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Good defense for Stam Templar ?
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RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I recently switched to stamina since i got a magic Sorc who does everything better magic wise then my Templar did and for a new playstyle)
In my delving of the stamina Templar, I find survivability is achieved in proportion to how much you want to give up damage wise. If you go for the 4k Weap Damage type of build you will lose surviability, its just how it appears to be with Templar's as were not Nightblades we lack cloak and the speed based options they have.
Right now im sitting at 3k Weapon Damage, and close to 2k Stamina Recovery BUT I am Breton, I have no bonuses to Stamina, Stamina Recovery, Weapon Damage, etc like Orc's. Redguards, and other races do. What I do have however is 10% more Max Magicka, 3% Reduced Spell Cost, and a little over 3k Extra Spell Resistance.
This allows me to play more of a Hybrid, as i have around 15-16k Magic i can use as a "dump" this allows me to use Breath of Life about 4-5 times and points in Quick Recovery and Blessed (Since i already have 120 points in the Ritual) increases my surviavibility considerably in conjunction with Vigor its extremely good as it allows me to have viable heals from both the stamina and magic pool and this in turn gives me flexibilty to choose which resource I want to use to Heal from unlike other pure Stamplars.
At the same time this allows me to get by with less stamina regen as i have a decent magic pool i can take advantage of to lessen the strain on my stamina pool. This also allows me to take advantage of and use liberally Templar magic skills that most other Stam builds can't use. Such as Eclipse against ranged casters, Purifying Ritual to heal and remove status effects, Blazing Shield when i need something to buffer damage, Breath of Life when my Stam is low and i need a heal, going more hybrid as a Templar lets you take advantage of these things giving you a bit more versatility at the cost of pure damage.
I went for Endurance Jewels over Agility because I needed the Stamina Recovery(because im a Breton), and the 1500+ max health really helps Blazing Shield that with enough points in Bastion and my Racial Cost reduction and Max Magic actually makes using it viable as a way to block incoming damage while trying to retreat, or return damage back at multiple attackers with Burning Lighting Procs, again this is focused more on surviving then burning some one down with High spell damage. However, Radial Sweep + Blazing Shield +Proxy Det + Biting Jabs in close quarters can often times make up for a lack of weapon damage.
Right now, I see Stamplars as better served as being Hybrid builds. Sure you can stack weap damage but you will never be as bursty as a Nightblade, sure you can stack magic but you will never be a DPS machine like a Sorc. If you don't want to be regulated as a healer, I think Hybrid is better...sure you will never out damage a pure 100% Glass Cannon Nightblade or Sorc, but being a Hybrid Stamplar does give you the opportunity to outmanuever them at the expense of being more survivable.
Also as a Hybrid, it allows you to take advantage of the few Templar abilities and passives that are good...such as the Restoring Light ones, Focused Healing in particular, being able to use Purifying Ritual liberally and then using Breath of Life while standing inside Ritual's range results in a very large heal even for a Stamina Templar, this goes in conjunction with Cs points in Quick Recoevery and Blessed, giving you a very viable way to heal from your magic pool freeing up stamina for other uses or just to stay alive while it recovers.
Hybrid Stamplar's allow Stamplar's to take advantage of what few things Templar's do well and giving up weapon damage in return for far more diversity and survivability is IMO worth it...again im a Breton, im never gonna have the damage of an Orc, or the stamina of a Redguard, so i had to find ways to take advantage of my Race and this is how i done it...and if Blinding Flashes ever comes back to the game, my choice of Breton for a Stamplar will be vindicated
Edited by RinaldoGandolphi on December 10, 2015 3:45PMRinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak2 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Swen_von_Walhallion wrote: »So I'm making a Templar and switched to stamina for the dps and could take any suggestions on what you use to defend yourself in 1v1 situations or 1vx? I was thinking blazing shield but heard it was nerfed . My heals aren't all that good considering I have very little magicka. So give me some idea that work for you
rerol on DK or NB if you want play stamina in pvp, templars are here in rly bad position.
On templars you can use some generick def skills aktive skils from heavy and medium armmor skilltree for boost your defence, or bone shield from undauted but it work only agais physikal dmg and rune focus from templar resto tree, for healing here are only two possibilities, momentum from 2H and vigor from PvP asault tree.
Stamina Templar is actually in a great place for PvP in my opinin, I've been playing great with it in 1v1 and 1vx situations. They have insane damage if you build your character well, while keeping decent recovery (I have around 4.2k Weapon Damage & 2.3k Stam Recovery). People have their own opinions, but my opinion is if you build right and learn to play a Stam Templar properly you will have no trouble with it in PvP.
I agree, I can't agree to what people say. Even if I wanted to and I have no reason to be biased here.
Since 1.6 stamina Templar is very strong and it still is. I think they are very dangerous and capable.
Sadly, most stam Templars don't use their arsenal properly. And forget to use 1 certain ability
DM what it is !!!!!! :O
Backlash. It's super strong, the best timed burst in the game.
Yet the current problem is, that it is bugged on damage shields. So this limits it's current reliability (but if you know how to do it and break the shield right before backlash goes off....) Once this gets fixed, I DEMAND any famous Templar to slot this damn thing, for it is one of the best abilities in the game.
Time this right and you anihilate things.
The Backlash tooltip on my fully buffed Templar is over 19k. 19K ! This is the hardest hitting ability in the game when it comes to tooltip and this can crit. For comparison, my Sorcerer Overload tooltip is around 15-16k depending on what setup I'm on.
Any player with an iq higher than 5 will purge it, btw magicka sorcs can actually hit for 16k overload crits in pvp, a spammable ability for 16k damage.
Straight away your 19k tooltip is cut in 50% as it can't crit, so you're doing a max of 9.5k before resistances are taken into accounr, so more like 6k damage at best.
And as above, a decent player will use purge or purifying ritual and remove it completly, it's also hugely obvious to them.
I use it since I started playing and I hardly ever see ppl purge it. And even if they do. Its an action they have to take instead of doing something else more productive, so thats still good situation for me.
That's because their bad players, every good player will have a purge of sorts on one of their bars, otherwise, well your dead meat to a huge number of purge able skills like curse and crystal frags and dark flare (yes dark flare and crystal frags are purge able I found this out last night)
In any case a bad player is going to die, and a good player can beat a bad player with any class or any set, hence why you see videos by people like sypher that are actually using terrible terrible builds and skills, yet they kill n00b all day.
I've 1v5 before and won on my mag temp, because they were a group of unskilled players, likewise I cannot and until something happens ever beat a truly well played sorc, because they will never let you get their shields down, and you'll be eating 16k overlord crits keeping you on the defence.
Same for gankers, a truly well built nb gank build WILL kill you before you can react, my stam nb had nearly 5k weapon damage, everyone was literially a one shot, it was hysterical, snipe and ambush from stealth with suprise attack and they would be dead before the stun was over.
That's because purging backlash is for people with IQ 5
You know why ? Because Purge has a very disadvantage 2nd effect.
reduces the duration of negative effects by 50% for 8 seconds after using purge. Magicka Detonation, Daedric Curse and backlash highly benefit from this. They go of 50% faster, but their damage remains the same
You they actually doom themselves. In 8 seconds, you can place 2 backlashes or 5 daedric curses. Instead of only 1 backlash or 2 curses.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
zornyan✭✭✭✭✭Swen_von_Walhallion wrote: »So I'm making a Templar and switched to stamina for the dps and could take any suggestions on what you use to defend yourself in 1v1 situations or 1vx? I was thinking blazing shield but heard it was nerfed . My heals aren't all that good considering I have very little magicka. So give me some idea that work for you
rerol on DK or NB if you want play stamina in pvp, templars are here in rly bad position.
