Dragons!

Lenikus · December 2015

I say this every time someone says " I want dragons liek the ones in skyrim"
,,, here goes.

I'll only address the merit of whatever you request, if you request it right.
No "Dragons" have ever appeared in ANY Elder Scrolls Game as far as I know of.
THIS ↓ is a dragon.

06 (six) limbs, being 04 (four) legs, and 02 (two) wings

The thing those imbred drunkards of the nord race called dragons, the Dovah, are sentient Wyverns

Chickens with scales for feathers.

And to that question i say:
Unless Zenimax makes it a quest/DLC where you travel trough time,
No.

Alec508 · December 2015

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Alec508 wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Alec508 wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

Although, this is the dragonbreak, all the dragons are dead or asleep at this time so there will be no dragons. This has been discussed multiple times before. Search the forums if you have questions like this in the future.

but wait I read in the forums earlier, that the lore is not complete about this and there still may be some dragons awake in this era

It's vague. Having a small number of dragons in hiding *might* work, either in Tamriel or a remote corner of Nirn or in some little plane of Oblivion. Generally speaking though, having lots of Dragons awake or having them out in full view would require a huge lore re-write. There is also the question of what the "Dragons" of Akavir might really mean.

[snip]

I think your missing the fact that this was not a "friendly lore discussion" the OP was saying he wants dragons added and you all jumped down his throat with "lore this lore that"

You do know half the players play not only ESO but TES in general for the lore right??? Not even half more like 60% to 80% of the TES community players for lore.

Completely not true. Maybe people on the forums . But not at all close . Try 30% . I have so many real life friends that have played morrowind , oblivion and skyrim and none know what lore even is. You are a minority. Which is okay I'm not hating on what people like but to say 80% of players care about lore is the silliest thing I've heard today.

yea 30% of the TES community is into the TES lore ssuurree that's why there's hundreds of hours of reading material about lore, hundreds of web sites for TES lore, hundreds of youtube videos about the lore and good bit of RP guilds in ESO to do lore RP.

Point being no dragons cause that hundreds and hundreds of lore stuff proves over and over again no dragons in the 2nd era.

I would bet my life that is not true. On so many levels. Go into area chat tonight and say "who here cares about lore" I bet no one will even reply . I talk in voice chat almost 24/7 and hear the way people talk about the game and the lore discussion came up and no one even knew what lore was besides lorebooks. You are very very wrong and this is something im almost positively sure about which im usually never sure but this time im 100% sure the majority of the player base knows NOTHING about lore. That's like saying the majority of the witcher fans are hard core fans who are into the lore. Which isn't true. They sold what a million copies? Majority of the people who bought the game did because it came out and it looked cool. Just like with TESO . People saw an mmo for console or saw a elder scrolls mmo and after playing oblivion or skyrim they decided to give it a chance. Trust me you are a minority.

I've seen what 3 groups of RPers in my entire time in the game? I've seen thousands in cyrodiil pvping. I really can't believe you think lore RPers make up most of the game. [snip]

[edited for flaming & to remove quote]

Lenikus · December 2015

Alec508 wrote: »

I would bet my life that is not true. On so many levels. Go into area chat tonight and say "who here cares about lore" I bet no one will even reply . I talk in voice chat almost 24/7 and hear the way people talk about the game and the lore discussion came up and no one even knew what lore was besides lorebooks. You are very very wrong and this is something im almost positively sure about which im usually never sure but this time im 100% sure the majority of the player base knows NOTHING about lore. That's like saying the majority of the witcher fans are hard core fans who are into the lore. Which isn't true. They sold what a million copies? Majority of the people who bought the game did because it came out and it looked cool. Just like with TESO . People saw an mmo for console or saw a elder scrolls mmo and after playing oblivion or skyrim they decided to give it a chance. Trust me you are a minority.

.... You're hanging out with the wrong kind of MMORPG players.
not judgin' tho', I pretty much /thread this thing on my post up there... can we please go back to "NERF SORC/NB AND BUFF GDB" or something ? plz? i want my forums to be funny.

