Vigor is Cheap- Bolt escape vs other gap closers.- Anti Cheat Tactics.

Wollust · January 2016

l2p

Dalsinthus · January 2016

leepalmer95 wrote: »

acw37162 wrote: »

Xjcon wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

ZOS you need to increase Vigor's stamina cost because its very cheap, i am magicka sorc without any stam reduce cost effect for me its only 3k stamina and noob NBs just spam that and get full health even first thick is enough to get full health when spammed.

Bolt escape is very expensive especially when spammed and its range only few meters compared to other gap closers like teleport strike or critical charge vs. and every other class uses those gap closers and they just spamm behind you non stop cuz their cost very cheap and their range is more than 25 meters. Also their damage is way higher than Streak damage.

I ask you ZOS whats the point of having bolt escape since useless for escaping especially noob spammer NBs just jumping on you from all directions non stop ? just increase their cost like bolt escape or reduce their range under the bolt escape's range. Or increase streak damage and make it equal to critical charge or teleport strike.

And for who having trouble againts CHEAT like stamina builds like noob NBs or WBers here some tips ;

Use 2 heavy armor pieces (one chest and pick one of these helm,legs,shoulder) craft every gear with impenetrable trait and invest 100 points to RESISTANT star in the steed constallation. Use Radiant Magelight from mages guild. And you will see those noobs couldnt hurt you any more. I crafted full legendary v16 gear with divines and it performs poorly then i crafted full epic v15 full impenetrable result was awsome just try it. I was getting 10-12k hits from cyrstal fragments, ambush and surprise attack now with full impenetrable and wit full resistant star i get 2-3k max 6k from crystal fragments very rarely good luck.

Sweet Nightmother where to start 4.2k weapon damage maxed out both Heals taken and healing done Argonian (9% heals taken) my Vigor crits for 2.5k Spamming Vigor is only okay to share with a friend resetting the HoT timer does nothing but waste Stamina.

Axorn wrote: »

bchulettub17_ESO wrote: »

I think you need to do some research on vigor before you attempt to make a thread like this.

why ? i saw many times people just spamming vigor and get full health noone waits for the hot

I fought Templar that spam Clease Mark even after I stop marking them.
Dragon Knight Root spamming long after I stop roll dodging.
Nightblades hitting with Ambush as I melt face with Suprise Attack.
And Sorcerers that spammed Overload as I One Hand and Shield reflect them. Spamming happens. Those of us with sense use three buffs/heals and two attacks you have to spam one on them cause the others a DoT and why spam DoTs

Xjcon wrote: »

Preyfar wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

why ? i saw many times people just spamming vigor and get full health noone waits for the hot

Because that's now how Vigor works. It's a HoT, so you don't get all your health in one go. You can't spam it to go heals unlike other skills, compared to (say) Rally. Rally is a great skill to spam heals in the midst of combat, and does wonders. Not to mention Rally gives you a 20% boost to damage.

Vigor is good, but it's not the end-all, be-all, especially after the 50% reduction.

Truth
Vigor, Dodge roll, Dodge roll. FULL HEALTH.

I don't think you know how HoTs work

Axorn wrote: »

For magicka builds, break free very expensive ,roll dodge very expensive ,heals are reduced ,no working escape mechanics,no decent protection from light armor, low spell power with staves , expensive abilties...

This game's pvp soooo unbalanced.

Yea it's like way can't they add something in the Champion System to reduce the cost of Rolling and Breaking free oh wait.

maxjapank wrote: »

A few questions. Can you use Vigor when in stealth? Will it break you out of stealth? Will it reveal you if you use it during Dark Cloak?

You can use a lot of powers in Stealth also if you're in stealth do you need a heal unless your a Nightblade even then cast then cloak

I know exactly how it works. I've got my ass handed to me over and over to players I couldn't finish simply because they could cast vigor dodge roll a few times hit rally and be topped off. That whole time I'm trying to kill them i'm using resources too.

It's all part of what brought stamina to the best choice for pvp aside for magicka sorc.

You stack three shields.

Can camp your mines.

Can streak away, plus streak wil hard stun though dodge, plus a morph will eat projectiles being thrown at you.

Can run an effective health pool of around 40K with 15K actual health.

You can't be critically hit unless you mess up your shield rotation.

And your irritated at Vigor and its cost and a dodge roll?

