How do you feel about the VR replacement ZOS is working on?

Elijah_Crow · November 2015

Good Idea

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

So we are simply replacing Vet Ranks with CP progression and locking gear behind CPs? There is essentially no change then.

A turd by any other name, would still stink like sh*t.

Except for:

1. My friend who has only gotten to level 41 and I can play together much quicker than waiting the next two years for him to hit VR16. Much less difference between a level 50 0cp player and a level 50 300 cp player.

2. My friends who want to come PvP without going through the VR grind now can.

3. I can now try a different class and play to 50 and have all my CP on my new alt.

4. Finishing the storyline and beating Molag Bal actually means something now and when the rest of the world is open for however I want to earn CP, I'm going to enjoy it.

That's not how it works at all

Cadwell content is still there
-Beating the main story means nothing if your skills aren't leveled to 50
-CP only applies a passive but at 50, you're gear progression is still 49 but now you have to have CP first on your account and then still gather mats or buy gear to be viable while higher CP folks will still have higher gear because of the CP requirements

The change isn't better it's only moving VR to CP which isn't removing VR at all it's moving a per character gear restriction to an account leveling gear restriction

You still have to do all the stuff as we do today....you can't jump to a Gold zone and get vr10-14 mats
You could basically just dungeon grind....which moves one grind to another

The CP system was created to replace VR Ranks. And everything in my post was true. Not sure what you have misunderstood. And as far as farming materials after hitting 50- I will just go to any of the new zones with nodes that scale. No reason to to do Cadwells Gold or Silver, if I don't want.

kupacmac · November 2015

Good Idea

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

That's not how it works at all

Cadwell content is still there
-Beating the main story means nothing if your skills aren't leveled to 50
-CP only applies a passive but at 50, you're gear progression is still 49 but now you have to have CP first on your account and then still gather mats or buy gear to be viable while higher CP folks will still have higher gear because of the CP requirements

The change isn't better it's only moving VR to CP which isn't removing VR at all it's moving a per character gear restriction to an account leveling gear restriction

You still have to do all the stuff as we do today....you can't jump to a Gold zone and get vr10-14 mats
You could basically just dungeon grind....which moves one grind to another

For people who have no existing VR characters, then yes it's just exchanging one system for another. For those of us who do have VR characters though this is a massive boon. No longer do we have to slog through cadwell's silver/gold to get high enough CP to use the best gear on current/future alts. We've done it once, that's enough. Never... have... to... do... it... again! How is that not a better system?

I_killed_Vivec · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

So we are simply replacing Vet Ranks with CP progression and locking gear behind CPs? There is essentially no change then.

A turd by any other name, would still stink like sh*t.

Except for:

1. My friend who has only gotten to level 41 and I can play together much quicker than waiting the next two years for him to hit VR16. Much less difference between a level 50 0cp player and a level 50 300 cp player.

2. My friends who want to come PvP without going through the VR grind now can.

3. I can now try a different class and play to 50 and have all my CP on my new alt.

4. Finishing the storyline and beating Molag Bal actually means something now and when the rest of the world is open for however I want to earn CP, I'm going to enjoy it.

That's not how it works at all

Cadwell content is still there
-Beating the main story means nothing if your skills aren't leveled to 50
-CP only applies a passive but at 50, you're gear progression is still 49 but now you have to have CP first on your account and then still gather mats or buy gear to be viable while higher CP folks will still have higher gear because of the CP requirements

The change isn't better it's only moving VR to CP which isn't removing VR at all it's moving a per character gear restriction to an account leveling gear restriction

You still have to do all the stuff as we do today....you can't jump to a Gold zone and get vr10-14 mats
You could basically just dungeon grind....which moves one grind to another

The CP system was created to replace VR Ranks. And everything in my post was true. Not sure what you have misunderstood. And as far as farming materials after hitting 50- I will just go to any of the new zones with nodes that scale. No reason to to do Cadwells Gold or Silver, if I don't want.

