How do people 1vX?

Strider_Roshin · November 2015

raasdal wrote: »

Chims wrote: »

I don't understand how a single player can kill me in 2-3 seconds getting off crystal frags 2 light attacks and a crushing shock all while being able to take dps from 4-5 people and never die.

How is it they are able to take so little damage while dealing so much? I understand they have hardened ward but how are they taking so little damage to the ward without casting it all the time?

Its not just sorcs its most people. what do they have to negate so much damage and how are they weaving so fast?

The correct answer to this question is;

He cannot - and nobody can.

Anyone - no matter if it be Sypher, Fengrush, LeftyLucy or any other famous 1vX'er, who goes up solo against an organized 5 man group, of good skill and coordination, will die almost immediately. If you see any of them in action, the thing to notice is the usage of LoS. THAT is how these people 1vX. When Sypher kills 7 people, he does it by making sure that there are never more than a couple of them that can hit him, and then he singles them out one by one, effectively making it a back-to-back series of 1v1's or maybe 1v2's.

If you where in a 5 man group, and got wiped by one person, then you did in fact NOT have 4-5 people DPS'ing that guy. You might think that you had, but you did not. Maybe it was a DK and everyone was spamming reflectable skills? Maybe half of your team was not doing anything but light attacks? Maybe he was cutting LoS so only 1 or 2 people were able to hit him at any given moment.

I have personally been able to do 1v2 and 1v3. When i do this, it is 100% because the people i am up against have no idea what they are doing. Mostly this happens in IC, going up agains PvE people. The healer will just stand there, and do nothing but heal, and hope his two DPS friends will get me. But they are using skills which i will negate by using my skills correctly.

It seems you are specifically asking about Sorcs. Sorcs with high CP can be REALLY difficult to take out, due to shielding. But they are not "magical" in the sense that they cannot deal damage, while healing or applying shields etc. So for your specific example, i will claim that the 4-5 guys doing "DPS" on that sorc, in fact where not doing anything. That would be my guess?

This is pretty accurate. I have 1v5 before and I 1v4 quite often. There are a lot of variables involved though. For instance in order to fight a group of people, you have to pay A LOT of attention to what your opponents are doing. Bash channeling abilities, dodge roll or block powerful attacks, and choose your targets wisely. If you notice one of them is squishy; take them out. If you identity the healer take them out first. Use CCs to help juggle opponents, and have a means of combating annoying play styles.

CtrlAltDlt · November 2015

We eat all our veggies

WillhelmBlack · November 2015

Interrupt, it's right + left click by default. It also breaks you free from CC's! Now you know, it'll be your new best move.

Sounds sarcastic but you sound new to PvP. Took me months to get used to it. Don't worry about Sorcerers, they're broken. Even the worst players can have the best gear and animation cancel shields.

zornyan · November 2015

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

raasdal wrote: »

Chims wrote: »

I don't understand how a single player can kill me in 2-3 seconds getting off crystal frags 2 light attacks and a crushing shock all while being able to take dps from 4-5 people and never die.

How is it they are able to take so little damage while dealing so much? I understand they have hardened ward but how are they taking so little damage to the ward without casting it all the time?

Its not just sorcs its most people. what do they have to negate so much damage and how are they weaving so fast?

The correct answer to this question is;

He cannot - and nobody can.

Anyone - no matter if it be Sypher, Fengrush, LeftyLucy or any other famous 1vX'er, who goes up solo against an organized 5 man group, of good skill and coordination, will die almost immediately. If you see any of them in action, the thing to notice is the usage of LoS. THAT is how these people 1vX. When Sypher kills 7 people, he does it by making sure that there are never more than a couple of them that can hit him, and then he singles them out one by one, effectively making it a back-to-back series of 1v1's or maybe 1v2's.

If you where in a 5 man group, and got wiped by one person, then you did in fact NOT have 4-5 people DPS'ing that guy. You might think that you had, but you did not. Maybe it was a DK and everyone was spamming reflectable skills? Maybe half of your team was not doing anything but light attacks? Maybe he was cutting LoS so only 1 or 2 people were able to hit him at any given moment.

