...meaning that while in sneak, u can NOT reg stamina.

Another great idea....magicka can NOT be regenerate while sprinting either.

I rolled a NB sap tank after the IC update tanked a few things like vet wgt and vet icp. some fights are a lot trickier as If I cant drop block and use siphoning to regen stam I'm screwed have been using things like refreshing path and shades to proc siphoning while I block to some effect. however they just reduced my primary dots ticks by half coupled with the new 33% cost increase to blocking this is going to be interesting to say the least.
One point I would raise though is this not only impacts tanks it screws with healers as well a good healer looks after the tank. guess what if because of these changes your tank is running low on stamina there is only one type of healer any use to you thats right templars because of spears. No other class has an ability that can help out others with stamina.
you could try masters resto staff but
1. its not scaled to v16
2. its not available until endgame
3. its rng dependent if you get 1 at all
4. it requires spamming a grand healing ability as the stamina returned is low
So yeah for stuff like manticore or other stamina demanding fights your gonna want a templar main healer unless your group can nuke before the tank is oos.
so on behalf of all tanks and all non templar healers ty ZOS gg

Disagree entirely. Permablocking was boring and required no skills. In fact, the lack of a challenge meant I had no interest tanking until they made the change. Thanks ZoS, this is a good one.

Damn I read the title and was expecting a one liner to follow:

"I used to be a tank like you... but then I got high!"

Trihugger wrote: »

Damn I read the title and was expecting a one liner to follow:

"I used to be a tank like you... but then I got high!"

LA DA DAT DAT DA DA!

CavalierPrime wrote: »

I am not a tank but I am a DK Magicka DPS. I've been thinking of respec to a tank (grass is always greener I guess). I am under the impression that 5 Footman 5 Hist Bark 2 Engine/Spawn allows for infinite blocking. The DK ability to restore stam from potions and ultimates and Engine, with cp points, glyphs, and passives into reduced block cost, you can have zero Stam regen and still have sufficient stam to perma-block. Am I incorrect?

That's the setup i use and it doesn't let me perma block.... maybe on a single boss with no adds? and even then you can't perma block anyway because you need to move from any aoe junk.

CavalierPrime wrote: »

Jake I was under the impression with that setup, each mitigated attack only takes away a tiny smidgen of stam. So unless you had 30 enemies hitting you with 1 spell each per second, you can get by. Lets say the boss on Banished Cells with the blue/red bubbles, just him and 1-3 daedroth, you could resupply your bars with stam with potions/ultimate/engine faster than the bar could drop. I have no firsthand experience but I was really hoping it was true.

Sorry i meant i have the bloodspawn set... so i just get the extra bit a regen... i'm sure engine set helps a little more but i can never get helms to drop I also meant that it could work in certain boss fights.... just doesn't seem to work for me on most.
I'm too busy buffing, taunting, healing self, and helping with dps... In perfect world with the best healers and best dps you could probably just taunt and hold your shield up all the time?

and yes with that setup it does take away less stamina... but its never just a tiny bit. with all jewelry with block cost reduction and a ton of cp it might help.... but i can't see anyone perma blocking anymore.... just seems like they want to keep tanks away from it.

nordsavage wrote: »

At the very least this should have been kept out of PvE and made part of the PvP Battle Spirit. But I never had any problem with a player who blocked until the timing to attack was right. Here is a good read on that subject http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:The_Mirror. Please don't quote the whole post if you are going to reply and thank you for reading my treatise if you did.

Hell no! They should remove that ridiculous feature from the block everywhere, not just from PVE.
That's the same as racism. Like PVPers are some lower class of players and deserve nothing.
That's selfish.
It was a bad idea in general, because now there are many other things that people can exploit. So what then, let's cut all of the abilities down so it would be almost impossible to use them?
Oh God how I'd like to get inside the head of those people who make these terrible combat changes in the game and see what's going on there.

hrothbern wrote: »

lathbury wrote: »

I rolled a NB sap tank after the IC update tanked a few things like vet wgt and vet icp. some fights are a lot trickier as If I cant drop block and use siphoning to regen stam I'm screwed have been using things like refreshing path and shades to proc siphoning while I block to some effect. however they just reduced my primary dots ticks by half coupled with the new 33% cost increase to blocking this is going to be interesting to say the least.
One point I would raise though is this not only impacts tanks it screws with healers as well a good healer looks after the tank. guess what if because of these changes your tank is running low on stamina there is only one type of healer any use to you thats right templars because of spears. No other class has an ability that can help out others with stamina.
you could try masters resto staff but
1. its not scaled to v16
2. its not available until endgame
3. its rng dependent if you get 1 at all
4. it requires spamming a grand healing ability as the stamina returned is low
So yeah for stuff like manticore or other stamina demanding fights your gonna want a templar main healer unless your group can nuke before the tank is oos.
so on behalf of all tanks and all non templar healers ty ZOS gg