On templars you can use some generick def skills aktive skils from heavy and medium armmor skilltree for boost your defence, or bone shield from undauted but it work only agais physikal dmg and rune focus from templar resto tree, for healing here are only two possibilities, momentum from 2H and vigor from PvP asault tree.
Stamina Templar is actually in a great place for PvP in my opinin, I've been playing great with it in 1v1 and 1vx situations. They have insane damage if you build your character well, while keeping decent recovery (I have around 4.2k Weapon Damage & 2.3k Stam Recovery). People have their own opinions, but my opinion is if you build right and learn to play a Stam Templar properly you will have no trouble with it in PvP.
I agree, I can't agree to what people say. Even if I wanted to and I have no reason to be biased here.
Since 1.6 stamina Templar is very strong and it still is. I think they are very dangerous and capable.
Sadly, most stam Templars don't use their arsenal properly. And forget to use 1 certain ability
DM what it is !!!!!! :O
Backlash. It's super strong, the best timed burst in the game.
Yet the current problem is, that it is bugged on damage shields. So this limits it's current reliability (but if you know how to do it and break the shield right before backlash goes off....) Once this gets fixed, I DEMAND any famous Templar to slot this damn thing, for it is one of the best abilities in the game.
Time this right and you anihilate things.
The Backlash tooltip on my fully buffed Templar is over 19k. 19K ! This is the hardest hitting ability in the game when it comes to tooltip and this can crit. For comparison, my Sorcerer Overload tooltip is around 15-16k depending on what setup I'm on.
Any player with an iq higher than 5 will purge it, btw magicka sorcs can actually hit for 16k overload crits in pvp, a spammable ability for 16k damage.
Straight away your 19k tooltip is cut in 50% as it can't crit, so you're doing a max of 9.5k before resistances are taken into accounr, so more like 6k damage at best.
And as above, a decent player will use purge or purifying ritual and remove it completly, it's also hugely obvious to them.
I use it since I started playing and I hardly ever see ppl purge it. And even if they do. Its an action they have to take instead of doing something else more productive, so thats still good situation for me.
That's because their bad players, every good player will have a purge of sorts on one of their bars, otherwise, well your dead meat to a huge number of purge able skills like curse and crystal frags and dark flare (yes dark flare and crystal frags are purge able I found this out last night)
In any case a bad player is going to die, and a good player can beat a bad player with any class or any set, hence why you see videos by people like sypher that are actually using terrible terrible builds and skills, yet they kill n00b all day.
I've 1v5 before and won on my mag temp, because they were a group of unskilled players, likewise I cannot and until something happens ever beat a truly well played sorc, because they will never let you get their shields down, and you'll be eating 16k overlord crits keeping you on the defence.
Same for gankers, a truly well built nb gank build WILL kill you before you can react, my stam nb had nearly 5k weapon damage, everyone was literially a one shot, it was hysterical, snipe and ambush from stealth with suprise attack and they would be dead before the stun was over.
That's because purging backlash is for people with IQ 5
You know why ? Because Purge has a very disadvantage 2nd effect.
reduces the duration of negative effects by 50% for 8 seconds after using purge. Magicka Detonation, Daedric Curse and backlash highly benefit from this. They go of 50% faster, but their damage remains the same
You they actually doom themselves. In 8 seconds, you can place 2 backlashes or 5 daedric curses. Instead of only 1 backlash or 2 curses.
Then you just purge again? Or use purifying ritual? Or any other cleanse?
It remains to be said, the single best templars around like alcast have stopped using stamplars completly because they are the single worst class I'm pvp and pve.
Only an idiot would die to purifying light, but any decent player will put a templar immediately on the defensive, and since templars lack defence it's the end of them2 -
Jura23✭✭✭✭✭
✭Swen_von_Walhallion wrote: »So I'm making a Templar and switched to stamina for the dps and could take any suggestions on what you use to defend yourself in 1v1 situations or 1vx? I was thinking blazing shield but heard it was nerfed . My heals aren't all that good considering I have very little magicka. So give me some idea that work for you
rerol on DK or NB if you want play stamina in pvp, templars are here in rly bad position.
On templars you can use some generick def skills aktive skils from heavy and medium armmor skilltree for boost your defence, or bone shield from undauted but it work only agais physikal dmg and rune focus from templar resto tree, for healing here are only two possibilities, momentum from 2H and vigor from PvP asault tree.
Stamina Templar is actually in a great place for PvP in my opinin, I've been playing great with it in 1v1 and 1vx situations. They have insane damage if you build your character well, while keeping decent recovery (I have around 4.2k Weapon Damage & 2.3k Stam Recovery). People have their own opinions, but my opinion is if you build right and learn to play a Stam Templar properly you will have no trouble with it in PvP.
I agree, I can't agree to what people say. Even if I wanted to and I have no reason to be biased here.
Since 1.6 stamina Templar is very strong and it still is. I think they are very dangerous and capable.
Sadly, most stam Templars don't use their arsenal properly. And forget to use 1 certain ability
DM what it is !!!!!! :O
Backlash. It's super strong, the best timed burst in the game.
Yet the current problem is, that it is bugged on damage shields. So this limits it's current reliability (but if you know how to do it and break the shield right before backlash goes off....) Once this gets fixed, I DEMAND any famous Templar to slot this damn thing, for it is one of the best abilities in the game.
Time this right and you anihilate things.
The Backlash tooltip on my fully buffed Templar is over 19k. 19K ! This is the hardest hitting ability in the game when it comes to tooltip and this can crit. For comparison, my Sorcerer Overload tooltip is around 15-16k depending on what setup I'm on.
Any player with an iq higher than 5 will purge it, btw magicka sorcs can actually hit for 16k overload crits in pvp, a spammable ability for 16k damage.
Straight away your 19k tooltip is cut in 50% as it can't crit, so you're doing a max of 9.5k before resistances are taken into accounr, so more like 6k damage at best.
And as above, a decent player will use purge or purifying ritual and remove it completly, it's also hugely obvious to them.
I use it since I started playing and I hardly ever see ppl purge it. And even if they do. Its an action they have to take instead of doing something else more productive, so thats still good situation for me.
That's because their bad players, every good player will have a purge of sorts on one of their bars, otherwise, well your dead meat to a huge number of purge able skills like curse and crystal frags and dark flare (yes dark flare and crystal frags are purge able I found this out last night)
In any case a bad player is going to die, and a good player can beat a bad player with any class or any set, hence why you see videos by people like sypher that are actually using terrible terrible builds and skills, yet they kill n00b all day.
I've 1v5 before and won on my mag temp, because they were a group of unskilled players, likewise I cannot and until something happens ever beat a truly well played sorc, because they will never let you get their shields down, and you'll be eating 16k overlord crits keeping you on the defence.
Same for gankers, a truly well built nb gank build WILL kill you before you can react, my stam nb had nearly 5k weapon damage, everyone was literially a one shot, it was hysterical, snipe and ambush from stealth with suprise attack and they would be dead before the stun was over.
That's because purging backlash is for people with IQ 5
You know why ? Because Purge has a very disadvantage 2nd effect.
reduces the duration of negative effects by 50% for 8 seconds after using purge. Magicka Detonation, Daedric Curse and backlash highly benefit from this. They go of 50% faster, but their damage remains the same
You they actually doom themselves. In 8 seconds, you can place 2 backlashes or 5 daedric curses. Instead of only 1 backlash or 2 curses.