"My friend who has only gotten to level 41 and I can play together much quicker than waiting the next two years for him to hit VR16. Much less difference between a level 50 0cp player and a level 50 300 cp player"

That wasn't true. It shouldn't take anyone two years to get from level 41 to VR16, but even if it does in that time they will only reach CP160.

Also, there is LESS difference between VR1 and VR16 than there is between CP0 and CP300.

Your friend at level 41 is just swapping a VR grind for a lengthier CP grind.

Don't forget, the current CP cap equates to VR50!

kupacmac · November 2015

Good Idea

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

Don't forget, the current CP cap equates to VR50!

Yes but there is not VR50 gear, so it's not like people who are currently VR16 will suddenly have to go out and start grinding CP levels.

CapnPhoton · November 2015

I don't really have a feeling one way or the other. Just have to wait and see what the alternative is once they change it. Before that happens, do we really know?

Turelus · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

@Elijah_Crow the information in your post was true, but misses the point that this system doesn't change anything at all only renames it.

Assuming 10 CP = 1VR, whilst right now these are easier to gain and scale upward in a way lower levels are easier to earn we still face exactly the same problem.

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

1. My friend who has only gotten to level 41 and I can play together much quicker than waiting the next two years for him to hit VR16. Much less difference between a level 50 0cp player and a level 50 300 cp player.

Not if gear is scaled off CP levels. A CP 0 player will have say a VR1 weapon, and CP 160 player will have a VR16 weapon. There is a very big difference in power there. Which they will be balancing content around.

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

2. My friends who want to come PvP without going through the VR grind now can.

Only to face exactly the same problems they do right now because a CP160 player will still be stronger due to attributes & gear locked behind CP levels.

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

3. I can now try a different class and play to 50 and have all my CP on my new alt.

This is true and good for everyone, I can't debate it.

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

4. Finishing the storyline and beating Molag Bal actually means something now and when the rest of the world is open for however I want to earn CP, I'm going to enjoy it.

This depends how they handle it. If gear progression is CP based it means dungeons/trials/arenas/zones will now be designed around players of a set CP level. Sure they could do what they have done with Orsinium and have all the zones scale, however you're still going to be focusing on the end goal of being at the current CP level cap to attain the best gear and play the latest content at the level of everyone else.

Hiero_Glyph · November 2015

Good Idea

A lot of posters are neglecting the fact that with each CP cap increase the formula for earning CP will also change. So players with low amounts of CP will always earn CP quickly at first especially as the cap continues to increase. Also, these same players are assuming that the CP requirement for gear will be high or that there will be excessive power creep on these new sets, which has no information to suppport it at this time. Keep in mind that CP are an account-based stat so even if you have a new acccount, once you reach the required CP amount then all of your characcters will also have that amount of CP. It is far simpler than having to level every alt up to the max level.

Scyantific · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

It is worse than VR because it is literally the same *** thing, except with bigger numbers and a punishment system for people who are above the current cap for each phase. The champion system has been nothing but problems since its implementation because:

1. Its implementation was botched because the team didn't bother to think "gee someone will probably grind their ass off and get a ridiculous amount of CP to wreck everyone else," and put an initial cap.
2. It was never a solid system to replace the statistical soft-caps. In fact it did the OPPOSITE of soft-caps.

Basically it was a failed system from the start

Like I posted in the thread where Rich posted his "proposal," just remove the CP system entirely, bring back softcaps, and raise the veteran rank level as needed for future x-pacs (while keeping material and grinding requirements at REASONABLE AMOUNTS, THIS IS IMPORTANT), remove AoE caps, and they will have basically solved a majority of the problems they've had since 1.6 went live.

CtrlAltDlt · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

Facepalm

HebrewHatchet · November 2015

Good Idea

This is great news, instead of having to level all of my alts, I can level them together through CP. Once they hit 50 of course. I like this plan

Stikato · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

(If the top-level gear in a patch is the same level as the CP cap for that patch)

This is WORSE than VR.