I have personally been able to do 1v2 and 1v3. When i do this, it is 100% because the people i am up against have no idea what they are doing. Mostly this happens in IC, going up agains PvE people. The healer will just stand there, and do nothing but heal, and hope his two DPS friends will get me. But they are using skills which i will negate by using my skills correctly.

It seems you are specifically asking about Sorcs. Sorcs with high CP can be REALLY difficult to take out, due to shielding. But they are not "magical" in the sense that they cannot deal damage, while healing or applying shields etc. So for your specific example, i will claim that the 4-5 guys doing "DPS" on that sorc, in fact where not doing anything. That would be my guess?

This is pretty accurate. I have 1v5 before and I 1v4 quite often. There are a lot of variables involved though. For instance in order to fight a group of people, you have to pay A LOT of attention to what your opponents are doing. Bash channeling abilities, dodge roll or block powerful attacks, and choose your targets wisely. If you notice one of them is squishy; take them out. If you identity the healer take them out first. Use CCs to help juggle opponents, and have a means of combating annoying play styles.

This^

Also I tend to run through the players constantly, to avoid any wrecking blows, and I'm sure it's infuriating for them to not be able to target me, whilst since my sweeps is an aoe is constantly hitting them.

Lexxypwns · November 2015

Tbh, the main thing with 1vX is finding a group of trash players, knowing when and where to time your burst, careful resource management, and clever line of sight. It is also important to remember than any good player being part of the "X" is going to make it impossible.

Titan1373 · November 2015

Want to 1vX easily? Reroll a sorc.
Seriously that's it lol.

Knootewoot · November 2015

Only Blobs can 1 vs X (or 2 vs X). the others just gather a bunch of noobs who don't use skills or counters like caltrops, mark target or whatever. You never see these in the 1 vs X video's, only light or heavy attacks and no blocking.
But in the Blob video's the screen is littered with counters, yet he survives. Don't want to praise him into heaven, but it's true.

I have "BL" tattooed on the left buttcheek and a "BS" on the right. So when i bend down it sais "BLOBS"

zornyan · November 2015

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Tbh, the main thing with 1vX is finding a group of trash players, knowing when and where to time your burst, careful resource management, and clever line of sight. It is also important to remember than any good player being part of the "X" is going to make it impossible.

This, I was beating down on 5 EP players in arena district earlier, 2 DKs 2 templars and a sorc, 3 vr 16s and 3 lower vrs.

I jumped down and went into the middle of them, quickly layer down purifying ritual and kept spamming sweeps, with a few roll dodges thrown in, I had a few lucky factors though

One I was a vamp and my clouding swarm saved me a couple times, I had dawnbreaker on my back bar and noticed 2 of them were vamps too, used it and they were both dead very quickly.

Roll dodges were timed as good as possible, like I saw an incoming wrecking blow, but luckily at the same time i dodged a dark flare from another player incoming that I didn't see. So luck!

As said picking off the weakest targets is vital, the best player was the dk tank, but the other dk and the temp were both easy pickings, so made sure they went down fast.

Then there's just a stupid, the sorc was only using one setup, which was

Bolt escape
Crit rush
Bolt escape
Crit rush

Spam steel tornado lol

Made them all very predictable. But the biggest help of all? They all stood close together, so my sweeps was hitting at least 4 players at a time, meaning I was getting big heals from every hit. Ig they had just spread out a bit I would have had a much harder time .

Blobsky · November 2015

Knootewoot wrote: »

Only Blobs can 1 vs X (or 2 vs X). the others just gather a bunch of noobs who don't use skills or counters like caltrops, mark target or whatever. You never see these in the 1 vs X video's, only light or heavy attacks and no blocking.
But in the Blob video's the screen is littered with counters, yet he survives. Don't want to praise him into heaven, but it's true.

I have "BL" tattooed on the left buttcheek and a "BS" on the right. So when i bend down it sais "BLOBS"

LOOOOL

I feel loved

Thanks XD

josh.lackey_ESO · November 2015

I am going to suggest that knowing the latest and greatest exploits probably helps, too. Okay, that might be too strong of a word, but there are definitely mechanics in the game that were not tested together and may be unintentionally much better than intended.