Then you just purge again? Or use purifying ritual? Or any other cleanse?
It remains to be said, the single best templars around like alcast have stopped using stamplars completly because they are the single worst class I'm pvp and pve.
Only an idiot would die to purifying light, but any decent player will put a templar immediately on the defensive, and since templars lack defence it's the end of them
Alcast is actually one of the few ppl who says this skill is not bad. But of course we can probably all agree that it SHOULD be able to crit above the tooltip numbers to make it more desirable.Georgion - Bosmer/Templar - PC/EU0 -
zornyan✭✭✭✭✭Swen_von_Walhallion wrote: »So I'm making a Templar and switched to stamina for the dps and could take any suggestions on what you use to defend yourself in 1v1 situations or 1vx? I was thinking blazing shield but heard it was nerfed . My heals aren't all that good considering I have very little magicka. So give me some idea that work for you
rerol on DK or NB if you want play stamina in pvp, templars are here in rly bad position.
On templars you can use some generick def skills aktive skils from heavy and medium armmor skilltree for boost your defence, or bone shield from undauted but it work only agais physikal dmg and rune focus from templar resto tree, for healing here are only two possibilities, momentum from 2H and vigor from PvP asault tree.
Stamina Templar is actually in a great place for PvP in my opinin, I've been playing great with it in 1v1 and 1vx situations. They have insane damage if you build your character well, while keeping decent recovery (I have around 4.2k Weapon Damage & 2.3k Stam Recovery). People have their own opinions, but my opinion is if you build right and learn to play a Stam Templar properly you will have no trouble with it in PvP.
I agree, I can't agree to what people say. Even if I wanted to and I have no reason to be biased here.
Since 1.6 stamina Templar is very strong and it still is. I think they are very dangerous and capable.
Sadly, most stam Templars don't use their arsenal properly. And forget to use 1 certain ability
DM what it is !!!!!! :O
Backlash. It's super strong, the best timed burst in the game.
Yet the current problem is, that it is bugged on damage shields. So this limits it's current reliability (but if you know how to do it and break the shield right before backlash goes off....) Once this gets fixed, I DEMAND any famous Templar to slot this damn thing, for it is one of the best abilities in the game.
Time this right and you anihilate things.
The Backlash tooltip on my fully buffed Templar is over 19k. 19K ! This is the hardest hitting ability in the game when it comes to tooltip and this can crit. For comparison, my Sorcerer Overload tooltip is around 15-16k depending on what setup I'm on.
Any player with an iq higher than 5 will purge it, btw magicka sorcs can actually hit for 16k overload crits in pvp, a spammable ability for 16k damage.
Straight away your 19k tooltip is cut in 50% as it can't crit, so you're doing a max of 9.5k before resistances are taken into accounr, so more like 6k damage at best.
And as above, a decent player will use purge or purifying ritual and remove it completly, it's also hugely obvious to them.
I use it since I started playing and I hardly ever see ppl purge it. And even if they do. Its an action they have to take instead of doing something else more productive, so thats still good situation for me.
That's because their bad players, every good player will have a purge of sorts on one of their bars, otherwise, well your dead meat to a huge number of purge able skills like curse and crystal frags and dark flare (yes dark flare and crystal frags are purge able I found this out last night)
In any case a bad player is going to die, and a good player can beat a bad player with any class or any set, hence why you see videos by people like sypher that are actually using terrible terrible builds and skills, yet they kill n00b all day.
I've 1v5 before and won on my mag temp, because they were a group of unskilled players, likewise I cannot and until something happens ever beat a truly well played sorc, because they will never let you get their shields down, and you'll be eating 16k overlord crits keeping you on the defence.
Same for gankers, a truly well built nb gank build WILL kill you before you can react, my stam nb had nearly 5k weapon damage, everyone was literially a one shot, it was hysterical, snipe and ambush from stealth with suprise attack and they would be dead before the stun was over.
That's because purging backlash is for people with IQ 5
You know why ? Because Purge has a very disadvantage 2nd effect.
reduces the duration of negative effects by 50% for 8 seconds after using purge. Magicka Detonation, Daedric Curse and backlash highly benefit from this. They go of 50% faster, but their damage remains the same
You they actually doom themselves. In 8 seconds, you can place 2 backlashes or 5 daedric curses. Instead of only 1 backlash or 2 curses.
Then you just purge again? Or use purifying ritual? Or any other cleanse?
It remains to be said, the single best templars around like alcast have stopped using stamplars completly because they are the single worst class I'm pvp and pve.
Only an idiot would die to purifying light, but any decent player will put a templar immediately on the defensive, and since templars lack defence it's the end of them
Alcast is actually one of the few ppl who says this skill is not bad. But of course we can probably all agree that it SHOULD be able to crit above the tooltip numbers to make it more desirable.
I'm pretty sure he changed his views recently as I noticed in the templar issues thread, he's also completely given up on his stamplar due to it being the worst class in eso now, which says a big something.
I agree it needs to be able to crit, it's a DPS loss atm in pve, which also says how bad the skill is.0 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm not defending/fighting Templar or something. I don't think, it's that good. It has the biggest amount of appealing and usefull abilities out of all classes for me, but the numbers are just too bad, that's all.
I think, Templar needs damage buffs and then it's going to look much better. Though I still think, it's time to expand skilllines to level 60 and introduce a new active and passive ability for each. Templar gets this Sunjump to become better in 1vx and everyone's happy.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm not defending/fighting Templar or something. I don't think, it's that good. It has the biggest amount of appealing and usefull abilities out of all classes for me, but the numbers are just too bad, that's all.
I think, Templar needs damage buffs and then it's going to look much better. Though I still think, it's time to expand skilllines to level 60 and introduce a new active and passive ability for each. Templar gets this Sunjump to become better in 1vx and everyone's happy.
Exactly why I was so excited when Gina asked us to compile our issues. For once I finally have a tiny bit of hope that Templar will be balanced again and I can resume my Stamplar and not feel gimp at every event.0 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm not defending/fighting Templar or something. I don't think, it's that good. It has the biggest amount of appealing and usefull abilities out of all classes for me, but the numbers are just too bad, that's all.
I think, Templar needs damage buffs and then it's going to look much better. Though I still think, it's time to expand skilllines to level 60 and introduce a new active and passive ability for each. Templar gets this Sunjump to become better in 1vx and everyone's happy.
Exactly why I was so excited when Gina asked us to compile our issues. For once I finally have a tiny bit of hope that Templar will be balanced again and I can resume my Stamplar and not feel gimp at every event.
Templar WILL get buffed. Don't you worry
it is going to happen. Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭It remains to be said, the single best templars around like alcast have stopped using stamplars completly because they are the single worst class I'm pvp and pve.
Only an idiot would die to purifying light, but any decent player will put a templar immediately on the defensive, and since templars lack defence it's the end of them
I don't know if I would go that far, sure Stam Templars need a little bit of help, but they are not as bad off as Sorc's were in 1.5.
Stamplar's can be very good I think if built more Hybrid, Infact think they are best class to play a Hybrid spec with and will be even better in the next update if many of the Undaunted hybrid sets are scaled up.
Templar's were never meant to be the best DPS(Magic Sorc's are better magic wise, and Nightblades are better Stam wise)
Templar's were never meant to be the best tanks (That goes to DK's)
Templar's were meant to be great healers.