Instead of having a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

We will have a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

..And will be unreachable by the majority of the playerbase.

Alphashado · November 2015

Good Idea

Stikato wrote: »

(If the top-level gear in a patch is the same level as the CP cap for that patch)

This is WORSE than VR.

Instead of having a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

We will have a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

..And will be unreachable by the majority of the playerbase.

They haven't said anything that even remotely indicates that endgame gear will require the CP cap, current or future. In fact, if the conversion were to take place right now, you would only need 160 CP to equip the best gear.

Speculation about outlandish CP requirements for endgame gear is getting people upset, but there is zero indication ZOS is planning on requiring anything other than X10 CP of the Vet Rank that would otherwise be required.

kupacmac · November 2015

Good Idea

Stikato wrote: »

(If the top-level gear in a patch is the same level as the CP cap for that patch)

This is WORSE than VR.

Instead of having a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

We will have a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

..And will be unreachable by the majority of the playerbase.

lolwut? This will make getting top end gear easier, especially for people who play multiple characters. I have 175 CP and 4 VR characters, none of which are VR16. If they changed the system today to what's proposed, I'd instantly have 4 character that can wear max level gear.

Stikato · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

kupacmac wrote: »

Stikato wrote: »

(If the top-level gear in a patch is the same level as the CP cap for that patch)

This is WORSE than VR.

Instead of having a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

We will have a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

..And will be unreachable by the majority of the playerbase.

lolwut? This will make getting top end gear easier, especially for people who play multiple characters. I have 175 CP and 4 VR characters, none of which are VR16. If they changed the system today to what's proposed, I'd instantly have 4 character that can wear max level gear.

Yeah, and a month later, when they raise the "level" cap 10 CPs, enjoy remaking all your gear for your 4 characters

Stravokov · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

MisterBigglesworth wrote: »

So VR18 actually is coming to game (and VR20... VR22... VR24...) it's just that they won't call it Veteran Rank...

No, instead they'll call it "Champion Rank 550"... "Champion Rank 600"... etc...

So a few DLCs down the line, when they raise the Champion Cap again, you'll see gear like this:

...and you better hope you're Champ Rank 502 by then!

Good luck trying to balance anything when the people with more Champion Points than you (ya'know, the people who are already stronger than you by virtue of having more CP passives) can also equip better gear than you!

This is lousy game design and is absolutely exclusionary to new players and players with limited play time

this speaks truth. Zo$ never thinks things through on their decision making. this will equate to more segregation between balance in PVP. might as well not PVP unless your one of the people grinding out CP ranks all day long. what a stupid move, god i hope they throw that idea out the window. It WILL kill PvP, its not a matter of if with that system, but when.

Turelus · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

A lot of posters are neglecting the fact that with each CP cap increase the formula for earning CP will also change. So players with low amounts of CP will always earn CP quickly at first especially as the cap continues to increase. Also, these same players are assuming that the CP requirement for gear will be high or that there will be excessive power creep on these new sets, which has no information to suppport it at this time. Keep in mind that CP are an account-based stat so even if you have a new acccount, once you reach the required CP amount then all of your characcters will also have that amount of CP. It is far simpler than having to level every alt up to the max level.

But for all of that, why do we need the gear based of CP? Why not have flat rates for level 50 gear and let progression come from the CP levels.

Then we can finally have all sets equal and start seeing balance passes on them tweaking them here and there to change the meta but without the "this one has bigger numbers because you number is bigger thus you should wear it".

Elijah_Crow · November 2015

Good Idea

I personally don't want to play a game without gear progression. If I did, I would be playing GW2.

It's nice to get a gear upgrade or two at least every few months.