@lathbury , you say:
"have been using things like refreshing path and shades to proc siphoning while I block to some effect. however they just reduced my primary dots ticks by half coupled with the new 33% cost increase to blocking this is going to be interesting to say the least."

as I stated in my post #276: please plzzzz stick to the facts in this discussion.
That tanking is much more difficult. Yes I agree with you !
The tank situation is NOT really encouraging for players that do want to tank and have no acces (because of private time priorities) to high end gear (like Monster sets / Engine Guardian), or high end boosters (like the 6% Undaunted / high CP)
ZOS must see that and should do something positive for casual tanks.

But back to the facts:
Refreshing Path does only proc SA on the first tick. So the change of 0.5 sec to 1.0 sec does not affect that first tick. Twisting Path however procs on all ticks. The doubling of the time between ticks did indeed nerf Twisting Path.
Do you use Refreshing Path??? because with a Healer you do not really need the self heal.
Shades does only proc SA on the first tick. So the change of 0.5 sec to 1.0 sec does not affect that first tick.
You say "the new 33% cost increase to blocking". To my knowledge the base cost of Blocking is still 2160 per hit (although it was for a short period of time with the Orsinium DLC higher, but that has been corrected by ZOS).

Agreed on all points, except I'm like 90% sure Siphoning Attacks has an internal cooldown of about 1-1.5 seconds. I think this came out about a year ago when they were trying to fix the health return on SA. So, the increased DoT time doesn't really affect Twisting Path all that much (though I still dislike the change because it makes it easier for enemies to step on/off without getting hit).

Had a dream... I was tank
I woke up... still tank

ArgoCye wrote: »

Disagree entirely. Permablocking was boring and required no skills. In fact, the lack of a challenge meant I had no interest tanking until they made the change. Thanks ZoS, this is a good one.

There may be a little, and I repeat, a little truth about it, but in PVP , considering the unreal lag most of the time, you can't even time your block properly, making it even harder for tank build to survive in such conditions.

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

CavalierPrime wrote: »

I am not a tank but I am a DK Magicka DPS. I've been thinking of respec to a tank (grass is always greener I guess). I am under the impression that 5 Footman 5 Hist Bark 2 Engine/Spawn allows for infinite blocking. The DK ability to restore stam from potions and ultimates and Engine, with cp points, glyphs, and passives into reduced block cost, you can have zero Stam regen and still have sufficient stam to perma-block. Am I incorrect?

I use 5 Footman + 5 Hist Bark + 1 Engine Guardian (just can't seem to get the shoulders). I absolutely do run out of stam often in vet dungeons. But it's usually not just blocking and taunting that does it -- there's almost always a chance to drop block and heavy attack. It's the bosses where I have to dodge or sprint a lot that really drain the reserves and they don't get enough of a chance to regen.

I hear if you have a whole slew of CP you can still come up with a permablock build.

For encounters where you have to run alot, look for ways to get speed buffs from abilities. Permablocking now doesn't require a lot of CPs really. A NB tank with Siphoning Attacks+Caltrops can permablock with ~17k stamina, and DKs can permablock by spamming Earthen Heart abilities (casting earthen heart abilities also grants Ult, and DKs get stamina when activating an Ultimate, so that helps too). Spamming Igneous Shield grants you a damage shield plus 30% healing received, which in some cases will allow you to drop block because the shield will absorb smaller hits, allowing for more stamina management. I am less familiar with Sorc and Templar ways to sustain stamina (can't sorcs trade magicka for stamina? seems like an easy way to keep stam up for blocking), but permablocking isn't a hidden or elite only thing.

Sorcs channel the heal with dark exchange, so they have to drop block to do it. I use it sometimes on my magicka-based sorc because the shield takes the initial hit often times, or I've bolted through a target which gives me time to reposition and channel the self heal simultaneously. On Templars I don't think we have a good stamina sustain at all unless there are corpses underfoot. I feel the changes in the game have been the hardest on Templar Tanks.

It's not so bad for DK tanks, just loop Igneous Shield until you run dry of magicka, then pop a magicka\stamina potion, when the effect of the potion is over you drop your standard\horn or use the corrosive armor and heavy attack if the situation is dire.

NB tanks have Siphoning Attacks so they can manage somehow..

Templars...

I agree with many here, i have tanked all vet content on the ps4 with both a stam dk and a magic nb - it is very doable however its just not as fun. I spend more time watching my bars and debuffs than enjoying the fight.

If @Wrobel wants us to be more active and keep in the no stam regen then let us get more stam after a heavy attack to make it worth it or a buff from heavy armour that reduces block cost after a heavy attack.