Harassment. Is there anything to be done about it?

RizaHawkeye · January 2016

I am so freaking frustrated right now.

Last night, at approximately 12:00 a.m. my time, I was running a zone when a player began harassing me. The harassment took the form of following me around, making psudeo-sexual gestures, and asking inappropriate personal questions. When I tried to ignore the player, they began casting area spells to annoy me and mess up my game. When I finally stopped asked what was going on, the player responded with another sexually suggestive comment. I turned to leave (I was just trying to complete a quest in that area) and he (and I'm using He as the indefinite pronoun; I acknowledge it could have been a she) began throwing out additional comments, questions, and gestures. I finally told him that if he didn't stop I would report him. He LOLed me and then said he was going to report me for being a prude.

I tried to ignore him but he just continued to follow me. Finally, I did report him (twice, in fact, because he wouldn't stop) once with a screen shot and his character name. But of course, this is the response I got:

Greetings!

Thank you for your inquiry. Please note that our support office is currently closed. Our support hours are between 9am and 10pm Eastern Standard Time, seven days a week. We will investigate your inquiry as soon as we reopen.

Our goal is to investigate and respond to your contact within six business hours.

We appreciate your patience.

Warm Regards,
The Bethesda Support Team

I finally had to logged off to get away from him. I still have not received any further response from Zenimax or Bethesda.

Okay, so here's my question: What can we do about this? Yeah, report it but you can see how effective that is. Normally, I can just brush this adolescent behaivor off, but this person so intent upon interfering with what I was doing that I couldn't even play the freakin game. Yeah, I could have gone to another zone or teleported (for gold) away from the situation. But why should I have to do that?

I can anticipate some responses:

This is an MMO. You have to deal with this stuff.

No, I don't. If that is the response from Zenimax, then give me my money back, including the cost of the game and all the subscriptions I've paid. Is that unreasonable? You bet it is. But so is doing absolutely NOTHING to stop harassment in the game.

Zenimax deals with harassment. They just can't talk about it.

Really? You believe that? That seems to be really easy way of not doing anything and hoping the problem goes away. And clearly, they're not doing anything except during regular business hours.

Grow up and get a thick skin.

You do realize I couldn't play the game. This isn't a thick skin issue; I can fire off snarly responses with the best of them, and I'm happy to walk way from a jerk, if I can go somewhere else and do something else. I am not happy when I have to leave a quest and come back and finish it later because some idiot is intent upon ruining my game.

So my question to Zenimax employees is: How do you anticipate players dealing with this? Really? You made this game. You had to expect this would happen. What do you want players to do?

Yes, twelve hours later, I am still quite angry.

Abeille · January 2016

I think that's all you can do, really. Report and move on.

Taking by all the posts I see on reddit of people annoyed because they were banned just for "fooling around", I imagine that reporting works.

RizaHawkeye · January 2016

Abeille wrote: »

I think that's all you can do, really. Report and move on.

Taking by all the posts I see on reddit of people annoyed because they were banned just for "fooling around", I imagine that reporting works.

Okay, that's comforting. Really.

I really, really just want to know that Zenimax will do something about this.

Cazzy · January 2016

I've had this happen multiple times. Seriously. I've left the game for a few days before where it irritated me so much to be followed and have mimicked assault happen. It's pathetic.

Ignoring someone doesn't remove the player from sight but can mean he can't contact you through chat. Apart from that we just need to keep reporting them until it becomes a problem for Zeni and not just ourselves.

Korah_Eaglecry · January 2016

Abeille wrote: »

I think that's all you can do, really. Report and move on.

Taking by all the posts I see on reddit of people annoyed because they were banned just for "fooling around", I imagine that reporting works.

