Stam Sorcs, where are their improvements?

D0ntevenL1ft · February 2016

AfkNinja wrote: »

D0ntevenL1ft wrote: »

I enjoy how this thread keeps growing without any reply from ZOS. Keep it up guys and maybe we can force change.

Lol please. Templar's are at over 2000 posts. If ZOS doesn't wanna acknowledge you they won't.
I feel for you guys but it looks like Stam balancing patch isn't till Dark Brotherhood.

Shhh dont mention templar near stam sorc because I'm afraid of nerf through affiliation

Autolycus · February 2016

I'd like to see a useful stam DoT or weavable instant-cast damage skill. I'd also like to see certain skills that deal shock damage (like thundering presence) changed to physical so that it plays nicely with CP passives.

Currently my stam sorc has 5288 weapon damage (fully buffed: surge, kena, SPC), 36k stam, recovery is very low for pve, but I don't run out much, and about 68% crit if I remember correctly. Not sure what else to do to make stronger though. He's already sitting in full legendary gear at vr16, has vMA sharpened maul too, but don't seem to pull more than 25-28k on my best runs.

Cathexis · February 2016

Jeezye wrote: »

I also agree to stam sorcs making use of their class utility such as streak and mobility, and I think they should mainly buff their physical dmg, like critsurge. The thing is that one loses 2 slots to bound armaments, 1 to critsurge and if you want to give them more assisting abilites even more. That doesn't leave much room for damage abilites that stamina sorcs will have to take from weapon skill lines. The nice thing however is that you have a optional 3rd skillbar that I'm making use of all the time and that is essential in all my stam sorc builds.

What I'm trying to say is, buffing is great, but if you have to keep 4 buffs with 15-20 sec uptime active your basically only buffing your whole combat. Other classes have their buffs integrated into their passives. So since all sorc passives are working okay, the needed buffs need to be applied to the skills that we use. Thats why I'm saying give critsurge also major fracture, and just twink the overall passives of bound armament and boundless storm.

THIS IS A MASSIVE PROBLEM.

Nit only that, but from my perspective as a stam tank build in pvp, to get all the necessary buffs to keep up I have to run 9/10 skill slots buffs/defensive abilities. You basically get werewolf, poison/arrow + overload + heroic strike if you are using a bow, crit rush and wb (or heroic strike) if you use a 2 hand..and that's it. That's your offensive toolkit.

Jeezye · February 2016

Alright, so if bound armaments is supposed to be a passive buffing ability taking two slots, then it should fullfill all your defense needed. Pretending crit surge worked reliably, we don't need another healing effect. This means the active component of bound armaments needs to be a direct defensive ability. Since we are sorcs, a stamin based shield would be fitting best, maybe combined with the major mending effect, as stated above. The shield has to be that high, that we dont need to slot other defensive abilities.

Damange wise, I'd actually be fine if they buffed the HA dmg of bound armamanets enough to let the HAs compete with WB/surprise attack. That way we keep the direction of supporting our physical dmg with spells while not being forced to use specific weapon line skills (and free up slots).

Jeezye · March 2016

Guys did anyone test critsurge yet? New PTS notes say that it got fixed regarding healing against shields, can anyone confirm this? I don't quite understand how they ment that since critsurge heals of crits and you can't crit shields. So how exactly does that change work??

RoyJade · March 2016

I think the game decide when a crit proc before the impact, and then the crit is negated by the shield. They probably moved the healing calculation part before the shield's response, or move the "flag" from "damage taken" to "damage landed".

Xeven · March 2016

Abilities that heal based on their damage done (Strife, Puncturing Sweeps, Surge, etc.) will now properly calculate their heal values when the damage is fully or partially absorbed.

This is a kind of a big deal. Awesome change.

Xeven · March 2016

@FENGRUSH ^

ub17_ESO · March 2016

Amongst other things, I hate that the best class skill for stam sorcs forces me to hide my armor....

Xeven · March 2016

ub17_ESO wrote: »

Amongst other things, I hate that the best class skill for stam sorcs forces me to hide my armor....

It's only used because of the regen passive slot requirements, nobody would slot it otherwise. Best for stam is a tossup between lightning form and crit surge. I would take crit surge.

It needs to be untoggled, and former toggles need to work on both bars even if they are only on one.

For the life of me I cant understand why in a game with only 5 skill slots they would make these sort of limitations. It's not an interesting choice when you're limited to this extreme. It makes them far less interesting, actually.

Giving up one slot for a buff is an interesting choice. Giving up two is deliberately gimping ability, and the class overall.

Erock25 · March 2016

So anyone actually test this new heals from surge against shields? I didn't do PTS this round because zos never listens to feedback anyways.

