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Surprise Attack OP?
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nordickittyhawk✭✭✭✭✭@nordickittyhawk
Lol ok you have never played this game I'm done talking to nubs BYE FORUMS
played since beta
malestrom no problem, imperial prison no problem, all trials cake walk, pvp meh im alright. but if your brining a vet 7 sorc to pvp yeah your at a disadvantage k thnx bye 4 -
nordickittyhawk✭✭✭✭✭nordickittyhawk wrote: »@nordickittyhawk go play stam sorc in pvp and say what you just said again. And honestly zos doesn't have to nerf SA, as long as they give my stam sorc something equivalent.
stam sorcs are fine .-. ever seen fengrush play? no one even tries stam sorc cause magic shield stacking.
Playing a stam sorc myself i would agree with you here if it werent for the case that most stam sorcs arent actually stam sorcs, but instead the proof of how strong the 2H skills are.
Pigenholed to healing (surge rally vigor) they are incredibly vulnerable to the more and more popular reverberating bashes, as well as hardly standing a chance against blocking enemies (or both) as well as magicka sorcs. On top of that cloak just counters uppercut straigt up.
Just about all stam sorcs (like most stamplars) rely on uppercut to kill anyone and thus every fight is a dance to hit the enemy, while all other builds except magplars have easily applied damage through instant cast spells. This is not an issue if you are better than you opponent, but if you are even you are at an inherent disadvantage against those builds.
Also *** axeploiters for screwing the actual balance towards the builds that can utilize it the most (cough cough stam Dks).
yeah i know about all that should have to nerf a skill just for that. jabs needs alittle fix for templar. dks? there dot build so... they dont have spamable. stam sorc just a class thats naturally powerful. if there was more options in weapon trees maybe there would be more builds.0 -
FullBlownBeast✭✭✭lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »You are comparing an aoe skill to a single target skill.
In addition to that, he is comparing a single skill(jabs) to a single skill + a passive(surprise attack by itself does not do major resolve or major ward, that comes from a separate passive).
A more fair comparison would be if he added burning light passive to the jabs - that increases the damage output considerably.
[edit] hmm even without burning light the damage against a single target does not look bad for jabs.
1388 with each strike, and iirc there are three four(it's in the tooltip dummy
) strikes during the channel, so 3x1388=4164 4x1388=5552
then, the closest target takes 140% more damage, so 4164 + 140% = 9993 5552 + 140% = 13324
Then you add burning light. Hmm.Edited by FullBlownBeast on January 24, 2016 7:44PMPlain and Simple1 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »
Check your passives again and you'll realize that Templars and NBs have the same buff to crit damage.leepalmer95 wrote: »Jabs doesn't work on shields either, and how many times are you realistically going to hit all 4 jabs on a half decent player?
Your lucky if you hit them 2/3 times at most. You actually have to aim jabs.
Jabs doesn't work on shields, but if were going to include passive, SA gives the user 5.2k armour on use as well.
Plus all nb's have high crit which high crit dmg. 50%+ is the min but usually i see people with 70% with 180%~ crit dmg.
Thats were SA suddenly starts doing stupid dmg.
Plus the first SA will be empowered usually. If ambushed in or the HA/SA from stealth weave will kill someone or take them to 25% hp.
Looks balanced to me.... <
( Sarcasm)
Exactly hence why i never mentioned it?
Point is SA does more dmg than a 1.1s channel.
A channel that won't hit all 4 of it's hits vs a good player.
That doesn't work on shields.
SA is instant, debuff's, stuns as well as gives 5.2k armour. Oh and as nb's are literally mean't for crit builds, nb's will crit most of the time were as pvp templars have quite a bit less crit. Also most templars are using serpant/atronach for regen while nb's can use shadow because they have an inherant 15% regen, sure templas have 10% but they have to waste a skill slot.
Anyway never mind all that SA/ Jabs simply because of the dmg/utility and fact it's instant and can be weaved quickly and more effectively.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1 -
Ampnode✭✭✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »and btw the only way to pull numbers like that off would be through pure "light armor" magicka build.
stamina build medium armor could never get that high in damage.
So my stamina NB that has 2.3K stam regen and 4.1K weapon damage with 62% crit isn't that high in damage? I need to create a better build
PC NA - CP640+
Characters:
Amp - Magicka Nightblade
Amp - Magicka Sorcerer
Amp - Magicka Templar
Amp - Stamina Dragonknight
Amp - Stamina Templar
Amp - Magicka Dragonknight
Amp - Stamina Sorcerer
Amp - Stamina Nightblade0 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »and btw the only way to pull numbers like that off would be through pure "light armor" magicka build.
stamina build medium armor could never get that high in damage.