It's not that hard to theorycraft how hard people can hit you, how high they can stack shields, how often they can dodge roll, etc. Even assuming max champion points and the best legendary gear on, I occasionally see people doing things that seem implausible. I check my combat log and see numbers that I can get to add up.

So I assume it's a broken mechanic somewhere. Builds using broken mechanics take a while after each update to start showing up. We're in the sweet spot for them to shine following Orisinium.

zornyan · November 2015

josh.lackey_ESO wrote: »

I am going to suggest that knowing the latest and greatest exploits probably helps, too. Okay, that might be too strong of a word, but there are definitely mechanics in the game that were not tested together and may be unintentionally much better than intended.

It's not that hard to theorycraft how hard people can hit you, how high they can stack shields, how often they can dodge roll, etc. Even assuming max champion points and the best legendary gear on, I occasionally see people doing things that seem implausible. I check my combat log and see numbers that I can get to add up.

So I assume it's a broken mechanic somewhere. Builds using broken mechanics take a while after each update to start showing up. We're in the sweet spot for them to shine following Orisinium.

Lol at this. Broken mechanics on a templar? Most of our skills are actually broken and bugged ffs, but we still do it, theory craft all you want, but when your in the middle of fighting 4 or 5 enemy players by yourself you've only got skill (and a bit of luck) sometimes that's going to pull you through.

Soulac · November 2015

That's how I do it..

I try to turn every encounter with multiple enemies into small duels.
Why? Cause I´m a nightblade and I got the abilities to do so.

As already said it´s nearly impossible to do stuff like that as soon as a single good player joins the party.

olsborg · November 2015

Shieldstacking.

It should be removed from the game imo, 1 shield active = major shield buff.

olsborg · November 2015

Soulac wrote: »

That's how I do it..

I try to turn every encounter with multiple enemies into small duels.
Why? Cause I´m a nightblade and I got the abilities to do so.

As already said it´s nearly impossible to do stuff like that as soon as a single good player joins the party.

They dont rly have to be that good, just have a build and gear that deals alot of dmg.

Soulac · November 2015

olsborg wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

That's how I do it..

I try to turn every encounter with multiple enemies into small duels.
Why? Cause I´m a nightblade and I got the abilities to do so.

As already said it´s nearly impossible to do stuff like that as soon as a single good player joins the party.

They dont rly have to be that good, just have a build and gear that deals alot of dmg.

With that logic I shouldn´t expect to win an encounter against three bad high damage gankers?

mrdankles · November 2015

Defense. Block when a frag is coming. But you have to be careful of stamina if youre a magic build. I can 1vX on my stamina NB. MOST of the time I win others, not so much. Depends on how well you and the other person know the classes. Plus vigor on a bar will help you out a lot or a purge, that curse is a killer.

Uberkull · November 2015

raasdal wrote: »

Chims wrote: »

I don't understand how a single player can kill me in 2-3 seconds getting off crystal frags 2 light attacks and a crushing shock all while being able to take dps from 4-5 people and never die.

How is it they are able to take so little damage while dealing so much? I understand they have hardened ward but how are they taking so little damage to the ward without casting it all the time?

Its not just sorcs its most people. what do they have to negate so much damage and how are they weaving so fast?

The correct answer to this question is;

He cannot - and nobody can.

Anyone - no matter if it be Sypher, Fengrush, LeftyLucy or any other famous 1vX'er, who goes up solo against an organized 5 man group, of good skill and coordination, will die almost immediately. If you see any of them in action, the thing to notice is the usage of LoS. THAT is how these people 1vX. When Sypher kills 7 people, he does it by making sure that there are never more than a couple of them that can hit him, and then he singles them out one by one, effectively making it a back-to-back series of 1v1's or maybe 1v2's.

If you where in a 5 man group, and got wiped by one person, then you did in fact NOT have 4-5 people DPS'ing that guy. You might think that you had, but you did not. Maybe it was a DK and everyone was spamming reflectable skills? Maybe half of your team was not doing anything but light attacks? Maybe he was cutting LoS so only 1 or 2 people were able to hit him at any given moment.

I have personally been able to do 1v2 and 1v3. When i do this, it is 100% because the people i am up against have no idea what they are doing. Mostly this happens in IC, going up agains PvE people. The healer will just stand there, and do nothing but heal, and hope his two DPS friends will get me. But they are using skills which i will negate by using my skills correctly.

