Why Use 'Sword & Board' As Magicka?

Molag_Crow · November 2015

Why do players still use a Sword & Shield as a Magicka user? I'd like to know the reasons to why you use it.

To Reflect single spells with defensive stance? (Or don't you slot it)
To Block certain spells/abilities? (If your combat awareness is THAT pro as well as your stamina management, in the heat of a 1vX situation, without draining your whole Stam bar)
To have the extra trait and stat like for example, 1k Magicka? (Legendary shield)
To look cool? (I love the AD Willpower Shield's design...)
To Bash/Interrupt more effectively?
To just move quickly while blocking and moving out of line of sight, etc?

Since us Magicka Templar's cannot hold block for more than 2 seconds when 1+ players are hitting us, I'm trying to find the purpose of even using it, rather than my dual wield for extra spell damage. I've been using a sword & shield for a few weeks now and I have to admit, I barely ever block, even with like 20 CP in Block Expertise.

zornyan · November 2015

My personal reasons?

I love the look of it, I've got both dw and sword and board for different situations/play styles.

But basically

38% cost reduction when defensive stance is slotted + passives

Extra armor piece

Extra 1k magicka (near enough)

Better stamina management.

Tbh my damage doesn't change a huge amount anyway, when swapping between a torugs sword/shield or dw my dark flare tooltip loses about 200 damage, because that magicka is worth about 100 spell damage anyway.

So 200 damage is negligible, but the other bonuses are brilliant imo, dw is good for pure raw dps, but my survivability goes right up with a shield.

Worth nothing with dw I use max magicka+ health, when sword and board I use tri stat, with my imperial racials I sit on 15k stam purely for blocking, which goes much much further than with dw etc.

Stoney_McGeee · November 2015

As a Dk magic

1. the extra 1k magic is nice.
2. gap closer is a Super plus. Plus lets me use my whip lash off the bat when you use invasion
3. More resistance (since I'm rocking light)
4. Its a nice animation cancel bonus with that bash dmg .
5. it looks flippen dope, gotta slay in style.

Molag_Crow · November 2015

zornyan wrote: »

My personal reasons?

I love the look of it, I've got both dw and sword and board for different situations/play styles.

But basically

38% cost reduction when defensive stance is slotted + passives

Extra armor piece

Extra 1k magicka (near enough)

Better stamina management.

Tbh my damage doesn't change a huge amount anyway, when swapping between a torugs sword/shield or dw my dark flare tooltip loses about 200 damage, because that magicka is worth about 100 spell damage anyway.

So 200 damage is negligible, but the other bonuses are brilliant imo, dw is good for pure raw dps, but my survivability goes right up with a shield.

Worth nothing with dw I use max magicka+ health, when sword and board I use tri stat, with my imperial racials I sit on 15k stam purely for blocking, which goes much much further than with dw etc.

That makes sense and yeah I just checked the differences with damage too, not really noticeable indeed so I may as well stay with it.

What I find annoying is getting used to smart blocking, after spending a month or 2 with dual wield

zornyan · November 2015

CrowsDescend wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

My personal reasons?

I love the look of it, I've got both dw and sword and board for different situations/play styles.

But basically

38% cost reduction when defensive stance is slotted + passives

Extra armor piece

Extra 1k magicka (near enough)

Better stamina management.

Tbh my damage doesn't change a huge amount anyway, when swapping between a torugs sword/shield or dw my dark flare tooltip loses about 200 damage, because that magicka is worth about 100 spell damage anyway.

So 200 damage is negligible, but the other bonuses are brilliant imo, dw is good for pure raw dps, but my survivability goes right up with a shield.

Worth nothing with dw I use max magicka+ health, when sword and board I use tri stat, with my imperial racials I sit on 15k stam purely for blocking, which goes much much further than with dw etc.

That makes sense and yeah I just checked the differences with damage too, not really noticeable indeed so I may as well stay with it.

What I find annoying is getting used to smart blocking, after spending a month or 2 with dual wield

It does take time, personally I think people get too hooked on certain numbers, a stam build running 6k weapon damage and 30k magicka isnt really any stronger than a magicka build running 3k spell damage and 45k magicka.

I've hit 3800 spell damage as a build so far, but I'm working on a magicka stacked build atm with my breton, using sword and board for the extra magicka, should be able to hit 44-45k magicka using all infused armor pieces.

With around 2800 spell damage. Be interested to see how it plays out

Molag_Crow · November 2015

zornyan wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

My personal reasons?