If you think it's so damn cheap and a "I win" button slot it on your bar and use it yourself. You said it yourself it's so good and so cheap.

If you think vigor irritates you I can't wait to read your reviews of a nightblade using vigor with shield breaker.

Sorc's are literally at the top of the PVP food chain, Vigor is not a problem if there is a problem with vigor it's that there are not enough stamina based heals in the game

People that exaggerate sorc's so much annoy me. I get that you have trouble with them but can you stop spreading misinformation?

Lol. Weren't you the one claiming Snipe had a 60 m range last week?

Please explain what in his post is wrong, because it seems spot on to my experience fighting magicka sorcs. They are by far the toughest class to kill.

mistermutiny89 · January 2016

I'm not going to use the four letter M word but perhaps if you are finding such classes to be tough to fight and you feel like your main character is lacking, create another?

Then when one gets buffed and the other gets nerfed you can swap between them. Pretty simple right?? That or find spells that inflict that debuff defile?? I'm not sure that reduces player healing by 30%.

Bolt escape was one of the most hated abilities in pvp because it made sorcs supposedly unkillable. That's why it's been nerfed to death. It's time will come again I'm sure. But no time soon.

OdinForge · January 2016

Spend less time complaining on the forum, and more time using healing ward in Cyrodiil.

Smh

MadNeedHelp · January 2016

As a VR16 7/7 light armor Magicka Sorc, if I get jump. First thing you need are immovable potions or the cheap stuff sold at the siege vendor. This will keep you grounded. Second If you don't have points in Bastion...well your shields won't work (35k Max Magicka works great). Third, Boundless storm is great for that extra bit you need to survive and get around your attacker. Don't bet your life in shield spamming, it won't save you for long.

Complement this with Magicka detection pots which are crafted with Lady Smock, Corn Flower and Wormwood. They are simply amazing for countering NBs. Last 2 cents I can give you is that don't rage quit if you like the game. Take a break..I did. Good luck!

Duukar · January 2016

He's listed some pretty heavy counters to stealth here and is still crying!!!!!

The magelight that reduces sneak attack dmg and blocks the stun changes the game. I actually feel like IT needs a nerf lol...

Who the hell is this guy anyway? So many tears and hes a sorc.. The life of an NB now is not great..

Duuk

Julianos · January 2016

guys who disagree dont know any sh**t also before spread miss info around hardened ward doesnt shield you 20k+ in cyrodiil its reduced to half in cyrodiil if you invest 100 point in bastion with 40k magicka its only shield you for 11k so stfu noob stamina players and l2p

Eejit1331 · January 2016

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

Vigor heals for about the same amout per second as one cast of healing springs with similar stamina / magicka and costs about the same (considering you get back ressources when you heal someone). So if you think vigor is too cheap, you also need to increase the costs of healing springs.

Difference is the player is required to have a resto staff on.

OdinForge · January 2016

Axorn wrote: »

guys who disagree dont know any sh**t also before spread miss info around hardened ward doesnt shield you 20k+ in cyrodiil its reduced to half in cyrodiil if you invest 100 point in bastion with 40k magicka its only shield you for 11k so stfu noob stamina players and l2p

This is cute.

Eejit1331 · January 2016

MrDerrikk wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

You can use a lot of powers in Stealth also if you're in stealth do you need a heal unless your a Nightblade even then cast then cloak

I guess based on the defensive answer that you then...can...use Vigor while stealthed or while using Dark Cloak. And that is a problem as it's the only heal that won't break you out of stealth. I asked because I saw a NB do this. He used dark cloak then spammed Vigor till he was full health. I was surprised when I saw it. Now I know that Magicka NBs can also do this by equipping a Resto staff...shield...dark cloak a couple of times...and come back full health. But..they do have to devote a weapon slot for this. So there is a trade off of sorts. But Vigor just seems unbalanced.

But Stam NB's can only cloak a couple of times, as they don't have piles of magicka. It's a balancing thing.

A stamina NB can use Cloak just as much as a magicka sorc can use bolt escape.

Takes-No-Prisoner · January 2016

I kindly disagree OP. Because this ability exists, Dark%20Flare.png

plus various poisons like

. The skill in question is a very useful HoT-- that being said full effect doesn't happen immediately so you can DPS them down. When used correctly it gives Stam users a chance to hang on in long fights. They needed this a lot prior to getting this skill. I have people use Vigor after I smack them with Dark Flare, they still go down just as quickly.