Geemarc · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

I don't like the fact that it removes all progression and achievement from playing the game (for me). I enjoy making new characters, progressing them through the game and levels and gearing them and the sense of achievement when I'm finished. With this new proposed method that is completely removed. If you have the 160 champion points it's just an 8 hour level to max, making all the rest of the content optional and pointless, other than to collect sky shards. Optional content just means that the majority of people won't do it after their initial completion or if it becomes out dated.

That's the difference between me and other players I guess, I enjoy the journey to max level and the satisfaction from doing it. I don't want everything given to me for doing very little. This game has held my attention a lot longer than most MMOs (with the exception of UO, DAoC and WoW pre-WotLK) for those reasons. It was not just about being max level and gearing like so many other MMOs.

When you hit max level what is there really to do? Grind out dungeons for your monster helm sets and pledges, PvP (which is horrendously laggy on the PS4 atm) and trials (that most people find obsolete).

A lot of people that wanted the removal of veteran levels just want an easier/quicker leveling experience (which is fair enough, it's just not me). I've also read posts about people wanting to turn all BoP gear into BoE gear, further removing the need to actually play the game.

My ideal solution would have been to keep veteran levels or rename them 50-65. Opening up the game world by removing the restrictions of Cadwell Silver and gold and battle leveling players in each zone (just like Orsinium). Allowing players to progress through the game after the main story in any order. Further increase the amount of experience gained from questing, dungeons, delves, dolmens etc to bring the experience gained on par with grinding (making it just as rewarding for playing the game as grinding mobs). If the time to level is still to high for the majority of players then modify the experience requirement as necessary. If they wanted to go a step further remove Cadwell Silver and Gold completely and add alliance based quests in the enemy zones instead of playing the regions through from the enemies point of view.

This is my opinion and I realise that other people have different wants from this game. I was just hoping a compromising solution would be found that didn't completely gut the leveling progression.

Stikato · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

Alphashado wrote: »

Stikato wrote: »

(If the top-level gear in a patch is the same level as the CP cap for that patch)

This is WORSE than VR.

Instead of having a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

We will have a cap that will be going up in small increments every few months..

..And will be unreachable by the majority of the playerbase.

They haven't said anything that even remotely indicates that endgame gear will require the CP cap, current or future. In fact, if the conversion were to take place right now, you would only need 160 CP to equip the best gear.

Speculation about outlandish CP requirements for endgame gear is getting people upset, but there is zero indication ZOS is planning on requiring anything other than X10 CP of the Vet Rank that would otherwise be required.

You may be right, but this is still a fail system.

People wanted VR removed for four main reasons:

1. Because Cadwells silver, gold, platinium, diamond, bronze, whatever was stupid
2. To stop minuscule cap increases that required constant regearing. Aka the v10->v12->v14 debacle (with a complete gear rebalancing thrown in there, that was effectively a 4th instance of having to remake gear) in the first 6 months of the game.
3. To reduce grinding to max level (and this seems to be the only thing this plan implements)
4. To equalize all gear at level 50 or above to level 50.

** Thus creating a game with literally infinite gear combinations that does not require constant regearing. But new xpacs can come out and provide *different* gear that may or may not be more desirable. Instead of being practically forced to artificially grind Willpower/Agility at v16 for example **

In this system, CPs were supposed to just be an alternative way of rewarding small boosts to your character for playing. (And of course, that was supposed to be more horizontal, but they completely botched that up by adding max hp, stam, and mag to each CP spent)

And what happens when they change the gear requirement to 170CP? Just make new gear?

And a month later...180CP.. etc, etc.

I take your point that it is not 500 CP gear. But they are essentially just rebranding the original problems of the game, lessening the grind a little (especially for alts, this is true) and calling it VR removal.

Uriel_Nocturne · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

My honest opinion? That sounds worse than just keeping the Vet Ranks.

I like the Vet Ranks. It gives me something to shoot for. Makes me feel as if I'm growing more powerful, actually becoming a character of legend.

I would like the Vet Ranks to stay, personally.

NewBlacksmurf · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

So we are simply replacing Vet Ranks with CP progression and locking gear behind CPs? There is essentially no change then.