Spacemonkey · December 2015

I think @tinythinker has the right idea.

I think most 'lore-loving' peops are worried ESO will turn into one of those mmos where you DO have pink unicorns breathing fire.

I think most of us posted originally in the thread offering caution, backed with lore arguments, as to why this is touchy and not just as simple as 'pop-dragons-in-game'

And I think it's been mostly recieved with: No, we want draggggggoooons. Or , 'you lore nerd, go back to reading lore'.

Which has started all the back and forth arguments that have nothing to do with how we would want to see dragons in game or if we want to see them.

[snip]

If you start a discussion, but refuse other's opinions, arguments, and comments. It isn't much of a discussion. And people will get frustrated because they come here to discuss the subject.

As for the subject at hand; Dragons are supposed to be stupid strong. In Skyrim you are the dragonborn and allthough bringing them down is kindof easy (gameplay) nobody else (npcs) think so. Oblivion pockets, remote area, I'm sure ZOS would be able to fit a dragon boss somewhere - I don't see the point. For players however - and because I'm sure (perhaps wrong) that this is all coming from the desire to ride into battle in Cyrodiil to take on a zerg ball from the back of a dragon - Why dragons? So many Nirn creatures can fly and are just as cool without holding the importance of dragons in TES Lore. Take Morrowind's cliffracers for example. They are clearly big enough to be ridden - and that just 1 creature, from Vvardenfell. There are bound to be many others. So if that 'dragon' you want is to fill that role, just ask 'flying mounts' or w/e instead, and ZOS will come up with something pretty darn cool. (Allthough if you do a 'flying mount' pole here on the forums, you'll see a lot of people are just as against that as we seem to be against dragons) -

@NetoJON -> also, why not have made this a poll, if you don't feel like actually discussing other than stating over and over that 'you just want dragons'.

[edited for baiting]

Pheefs · December 2015

one of the interesting things about this question for me, is that many object on the basis that at this moment in the timeline all but a very few dragons are dormant...

...at this moment!

& there's no scroll, or spell, or daedric influence that could manipulate where WE ARE in time, right?

oh wait! ..except that one time we were all The Vestige, oh and those tricksy Elder Scrolls, and observing someone else's memories and living though them, or anything to do with Hermaeus Mora, or visions of the future, or even being on another plane of Oblivion.
I'd imagine there'd be Dragons occasionally in Hircine's Hunting Grounds, just for the fun of it!

This is Tamriel, people!
anything could happen!

for practical purposes any Dragons in ESO would have to only be in a particular combat instance, or only on a certain map at a certain time.
As cool as it would be to see a Dragon attack Daggerfall, I don't think it would work.

RAGUNAnoOne · December 2015

Akavir please,there is a dragon there that is one of the great leaders please @ZOS_BrianWheeler give us an Akavir DLC let us aid the tiger dragon!

Alec508 · December 2015

I'm all set with arguing with anyone. If you like lore then that's great I'm happy for you. If you want dragons that's even better I hope we get dragons who pop up as soon as you read a lore book. And for anyone that wants to keep arguing come to cyrodil on xb1 and duel me my gt is the same as this. Sadly I don't have my PC anymore so that's out of the question

ZOS_Tarina · December 2015

Hello! This thread is temporarily closed for some clean-up.

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ZOS_Tarina · December 2015

This thread is now being re-opened for discussion. Several posts have been removed because of community rules violations.

We understand that people are going to disagree from time to time, but please remember to keep your comments respectful at all times on our forums, even when you disagree with others. Insults or other disruptive behavior do not help further discussion and can move a thread off topic quickly. We encourage sharing opinions, but we ask that they are constructively stated when doing so, as this will help keep the discussion on track. Thank you!

Divinius · December 2015

ZOS_Tarina wrote: »

This thread is now being re-opened for discussion. Several posts have been removed because of community rules violations.

We understand that people are going to disagree from time to time, but please remember to keep your comments respectful at all times on our forums, even when you disagree with others. Insults or other disruptive behavior do not help further discussion and can move a thread off topic quickly. We encourage sharing opinions, but we ask that they are constructively stated when doing so, as this will help keep the discussion on track. Thank you!