This PoV comes from a Mag Templar user who mainly PvPs.

mrvbalc · January 2016

Axorn wrote: »

guys who disagree dont know any sh**t also before spread miss info around hardened ward doesnt shield you 20k+ in cyrodiil its reduced to half in cyrodiil if you invest 100 point in bastion with 40k magicka its only shield you for 11k so stfu noob stamina players and l2p

I am really sorry to say this

but L2P

Before you say stfu to me and add me to your list of "NOOB" Nbs, read this

I am playing Stam DK, and no i dont have vigor in my bar. I am playing this game from Day 1, and i have pvped with all 4 classses and all possible builds and skill combos. And i never had any problem killing StamNBs with my altmer sorc. and never had any problem with my sorc in pvp. I have some guildies who is speacialist in sorc, and i have seen those ppl bring shield upto 35k and be a beast in pvp. example stat of a friendly sorc: spell dmg 3800, mag 39k, hp 19k, shiled upto 35k. Ask any stam player is it easy to kill such a sorc. No its not, Sorcs are still powerful class in game

I agree with you in this, bolt escape has been nerfed to death but I wont say its unfair, we used to have races in cyrodiil map and i have seen ppl run form one end of map to other end in mins only by using bolt escape. And for the spamming vigor claims, first of all spamming vigor is the dumbest thing for a stam dps, if you are getting killed by a NB who spams vigor then you seriously have to reconsider your build and gear. and second vigor and rally are the only skills for healing available for stam players and both of them are HoT(I am sure others already explained the concept of HoT), all other healing skills cost mag which stam players dont have much, even if they have mag they will be using other useful skills (like i use talons on my dk).

PS: If you really want to learn how to play sorc contact me in game i will hook you up with those guys so you can stop complaining and start playing

mistermutiny89 · January 2016

MadNeedHelp wrote: »

As a VR16 7/7 light armor Magicka Sorc, if I get jump. First thing you need are immovable potions or the cheap stuff sold at the siege vendor. This will keep you grounded. Second If you don't have points in Bastion...well your shields won't work (35k Max Magicka works great). Third, Boundless storm is great for that extra bit you need to survive and get around your attacker. Don't bet your life in shield spamming, it won't save you for long.

Complement this with Magicka detection pots which are crafted with Lady Smock, Corn Flower and Wormwood. They are simply amazing for countering NBs. Last 2 cents I can give you is that don't rage quit if you like the game. Take a break..I did. Good luck!

Level headed, non judgemental, constructive and accurate advice! Pigs do fly!

Xjcon · January 2016

acw37162 wrote: »

Xjcon wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

ZOS you need to increase Vigor's stamina cost because its very cheap, i am magicka sorc without any stam reduce cost effect for me its only 3k stamina and noob NBs just spam that and get full health even first thick is enough to get full health when spammed.

Bolt escape is very expensive especially when spammed and its range only few meters compared to other gap closers like teleport strike or critical charge vs. and every other class uses those gap closers and they just spamm behind you non stop cuz their cost very cheap and their range is more than 25 meters. Also their damage is way higher than Streak damage.

I ask you ZOS whats the point of having bolt escape since useless for escaping especially noob spammer NBs just jumping on you from all directions non stop ? just increase their cost like bolt escape or reduce their range under the bolt escape's range. Or increase streak damage and make it equal to critical charge or teleport strike.

And for who having trouble againts CHEAT like stamina builds like noob NBs or WBers here some tips ;

Use 2 heavy armor pieces (one chest and pick one of these helm,legs,shoulder) craft every gear with impenetrable trait and invest 100 points to RESISTANT star in the steed constallation. Use Radiant Magelight from mages guild. And you will see those noobs couldnt hurt you any more. I crafted full legendary v16 gear with divines and it performs poorly then i crafted full epic v15 full impenetrable result was awsome just try it. I was getting 10-12k hits from cyrstal fragments, ambush and surprise attack now with full impenetrable and wit full resistant star i get 2-3k max 6k from crystal fragments very rarely good luck.

Sweet Nightmother where to start 4.2k weapon damage maxed out both Heals taken and healing done Argonian (9% heals taken) my Vigor crits for 2.5k Spamming Vigor is only okay to share with a friend resetting the HoT timer does nothing but waste Stamina.