I also think Templar's are in the best place for Hybrid Builds which will be making a big comeback in the next update, because the skills Templar's have access to use as "Magic Dumps" are better then what other classes have access to....in the next update Blazing Shield will be better, and its viable right now to use Breath of Life, Purifying Ritual, Eclipse, Blazing Shield, and Toppling Charge as magic dumps, freeing up your Stam pool for other things....Hybrid Builds are never the master or best at one role, but they are good at a few different ones, and I think Templar is the best Hybrid Class and i think Hybrid Templar;s will be very good next update. If built correctly now with enough Champ points, you can make Hybrid Temps work that are very hard to kill.
In the current meta of DPS I think Templar's who don't want to heal or play full on magic can find success in Hybrid Roles, I also think hybrid roles will just get better for Templar's moving forward. just my 2 cents.Edited by RinaldoGandolphi on December 10, 2015 4:19PMRinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak0 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm not defending/fighting Templar or something. I don't think, it's that good. It has the biggest amount of appealing and usefull abilities out of all classes for me, but the numbers are just too bad, that's all.
I think, Templar needs damage buffs and then it's going to look much better. Though I still think, it's time to expand skilllines to level 60 and introduce a new active and passive ability for each. Templar gets this Sunjump to become better in 1vx and everyone's happy.
Exactly why I was so excited when Gina asked us to compile our issues. For once I finally have a tiny bit of hope that Templar will be balanced again and I can resume my Stamplar and not feel gimp at every event.
Templar WILL get buffed. Don't you worry it is going to happen.
And on that day I shall leap into thine heavens with a shinning golden spear of light and smite thy pvp foes!1 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »It remains to be said, the single best templars around like alcast have stopped using stamplars completly because they are the single worst class I'm pvp and pve.
Only an idiot would die to purifying light, but any decent player will put a templar immediately on the defensive, and since templars lack defence it's the end of them
I don't know if I would go that far, sure Stam Templars need a little bit of help, but they are not as bad off as Sorc's were in 1.5.
Stamplar's can be very good I think if built more Hybrid, Infact think they are best class to play a Hybrid spec with and will be even better in the next update if many of the Undaunted hybrid sets are scaled up.
Templar's were never meant to be the best DPS(Magic Sorc's are better magic wise, and Nightblades are better Stam wise)
Templar's were never meant to be the best tanks (That goes to DK's)
Templar's were meant to be great healers.
I also think Templar's are in the best place for Hybrid Builds which will be making a big comeback in the next update, because the skills Templar's have access to use as "Magic Dumps" are better then what other classes have access to....in the next update Blazing Shield will be better, and its viable right now to use Breath of Life, Purifying Ritual, Eclipse, Blazing Shield, and Toppling Charge as magic dumps, freeing up your Stam pool for other things....Hybrid Builds are never the master or best at one role, but they are good at a few different ones, and I think Templar is the best Hybrid Class and i think Hybrid Templar;s will be very good next update. If built correctly now with enough Champ points, you can make Hybrid Temps work that are very hard to kill.
In the current meta of DPS I think Templar's who don't want to heal or play full on magic can find success in Hybrid Roles, I also think hybrid roles will just get better for Templar's moving forward. just my 2 cents.
I actually would disagree, as the base idea was to make everything good at everything.
But Zenimax just recently stated, that classes were never intended to be equally good. Some are supposed to be stronger and better in certain situations.
And I agree, Stamplars aren't bad.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm not defending/fighting Templar or something. I don't think, it's that good. It has the biggest amount of appealing and usefull abilities out of all classes for me, but the numbers are just too bad, that's all.
I think, Templar needs damage buffs and then it's going to look much better. Though I still think, it's time to expand skilllines to level 60 and introduce a new active and passive ability for each. Templar gets this Sunjump to become better in 1vx and everyone's happy.
Exactly why I was so excited when Gina asked us to compile our issues. For once I finally have a tiny bit of hope that Templar will be balanced again and I can resume my Stamplar and not feel gimp at every event.
Templar WILL get buffed. Don't you worry it is going to happen.
And on that day I shall leap into thine heavens with a shinning golden spear of light and smite thy pvp foes!
Oh, I have many foes. Yet, I am capable to smite them on my own.
But the holy father Auri-El always appreciates holy and faithfull guardians. You shall impress him with your light and oath your spear to him. So that his cleansing light shall smite thy foes.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos1 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »It remains to be said, the single best templars around like alcast have stopped using stamplars completly because they are the single worst class I'm pvp and pve.
Only an idiot would die to purifying light, but any decent player will put a templar immediately on the defensive, and since templars lack defence it's the end of them
I don't know if I would go that far, sure Stam Templars need a little bit of help, but they are not as bad off as Sorc's were in 1.5.
Stamplar's can be very good I think if built more Hybrid, Infact think they are best class to play a Hybrid spec with and will be even better in the next update if many of the Undaunted hybrid sets are scaled up.
Templar's were never meant to be the best DPS(Magic Sorc's are better magic wise, and Nightblades are better Stam wise)
Templar's were never meant to be the best tanks (That goes to DK's)
Templar's were meant to be great healers.
I also think Templar's are in the best place for Hybrid Builds which will be making a big comeback in the next update, because the skills Templar's have access to use as "Magic Dumps" are better then what other classes have access to....in the next update Blazing Shield will be better, and its viable right now to use Breath of Life, Purifying Ritual, Eclipse, Blazing Shield, and Toppling Charge as magic dumps, freeing up your Stam pool for other things....Hybrid Builds are never the master or best at one role, but they are good at a few different ones, and I think Templar is the best Hybrid Class and i think Hybrid Templar;s will be very good next update. If built correctly now with enough Champ points, you can make Hybrid Temps work that are very hard to kill.
In the current meta of DPS I think Templar's who don't want to heal or play full on magic can find success in Hybrid Roles, I also think hybrid roles will just get better for Templar's moving forward. just my 2 cents.
See, the funny part about your post is you don't even realize that Stamplar sacrifices his whole identity of "healing" but no other class does when choosing Stamina. DK are just as tanky, if not more when Stamina, Sorcs are just as mobile, NB just as sneaky.
So if you are correct and ZOS never intended us to do good dmg just heal, why would they take away ALL of stamplars healing? Your solution is to hybridize. Unfortunately that just makes you even weaker in PVP, it's not just weapon dmg you are sacrificing to get a small heal. You're also sacrificing max stamina which = even more wep dmg. All of that to get a small heal from breath of life and it doesn't even heal 1 heavy attack. You're better off using Vigor/rally like everyone else and trying to find defense with shuffle. The thing that REALLY makes me mad? Stamina Dragon Knights get to heal better than us too, WTF IS THAT? DK class passives add major/minor mending +50% healing that works on ALL heals. Templar's healing passives effect......only Templar specific class heals...that's just flat out not fair if we are the "healing" specialists as you claim.
So ZOS's whole thing is we should be happy being limited to 1 role? Healer/magic DPS? But they keep nerfing our magic dps too. So it's clear they just want us to be heal bots, but if that is the case why even HAVE stamina morphs for Temp?
If they want us to be Hybrids that's fine, but for that to work we need soft caps back.1 -
Van_0S✭✭✭✭✭I'm not defending/fighting Templar or something. I don't think, it's that good. It has the biggest amount of appealing and usefull abilities out of all classes for me, but the numbers are just too bad, that's all.