You probably should have just left the thread locked, honestly.

Lightninvash · December 2015

Divinius wrote: »

ZOS_Tarina wrote: »

This thread is now being re-opened for discussion. Several posts have been removed because of community rules violations.

We understand that people are going to disagree from time to time, but please remember to keep your comments respectful at all times on our forums, even when you disagree with others. Insults or other disruptive behavior do not help further discussion and can move a thread off topic quickly. We encourage sharing opinions, but we ask that they are constructively stated when doing so, as this will help keep the discussion on track. Thank you!

You probably should have just left the thread locked, honestly.

just because you don't like dragons in eso doesn't mean the thread should be locked. it is a discussion on dragons pertaining to them being in eso not how it breaks lore ect

catalyst10e · December 2015

I'd just like to say, on behalf of other lore-buffs... There are a lot of us, not just in ESO. ESO being this far back in the timeline means it can have detrimental effects on the other titles. Even going into a "memory" could have ramifications for the established lore that you may not totally understand.

There's nothing wrong with wanting Dragons in a fantasy game because you like them. That's cool, Dragons are cool. But just try and understand that if ZOS were to just toss in Dragons just to appease the "I want dragons now" fanbase, its a slap in the face to those of us who have dedicated so much time and worship to the franchise.(That dedication and worship is the whole reason you're playing this game now btw) And even if you or ZOS doesn't care about the lore, that's fine, but Bethesda does. It's their money-maker, and the game(s) is/are nothing without its lore. It's the dedication to the lore that first established the "Dragon Break" concept as a whole, they didn't want anyone to feel like their decisions didn't matter.

For the most part, Dragons ruled over man, so going back to a memory of when they ruled, and killing one, would raise the question, "why didn't everyone else rise up against them?" the Dragons oppressing man is what eventually lead to the Dragon Rend Shout in Skyrim, if man wasn't ruled over by dragons, then they wouldn't ever create that shout, and never would have used it on Alduin, the Last Dragonborn wouldn't have learned it, and so on and so on. The next time Dragon appear in the timeline, Tiber Septim is Emperor, and if he's Emperor it means ESO is OVER.

TL;DR I get you want Dragons because Dragons are cool, but try and see things from our viewpoint, Bethesda decides what is and isnt lore appropriate, and Dragons just tossed in, isnt lore appropriate. (and they need to protect their brand)

Molag_Crow · December 2015

Dragons are awesome, but I'm no expert on lore so... I'll... just say that, and that's all.

Luigi_Vampa · December 2015

I just don't understand the appeal. Why do people always want to make different fantasy settings into the same thing? It isn't just dragons, people are always saying things like "that (insert cool thing) from (insert popular fantasy world) was really cool. It would be awesome if (insert cool thing) was in this (insert popular fantasy world) as well!" Really!? Would it? Wouldn't that just make all the worlds into some stupid generic amalgamation of fantasy where nothing is really unique or special?

Shadesofkin · December 2015

NetoJON wrote: »

Shadesofkin wrote: »

Players who want dragons are usually players who don't care about the actual Lore of the game. That's cool, I respect it, but I will always say no.

Dont go judging people that way... you dont know what I care or dont

they can make a thousand things to bring dragons to the game without having the lore broken... wait for it...

You will note the word "usually" was in that sentence. You're right, they could...but a multitude of lore buffs would call foul, myself included.

zornyan · December 2015

First off, the reason people haven't said much to you @Alec508 is because your on a console.

Two BIG issues there.

The majority of console players only ever played skyrim, so they don't understand much of the lore, as skyrim was already a very watered down elder scrolls game, go play daggerfall or morrowind and see why the lore is important to many of us.

Secondly on console you have no text chat, voice chat is a very small part of the community, like a maximum of twelve, when only about 1 in 10 players even use a headsrt, even when I played on ps4 I didn't as it was actually quite an anti social place.

Where as if I type the question in pc guild chat, I'm literially getting thst message across to hundreds of players at once, as opposed to a handful at best.