It seems you are specifically asking about Sorcs. Sorcs with high CP can be REALLY difficult to take out, due to shielding. But they are not "magical" in the sense that they cannot deal damage, while healing or applying shields etc. So for your specific example, i will claim that the 4-5 guys doing "DPS" on that sorc, in fact where not doing anything. That would be my guess?

Nailed it. Spot on.

Watch the 1vX videos or Twitch streams closely. Notice the skills that are being cast in the fight. Watch how many of the 'X' players are backing away or holding up block for 5 minutes.

What Fengrush, Sypher, and the rest of the Twitch PvPers bring to the table is skill in understanding every classes abilities and how to counter it. If you want to be good at solo pvp, understand all the classes spells and abilities. Then you can counter the attack if you see it coming.

If 4 organized pvpers jump you, you will not survive.

Cogo · November 2015

Depends how the situation looks...

A closed area with 1 vs 10 = top notch pvpers. Some mentioned above here. How these guys do that.....I have no clue

However,

..Cyrodiil is big for a reason. There are a lot of ways for a player to wipe out a full raid.
The skill has very little to do with class, build, Level, gear, etc. Much more about, the situation and "reading" the map instantly, almost like they know what to do and what will happen in the next few seconds.
Players personal skills in Adapting, improvise and react instantly, is mostly how you defeat larger numbers.

1 vs 15 you almost never get close to your enemy, until only you are left standing, with all kinds of tells of cheating or lovely words you can get.

My best skill isn't my own, but other players weaknesses.

Septimus_Magna · November 2015

Waffennacht wrote: »

The dancing i think is in reference to walking through WB (as example)

Also @k2blader very recently it was shown to me tha g with the right build a sorc can actually achieve a 96k (pretty sure not in Cyrodiil but freakin still) shield (not just one but you know what I mean)

At 48k shield strength I seriously doubt you'll see much damage, and at that magicka level you gonna be droppin mad bombs

These stats a highly gimped, not a single sorc in pvp even comes close to 48k shields.

To achieve shields with these values you need to do the following:
-everything into max magicka, this means 11k health/stamina and low regen
-Green v15 magicka buff food
-100 CPs into the Bastion and 167 CPs in the Mage constellation.
-5x Necropotence, 4x Ele.Succession, 3-2x Willpower (S&B/resto)
-skill buffs: Inner Light, Bound Aegis, Pet
-S&B bar: Hardened, Dampen Magic and Barrier
-Resto staff bar: Healing ward + Spell Symmetry

First cast Pet, Dampen Magic, Hardened Ward, Barrier from S&B bar.
Then switch to your resto staff bar and spam Spell Symmetry till your health gets really low and cast Healing Ward.

Now you have a very big shield which doesnt mean anything.

ToRelax · November 2015

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

The dancing i think is in reference to walking through WB (as example)

Also @k2blader very recently it was shown to me tha g with the right build a sorc can actually achieve a 96k (pretty sure not in Cyrodiil but freakin still) shield (not just one but you know what I mean)

At 48k shield strength I seriously doubt you'll see much damage, and at that magicka level you gonna be droppin mad bombs

These stats a highly gimped, not a single sorc in pvp even comes close to 48k shields.

To achieve shields with these values you need to do the following:
-everything into max magicka, this means 11k health/stamina and low regen
-Green v15 magicka buff food
-100 CPs into the Bastion and 167 CPs in the Mage constellation.
-5x Necropotence, 4x Ele.Succession, 3-2x Willpower (S&B/resto)
-skill buffs: Inner Light, Bound Aegis, Pet
-S&B bar: Hardened, Dampen Magic and Barrier
-Resto staff bar: Healing ward + Spell Symmetry

First cast Pet, Dampen Magic, Hardened Ward, Barrier from S&B bar.
Then switch to your resto staff bar and spam Spell Symmetry till your health gets really low and cast Healing Ward.

Now you have a very big shield which doesnt mean anything.

Bone Shield, Whitestrake, enchants, potion/blocking cp passives, Petrify, Obsidian Shield, Brands of the Imperium, also Healing Ward from an ally and use 2hand instead for Brawler.

ps: warhorn ofc