hit level 10. And it's the reason I linger is its the only game that's really doing it now with a good siege engine.
This. People wanting arenas are probably the ones that played the ultra fotm classes in swtor and wow and in this game as well tbh. If they played the classes that got ultra shafted in arenas they would have a different tone.
@laced @technohic
Could you guys give an example or prediction on how something would become unbalanced in ESO due to arenas?
I never played SWTOR or WoW so I can't relate to your posts."IMO"Aldmeri Dominion1 Nightblade - 1 Templar - 7 Hybrid Mutt Abominations0 -
@Lucious90 Nah I would keep TV stones for IC. Think a good option for TV stones is to make them exchangeable for Gold Mats. I have heard that idea thrown around and like the idea but I think they should be Bind on Pickup so it doesn't flood the market.My solution to Champion Point System here1
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Lucious90✭✭✭There isn't really any real good reason not to have some sort of arena combat, as far as I can tell. A lot people say "balance" but I don't really buy that, why would putting an equal amount of players against each other create imbalances? It's almost like ZOS is afraid of the amount of statistical data that could be used from arenas, to help balance the game..
The IC districts are worthless, make them into the small scale everyone wants.
Obviously, after Cyro's lag is fixed...........
Look at other games that have done it. Going from more numbers of players fighting to a smaller amount amplifies balance issues. In SWTOR right now, all 8 classes are viable in warzones. In arenas, 3 are actually competitive but I think 1 of those got needed out, another 3 are meh, and 2 are absolutely intolerable to play unless you're group actively protects the bell out of you.
Oh, and I too came to ESO for the PVP. Found the game awful in beta until I hit level 10. And it's the reason I linger is its the only game that's really doing it now with a good siege engine.
This. People wanting arenas are probably the ones that played the ultra fotm classes in swtor and wow and in this game as well tbh. If they played the classes that got ultra shafted in arenas they would have a different tone.
@laced @technohic
Could you guys give an example or prediction on how something would become unbalanced in ESO due to arenas?
I never played SWTOR or WoW so I can't relate to your posts.
I cant speak for SWTOR but I have a bit here on WoW up to Cataclysm. Open PvP in vanilla was boring, litterally consisted of attacking and zerging a capitol city, Hillsbrad and Tarren Mills. then get beat out, big whoop. Probably got some lower levels or alts pretty upset. BG and Arena gave us a bit more variety which to me helped, every class has rotated to be the flavor of the month, I remember paladins being pretty popular and had to adjust the AoE calcuations during WOTLK. The onlything the intro of BG and Arenas did was give PvP meaning something ESO needs. Heck after the fact they introducted Wintergrasp, an instanced world like pvp event that happened every hour for the opportunity for a good 40 man raid and I think pvp gear IRRC and I believe they released another one as well (dont quote me though as I havent played since Cataclysm).
In short Arenas and BG could and in my opion would help the PvP environment but ZOS must implement it rightXbox/NA
Naturegoat - Stam Warden
Healgoat- Mag temp
Staticgoat- Stam Sorc0 -
rich.magab14a_ESO wrote: »rich.magab14a_ESO wrote: »
We'll take it as unsubstantiated opinion then.
I'm all in favour of ZOS fixing the PvP issues and adding more PvP content in PvP areas, but not PvPers exaggerating their numbers and importance.
No one is exaggerating anything. The majority of people that came into this game in the beginning signed up for large scale pvp.
I'll put the same question to you that I put earlier then. Is that your unsubtantiated opinion or are you able to produce the evidence to support that statement as fact?
You'll doubtless be aware that there was plenty of marketing for the PvE content, that the whole game was based around a single player series in which by definition PvP had no part, and that the original box featured four illustrated descriptions of the focus of the game, only one of which related to PvP.
Again, I'm fine with PvP and agree that a lot of players came into the game for the large scale PvP that was promoted, but let's not get carried away with statements about that being "the majority of people" unless that is qualified as a personal opinion or supported by evidence as fact.
Or are you also going to claim that when you said "the majority of people" you actually meant "the majority of PvPers"? That's where the exaggeration came in earlier, claiming something more than was subsequently conceded to be what was meant.
Again over a 100 million on a marketing campaign that focus's on the pvp aspect. I never seen high budget productions for any of the pve content. Where are the high end cinematics featuring the 3 alliance leaders, the mages guild, fighters guild, or anything in the main quest line. The logo for ESO is the three animal ouroboros that signifies the AvAvA. When this game first launched there was no end game pve content to market only pvp.
100 million? That number seems pretty huge. Im pretty sure you could make an entire full length film for that price.0