If you want dragons, go play skyrim, it's pretty simple, I would love to see (forgot his Damm name) the dwemer infected with corpus in morrowind in eso, see that's even feasible because he even tells you in morrowind that he spent many years searching for his people, so he is actually near by and in our time frame, yet it won't happen.

Youve obviously not played even various elder scrolls titles, but it's a very lore dependant game, and the lore is why it's such a huge success, the combat always been iffy, graphics have never been the best of the best (but good still) , there's always been dozens of stupid bugs, but this game series is hugely loved by hundreds of thousands of people worldwide, if not millions, because of its story telling, because of its lore, because it IS the elder scrolls series.

Maybe you don't care for lore, but we do, they actually cannot throw the lore out the window, because they are not allowed to, that's the end of that.

And they couldn't very well go and work around it, because you know, skyrim which is in the future already told us that there were no dragons now, and going against that would be a huge mistake for any elder scrolls title

Necrelios · December 2015

There ARE dragons. They are just dormant/sleeping/trapped in Aetherius or otherwise temporarily predisposed at the moment. Things like this happen in Nirn, but they can also unhappen. The Elder Scrolls have been known to change, and with that events can happen that were not aforementioned. That being said, we could easily see DLC dragons at some point.

DanielMaxwell · December 2015

The MMO ESOTU takes place in the 2nd era of the TES universe , a time when dragons where considered to be just a myth , extinct , or asleep by the vast majority of the population . Dragons do not return until the events of the Skyrim game which is sometime in the 4th era or later .

All of the TES single player games take place well after the events of ESOTU . This was a choice made by the developers (a mistake IMHO ) which restricts them on what they can do to things that will not break game lore , they do things that can explained as forgotten or unrecorded events , but they can not break the games lore with out ruining the game itself.

If they did break the games lore by adding dragons to the game ( as a DLC , or a pet in the crown store) , it could be seen by a portion of the player base as an indication that the games player base is getting small enough that it is causing the company to consider shutting down the servers or ruining the game via cash grabs in the crown store .

catalyst10e · December 2015

NetoJON wrote: »

Shadesofkin wrote: »

Players who want dragons are usually players who don't care about the actual Lore of the game. That's cool, I respect it, but I will always say no.

Dont go judging people that way... you dont know what I care or dont

they can make a thousand things to bring dragons to the game without having the lore broken... wait for it...

I am curious as to what you think would be "a thousand" lore-friendly ways to bring Dragons. Every time you say "wait for it" I assumed you were going to type up a list or something... Now I'm beginning to think you think it's an inevitable conclusion.. like ZOS WILL eventually put in dragons in a lore-friendly manner, and we all just have to wait and see.

The Dragons of the past were worshiped, and any of the Dragons you can name, you got the name from Skyrim, which means they have to live long enough to make it to the 4th era. Dragon hunts were done after Tiber Septim ascends the ruby throne. After that they disappear until the 4th Area during the events of Skyrim. Inserting a Dragon at any other point would cause all kinds of problems.

The closest you might be able to get to being Lore friendly would be to introduce Akavir, but since Bethesda themselves haven't yet shown what Akavir looks like, I doubt they'd allow ZOS to make it. Aside from the continent itself, it'd force them to also introduce all those other races and such, theres too many hoops to jump thru all so you can fight a Dragon.

The only other lore that might sync up would be the Dragon War itself that ended all Dragon rule, and while it might be easy to jump on and say "yeah! we should play in the memory of a nord(s) to killed a Dragon!" I'll remind you Magic is only just now (within the 2nd era of ESO) being introduced as open for eveyone to use. It didn't use to be that way, and so the lore of not being able to use magic during that time would clash with the lore of fighting Dragons. Etc etc...

sir_buttersworth · December 2015

I like the lore, but I'm no master of it. Could someone who is, answer me this?
Would it be lore-breaking to have, instead of dragons, those Daedric Titans tameable and used as pets and or mounts? I was wondering, because if it is possible, that might be a good compromise.