So my stamina NB that has 2.3K stam regen and 4.1K weapon damage with 62% crit isn't that high in damage? I need to create a better build
Do you have 28k hp if not your '2 hit'....PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I think most reasonable people admit that SA is one of the strongest abilities in the game. It is definitely stronger than Biting Jabs.The only question is whether it needs to be nerfed or other stuff needs to be buffed.Edited by timidobserver on January 24, 2016 10:33PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
Mumyo✭✭✭✭✭Major defense buff + Major fracture or whatever in 1 skill that costs nothing and does tons of dmg instantly... of course its OP!1 -
Barlthump✭✭✭RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »
Tell that to the BoL, WB, Jab, Overload spammers who press one button to win as well. I on the other hand have to go to stealth, position myself and then go in0 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »
Tell that to the BoL, WB, Jab, Overload spammers who press one button to win as well. I on the other hand have to go to stealth, position myself and then go in
Your seriously complaing about templars on a nb?PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...2 -
Barlthump✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »
Tell that to the BoL, WB, Jab, Overload spammers who press one button to win as well. I on the other hand have to go to stealth, position myself and then go in
Your seriously complaing about templars on a nb?
NO I'm just saying everyone is pressing one button to win. It's funny how you think I was complaining. One guy posted
A generic, "press 1 to kill" button that you're encouraged to use over and over is just poor design.
While practically all classes do it but he chooses to target one class.2 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »
Tell that to the BoL, WB, Jab, Overload spammers who press one button to win as well. I on the other hand have to go to stealth, position myself and then go in
Your seriously complaing about templars on a nb?
NO I'm just saying everyone is pressing one button to win. It's funny how you think I was complaining. One guy posted
A generic, "press 1 to kill" button that you're encouraged to use over and over is just poor design.
While practically all classes do it but he chooses to target one class.
My stam dk uses LA-Ransack-Bash with breath and keeps shuffle + rally + volcanic armour up? 1 button win.
My sorc uses curse/det/frag/execute/webs to kill people while keeping shields/surge up.
Nb's ambush + SA. = 3 hit kill.
My templar usually gets 1 attack off before he needs to heal vs a nb. Usually flare into jabs/ radiant/ shards, need to keep channel focus up with purifying ritual so i can actually heal, also toppling when it works it good burst dmg as i can only kill people with burst sadly.
Those people who press 1 button to win are just bad, people who use wb annoy me, stupid high dmg ability with broken cc, broken range and empower and they literally spam it, they don't even execute.
Nb's are a literally 1 button class though.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...5 -
Zinaroth✭✭✭✭✭
✭lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »You are comparing an aoe skill to a single target skill.
In addition to that, he is comparing a single skill(jabs) to a single skill + a passive(surprise attack by itself does not do major resolve or major ward, that comes from a separate passive).
A more fair comparison would be if he added burning light passive to the jabs - that increases the damage output considerably.
[edit] hmm even without burning light the damage against a single target does not look bad for jabs.
1388 with each strike, and iirc there are three four(it's in the tooltip dummy) strikes during the channel, so 3x1388=4164 4x1388=5552
then, the closest target takes 140% more damage, so 4164 + 140% = 9993 5552 + 140% = 13324
Then you add burning light. Hmm.Gilliamtherogue wrote: »Really Alcast? You're better than this dude. At first glance it seems SA is way stronger than Jabs but once you actually think about it and break each one down, they're both pretty close in power. Please don't become like the rest of the fear mongers on these forums just to get your way. Someone has already mathematically broken down to show Jabs is a lot stronger than the small number listed on the tool tip, and also mentioned the fact that you also get burning light procs from each, and let's not forget the reason stamplars were OP in 1.6; camo able to proc each hit. There's way more going on behind the scenes than you suggest to in your thread, but nice bait m8.
You can fire off two SA including two light attacks in the same time it takes to finish a Jab. Both SA will land whereas most of Jabs will not unless the target is standing still. Furthermore the second SA will do more damage because of Major Breach, and Burning Light proc is magic damage so it doesn't scale well. The NB will have Major armor and spell resisr whereas the templar will be left with crit and can only pray target isn't using shields. In which case Burning Light won't proc and the crit will be useless. Furthermore Burning Light can only proc once per skill use because of its hidden CD.