I think, Templar needs damage buffs and then it's going to look much better. Though I still think, it's time to expand skilllines to level 60 and introduce a new active and passive ability for each. Templar gets this Sunjump to become better in 1vx and everyone's happy.
Exactly why I was so excited when Gina asked us to compile our issues. For once I finally have a tiny bit of hope that Templar will be balanced again and I can resume my Stamplar and not feel gimp at every event.
What happens, if zeni chooses to nerf templars?
Then what will you guys do?( I will simply quit!! provided they nerf other class or *cough* sorcerers*cough*)0 -
Docmandu✭✭✭✭✭
✭The Backlash tooltip on my fully buffed Templar is over 19k. 19K ! This is the hardest hitting ability in the game when it comes to tooltip and this can crit. For comparison, my Sorcerer Overload tooltip is around 15-16k depending on what setup I'm on.
Yes it can crit, but it CAN'T go above that delve value.. max it will EVER do is that tooltip value.. crit or not.
0 -
Jura23✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm not defending/fighting Templar or something. I don't think, it's that good. It has the biggest amount of appealing and usefull abilities out of all classes for me, but the numbers are just too bad, that's all.
I think, Templar needs damage buffs and then it's going to look much better. Though I still think, it's time to expand skilllines to level 60 and introduce a new active and passive ability for each. Templar gets this Sunjump to become better in 1vx and everyone's happy.
Exactly why I was so excited when Gina asked us to compile our issues. For once I finally have a tiny bit of hope that Templar will be balanced again and I can resume my Stamplar and not feel gimp at every event.
This actually annoyed me quite a bit. Feels like they want us to do their job for them. Hell, were not beta testers. We are customers.
But if somebody else here is willing to do it, I thank them for it.Georgion - Bosmer/Templar - PC/EU0 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
See, the funny part about your post is you don't even realize that Stamplar sacrifices his whole identity of "healing" but no other class does when choosing Stamina. DK are just as tanky, if not more when Stamina, Sorcs are just as mobile, NB just as sneaky.
So if you are correct and ZOS never intended us to do good dmg just heal, why would they take away ALL of stamplars healing? Your solution is to hybridize. Unfortunately that just makes you even weaker in PVP, it's not just weapon dmg you are sacrificing to get a small heal. You're also sacrificing max stamina which = even more wep dmg. All of that to get a small heal from breath of life and it doesn't even heal 1 heavy attack. You're better off using Vigor/rally like everyone else and trying to find defense with shuffle. The thing that REALLY makes me mad? Stamina Dragon Knights get to heal better than us too, WTF IS THAT? DK class passives add major/minor mending +50% healing that works on ALL heals. Templar's healing passives effect......only Templar specific class heals...that's just flat out not fair if we are the "healing" specialists as you claim.
So ZOS's whole thing is we should be happy being limited to 1 role? Healer/magic DPS? But they keep nerfing our magic dps too. So it's clear they just want us to be heal bots, but if that is the case why even HAVE stamina morphs for Temp?
If they want us to be Hybrids that's fine, but for that to work we need soft caps back.
I don't really feel any weaker in PVP then say my full on DPS mag Templar for example, its just a different way of playing.
Templar's can hybridize and do very well with the right build and CP distribution, infact i'd say right now a Hybrid Templar built correctly is probably better then both a pure Stamplar and a Magic Templar. (My way of doing it isn't the only way either; I am a Breton and had to find ways to make up the Stam regen and such, other races and stuff could do it different and still work perfectly fine)
You don't need 4k Weapon Damage to kill someone, and you don't have to be ultra tanky to not die. I didn't have to give up any max stamina to get a viable Magic Pool, all my enchants are Weapon Damage. I seen Endurance jewels as better synergy for a Hybrid Stamplar thats a Breton like me because of the Stamina Recovery helps my Breton and Max Health helps my defense, damage, and ability to survive(Blazing Shield)
I'll check when i get home, but with points in Bastion im pretty sure my Blazing Shield is around 6K-6.5k before i get the 4% bonus, thats pretty viable. I give up no weapon damage, max stamina or anything else to get this...That Blazing Shield returns damage and allows me to survive what kills other Stamplars while also dealing damage.
If you cast Purifying Ritual and stand inside it and then cast BOL its a huge Burst heal...i think i was hitting 9-10k with i in Cyro the other night its completely viable and it makes Templar's the ONLY Class in the game that can heal from both resource pools and be viable and thats a huge advantage in its own right if used properly.
Blazing Shield could allow you to pop BOL, duck behind a rock pop Vigor and be at Full Health, you can have Vigor + Rally ticking at the same time and BOL can bail you out when you would die otherwise...Purifying Ritual purges off meteors and pretty much any other bad effect in the game and increases the potency of your BOL by 15% Combine that with 10% from Quick Recovery, 1-2% from the Heavy Armor Passive, thats a pretty decent sized heal...
I know everyone focuses on Min max, but a 7k BOL heal "thats instant" in many cases is better then Vigor Healing for 10,000 over 5 secs(2k a sec) in many cases that so called "inefficent Stamplar Hybrid 6-7k heal" will be what keeps you alive when Vigor that your full speced to stamina fails you because it can't overcome the 7k burst thats coming and you don't have the stamina to dodge.
Templar's as a whole need help, but as a Hybrid you can take advantage of the utility skills Templar's do have..Such as Eclipse, Blazing Shield, Purifying ritual, BOL when standing inside Purifying Ritual, and even Blazing Shield becomes viable with a Hybrid build when its not viable with any other build.
I know in many cases min-max builds are considered to be better, and yes a Hybrid Templar will never heal as well as a full blown healer, and a Hybrid Templar will never do as much flat out damage as a full blown Nightblade, but the way this games PVP is designed you can still be effective with it.
Dead people kill no one and i would rather give up a bit of damage for the ability to survive, and make no mistake, a 6k Blazing Shield and a viable Breath of Life off heal allowing me to use my magic bar while my stam recoevers does make survival much easier specially when being focused on by multiple people from range. Im still new to Stam Templar, but i am trying to incorporate a lot of what i observed from Vanus back in the day when he ran an AD Templar, I know everything don't translate, but more of it does then i thought, im still new but i like having all these decent utility skills that are useful to dump magic on even if i do give up a little bit of damage to do it, its really fun...it feels like a whole new class playing it this way.
just my 2cents, everyone has their own way of doing things they think is funEdited by RinaldoGandolphi on December 10, 2015 5:45PMRinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak1 -
zornyan✭✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »
See, the funny part about your post is you don't even realize that Stamplar sacrifices his whole identity of "healing" but no other class does when choosing Stamina. DK are just as tanky, if not more when Stamina, Sorcs are just as mobile, NB just as sneaky.
So if you are correct and ZOS never intended us to do good dmg just heal, why would they take away ALL of stamplars healing? Your solution is to hybridize. Unfortunately that just makes you even weaker in PVP, it's not just weapon dmg you are sacrificing to get a small heal. You're also sacrificing max stamina which = even more wep dmg. All of that to get a small heal from breath of life and it doesn't even heal 1 heavy attack. You're better off using Vigor/rally like everyone else and trying to find defense with shuffle. The thing that REALLY makes me mad? Stamina Dragon Knights get to heal better than us too, WTF IS THAT? DK class passives add major/minor mending +50% healing that works on ALL heals. Templar's healing passives effect......only Templar specific class heals...that's just flat out not fair if we are the "healing" specialists as you claim.
So ZOS's whole thing is we should be happy being limited to 1 role? Healer/magic DPS? But they keep nerfing our magic dps too. So it's clear they just want us to be heal bots, but if that is the case why even HAVE stamina morphs for Temp?