Seems to be the new trend among younger people now a days. Its not Harrassment or Stealing or Assault. Its Pranks and Fooling Around. They didnt mean anything by it so they should get a pass.

redspecter23 · January 2016

Report him and hope that those that read the report will look into it. I'd like to assume that repeated sexual harassment would not be taken lightly by moderators. Though it could take some time, I'd expect to see some sort of response. Maybe a temporary ban for a first offense. It's my experience that moderation does not happen immediately in this game so give it a few days. That person has probably moved on to other targets by now but you can perhaps save others a headache.

Zorrashi · January 2016

Well nor normally I wouldn't encourage this but...
You may not really remember, but there was once a time where if one person was really hated by a lot of people, a response from ZOS could be received asap if enough people reported the issue--even if it was something trivial and/or contrived like a PvP player's name being (not really) offensive in order to get him either banned or inconvenienced.

But this isn't just a simple PvP grudge. It's legit harassment (of several sorts it seems).

So I suppose you can gather your friends and/or guild and have them mass report him. ZOS has a tendency to respond to those quickly.

But in the meantime, don't give him a reaction--they thrive on that.

CaptainObvious · January 2016

While this doesn't necessarily help, that is why all games with online multiplayer content have the tag line that they cannot control the content of player to player interactions.

That is also why they put in the ignore list and report system. Building and executing a case file takes time. Otherwise, one could just go around randomly getting people banned that are non-the-wiser. So I suspect this is a case of needing some patience.

BabeestorGor · January 2016

Zenimax should deal with it
If they aren't its bad but I'm not sure what we can do about it except:

make our discontent known on the forums
complain about it in game
leave the game

you've done the 1st 2, hopefully the 3rd won't be neccessary
just wish Zenimax made their support for good behaviour a bit more apparent, the ocasional Gamesmaster appearing on Friday or Saturday nights could do a lot to keep the imbeciles at bay

rdavis9b14_ESO · January 2016

I'm not sure if this is a response you were hoping to have from this particular topic, but did you attempt a second report on this during their normal hours of operation? Their goal may be 6 hours, but in a game like this, sometimes things get lost in transit so to speak, especially when the issue happens in off hours.

Other than that, my suggestion would be to block the person and then log off for about 15-20 minutes. Most people who harass others do not sit and wait for them to log back in. I know it's a pain in the behind to be the one to log out, but unless a GM gets a chance to investigate your ticket(while it's happening) it's going to take a while to form a response, which is at best going to be a ban, either temporary or with gross number of complaints permanent.

I know it is not much consolation, but I hope it works out for you.

Alabyn · January 2016

I'm really sorry, that sounds like a crummy night in Tam'riel. I do wonder if such things would happen as commonly if the game were still buy-to-play.

Abeille · January 2016

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Abeille wrote: »

I think that's all you can do, really. Report and move on.

Taking by all the posts I see on reddit of people annoyed because they were banned just for "fooling around", I imagine that reporting works.

Seems to be the new trend among younger people now a days. Its not Harrassment or Stealing or Assault. Its Pranks and Fooling Around. They didnt mean anything by it so they should get a pass.

I love when these people make a thread complaining about their ban. They post things like "I did nothing wrong, I just said [racist comment] on zone chat and jokingly said that [sexist comment]! That's not fair". I find it hilarious that they go cry to us when they are banned.

Troneon · January 2016

Zone out, wait a few minutes, zone back in...

They will get bored...

Ignore and block.

Get a thicker skin? This is the internet?

I don't condone this at all but honestly if the big bad wolf stranger on a game is bothering you, don't let it?

CaptainObvious · January 2016

Heh. Maybe some banned players should be forever immortalized in Molag Bal's lightning prison cells in the final Main Story quest.

Cazzy · January 2016

Can I also recommend you keeping a log of names and days/times it happens. In the chance it occurs more than once!

RizaHawkeye · January 2016

rdavis9b14_ESO wrote: »

I'm not sure if this is a response you were hoping to have from this particular topic, but did you attempt a second report on this during their normal hours of operation? Their goal may be 6 hours, but in a game like this, sometimes things get lost in transit so to speak, especially when the issue happens in off hours.