It is pretty easy to see that SA is superior.Edited by Zinaroth on January 24, 2016 11:46PM4 -
Jura23✭✭✭✭✭
✭leepalmer95 wrote: »Jabs doesn't work on shields either, and how many times are you realistically going to hit all 4 jabs on a half decent player?
Your lucky if you hit them 2/3 times at most. You actually have to aim jabs.
Jabs doesn't work on shields, but if were going to include passive, SA gives the user 5.2k armour on use as well.
Plus all nb's have high crit which high crit dmg. 50%+ is the min but usually i see people with 70% with 180%~ crit dmg.
Thats were SA suddenly starts doing stupid dmg.
Plus the first SA will be empowered usually. If ambushed in or the HA/SA from stealth weave will kill someone or take them to 25% hp.
Looks balanced to me.... <
( Sarcasm)
let's start with capping crit at 50%, but not regular cap. make it so that all crit values are cut in half, so somebody who has 70% now is gonna have 35% with the same setup.Georgion - Bosmer/Templar - PC/EU0 -
Barlthump✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »
Tell that to the BoL, WB, Jab, Overload spammers who press one button to win as well. I on the other hand have to go to stealth, position myself and then go in
Your seriously complaing about templars on a nb?
NO I'm just saying everyone is pressing one button to win. It's funny how you think I was complaining. One guy posted
A generic, "press 1 to kill" button that you're encouraged to use over and over is just poor design.
While practically all classes do it but he chooses to target one class.
My stam dk uses LA-Ransack-Bash with breath and keeps shuffle + rally + volcanic armour up? 1 button win.
My sorc uses curse/det/frag/execute/webs to kill people while keeping shields/surge up.
Nb's ambush + SA. = 3 hit kill.
My templar usually gets 1 attack off before he needs to heal vs a nb. Usually flare into jabs/ radiant/ shards, need to keep channel focus up with purifying ritual so i can actually heal, also toppling when it works it good burst dmg as i can only kill people with burst sadly.
Those people who press 1 button to win are just bad, people who use wb annoy me, stupid high dmg ability with broken cc, broken range and empower and they literally spam it, they don't even execute.
Nb's are a literally 1 button class though.
And I use, double take, camo hunter, mass hysteria, Ambush and surprise attack (heavy weave animation cancel), death stroke with killers blade to finish? Only difference is you use them after a fight starts while I run around with my buffs all the time even when not in combat. Ask anyone who plays with me I constantly use my buffs even if there is no one around just so I'm ready. So don't come tell me you use more skills then me when I use the exact same amount of skills as amy other person.3 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »
Tell that to the BoL, WB, Jab, Overload spammers who press one button to win as well. I on the other hand have to go to stealth, position myself and then go in
Your seriously complaing about templars on a nb?
NO I'm just saying everyone is pressing one button to win. It's funny how you think I was complaining. One guy posted
A generic, "press 1 to kill" button that you're encouraged to use over and over is just poor design.
While practically all classes do it but he chooses to target one class.
My stam dk uses LA-Ransack-Bash with breath and keeps shuffle + rally + volcanic armour up? 1 button win.
My sorc uses curse/det/frag/execute/webs to kill people while keeping shields/surge up.
Nb's ambush + SA. = 3 hit kill.
My templar usually gets 1 attack off before he needs to heal vs a nb. Usually flare into jabs/ radiant/ shards, need to keep channel focus up with purifying ritual so i can actually heal, also toppling when it works it good burst dmg as i can only kill people with burst sadly.
Those people who press 1 button to win are just bad, people who use wb annoy me, stupid high dmg ability with broken cc, broken range and empower and they literally spam it, they don't even execute.
Nb's are a literally 1 button class though.
And I use, double take, camo hunter, mass hysteria, Ambush and surprise attack (heavy weave animation cancel), death stroke with killers blade to finish? Only difference is you use them after a fight starts while I run around with my buffs all the time even when not in combat. Ask anyone who plays with me I constantly use my buffs even if there is no one around just so I'm ready. So don't come tell me you use more skills then me when I use the exact same amount of skills as amy other person.
You buff up and ambush/SA.
Doesn't matter anyway, the thread is about SA. It's a high dps spam skill, with major breach/ward that also stuns as well as buffs your' armour by 5.2k.