Jar_Ek · March 2016

Bound Armour would be okay if it had an active component, such as a bound weapon which caused your next light or heavy to caused a major fracture (breach for aegis) for 8s or something like that.

Xeven · March 2016

Jar_Ek wrote: »

Bound Armour would be okay if it had an active component, such as a bound weapon which caused your next light or heavy to caused a major fracture (breach for aegis) for 8s or something like that.

That's not enough. Spending that global cooldown on a WB would do far more damage. However, if it had an active component, it wouldnt be a toggle.

It's still not enough though. A formal toggle that only provides its buff on one bar is not going to be worth the slot.

The same thing applies to Inner Light. If it's taking a slot on your DPS bar, it's not really helping the issue with toggles to begin with.

If they want to force the weapon swaps, then they need to be instant, and they need to work while in CC. Casting something on your back bar should be as easy as capitalizing the C at the beginning of this sentence.

Jar_Ek · March 2016

@Xeven True a wb would do more damage. So maybe bound weapon would need to be a longer prebuff that meant every light or heavy attack whilst active caused a fracture for 3s. So it would be included within a weave - and bound weapon would only need to be cast every 30s or so.

Jeezye · March 2016

Xeven wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

Bound Armour would be okay if it had an active component, such as a bound weapon which caused your next light or heavy to caused a major fracture (breach for aegis) for 8s or something like that.

That's not enough. Spending that global cooldown on a WB would do far more damage. However, if it had an active component, it wouldnt be a toggle.

Actually all pets work like this now. I think, since bound armaments is a summoning spell, it should behave similar to a twilight e.g., which is summoned by toggling and has a reactivation feature. Since bound armaments is a defensive skill, the active component should fit into the lacks of defense that stam sorcs struggle with.

Jar_Ek · March 2016

A defensive active element to Bound Armour would have to be carefully considered to ensure it didn't buff magicka sorcerers too much as the combination of stacked wards and an active defensive buff might be quite op. Of course if zos gut ward's then this situation would change immediately.

RoyJade · March 2016

A buff who don't apply for shield should be a good idea, isn't it ? Bound aegis as a defensive way who don't need shield (and don't boost them) should perfectly fit a tanking skill role. I wonder if the minor protection buff work for shield.

Jeezye · March 2016

Jar_Ek wrote: »

A defensive active element to Bound Armour would have to be carefully considered to ensure it didn't buff magicka sorcerers too much as the combination of stacked wards and an active defensive buff might be quite op. Of course if zos gut ward's then this situation would change immediately.

Just make it stamina based and its useless for magicka sorcs. Im talking of something like a shield or a heal like vigor or maybe a dodgechance + heal or ... Tons of stuff one could add here to help.

Mumyo · March 2016

Surge now should heal u when hitting shields btw. Its in the 2.3.4. notes.

Jeezye · March 2016

Mumyo wrote: »

Surge now should heal u when hitting shields btw. Its in the 2.3.4. notes.

I couln't test it yet, but I'd love to know the exact functionality. Do you get healed for a crit thats calculated before it hits the shield, and then the shield absorbs the critted dmg, or do you get healed for the reduced (noncritted) dmg you do to shields?

dodgehopper_ESO · March 2016

Xeven wrote: »

ub17_ESO wrote: »

Amongst other things, I hate that the best class skill for stam sorcs forces me to hide my armor....

It's only used because of the regen passive slot requirements, nobody would slot it otherwise. Best for stam is a tossup between lightning form and crit surge. I would take crit surge.

It needs to be untoggled, and former toggles need to work on both bars even if they are only on one.

For the life of me I cant understand why in a game with only 5 skill slots they would make these sort of limitations. It's not an interesting choice when you're limited to this extreme. It makes them far less interesting, actually.

Giving up one slot for a buff is an interesting choice. Giving up two is deliberately gimping ability, and the class overall.

I agree with this issue, and it is a problem a lot of classes face. I would like for instance to not have to slot Repentance on both bars either, or have to slot werewolf on both bars to get the bonus, or inner light, or anything. I agree with you that these passive skill slot bonuses should exist as a whole, and not just on the bar you have active. I feel the same way about Sorcerer pets, I don't really think you should have to have them slotted on both bars. A lot of Sorcerers would be more likely to use pets if they didn't take up their entire bar, and therefore force them to have nothing active to fire. I'm all for having to make choices, but I agree with the notion that this is a flaw. I also think the whole idea of having toggles in this game is a flaw.

Dyride · March 2016

To increase the viability of Bound Armaments and continue with the Bound weapons theme from previous ES games, adding a blue Morkuldin Sword to Bound Armaments as an active effect would be a nice boost to DPS.