Axorn wrote: »

bchulettub17_ESO wrote: »

I think you need to do some research on vigor before you attempt to make a thread like this.

why ? i saw many times people just spamming vigor and get full health noone waits for the hot

I fought Templar that spam Clease Mark even after I stop marking them.
Dragon Knight Root spamming long after I stop roll dodging.
Nightblades hitting with Ambush as I melt face with Suprise Attack.
And Sorcerers that spammed Overload as I One Hand and Shield reflect them. Spamming happens. Those of us with sense use three buffs/heals and two attacks you have to spam one on them cause the others a DoT and why spam DoTs

Xjcon wrote: »

Preyfar wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

why ? i saw many times people just spamming vigor and get full health noone waits for the hot

Because that's now how Vigor works. It's a HoT, so you don't get all your health in one go. You can't spam it to go heals unlike other skills, compared to (say) Rally. Rally is a great skill to spam heals in the midst of combat, and does wonders. Not to mention Rally gives you a 20% boost to damage.

Vigor is good, but it's not the end-all, be-all, especially after the 50% reduction.

Truth
Vigor, Dodge roll, Dodge roll. FULL HEALTH.

I don't think you know how HoTs work

Axorn wrote: »

For magicka builds, break free very expensive ,roll dodge very expensive ,heals are reduced ,no working escape mechanics,no decent protection from light armor, low spell power with staves , expensive abilties...

This game's pvp soooo unbalanced.

Yea it's like way can't they add something in the Champion System to reduce the cost of Rolling and Breaking free oh wait.

maxjapank wrote: »

A few questions. Can you use Vigor when in stealth? Will it break you out of stealth? Will it reveal you if you use it during Dark Cloak?

You can use a lot of powers in Stealth also if you're in stealth do you need a heal unless your a Nightblade even then cast then cloak

I know exactly how it works. I've got my ass handed to me over and over to players I couldn't finish simply because they could cast vigor dodge roll a few times hit rally and be topped off. That whole time I'm trying to kill them i'm using resources too.

It's all part of what brought stamina to the best choice for pvp aside for magicka sorc.

You stack three shields.

Can camp your mines.

Can streak away, plus streak wil hard stun though dodge, plus a morph will eat projectiles being thrown at you.

Can run an effective health pool of around 40K with 15K actual health.

You can't be critically hit unless you mess up your shield rotation.

And your irritated at Vigor and its cost and a dodge roll?

If you think it's so damn cheap and a "I win" button slot it on your bar and use it yourself. You said it yourself it's so good and so cheap.

If you think vigor irritates you I can't wait to read your reviews of a nightblade using vigor with shield breaker.

Sorc's are literally at the top of the PVP food chain, Vigor is not a problem if there is a problem with vigor it's that there are not enough stamina based heals in the game

I don't play sorc. Nice try tho. Good effort.

Eejit1331 · January 2016

DurzoBlint13 wrote: »

you play as a magica sorc and you are complaining about Vigor? Seriously? What is your Hardened Ward at, 25K? 30K? If they increase the cost for Vigor they should TRIPLE the cost of Hardened ward and give it a cool down timer

Maybe they should add vigor to the sword and sheild tree and force you to have a specific weapon to have a heal.

leepalmer95 · January 2016

Dalsinthus wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

acw37162 wrote: »

Xjcon wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

ZOS you need to increase Vigor's stamina cost because its very cheap, i am magicka sorc without any stam reduce cost effect for me its only 3k stamina and noob NBs just spam that and get full health even first thick is enough to get full health when spammed.

Bolt escape is very expensive especially when spammed and its range only few meters compared to other gap closers like teleport strike or critical charge vs. and every other class uses those gap closers and they just spamm behind you non stop cuz their cost very cheap and their range is more than 25 meters. Also their damage is way higher than Streak damage.

I ask you ZOS whats the point of having bolt escape since useless for escaping especially noob spammer NBs just jumping on you from all directions non stop ? just increase their cost like bolt escape or reduce their range under the bolt escape's range. Or increase streak damage and make it equal to critical charge or teleport strike.

And for who having trouble againts CHEAT like stamina builds like noob NBs or WBers here some tips ;

Use 2 heavy armor pieces (one chest and pick one of these helm,legs,shoulder) craft every gear with impenetrable trait and invest 100 points to RESISTANT star in the steed constallation. Use Radiant Magelight from mages guild. And you will see those noobs couldnt hurt you any more. I crafted full legendary v16 gear with divines and it performs poorly then i crafted full epic v15 full impenetrable result was awsome just try it. I was getting 10-12k hits from cyrstal fragments, ambush and surprise attack now with full impenetrable and wit full resistant star i get 2-3k max 6k from crystal fragments very rarely good luck.