Now every other class has to slot a skill and keep it up for armour. Nb's just get it naturally.
Every other class has to spefically use a skill that causes major ward/breach if they even can. Dk's have to use breath or use ransack/la/bash and AC them to even do dmg. Nb's do more and naturally have this.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1 -
Cody✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Nightblade is totally unbalanced. All of their attacks are instant cast and give huge buffs/debuffs. So unfair, as a stam sorc my only spamable dps skill is wrecking blow and ya it sucks. Especially when you go against NB in lag. Ya good luck ever hitting a wrecking blow with the lag and them *** NB's always using cloak.
i watched a magicka sorcerer put up a 27K damage shield just 5 minutes ago. You want to talk about an unfair advantage? we certainly can, because said sorcerer also had 30K HP and hit me for a 10K crystal frag. I have never seen any other class, in my year long history in ESO, pull anything like that. No NB I have seen comes close to anything of that extreme besides the people that can only gank from stealth for 12K heavies.2 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Nightblade is totally unbalanced. All of their attacks are instant cast and give huge buffs/debuffs. So unfair, as a stam sorc my only spamable dps skill is wrecking blow and ya it sucks. Especially when you go against NB in lag. Ya good luck ever hitting a wrecking blow with the lag and them *** NB's always using cloak.
i watched a magicka sorcerer put up a 27K damage shield just 5 minutes ago. You want to talk about an unfair advantage? we certainly can, because said sorcerer also had 30K HP and hit me for a 10K crystal frag. I have never seen any other class, in my year long history in ESO, pull anything like that. No NB I have seen comes close to anything of that extreme besides the people that can only gank from stealth for 12K heavies.
s/s or lies, was that sorc the emp?
27k dmg shield isn't 27k physical shield though.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1 -
Barlthump✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »
Tell that to the BoL, WB, Jab, Overload spammers who press one button to win as well. I on the other hand have to go to stealth, position myself and then go in
Your seriously complaing about templars on a nb?
NO I'm just saying everyone is pressing one button to win. It's funny how you think I was complaining. One guy posted
A generic, "press 1 to kill" button that you're encouraged to use over and over is just poor design.
While practically all classes do it but he chooses to target one class.
My stam dk uses LA-Ransack-Bash with breath and keeps shuffle + rally + volcanic armour up? 1 button win.
My sorc uses curse/det/frag/execute/webs to kill people while keeping shields/surge up.
Nb's ambush + SA. = 3 hit kill.
My templar usually gets 1 attack off before he needs to heal vs a nb. Usually flare into jabs/ radiant/ shards, need to keep channel focus up with purifying ritual so i can actually heal, also toppling when it works it good burst dmg as i can only kill people with burst sadly.
Those people who press 1 button to win are just bad, people who use wb annoy me, stupid high dmg ability with broken cc, broken range and empower and they literally spam it, they don't even execute.
Nb's are a literally 1 button class though.
And I use, double take, camo hunter, mass hysteria, Ambush and surprise attack (heavy weave animation cancel), death stroke with killers blade to finish? Only difference is you use them after a fight starts while I run around with my buffs all the time even when not in combat. Ask anyone who plays with me I constantly use my buffs even if there is no one around just so I'm ready. So don't come tell me you use more skills then me when I use the exact same amount of skills as amy other person.
You buff up and ambush/SA.
Doesn't matter anyway, the thread is about SA. It's a high dps spam skill, with major breach/ward that also stuns as well as buffs your' armour by 5.2k.
Now every other class has to slot a skill and keep it up for armour. Nb's just get it naturally.
Every other class has to spefically use a skill that causes major ward/breach if they even can. Dk's have to use breath or use ransack/la/bash and AC them to even do dmg. Nb's do more and naturally have this.
Now that's moving to a whole new topic altogether. You are looking at passives and not the skill itself, what I would do is move SA to the assassination tree and move double take to the shadow tree, that would remove the major buffs from the skill. The real issue here that you are QQ-ing about is how the skill synergizes with the passives.0 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »
Tell that to the BoL, WB, Jab, Overload spammers who press one button to win as well. I on the other hand have to go to stealth, position myself and then go in
Your seriously complaing about templars on a nb?
NO I'm just saying everyone is pressing one button to win. It's funny how you think I was complaining. One guy posted
A generic, "press 1 to kill" button that you're encouraged to use over and over is just poor design.
While practically all classes do it but he chooses to target one class.