Other than that, my suggestion would be to block the person and then log off for about 15-20 minutes. Most people who harass others do not sit and wait for them to log back in. I know it's a pain in the behind to be the one to log out, but unless a GM gets a chance to investigate your ticket(while it's happening) it's going to take a while to form a response, which is at best going to be a ban, either temporary or with gross number of complaints permanent.

I know it is not much consolation, but I hope it works out for you.

No, I think that's a valid suggestion.

I guess what I'm hoping for is an official acknowledgement from someone at Zenimax, that they would take a situation like this seriously. They don't have to talk about specifics; I can see why they wouldn't want to do that. But I would like to know, generally, how they approach issues like this. What is their response generally? Warnings? Do they actually ban people?

I feel like even a three day ban would be enough to get this person's attention and make them realize they can't do this.

Acrolas · January 2016

We need an unlimited ignore list with at least a few quarterly Phase Out Player allowances for the real *** out there.

Because you shouldn't have to play an old Argonian woman to get people to leave you alone.

CaptainObvious · January 2016

Cazzy wrote: »

Can I also recommend you keeping a log of names and days/times it happens. In the chance it occurs more than once!

Yep. They have to go analyze the chat logs etc. as part of this. So more documented evidence == stronger case. Plus giving them timestamps and server/location names helps speed up this process.

RizaHawkeye · January 2016

Troneon wrote: »

Zone out, wait a few minutes, zone back in...

They will get bored...

Ignore and block.

Get a thicker skin? This is the internet?

I don't condone this at all but honestly if the big bad wolf stranger on a game is bothering you, don't let it?

Believe me, I can - and have - walked away. But seriously, if I have one final freakin quest to finish in a zone and I can't finish that quest because someone is literally screwing up my game - not just tossing out comments, but interfering with gameplay - then I need to log off and start the quest zone again??? And if I don't then I'm letting them bother me?

No. Wrong. Their conduct is interfering with gameplay. To be clear: I'm not talking about comments or even just gestures; this individual was literally preventing me from proceeding with the quest.

Sorry, @Troneon, my skin is thick enough.

Lenikus · January 2016

People do that to get a reaction out of you. If you were telling him to stop, or talking to him (wich you did) that was precisely what he was out for. When you notice a troll, you just ignore it. he'll go away eventually. But if you feed it, he'll stay.
Like hobos.

Troneon · January 2016

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

Troneon wrote: »

Zone out, wait a few minutes, zone back in...

They will get bored...

Ignore and block.

Get a thicker skin? This is the internet?

I don't condone this at all but honestly if the big bad wolf stranger on a game is bothering you, don't let it?

Believe me, I can - and have - walked away. But seriously, if I have one final freakin quest to finish in a zone and I can't finish that quest because someone is literally screwing up my game - not just tossing out comments, but interfering with gameplay - then I need to log off and start the quest zone again??? And if I don't then I'm letting them bother me?

No. Wrong. Their conduct is interfering with gameplay. To be clear: I'm not talking about comments or even just gestures; this individual was literally preventing me from proceeding with the quest.

Sorry, @Troneon, my skin is thick enough.

How is it stopping your progression in your quest? I don't see how?

If it is, then that is griefing/harassment and should be bannable.

But give specifics, because I am having a hard time thinking of a single quest where anyone can stop you? Unless you let them.

Ackwalan · January 2016

Do not, under any circumstance, interact with a troll. All you can do is report them and put them on ignore. Do not tell them you are ignoring them or reporting them, do not talk about them in zone chat, you just have to completely ignore them. Even the slightest interaction with them will cause them to double their effort to get attention. Report, ignore and move on.

RizaHawkeye · January 2016

Troneon wrote: »

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

Troneon wrote: »

Zone out, wait a few minutes, zone back in...

They will get bored...

Ignore and block.

Get a thicker skin? This is the internet?

I don't condone this at all but honestly if the big bad wolf stranger on a game is bothering you, don't let it?