If they want us to be Hybrids that's fine, but for that to work we need soft caps back.
I don't really feel any weaker in PVP then say my full on DPS mag Templar for example, its just a different way of playing.
Templar's can hybridize and do very well with the right build and CP distribution, infact i'd say right now a Hybrid Templar built correctly is probably better then both a pure Stamplar and a Magic Templar. (My way of doing it isn't the only way either; I am a Breton and had to find ways to make up the Stam regen and such, other races and stuff could do it different and still work perfectly fine)
You don't need 4k Weapon Damage to kill someone, and you don't have to be ultra tanky to not die. I didn't have to give up any max stamina to get a viable Magic Pool, all my enchants are Weapon Damage. I seen Endurance jewels as better synergy for a Hybrid Stamplar thats a Breton like me because of the Stamina Recovery helps my Breton and Max Health helps my defense, damage, and ability to survive(Blazing Shield)
I'll check when i get home, but with points in Bastion im pretty sure my Blazing Shield is around 6K-6.5k before i get the 4% bonus, thats pretty viable. I give up no weapon damage, max stamina or anything else to get this...That Blazing Shield returns damage and allows me to survive what kills other Stamplars while also dealing damage.
If you cast Purifying Ritual and stand inside it and then cast BOL its a huge Burst heal...i think i was hitting 9-10k with i in Cyro the other night its completely viable and it makes Templar's the ONLY Class in the game that can heal from both resource pools and be viable and thats a huge advantage in its own right if used properly.
Blazing Shield could allow you to pop BOL, duck behind a rock pop Vigor and be at Full Health, you can have Vigor + Rally ticking at the same time and BOL can bail you out when you would die otherwise...Purifying Ritual purges off meteors and pretty much any other bad effect in the game and increases the potency of your BOL by 15% Combine that with 10% from Quick Recovery, 1-2% from the Heavy Armor Passive, thats a pretty decent sized heal...
I know everyone focuses on Min max, but a 7k BOL heal "thats instant" in many cases is better then Vigor Healing for 10,000 over 5 secs(2k a sec) in many cases that so called "inefficent Stamplar Hybrid 6-7k heal" will be what keeps you alive when Vigor that your full speced to stamina fails you because it can't overcome the 7k burst thats coming and you don't have the stamina to dodge.
Templar's as a whole need help, but as a Hybrid you can take advantage of the utility skills Templar's do have..Such as Eclipse, Blazing Shield, Purifying ritual, BOL when standing inside Purifying Ritual, and even Blazing Shield becomes viable with a Hybrid build when its not viable with any other build.
I know in many cases min-max builds are considered to be better, and yes a Hybrid Templar will never heal as well as a full blown healer, and a Hybrid Templar will never do as much flat out damage as a full blown Nightblade, but the way this games PVP is designed you can still be effective with it.
Dead people kill no one and i would rather give up a bit of damage for the ability to survive, and make no mistake, a 6k Blazing Shield and a viable Breath of Life off heal allowing me to use my magic bar while my stam recoevers does make survival much easier specially when being focused on by multiple people from range. Im still new to Stam Templar, but i am trying to incorporate a lot of what i observed from Vanus back in the day when he ran an AD Templar, I know everything don't translate, but more of it does then i thought, im still new but i like having all these decent utility skills that are useful to dump magic on even if i do give up a little bit of damage to do it, its really fun...it feels like a whole new class playing it this way.
just my 2cents, everyone has their own way of doing things they think is fun
But that isn't surviving.
For instance
My Brenton magicka templar crit heals fwhem 15-17k in cyro when a sorc is overloading me each one of my heals heals exactly the amount of damage dealt to me.
If I was doing 10k heals only, in 3 overload attacks I'd be dead. That means that every single burst damage type is going to out damage your healing, a 15k wrecking blow, a 14k frag etc etc.
Hybrids have been proven to be sup bar since soft caps were removed.0 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭Take your hybrid build to a 1v1 dueling tournament then report back to us how fast you were eliminated.
To get that magic pool, 16,000?, you have to make a compromise somewhere. Any skill, item, weapon, stat point etc you change to give you magic instead of stamina or wep dmg is lowing your DPS. Because Stamina also converts to Wep Dmg you are losing out x2. In return you are getting VERY small return on your overall healing because of the 50% nerf and the fact that all our heals only scale on magic. You're not being honest here, where are you getting that 16,000+ magic? To get that you're losing out somewhere around 5000-6000 stamina which directly converts into over 1000 wep dmg. My point is compared to a pure stamina Stamplar you're likely anywhere from 1000-2000 total wep dmg behind (when factoring max stamina AND wep dmg). That is a HUGE loss in dps and all it does is change your heal from about 3,000 to 6,000 which is still 1 heavy attack. You would be much better off dumping that magic into health for your shield or Stamina for dmg and rally/vigor scaling instead.
ANY build can work in pvp because lots of players there are clueless, if you are skilled you can make it work vs new players. But you're not going to make it effective vs other skilled players cause they will have higher dps than you, higher healing than you and better overall defense. They will wreck you while you stand there spamming breath of life and running out of magic. One CC and you are dead.
To top everything off you didn't even acknowledge my other points such as:
Why do Dragon Knights heal better than Templars?
Why is Stamplar the only class being forced to lose its class identity or severely hamper it's build to get some healing?
Plus we have even more issues with bugs and such. Like with Biting Jabs, if your opponent has a shield he just effectively made your Biting Jabs almost useless as you will not get the dmg bonus from it or crits.
Hybrid builds work great for solo PVE but in PVP you are at a big disadvantage vs specialized builds.
P.S. I want Hybrids to work, but we need soft caps back for that to be realistic.Edited by AfkNinja on December 10, 2015 6:09PM0 -
SemiD4rkness✭✭✭✭✭All we need is passives to affect all types of healing, that way stamplars can also be the top self healing class (since its supposed to be our main role) It could be the less hp you have left the higher your heals will be.1
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RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Why would I duel? I don't even care about dueling, never have. I play the game for fun i don't play it for anything competitive or serious, i play it for fun only. There are many duelers out there that play this game far better then me and my hats off to them, I have even had playful convos with a few of them, all great people. They have their 1v1 builds down to an art and have been practicing and honing their skill at it for quite sometime, and they are good at it because of it.
Secondly, being a Hybrid Templar is about utility, not damage...its not meant to go toe to toe with say a Stam blade and out damage him, thats not how it works, and it sure isn't meant to be a dueling or a 1v1 build in anyway, its meant to be viable in open world pvp under normal pvp conditions and there is a big difference there, Hybrid Stamplar is more of a support role that can chip in when needed. The only way a Hybrid Templar beats a Stam Blade or whatever is by using terrain and such to flatout out position and outplay him, a Hybrid Templar sure isn't going to beat him in a 1v1 duel in a war of attrition.
I use purple or blue food instead of drink, My Breton passives gives me more 10% max magicka, thats where it comes from.
Third: Being able to use your magic to heal when your low on stamina is an advantage in some situations. Being able to Eclipse an Overloading Sorc is an advantage in some cases as well. Being able to use Toppling Charge as a gap closer frees up stamina for another skill. Using Blazing Shield can buy you time to LOS enemies when your being focused on by multiple targets from range.
Fourth: Im not disagreeing with you. I think Templar healing passives should apply to skills like Vigor, and yes Templar does need help in some way...yes it sucks that Jabs is bugged against sheilds, im hopeful that gets fixed.