My stam dk uses LA-Ransack-Bash with breath and keeps shuffle + rally + volcanic armour up? 1 button win.
My sorc uses curse/det/frag/execute/webs to kill people while keeping shields/surge up.
Nb's ambush + SA. = 3 hit kill.
My templar usually gets 1 attack off before he needs to heal vs a nb. Usually flare into jabs/ radiant/ shards, need to keep channel focus up with purifying ritual so i can actually heal, also toppling when it works it good burst dmg as i can only kill people with burst sadly.
Those people who press 1 button to win are just bad, people who use wb annoy me, stupid high dmg ability with broken cc, broken range and empower and they literally spam it, they don't even execute.
Nb's are a literally 1 button class though.
And I use, double take, camo hunter, mass hysteria, Ambush and surprise attack (heavy weave animation cancel), death stroke with killers blade to finish? Only difference is you use them after a fight starts while I run around with my buffs all the time even when not in combat. Ask anyone who plays with me I constantly use my buffs even if there is no one around just so I'm ready. So don't come tell me you use more skills then me when I use the exact same amount of skills as amy other person.
You buff up and ambush/SA.
Doesn't matter anyway, the thread is about SA. It's a high dps spam skill, with major breach/ward that also stuns as well as buffs your' armour by 5.2k.
Now every other class has to slot a skill and keep it up for armour. Nb's just get it naturally.
Every other class has to spefically use a skill that causes major ward/breach if they even can. Dk's have to use breath or use ransack/la/bash and AC them to even do dmg. Nb's do more and naturally have this.
Now that's moving to a whole new topic altogether. You are looking at passives and not the skill itself, what I would do is move SA to the assassination tree and move double take to the shadow tree, that would remove the major buffs from the skill. The real issue here that you are QQ-ing about is how the skill synergizes with the passives.
The skill is strong enough as it is, never mind taking the passives into account.
The skill does more dmg than jabs which is a channel.
And you can use this twice before you can use jabs once.
PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1 -
Cody✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »Nightblade is totally unbalanced. All of their attacks are instant cast and give huge buffs/debuffs. So unfair, as a stam sorc my only spamable dps skill is wrecking blow and ya it sucks. Especially when you go against NB in lag. Ya good luck ever hitting a wrecking blow with the lag and them *** NB's always using cloak.
i watched a magicka sorcerer put up a 27K damage shield just 5 minutes ago. You want to talk about an unfair advantage? we certainly can, because said sorcerer also had 30K HP and hit me for a 10K crystal frag. I have never seen any other class, in my year long history in ESO, pull anything like that. No NB I have seen comes close to anything of that extreme besides the people that can only gank from stealth for 12K heavies.
s/s or lies, was that sorc the emp?
27k dmg shield isn't 27k physical shield though.
he was not the emp, and it did happen, screenshot be damned. I am not lying. we engaged in battle, he threw down mines, i gap closed him, we scuffled, then he hit me with a 10K frag and killed me. a teammate came in, then the guy threw up a 27K damage shield, he was AD, and AD was de-throned a few hours before, so no he was not the emp. And i do not care if it is physical or not, those shields can still take quite a beating, a 3 second long cloak that can be stopped by an AOE and/or magelight is nothing compared to that.
I do not lie about such things, whether or not you believe me is up to you, but I know what I saw, and I highly doubt it was the first time. It amazes me how the majority of the people here have such an issue with a 3 second long cloak, but are fine with a damage shield that almost gives a second healthbar. Or they go berserk over a 12K stealth attack, but 9-12K crystal frags in open combat that can be insta cast are just fine. /sigh
Look, I am not trying to down talk sorcerers, nor am i trying to get them nerfed, I am just trying to point out that NBs are not the only ones with balance issues. a 20K damage shield is ridiculous, i do not care how weak that class may or may not be without it. You will not believe me though im sure, the Nightblade needs to be severely nerfed first, then these ridiculous damage shields will finally come to everyone's attention. If that is what it takes, fine, lets nerf the nightblade, maybe then people will see the real issues.