Sweet Nightmother where to start 4.2k weapon damage maxed out both Heals taken and healing done Argonian (9% heals taken) my Vigor crits for 2.5k Spamming Vigor is only okay to share with a friend resetting the HoT timer does nothing but waste Stamina.

Axorn wrote: »

bchulettub17_ESO wrote: »

I think you need to do some research on vigor before you attempt to make a thread like this.

why ? i saw many times people just spamming vigor and get full health noone waits for the hot

I fought Templar that spam Clease Mark even after I stop marking them.
Dragon Knight Root spamming long after I stop roll dodging.
Nightblades hitting with Ambush as I melt face with Suprise Attack.
And Sorcerers that spammed Overload as I One Hand and Shield reflect them. Spamming happens. Those of us with sense use three buffs/heals and two attacks you have to spam one on them cause the others a DoT and why spam DoTs

Xjcon wrote: »

Preyfar wrote: »

Axorn wrote: »

why ? i saw many times people just spamming vigor and get full health noone waits for the hot

Because that's now how Vigor works. It's a HoT, so you don't get all your health in one go. You can't spam it to go heals unlike other skills, compared to (say) Rally. Rally is a great skill to spam heals in the midst of combat, and does wonders. Not to mention Rally gives you a 20% boost to damage.

Vigor is good, but it's not the end-all, be-all, especially after the 50% reduction.

Truth
Vigor, Dodge roll, Dodge roll. FULL HEALTH.

I don't think you know how HoTs work

Axorn wrote: »

For magicka builds, break free very expensive ,roll dodge very expensive ,heals are reduced ,no working escape mechanics,no decent protection from light armor, low spell power with staves , expensive abilties...

This game's pvp soooo unbalanced.

Yea it's like way can't they add something in the Champion System to reduce the cost of Rolling and Breaking free oh wait.

maxjapank wrote: »

A few questions. Can you use Vigor when in stealth? Will it break you out of stealth? Will it reveal you if you use it during Dark Cloak?

You can use a lot of powers in Stealth also if you're in stealth do you need a heal unless your a Nightblade even then cast then cloak

I know exactly how it works. I've got my ass handed to me over and over to players I couldn't finish simply because they could cast vigor dodge roll a few times hit rally and be topped off. That whole time I'm trying to kill them i'm using resources too.

It's all part of what brought stamina to the best choice for pvp aside for magicka sorc.

You stack three shields.

Can camp your mines.

Can streak away, plus streak wil hard stun though dodge, plus a morph will eat projectiles being thrown at you.

Can run an effective health pool of around 40K with 15K actual health.

You can't be critically hit unless you mess up your shield rotation.

And your irritated at Vigor and its cost and a dodge roll?

If you think it's so damn cheap and a "I win" button slot it on your bar and use it yourself. You said it yourself it's so good and so cheap.

If you think vigor irritates you I can't wait to read your reviews of a nightblade using vigor with shield breaker.

Sorc's are literally at the top of the PVP food chain, Vigor is not a problem if there is a problem with vigor it's that there are not enough stamina based heals in the game

People that exaggerate sorc's so much annoy me. I get that you have trouble with them but can you stop spreading misinformation?

Lol. Weren't you the one claiming Snipe had a 60 m range last week?

Please explain what in his post is wrong, because it seems spot on to my experience fighting magicka sorcs. They are by far the toughest class to kill.

Hard for people who spam 1 skill and have no skill easy for any half decent stam build? 53m is snipes range, well focused aim range. So i wasn't far off.

Stam build have super high burst dmg and shieldbreaker. I could kill a sorc in 1.6, they got nerfed, shields an extra 30%, dmg never really changed because of new gear, yet people are still crying about them.

Nb's have been buffed and buffed since launch and never been nerfed once, hence why they are so op right now.

Stam nb's have the highest dmg in the game, vigor + cloak means they can heal quite easily and quickly.

It's funny when people cry about sorc stacking 3 shields when there a stamina build, the only shield they use is hardened which is 11k at the very most with all v16 gold gear/gold enchant. Thats 2 suprise attacks? Healing ward is a heal.