A turd by any other name, would still stink like sh*t.

Except for:

1. My friend who has only gotten to level 41 and I can play together much quicker than waiting the next two years for him to hit VR16. Much less difference between a level 50 0cp player and a level 50 300 cp player.

2. My friends who want to come PvP without going through the VR grind now can.

3. I can now try a different class and play to 50 and have all my CP on my new alt.

4. Finishing the storyline and beating Molag Bal actually means something now and when the rest of the world is open for however I want to earn CP, I'm going to enjoy it.

That's not how it works at all

Cadwell content is still there
-Beating the main story means nothing if your skills aren't leveled to 50
-CP only applies a passive but at 50, you're gear progression is still 49 but now you have to have CP first on your account and then still gather mats or buy gear to be viable while higher CP folks will still have higher gear because of the CP requirements

The change isn't better it's only moving VR to CP which isn't removing VR at all it's moving a per character gear restriction to an account leveling gear restriction

You still have to do all the stuff as we do today....you can't jump to a Gold zone and get vr10-14 mats
You could basically just dungeon grind....which moves one grind to another

The CP system was created to replace VR Ranks. And everything in my post was true. Not sure what you have misunderstood. And as far as farming materials after hitting 50- I will just go to any of the new zones with nodes that scale. No reason to to do Cadwells Gold or Silver, if I don't want.

-Originally CP was added and suggested to replace VR system (Not the VR levels)
Later ZOS on these forums specifically state that CP is not there to replace VR levels and that dialogue still exists

I'm not saying your comments are untrue but I am suggesting that how it's written seems to proclaim that the reality of what may happen based on Rich's forum comment in the Reddit AMA isn't how things will actually work.

What I mean is this:
Your friend who is 41 will hit 50 and not be able to join you any different than today. The proposed thoughts as of now are that CP will replace the VR gear restrictions. There was no mention of any VR zones changing or automatically being unlocked and gear progression remains locked behind CP instead of VR. The character skills still require that each level to 50 and CP passives wouldn't give anything different than it does today.

If you roll an alt, that alt still had to gain the plus 50 skills and stats that VR's provide as well as skill level up and gear progress so unless your main is a crafter or unless you're buying gear at 50 you're no diff than a new VR1 today

The only change is that instead of having a VR restriction is now a CP restriction.
The grind is a min of 160 CP for gear requirements but with CP catch-up in place but you still have to get to the areas to obtain the gear or mats.

Artjuh90 · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

funny thing about this mechanism is the grind will be bigger...
and for those who are calling about the catch up mechanism, in the end this will cause the grind to bigger for the long term communty.
let me explain this, before ever cp was 400k exp right. now if you are above a certain amount i think its around 350 correct me if im wrong. it takes more exp for each cp right. so the last 150 cp will go slowly. when the cap i raised again the idia should be that most people will be at the cap and the will probably alter the catch up mechanism. this means exp for cp will be higher then the 400k again. so the grind in the end will be MUTCH bigger then even 8 alts leveling up the last 2 levels...
but then again you have to think further then one update and this community and delepment team isn't that good at looking forward into the future

jkemmery · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

If they do this, then what about gear? What will be the difference between existing VR1 gear and VR16 gear? What I've found in this game is that gear matters a lot. Weapons that do more damage and armor that absorbs more, and all gear can take better enchantments and has stronger trait buffs ... so what happens to the gear? Or will the higher gear be linked to CP?

Artjuh90 · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

yes the power gap between old and new communty will be even bigger discourging new player. smart move who needs new players right

Elijah_Crow · November 2015

Good Idea

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

So we are simply replacing Vet Ranks with CP progression and locking gear behind CPs? There is essentially no change then.

A turd by any other name, would still stink like sh*t.

Except for:

1. My friend who has only gotten to level 41 and I can play together much quicker than waiting the next two years for him to hit VR16. Much less difference between a level 50 0cp player and a level 50 300 cp player.