Believe me, I can - and have - walked away. But seriously, if I have one final freakin quest to finish in a zone and I can't finish that quest because someone is literally screwing up my game - not just tossing out comments, but interfering with gameplay - then I need to log off and start the quest zone again??? And if I don't then I'm letting them bother me?

No. Wrong. Their conduct is interfering with gameplay. To be clear: I'm not talking about comments or even just gestures; this individual was literally preventing me from proceeding with the quest.

Sorry, @Troneon, my skin is thick enough.

How is it stopping your progression in your quest? I don't see how?

If it is, then that is griefing/harassment and should be bannable.

But give specifics, because I am having a hard time thinking of a single quest where anyone can stop you? Unless you let them.

They can kill all the mobs before you can because they're way over-leveled for the zone?

Is that clear enough for you?

Zorrashi · January 2016

CaptainObvious wrote: »

Heh. Maybe some banned players should be forever immortalized in Molag Bal's lightning prison cells in the final Main Story quest.

I was thinking of having the NPCs refuse to give him quests and access to their shops because he's known around town as a an a**hole. Cue the sassy NPC dialogue.

"You think I will do business with you? After what you said? Away with you."
"Normally I wouldn't care who came to my assistance, but I think I'd be better off asking a brute to do the job instead of you"
"Hmpf. I'm surprised they let unseemly riff raff like you wander the streets."

Molag_Crow · January 2016

I have to agree with Troneon.

I've played plenty of female characters on mmos like this and WoW, and I have been followed/stalked and harassed in similar ways too but when you completely ignore the person, and I'm talking about acting as if they don't exist, then they actually do get bored and move on.

If you respond to them in any way, or stop to even acknowledge their presence (with your character ofc) then it only fuels the situation.

Troneon · January 2016

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

Troneon wrote: »

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

Troneon wrote: »

Zone out, wait a few minutes, zone back in...

They will get bored...

Ignore and block.

Get a thicker skin? This is the internet?

I don't condone this at all but honestly if the big bad wolf stranger on a game is bothering you, don't let it?

Believe me, I can - and have - walked away. But seriously, if I have one final freakin quest to finish in a zone and I can't finish that quest because someone is literally screwing up my game - not just tossing out comments, but interfering with gameplay - then I need to log off and start the quest zone again??? And if I don't then I'm letting them bother me?

No. Wrong. Their conduct is interfering with gameplay. To be clear: I'm not talking about comments or even just gestures; this individual was literally preventing me from proceeding with the quest.

Sorry, @Troneon, my skin is thick enough.

How is it stopping your progression in your quest? I don't see how?

If it is, then that is griefing/harassment and should be bannable.

But give specifics, because I am having a hard time thinking of a single quest where anyone can stop you? Unless you let them.

They can kill all the mobs before you can because they're way over-leveled for the zone?

Is that clear enough for you?

Iv had people try that with me a long time ago when I was leveling, I just ran faster and spammed aoe everywhere and they failed at it....

I agree with you don't get me wrong, I just don't believe in waiting for ZOS to magically do something, they won't...or it will be in forever neverland....I believe in solving things myself and working around it.

Korah_Eaglecry · January 2016

Zorrashi wrote: »

CaptainObvious wrote: »

Heh. Maybe some banned players should be forever immortalized in Molag Bal's lightning prison cells in the final Main Story quest.

I was thinking of having the NPCs refuse to give him quests and access to their shops because he's known around town as a an a**hole. Cue the sassy NPC dialogue.

"You think I will do business with you? After what you said? Away with you."
"Normally I wouldn't care who came to my assistance, but I think I'd be better off asking a brute to do the job instead of you"
"Hmpf. I'm surprised they let unseemly riff raff like you wander the streets."

That would be hilarious. Theyd be able to move from area to area but theyd be unable to sell/buy anything or complete/start any quests.

It also be hilarious if they renamed every character belonging to someone like this Peasant. Just nothing but peasants running around.