AfkNinja · March 2016

Dyride wrote: »

To increase the viability of Bound Armaments and continue with the Bound weapons theme from previous ES games, adding a blue Morkuldin Sword to Bound Armaments as an active effect would be a nice boost to DPS.

Bound Armaments: Once toggled changes to "Lightning Slash" conjure a deadric weapon infused with the fury of the storm. Slash your enemy for X dmg additionally applies "charged" status resulting in all lightning damage being increased by 10% for 3-4 seconds. Damage simmilar to Surprise attack and scales with stam?

That would look awesome.

Edit: ZOS doesn't want to give you guys an instant attack though. /sad

Jeezye · March 2016

I'd be more that super happy if at least anything changed for now. I don't even particulary want a spammable dps skill. If we want to follow our theme of buffing our normal attacks with spells as mentioned above, increasing the HA dmg would work perfectly for now. Maybe the dmg skill that sorcs should be using are light and heavy attacks? I like the idea and it would make them special and seperate from other classes.

AfkNinja · March 2016

Jeezye wrote: »

I'd be more that super happy if at least anything changed for now. I don't even particulary want a spammable dps skill. If we want to follow our theme of buffing our normal attacks with spells as mentioned above, increasing the HA dmg would work perfectly for now. Maybe the dmg skill that sorcs should be using are light and heavy attacks? I like the idea and it would make them special and seperate from other classes.

What if the DMG skill tied to Bound Armaments had a 1s cast with random proc on other skills for instant? Like Frags, but a stam variant. It would need comparable dmg too.

Edit: Or chance to proc instant cast off light/heavy attacks. 10% for light, 25%+ for heavy?

cschwingeb14_ESO · March 2016

AfkNinja wrote: »

Bound Armaments: Once toggled changes to "Lightning Slash" conjure a deadric weapon infused with the fury of the storm. Slash your enemy for X dmg additionally applies "charged" status resulting in all lightning damage being increased by 10% for 3-4 seconds. Damage simmilar to Surprise attack and scales with stam?

That would look awesome.

Edit: ZOS doesn't want to give you guys an instant attack though. /sad

This is an amazing idea to make bound armor and morphs useful and not boring. It's thematic, it could be applied to all morphs for an instant magicka or stamina attack.

I'd gladly trade the stat buff for an active ability

kkampaseb17_ESO · March 2016

AfkNinja wrote: »

Jeezye wrote: »

I'd be more that super happy if at least anything changed for now. I don't even particulary want a spammable dps skill. If we want to follow our theme of buffing our normal attacks with spells as mentioned above, increasing the HA dmg would work perfectly for now. Maybe the dmg skill that sorcs should be using are light and heavy attacks? I like the idea and it would make them special and seperate from other classes.

What if the DMG skill tied to Bound Armaments had a 1s cast with random proc on other skills for instant? Like Frags, but a stam variant. It would need comparable dmg too.

Edit: Or chance to proc instant cast off light/heavy attacks. 10% for light, 25%+ for heavy?

Wow....what an amazing idea actually.

mistermutiny89 · March 2016

1. Reduce cost of thundering presence and have it remove snares.

2. Magicka sorcs don't use the aoe crystal frags so give us an instant cast dps morph that only Ccs when the enemy has been debuffed by lightning status effect.

3. Morph for Curse that causes major defile and poison damage.

These are big changes that would fix most stam sorc issues and make them as bursty as their magicka counterparts.

It'd also clear out a couple of unused morphs. This isn't rocket science.

AfkNinja · March 2016

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

AfkNinja wrote: »

Jeezye wrote: »

I'd be more that super happy if at least anything changed for now. I don't even particulary want a spammable dps skill. If we want to follow our theme of buffing our normal attacks with spells as mentioned above, increasing the HA dmg would work perfectly for now. Maybe the dmg skill that sorcs should be using are light and heavy attacks? I like the idea and it would make them special and seperate from other classes.

What if the DMG skill tied to Bound Armaments had a 1s cast with random proc on other skills for instant? Like Frags, but a stam variant. It would need comparable dmg too.

Edit: Or chance to proc instant cast off light/heavy attacks. 10% for light, 25%+ for heavy?

Wow....what an amazing idea actually.

Thanks! Just trying to think up a thematic attack that fits with the general idea of what ZOS has been doing with Storc. Plus, who wouldn't love a Lightning Edge type attack?

Edit: The more I think about it the more I think the instant cast chance should be tied to heavy attacks. Then bound armaments has +11% HA dmg, +8% stam, 25%~ chance to proc instant Lightning Edge on Bound Armaments.

Jeezye · March 2016

Yeah Id love to play my stam sorcs around HAs and it'd make em special compared to other stam based classes