2. My friends who want to come PvP without going through the VR grind now can.

3. I can now try a different class and play to 50 and have all my CP on my new alt.

4. Finishing the storyline and beating Molag Bal actually means something now and when the rest of the world is open for however I want to earn CP, I'm going to enjoy it.

That's not how it works at all

Cadwell content is still there
-Beating the main story means nothing if your skills aren't leveled to 50
-CP only applies a passive but at 50, you're gear progression is still 49 but now you have to have CP first on your account and then still gather mats or buy gear to be viable while higher CP folks will still have higher gear because of the CP requirements

The change isn't better it's only moving VR to CP which isn't removing VR at all it's moving a per character gear restriction to an account leveling gear restriction

You still have to do all the stuff as we do today....you can't jump to a Gold zone and get vr10-14 mats
You could basically just dungeon grind....which moves one grind to another

The CP system was created to replace VR Ranks. And everything in my post was true. Not sure what you have misunderstood. And as far as farming materials after hitting 50- I will just go to any of the new zones with nodes that scale. No reason to to do Cadwells Gold or Silver, if I don't want.

-Originally CP was added and suggested to replace VR system (Not the VR levels)
Later ZOS on these forums specifically state that CP is not there to replace VR levels and that dialogue still exists

I'm not saying your comments are untrue but I am suggesting that how it's written seems to proclaim that the reality of what may happen based on Rich's forum comment in the Reddit AMA isn't how things will actually work.

What I mean is this:
Your friend who is 41 will hit 50 and not be able to join you any different than today. The proposed thoughts as of now are that CP will replace the VR gear restrictions. There was no mention of any VR zones changing or automatically being unlocked and gear progression remains locked behind CP instead of VR. The character skills still require that each level to 50 and CP passives wouldn't give anything different than it does today.

The only change is that instead of having a VR restriction is now a CP restriction.
The grind is a min of 160 CP for gear requirements but with CP catch-up in place but you still have to get to the areas to obtain the gear or mats.

Sorry. You seem not to know the history. Educate yourself then come back. Start at 37 min and 37 seconds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Jk7LrLgRfg

NewBlacksmurf · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

So we are simply replacing Vet Ranks with CP progression and locking gear behind CPs? There is essentially no change then.

A turd by any other name, would still stink like sh*t.

Except for:

1. My friend who has only gotten to level 41 and I can play together much quicker than waiting the next two years for him to hit VR16. Much less difference between a level 50 0cp player and a level 50 300 cp player.

2. My friends who want to come PvP without going through the VR grind now can.

3. I can now try a different class and play to 50 and have all my CP on my new alt.

4. Finishing the storyline and beating Molag Bal actually means something now and when the rest of the world is open for however I want to earn CP, I'm going to enjoy it.

That's not how it works at all

Cadwell content is still there
-Beating the main story means nothing if your skills aren't leveled to 50
-CP only applies a passive but at 50, you're gear progression is still 49 but now you have to have CP first on your account and then still gather mats or buy gear to be viable while higher CP folks will still have higher gear because of the CP requirements

The change isn't better it's only moving VR to CP which isn't removing VR at all it's moving a per character gear restriction to an account leveling gear restriction

You still have to do all the stuff as we do today....you can't jump to a Gold zone and get vr10-14 mats
You could basically just dungeon grind....which moves one grind to another

The CP system was created to replace VR Ranks. And everything in my post was true. Not sure what you have misunderstood. And as far as farming materials after hitting 50- I will just go to any of the new zones with nodes that scale. No reason to to do Cadwells Gold or Silver, if I don't want.

-Originally CP was added and suggested to replace VR system (Not the VR levels)
Later ZOS on these forums specifically state that CP is not there to replace VR levels and that dialogue still exists

I'm not saying your comments are untrue but I am suggesting that how it's written seems to proclaim that the reality of what may happen based on Rich's forum comment in the Reddit AMA isn't how things will actually work.