Florial · January 2016

@RizaHawkeye Sorry this happened. I hate when my play sessions are ruined by other's behavior. Usually I can overlook some griefing but this seemed to go on and on. I would keep pressing it with Zenimax. I wouldn't engage with the harassing player. I just assume the harassing player is a mentally disabled person in some way.

I always love the "grow a thicker skin" comment. True, one should not take everything personally. But there comes a time when certain behaviors are so over the top that they should be dealt with. I'm tired of "this is the internet" excuse. A responsive gaming company SHOULD respond and do so in a quick manner. I stopped playing Rift entirely due to extreme hate speech and vile behavior in general chat (in addition to getting weary with the game). People were reported over and over again but no action taken. I spoke with my gaming dollars--stopped paying a sub and stopped playing the game. Just ignoring this behavior by turning off zone chat is not an option. Why should I have to modify my game play when I like to help others?

For the most part, my time in Tamriel has been pretty good compared to other games out there. My biggest problem is one of my guilds where mom and *** jokes seem to be the height of wit.

Pheefs · January 2016

sounds like he was raised by the Reachmen and he thought he was flirting...

SO! when this sort of thing happens to me I just stop and play the lute or drums until they get bored, usually less than three minutes.
don't forget that your reactions feed the weirdo, be calm & be sarcastic, & in an emergency you can always claim to be a 50 yo asian male... that gets rid of most of the Rude Boys.

don't let the ash-holes get you down!

Totalitarian · January 2016

You did everything that you could.

If you get to the point of desperation, calling them out in zone chat may get people to support you (but chances are that that would just lead to more trouble).

RizaHawkeye · January 2016

CrowsDescend wrote: »

I have to agree with Troneon.

I've played plenty of female characters on mmos like this and WoW, and I have been followed/stalked and harassed in similar ways too but when you completely ignore the person, and I'm talking about acting as if they don't exist, then they actually do get bored and move on.

If you respond to them in any way, or stop to even acknowledge their presence (with your character ofc) then it only fuels the situation.

Troneon wrote: »

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

Troneon wrote: »

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

Troneon wrote: »

Zone out, wait a few minutes, zone back in...

They will get bored...

Ignore and block.

Get a thicker skin? This is the internet?

I don't condone this at all but honestly if the big bad wolf stranger on a game is bothering you, don't let it?

Believe me, I can - and have - walked away. But seriously, if I have one final freakin quest to finish in a zone and I can't finish that quest because someone is literally screwing up my game - not just tossing out comments, but interfering with gameplay - then I need to log off and start the quest zone again??? And if I don't then I'm letting them bother me?

No. Wrong. Their conduct is interfering with gameplay. To be clear: I'm not talking about comments or even just gestures; this individual was literally preventing me from proceeding with the quest.

Sorry, @Troneon, my skin is thick enough.

How is it stopping your progression in your quest? I don't see how?

If it is, then that is griefing/harassment and should be bannable.

But give specifics, because I am having a hard time thinking of a single quest where anyone can stop you? Unless you let them.

They can kill all the mobs before you can because they're way over-leveled for the zone?

Is that clear enough for you?

Iv had people try that with me a long time ago when I was leveling, I just ran faster and spammed aoe everywhere and they failed at it....

I agree with you don't get me wrong, I just don't believe in waiting for ZOS to magically do something, they won't...or it will be in forever neverland....I believe in solving things myself and working around it.

And I'm not trying to pick a fight with you. I'm saying that:

(1) I ignored the person. Completely. Until they started interfering with my game by making it impossible/very difficult to proceed with my quest.

(2) I tried to resolve the issue by asking what was going on. Maybe a mistake but by then I really couldn't play because they were a sorcerer spamming AoE and they could literally one shot groups of mobs.

(3) The situation didn't improve from there.

I'm not saying your advice is invalid. Maybe I should have logged off (and eventually that's what I did). But it's incredibly frustrating to have to do so.

That's it.

And I gave both of you and insightful because I think your advice is, basically, good advice.

Edit: By the way, I hate sorcerers right now.