Pendrillion · December 2015

sir_buttersworth wrote: »

I like the lore, but I'm no master of it. Could someone who is, answer me this?
Would it be lore-breaking to have, instead of dragons, those Daedric Titans tameable and used as pets and or mounts? I was wondering, because if it is possible, that might be a good compromise.

To answer your question... No it would not be lore breaking. Also there is a source within Coldharbour that tells you how Molag Bals Titans came about.

I don't remember exactly what book it was from. But essentially a Dragon got captured and was the Ancestor for the Titans.

sir_buttersworth · December 2015

Pendrillion wrote: »

sir_buttersworth wrote: »

I like the lore, but I'm no master of it. Could someone who is, answer me this?
Would it be lore-breaking to have, instead of dragons, those Daedric Titans tameable and used as pets and or mounts? I was wondering, because if it is possible, that might be a good compromise.

To answer your question... No it would not be lore breaking. Also there is a source within Coldharbour that tells you how Molag Bals Titans came about.

I don't remember exactly what book it was from. But essentially a Dragon got captured and was the Ancestor for the Titans.

Thanks for the quick reply

MrDerrikk · December 2015

I feel like tagging people in this; it's funny and yet not funny at the same time.

@NetoJON
If you really feel so strongly about seeing a dragon in ESO, remember that Paarthurnax is at the Throat of the World and happily living there even in this time period.

I can see the possibility of us going back to fight them in the Dragon Wars like others have suggested, but with all the other planned content that they've already hinted at I would see it as being a very, very long time before they added it.

TheShadowScout · December 2015

Oh, this again?

Dragons are "officially extinct" in ESO times. Meaning, there are still some around, but they are keeping suck a low profile that none know they are around.
Sure, someday you might be able to travel up to the throat of the world if they feel like making that. And there you'll find some greybeards, and a big closed door... and that's it until the fourth age. Sorry.

Of course, there might still be these "time travel / flashback" style quests... those are basically the only way how you can meet dwemer, snow elves or dragons without major lore dissonance...
...and they might add one or more of the above. Other "lost age" stuff could come like this as well I guess... IF if suits the designers purpose in quest-plot-telling.
We'll see.

As for the ones who go on about moiunts... nah, flying mounts would be a hugely annoying can of worms, the closest ESO should -ever- get to flying mounts might be some "floating carpet" or "floating Broomstick" mount for fun purposes...
...actually those might fit well enough within lore, there are flying spells in TES lore (at least I recall them back in Daggerfall or Morrowind... I think they kinda got removed later on due to game issues...) but regardless, a object enchanted to float would be all right, since it would not need redoing all the gameworld with huge, lag-inducing (because collision) invisible walls to prevent people from just flying out of the map or something...

Deandril · December 2015

And then these dragons can attack every town the moment a player shows up. Vital npc merchants can recklessly charge into battle and permanently die out of the game. Maybe the dragons will actually be able to kill guards. We can make ridiculous looking armor from their corpses. My provisioner will make dragon soup. Dragons made Skyrim the worst elder scrolls game.

KingYogi415 · December 2015

I vote for killable ridable dragonz.

CANIPLZHAZDRAGONSPLz?P

MrDerrikk · December 2015

Deandril wrote: »

And then these dragons can attack every town the moment a player shows up. Vital npc merchants can recklessly charge into battle and permanently die out of the game. Maybe the dragons will actually be able to kill guards. We can make ridiculous looking armor from their corpses. My provisioner will make dragon soup. Dragons made Skyrim the worst elder scrolls game.

I think you're looking for this:

nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/23906/

Bebopgroove · December 2015

I feel like the fact that TES has always been pretty stingy about its dragons is one of the special little things that has separated this series as a whole from every other generic fantasy game.

If I have an itch to fight a dragon, I just pop in Skyrim, but only because I'm cool like dat.

NetoJON · December 2015

I still want those dragons... and I still think they will make a dlc with them

MrDerrikk · December 2015

NetoJON wrote: »

I still want those dragons... and I still think they will make a dlc with them

Read my comment I tagged you in.