What I mean is this:
Your friend who is 41 will hit 50 and not be able to join you any different than today. The proposed thoughts as of now are that CP will replace the VR gear restrictions. There was no mention of any VR zones changing or automatically being unlocked and gear progression remains locked behind CP instead of VR. The character skills still require that each level to 50 and CP passives wouldn't give anything different than it does today.

The only change is that instead of having a VR restriction is now a CP restriction.
The grind is a min of 160 CP for gear requirements but with CP catch-up in place but you still have to get to the areas to obtain the gear or mats.

Sorry. You seem not to know the history. Educate yourself then come back. Start at 37 min and 37 seconds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Jk7LrLgRfg

I'm aware of the history as well as the 2015 information from the last Quakecon and dev comments here on this forum

Take some time to check the new info out as another forum
Member shared it with us last month and weeks prior in multiple threads

Teiji wrote: »

Timestamp 52:50

https://youtu.be/5Rtw2wfJaLU?t=52m50s

Matt Firor said they're being removed after Orsinium. He said this @ Quakecon 2015. As has been stated many, many times already and several times in this thread.

Edit**********
So all of this plus the latest means.....

2 years to slide one system into another terminology but what ppl are missing is the gripes of VR remain

The whole point of removing VR is to remove VR so that what you comment does actually work this way but unfortunately it won't. You'll be able to do things CP related but you won't be jumping from 50 to endgame without the VR zone things that exist today

Catblade · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

Gonna be the biggest, longest most brutal grind in any mmo ever.Also the game is severely content light. there may be a thousand quests but they are all the same. Go fetch this go kill that. No choices matter and nothing deviates from the same, boring set path. The grind to 500 champion points is so much more than to grind 4-5 VR16 characters. I told you people what would happen, that this would become an even bigger, playerbase separating grind. I have 4 VR16 characters and only 265 champion points. how does this system improve the grind in any way? It makes it way longer. Even getting 160 CP for all my vr16 what's the point? I wont be able to spend them and then my progression gets slowed so might as well go play golf. I thought people wanted this to improve the gap between players, not take it from 16 to 501. And where do my 16 attribute points go? So now we get severely weaker with less resources as a side effect of this. No thanks

Scyantific · November 2015

This sounds worse than VR

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

I personally don't want to play a game without gear progression. If I did, I would be playing GW2.

It's nice to get a gear upgrade or two at least every few months.

That's what veteran rank 16 was for. At this point I will gladly take Veteran Rank system 2.0 over Botched Champion Point System 1.5

JD2013 · November 2015

Good Idea

Well, this is what people wanted, no? No Veteran Ranks?

There was going to be some system for levelling and itemization. To think otherwise was foolish. You weren't going to get to lvl 50 and then have everything. Nothing else to shoot for. Nothing to get new gear for.

This way, levelling alts will be a lot less pain.

Alphashado · November 2015

Good Idea

JD2013 wrote: »

Well, this is what people wanted, no? No Veteran Ranks?

There was going to be some system for levelling and itemization. To think otherwise was foolish. You weren't going to get to lvl 50 and then have everything. Nothing else to shoot for. Nothing to get new gear for.

This way, levelling alts will be a lot less pain.

Exactly. Level increases are part of an MMO. Seems to me that most people that dislike this change are people that didn't like Vet Rank increases either and wanted their characters to hit max level and stay there forever. I suspect it has a lot to do with ES fans who consider ESO just another ES game. ESO is a very typical MMO with standard incremental level/gear increases. It's no different than WoW, RIft, SWTOR, LOTRO, or any other AAA MMO on the market.

This conversion is way closer to what you see in your average MMO than the VR system is. The only difference is that now you will need 160 CP to equip level capped gear instead of Vet Rank16, yet you will have the freedom to earn CP by going anywhere and doing anything in the game rather than being locked behind Gold/Silver zones and group content like Craglorn in order to progress.