A hybrid Templar won't have the damage a pure speced Stamplar will have, but its not supposed to. I wanted to try stam and i didn't want my Breton Racial passives going to waste so i figured out a way to take advantage of them by using a few magic skills as a way to simply "dump magic" as passive utility.
The the Overload example above, im not going to use BOL to take the damage, im gonna Eclipse the Sorc, then dodge roll or LOS the nearest place I can, the Sorc has to break the Eclipse before he can continue, it buys time and stops the damage output, giving you time to adjust, be it sheilding yourself, etc...as a Hybrid I know im not gonna win that in a straight up fight, but what i can do is use my magic utility skills and dodge rolling stam skills to drag out the fight and do my best to string the Sorc back towards friendlies where he either gets chased away or killed...
I know im not going to win a straight up locking horns with a Stam or Magic focused class like Sorc's or Nightblades, but what i will do well is support my allies, bring utility to the fight. Its not speclizing in doing one thing well, its making the sum of all the average parts work at an above average rate.
Trust me, i'd rather re-roll a stamina race such as a Redguard, Khajiit, etc and roll a Nightblade but I don't have the patience to level another toon....so for now this will have to do me, I know there will be fights I can't win, and im OK with that, I also know i'll have to be far more careful with my positioning, but fighting at a disadvantage will only make my successes far more satisfying.
I really hope Templar's get the help we need though, I always have my Sorc to fall back on, but so far trying a Hybrid Templar has been fun for me, its not as bad as i originally thought it would be, not as good as a pure Stamplar either in terms of damage, but thats ok, its still fun and not FOTM so i will roll with it and i'll just have to learn to put myself in better positions thats all, it is what it is.Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak0 -
Alec508✭✭✭Swen_von_Walhallion wrote: »So I'm making a Templar and switched to stamina for the dps and could take any suggestions on what you use to defend yourself in 1v1 situations or 1vx? I was thinking blazing shield but heard it was nerfed . My heals aren't all that good considering I have very little magicka. So give me some idea that work for you
rerol on DK or NB if you want play stamina in pvp, templars are here in rly bad position.
On templars you can use some generick def skills aktive skils from heavy and medium armmor skilltree for boost your defence, or bone shield from undauted but it work only agais physikal dmg and rune focus from templar resto tree, for healing here are only two possibilities, momentum from 2H and vigor from PvP asault tree.
Stamina Templar is actually in a great place for PvP in my opinin, I've been playing great with it in 1v1 and 1vx situations. They have insane damage if you build your character well, while keeping decent recovery (I have around 4.2k Weapon Damage & 2.3k Stam Recovery). People have their own opinions, but my opinion is if you build right and learn to play a Stam Templar properly you will have no trouble with it in PvP.
I agree, I can't agree to what people say. Even if I wanted to and I have no reason to be biased here.
Since 1.6 stamina Templar is very strong and it still is. I think they are very dangerous and capable.
Sadly, most stam Templars don't use their arsenal properly. And forget to use 1 certain ability
DM what it is !!!!!! :O
Backlash. It's super strong, the best timed burst in the game.
Yet the current problem is, that it is bugged on damage shields. So this limits it's current reliability (but if you know how to do it and break the shield right before backlash goes off....) Once this gets fixed, I DEMAND any famous Templar to slot this damn thing, for it is one of the best abilities in the game.
Time this right and you anihilate things.
The Backlash tooltip on my fully buffed Templar is over 19k. 19K ! This is the hardest hitting ability in the game when it comes to tooltip and this can crit. For comparison, my Sorcerer Overload tooltip is around 15-16k depending on what setup I'm on.
Any player with an iq higher than 5 will purge it, btw magicka sorcs can actually hit for 16k overload crits in pvp, a spammable ability for 16k damage.
Straight away your 19k tooltip is cut in 50% as it can't crit, so you're doing a max of 9.5k before resistances are taken into accounr, so more like 6k damage at best.
And as above, a decent player will use purge or purifying ritual and remove it completly, it's also hugely obvious to them.
I use it since I started playing and I hardly ever see ppl purge it. And even if they do. Its an action they have to take instead of doing something else more productive, so thats still good situation for me.
That's because their bad players, every good player will have a purge of sorts on one of their bars, otherwise, well your dead meat to a huge number of purge able skills like curse and crystal frags and dark flare (yes dark flare and crystal frags are purge able I found this out last night)
In any case a bad player is going to die, and a good player can beat a bad player with any class or any set, hence why you see videos by people like sypher that are actually using terrible terrible builds and skills, yet they kill n00b all day.
I've 1v5 before and won on my mag temp, because they were a group of unskilled players, likewise I cannot and until something happens ever beat a truly well played sorc, because they will never let you get their shields down, and you'll be eating 16k overlord crits keeping you on the defence.
Same for gankers, a truly well built nb gank build WILL kill you before you can react, my stam nb had nearly 5k weapon damage, everyone was literially a one shot, it was hysterical, snipe and ambush from stealth with suprise attack and they would be dead before the stun was over.
That's because purging backlash is for people with IQ 5
You know why ? Because Purge has a very disadvantage 2nd effect.
reduces the duration of negative effects by 50% for 8 seconds after using purge. Magicka Detonation, Daedric Curse and backlash highly benefit from this. They go of 50% faster, but their damage remains the same
You they actually doom themselves. In 8 seconds, you can place 2 backlashes or 5 daedric curses. Instead of only 1 backlash or 2 curses.
Then you just purge again? Or use purifying ritual? Or any other cleanse?
It remains to be said, the single best templars around like alcast have stopped using stamplars completly because they are the single worst class I'm pvp and pve.
Only an idiot would die to purifying light, but any decent player will put a templar immediately on the defensive, and since templars lack defence it's the end of them
Totally disagree about them being the complete worst class in pvp. I must be fighting a bunch of "idiots" because I kill nbs in like 10 seconds and only die if I get double teamed or usually quadruple teamed0 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭@RinaldoGandolphi
I'm not trying to single you out and antagonize you or anything I'm glad you have a build you enjoy. The only reason I am arguing against your build is because your posts could encourage people to try a build that is built to fail. I just want people to be aware of the compromises you make to get that 6,000 hp heal (this is tiny in PVP).
The reason I mentioned 1v1 dueling is because you can really see the strengths and weaknesses of a class and build when you test yourself in a one on one environment against a really good opponent. No it does not cover all the situations you will encounter in small scale group pvp or solo roaming. But it's a good stress test and hybrids neither have the damage nor the healing to keep up in a true competitive environment, at this time.
If you want to support your group you are MUCH better off full magicka. If you want to DPS you are MUCH better off full stamina. Hybridizing your build is gimping yourself because in the current state of the game the mechanics just don't support it.
If they brought back soft caps this would change overnight, and soft caps are something I am STRONGLY in favor of because I believe it strongly promotes varied builds as you can easily reach the caps in multiple ways making it so gear sets are more of a personal choice and not a necessity like Hundings is now.
I'm glad you're having fun as that is the important part, I'm just trying to caution people. If you use this build you will be good at nothing, just average, and as soon as you come up against a competent player you WILL lose.
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Alec508✭✭✭@RinaldoGandolphi
I'm not trying to single you out and antagonize you or anything I'm glad you have a build you enjoy. The only reason I am arguing against your build is because your posts could encourage people to try a build that is built to fail. I just want people to be aware of the compromises you make to get that 6,000 hp heal (this is tiny in PVP).