/end rantEdited by Cody on January 25, 2016 12:27AM3 -
MrGigglypants✭✭✭You're comparing an aoe cone with a single target spam lol not to mention jabs procs aedric passives that add 2k+ damage per proc.0
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leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »Nightblade is totally unbalanced. All of their attacks are instant cast and give huge buffs/debuffs. So unfair, as a stam sorc my only spamable dps skill is wrecking blow and ya it sucks. Especially when you go against NB in lag. Ya good luck ever hitting a wrecking blow with the lag and them *** NB's always using cloak.
i watched a magicka sorcerer put up a 27K damage shield just 5 minutes ago. You want to talk about an unfair advantage? we certainly can, because said sorcerer also had 30K HP and hit me for a 10K crystal frag. I have never seen any other class, in my year long history in ESO, pull anything like that. No NB I have seen comes close to anything of that extreme besides the people that can only gank from stealth for 12K heavies.
s/s or lies, was that sorc the emp?
27k dmg shield isn't 27k physical shield though.
he was not the emp, and it did happen, screenshot be damned. I am not lying. we engaged in battle, he threw down mines, i gap closed him, we scuffled, then he hit me with a 10K frag and killed me. a teammate came in, then the guy threw up a 27K damage shield, he was AD, and AD was de-throned a few hours before, so no he was not the emp. And i do not care if it is physical or not, those shields can still take quite a beating, a 3 second long cloak that can be stopped by an AOE and/or magelight is nothing compared to that.
I do not lie about such things, whether or not you believe me is up to you, but I know what I saw, and I highly doubt it was the first time. It amazes me how the majority of the people here have such an issue with a 3 second long cloak, but are fine with a damage shield that almost gives a second healthbar. Or they go berserk over a 12K stealth attack, but 9-12K crystal frags in open combat that can be insta cast are just fine. /sigh
Look, I am not trying to down talk sorcerers, nor am i trying to get them nerfed, I am just trying to point out that NBs are not the only ones with balance issues. a 20K damage shield is ridiculous, i do not care how weak that class may or may not be without it. You will not believe me though im sure, the Nightblade needs to be severely nerfed first, then these ridiculous damage shields will finally come to everyone's attention. If that is what it takes, fine, lets nerf the nightblade, maybe then people will see the real issues.
/end rant
ShieldBreaker.
If i manage to take out 25k dmg shields on my magicka templar i'm sure you can on your stamina character.
Though i've never been hit for a 10k frag before even on light armour characters.
Difference with the shields is if i use wb/ransack/meteor etc... my usual skills or dps rotation even if the sorc puts up a shield i'll still hit them. If their in execute range and i can still use executes to burn down the new shields they use.
Where as a nb, you press cloak everything misses. Your in execute range you cloak/ vigor or healing ward/ cloak and full hp.
Even if i break you out of cloak the first time your vigor or ward is up and i can't execute you because i need to aoe to find you, if i actually find you. Your healed.
PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...2 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MrGigglypants wrote: »You're comparing an aoe cone with a single target spam lol not to mention jabs procs aedric passives that add 2k+ damage per proc.
25% proc, that dmg isn't exactly insane, random proc, sure you technically get 1 per jabs channel but thats if you actually hit them.
No one uses jabs for the aoe, it's a templars dps single target skill.
Sa does comparable dmg to a 1.1s channel and you can get 2 SA off before you get 1 jab off.
'Balanced'PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1 -
pronkg✭✭✭✭Nightblade is totally unbalanced. All of their attacks are instant cast and give huge buffs/debuffs. So unfair, as a stam sorc my only spamable dps skill is wrecking blow and ya it sucks. Especially when you go against NB in lag. Ya good luck ever hitting a wrecking blow with the lag and them *** NB's always using cloak.
i watched a magicka sorcerer put up a 27K damage shield just 5 minutes ago. You want to talk about an unfair advantage? we certainly can, because said sorcerer also had 30K HP and hit me for a 10K crystal frag. I have never seen any other class, in my year long history in ESO, pull anything like that. No NB I have seen comes close to anything of that extreme besides the people that can only gank from stealth for 12K heavies.
The dmg shield is possible but only half of it will cover physical.
(Shield stacking should go for sure, we don't need it anyway)
However a shield like that and 30k health? I don't think so, either you've seen it wrong or he was indeed an emperor.
No way any sorc has 30k health and at least 45k magicka.
I mean I run 44.750 magicka, which is considered really high for a sorc even, but I have 20k health (in pvp, with food). Dunno what kind of equipment would provide me with another 10k health on top of that.
Edited by pronkg on January 25, 2016 12:39AM2 -
Farorin✭✭✭✭✭Same Gearsetup on Tempalr and NB
Surprise Attack Instant cast: Major Fracture, Major Resolve, Major Ward, Stuns+off balance out of stealth
Jabs 1,1s Channel: Major Savagery
Balanced?
@ZOS_RichLambert
How about instead of surprise attack OP, change it to, Jabs is under powered?2 -
Mojmir✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This like comparing rapids to quick cloak. WT actual F.
can we compare ambush to toppling charge next?Edited by Mojmir on January 25, 2016 1:19AM1 -
AltusVenifus✭✭✭[[/quote]lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »You are comparing an aoe skill to a single target skill.
In addition to that, he is comparing a single skill(jabs) to a single skill + a passive(surprise attack by itself does not do major resolve or major ward, that comes from a separate passive).
A more fair comparison would be if he added burning light passive to the jabs - that increases the damage output considerably.
[edit] hmm even without burning light the damage against a single target does not look bad for jabs.
1388 with each strike, and iirc there are three four(it's in the tooltip dummy) strikes during the channel, so 3x1388=4164 4x1388=5552
then, the closest target takes 140% more damage, so 4164 + 140% = 9993 5552 + 140% = 13324
Then you add burning light. Hmm.
Math or truth have no place here... It's a nerf nb threatEdited by AltusVenifus on January 25, 2016 2:32PM3 -
MrGigglypants✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »
Check your passives again and you'll realize that Templars and NBs have the same buff to crit damage.leepalmer95 wrote: »Jabs doesn't work on shields either, and how many times are you realistically going to hit all 4 jabs on a half decent player?
Your lucky if you hit them 2/3 times at most. You actually have to aim jabs.
Jabs doesn't work on shields, but if were going to include passive, SA gives the user 5.2k armour on use as well.
Plus all nb's have high crit which high crit dmg. 50%+ is the min but usually i see people with 70% with 180%~ crit dmg.
Thats were SA suddenly starts doing stupid dmg.
Plus the first SA will be empowered usually. If ambushed in or the HA/SA from stealth weave will kill someone or take them to 25% hp.
Looks balanced to me.... <
( Sarcasm)
Exactly hence why i never mentioned it?
Point is SA does more dmg than a 1.1s channel.
A channel that won't hit all 4 of it's hits vs a good player.
That doesn't work on shields.
SA is instant, debuff's, stuns as well as gives 5.2k armour. Oh and as nb's are literally mean't for crit builds, nb's will crit most of the time were as pvp templars have quite a bit less crit. Also most templars are using serpant/atronach for regen while nb's can use shadow because they have an inherant 15% regen, sure templas have 10% but they have to waste a skill slot.
Anyway never mind all that SA/ Jabs simply because of the dmg/utility and fact it's instant and can be weaved quickly and more effectively.
Jabs is an aoe stam temp single target is meant to be wb0 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MrGigglypants wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »
Check your passives again and you'll realize that Templars and NBs have the same buff to crit damage.leepalmer95 wrote: »Jabs doesn't work on shields either, and how many times are you realistically going to hit all 4 jabs on a half decent player?
Your lucky if you hit them 2/3 times at most. You actually have to aim jabs.
Jabs doesn't work on shields, but if were going to include passive, SA gives the user 5.2k armour on use as well.
Plus all nb's have high crit which high crit dmg. 50%+ is the min but usually i see people with 70% with 180%~ crit dmg.
Thats were SA suddenly starts doing stupid dmg.
Plus the first SA will be empowered usually. If ambushed in or the HA/SA from stealth weave will kill someone or take them to 25% hp.
Looks balanced to me.... <
( Sarcasm)
Exactly hence why i never mentioned it?
Point is SA does more dmg than a 1.1s channel.
A channel that won't hit all 4 of it's hits vs a good player.
That doesn't work on shields.
SA is instant, debuff's, stuns as well as gives 5.2k armour. Oh and as nb's are literally mean't for crit builds, nb's will crit most of the time were as pvp templars have quite a bit less crit. Also most templars are using serpant/atronach for regen while nb's can use shadow because they have an inherant 15% regen, sure templas have 10% but they have to waste a skill slot.
Anyway never mind all that SA/ Jabs simply because of the dmg/utility and fact it's instant and can be weaved quickly and more effectively.
Jabs is an aoe stam temp single target is meant to be wb
Wb is for scrubs.
Also people don't use Jabs for the 'Aoe' jabs/sweeps is a templars single target skill.
Aoe it only useful in pve, it's not that great in pvp, hitting another person for 1.2k tooltip dmg (600 dmg) per jab is not exactly what i'd call dmg.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1