The reason I mentioned 1v1 dueling is because you can really see the strengths and weaknesses of a class and build when you test yourself in a one on one environment against a really good opponent. No it does not cover all the situations you will encounter in small scale group pvp or solo roaming. But it's a good stress test and hybrids neither have the damage nor the healing to keep up in a true competitive environment, at this time.
If you want to support your group you are MUCH better off full magicka. If you want to DPS you are MUCH better off full stamina. Hybridizing your build is gimping yourself because in the current state of the game the mechanics just don't support it.
If they brought back soft caps this would change overnight, and soft caps are something I am STRONGLY in favor of because I believe it strongly promotes varied builds as you can easily reach the caps in multiple ways making it so gear sets are more of a personal choice and not a necessity like Hundings is now.
I'm glad you're having fun as that is the important part, I'm just trying to caution people. If you use this build you will be good at nothing, just average, and as soon as you come up against a competent player you WILL lose.
what's a hybrid ? Someone with half magicka half stamina ?0 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Alec508
Maybe not directly half but yes. It is a build that sacrifices damage and stamina to get some more magicka so your heals will be a bit stronger. However because of the huge nerf to healing your spells will still be less that half as effective as a full magic templar. You'll go from hitting 15,000+ breath of life/20,000+ crits, to 6,000/10,000 ~. It's the diff between being able to recover from a crystal frag/WB with one cast vs having to use it 2-3 times which murders your mana. (And gives them time to use it again while you recover)Edited by AfkNinja on December 10, 2015 8:06PM0 -
Alec508✭✭✭@Alec508
Maybe not directly half but yes. It is a build that sacrifices damage and stamina to get some more magicka so your heals will be a bit stronger. However because of the huge nerf to healing your spells will still be less that half as effective as a full magic templar. You'll go from hitting 15,000+ breath of life/20,000+ crits, to 6,000/10,000 ~. It's the diff between being able to recover from a crystal frag/WB with one cast vs having to use it 2-3 times which murders your mana. (And gives them time to use it again while you recover)
Gotch. Though my heals aren't that strong I don't use magicka for anything besides toppling charge so breath of life is kind of like an hp pot for me , so when I spam it I let usually puts me back to full hp by the time I run out. I also play on black water blade too so my stats aren't as high as a v160 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Alec508
Maybe not directly half but yes. It is a build that sacrifices damage and stamina to get some more magicka so your heals will be a bit stronger. However because of the huge nerf to healing your spells will still be less that half as effective as a full magic templar. You'll go from hitting 15,000+ breath of life/20,000+ crits, to 6,000/10,000 ~. It's the diff between being able to recover from a crystal frag/WB with one cast vs having to use it 2-3 times which murders your mana. (And gives them time to use it again while you recover)
Gotch. Though my heals aren't that strong I don't use magicka for anything besides toppling charge so breath of life is kind of like an hp pot for me , so when I spam it I let usually puts me back to full hp by the time I run out. I also play on black water blade too so my stats aren't as high as a v16
The issue isn't necessarily that you can't heal back to full. It's that it costs to much to do so and you lose out on other things to do it. Using 3-4 global cooldowns (1s) to get back to full hp is TERRIBLE cause it gives your opponent 3-4 seconds of you standing there doing nothing but healing. Meanwhile they are queuing up their burst to nuke you and now you're out of mana. They can also CC you at any time while you are trying to heal and kill you.
You will get much more effectiveness by just going full magicka if you want to heal. You'll do more dps than a Hybrid by going full magicka too. On top of getting extra dmg and defensive options your puncturing sweeps will also heal you while you DPS. Stamplar is sadly is a really weird place right now as it has no synergy and no solid defensive options other than baseline rally/vigor.0 -
Alec508✭✭✭@Alec508
Maybe not directly half but yes. It is a build that sacrifices damage and stamina to get some more magicka so your heals will be a bit stronger. However because of the huge nerf to healing your spells will still be less that half as effective as a full magic templar. You'll go from hitting 15,000+ breath of life/20,000+ crits, to 6,000/10,000 ~. It's the diff between being able to recover from a crystal frag/WB with one cast vs having to use it 2-3 times which murders your mana. (And gives them time to use it again while you recover)
Gotch. Though my heals aren't that strong I don't use magicka for anything besides toppling charge so breath of life is kind of like an hp pot for me , so when I spam it I let usually puts me back to full hp by the time I run out. I also play on black water blade too so my stats aren't as high as a v16
The issue isn't necessarily that you can't heal back to full. It's that it costs to much to do so and you lose out on other things to do it. Using 3-4 global cooldowns (1s) to get back to full hp is TERRIBLE cause it gives your opponent 3-4 seconds of you standing there doing nothing but healing. Meanwhile they are queuing up their burst to nuke you and now you're out of mana. They can also CC you at any time while you are trying to heal and kill you.
You will get much more effectiveness by just going full magicka if you want to heal. You'll do more dps than a Hybrid by going full magicka too. On top of getting extra dmg and defensive options your puncturing sweeps will also heal you while you DPS. Stamplar is sadly is a really weird place right now as it has no synergy and no solid defensive options other than baseline rally/vigor.
I'm trying to get vigor because I don't wanna spend gold to respec a 3rd time. I was using magicka and did like it a lot but noticed a lot more dps on stamina but like you said there's a lack of defensive skills I can use. I totally agree with being a sitting duck when trying to heal, and by the time you waste all your mana healing your Already back at half hp with no stamina0 -
dodgehopper_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭YurtTheSilentChief wrote: »I'm not defending/fighting Templar or something. I don't think, it's that good. It has the biggest amount of appealing and usefull abilities out of all classes for me, but the numbers are just too bad, that's all.
I think, Templar needs damage buffs and then it's going to look much better. Though I still think, it's time to expand skilllines to level 60 and introduce a new active and passive ability for each. Templar gets this Sunjump to become better in 1vx and everyone's happy.
Exactly why I was so excited when Gina asked us to compile our issues. For once I finally have a tiny bit of hope that Templar will be balanced again and I can resume my Stamplar and not feel gimp at every event.
What happens, if zeni chooses to nerf templars?
Then what will you guys do?( I will simply quit!! provided they nerf other class or *cough* sorcerers*cough*)
If they nerf Templars much more, then I will have a really cool crafter character that has maxed out every morph of every skill.US/AD - Dodge Hopper - Vet Imperial Templar | US/AD - Goj-ei-Raj - Vet Argonian Nightblade
US/AD - Arondonimo - Vet Altmer Sorcerer | US/AD - Azumarax - Vet Dunmer Dragon Knight
US/AD - Barkan al-Sheharesh - Vet Redguard Dragon Knight | US/AD - Aelus Vortavoriil - Vet Altmer Templar
US/AD - Shirari Qa'Dar - Vet Khajiit Nightblade | US/AD - Ndvari Mzunchvolenthumz - Vet Bosmer Nightblade
US/EP - Yngmar - Vet Nord Dragon Knight | US/EP - Reloth Ur Fyr - Vet Dunmer Sorcerer
US/DC - Muiredeach - Vet Breton Sorcerer | US/DC - Nachtrabe - Vet Orc Nightblade
EU/DC - Dragol gro-Unglak - Vet Orc Dragon Knight | EU/DC - Targan al-Barkan - Vet Redguard Templar
EU/DC - Wuthmir - Vet Nord Sorcerer | EU/DC - Kosh Ragotoro - Vet Khajiit Nightblade
<And plenty more>1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymTREBQi3Ac