I love the look of it, I've got both dw and sword and board for different situations/play styles.

But basically

38% cost reduction when defensive stance is slotted + passives

Extra armor piece

Extra 1k magicka (near enough)

Better stamina management.

Tbh my damage doesn't change a huge amount anyway, when swapping between a torugs sword/shield or dw my dark flare tooltip loses about 200 damage, because that magicka is worth about 100 spell damage anyway.

So 200 damage is negligible, but the other bonuses are brilliant imo, dw is good for pure raw dps, but my survivability goes right up with a shield.

Worth nothing with dw I use max magicka+ health, when sword and board I use tri stat, with my imperial racials I sit on 15k stam purely for blocking, which goes much much further than with dw etc.

That makes sense and yeah I just checked the differences with damage too, not really noticeable indeed so I may as well stay with it.

What I find annoying is getting used to smart blocking, after spending a month or 2 with dual wield

It does take time, personally I think people get too hooked on certain numbers, a stam build running 6k weapon damage and 30k magicka isnt really any stronger than a magicka build running 3k spell damage and 45k magicka.

I've hit 3800 spell damage as a build so far, but I'm working on a magicka stacked build atm with my breton, using sword and board for the extra magicka, should be able to hit 44-45k magicka using all infused armor pieces.

With around 2800 spell damage. Be interested to see how it plays out

My gear's all messed up at the moment because I'm nowhere near those stats, but I'm not gonna change it until after Orsinium and go for the Julianous and maybe the other set that can make me in to a light armored tank, almost.. I don't know yet. I really prefer sustained resource builds that let me 1vX .. like with just blue drinks, I'm on about 27k magicka, 21k health, 2k spell damage, 2k magicka recovery, 1k+ stamina recovery, now of course that's really low Magicka but it does kinda work out, although I know I'm gonna have to improve it/change stuff in Orsinium

zornyan · November 2015

CrowsDescend wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

My personal reasons?

I love the look of it, I've got both dw and sword and board for different situations/play styles.

But basically

38% cost reduction when defensive stance is slotted + passives

Extra armor piece

Extra 1k magicka (near enough)

Better stamina management.

Tbh my damage doesn't change a huge amount anyway, when swapping between a torugs sword/shield or dw my dark flare tooltip loses about 200 damage, because that magicka is worth about 100 spell damage anyway.

So 200 damage is negligible, but the other bonuses are brilliant imo, dw is good for pure raw dps, but my survivability goes right up with a shield.

Worth nothing with dw I use max magicka+ health, when sword and board I use tri stat, with my imperial racials I sit on 15k stam purely for blocking, which goes much much further than with dw etc.

That makes sense and yeah I just checked the differences with damage too, not really noticeable indeed so I may as well stay with it.

What I find annoying is getting used to smart blocking, after spending a month or 2 with dual wield

It does take time, personally I think people get too hooked on certain numbers, a stam build running 6k weapon damage and 30k magicka isnt really any stronger than a magicka build running 3k spell damage and 45k magicka.

I've hit 3800 spell damage as a build so far, but I'm working on a magicka stacked build atm with my breton, using sword and board for the extra magicka, should be able to hit 44-45k magicka using all infused armor pieces.

With around 2800 spell damage. Be interested to see how it plays out

My gear's all messed up at the moment because I'm nowhere near those stats, but I'm not gonna change it until after Orsinium and go for the Julianous and maybe the other set that can make me in to a light armored tank, almost.. I don't know yet. I really prefer sustained resource builds that let me 1vX .. like with just blue drinks, I'm on about 27k magicka, 21k health, 2k spell damage, 2k magicka recovery, 1k+ stamina recovery, now of course that's really low Magicka but it does kinda work out, although I know I'm gonna have to improve it/change stuff in Orsinium

I WAS waiting for julianos, but I'm just going kragneracs now, I actually think it's more beneficial and offers the same level of damage.

Julianos
2% crit
950 magicka
2% crit
300 spell damage

Krag
950 magicka
1000 health
130 recovery
225 spell damage

The total build is

3x torugs
1 spell damage
1 health

5x krag

1x health
1x recovery
1x spell damage
1x health

1x kena
1x spell damage

3x willpower
1x spell power + 2/3 spell damage enchants depending on sustain
1x max magicka

Using the krag and 3x torugs will be an extra 2k health, meaning you can get 3x max magicka enchants on your willpower jewellery.

Using vr14-15 divines gear I was sitting at 36.6k magicka on my templar, using magicka+health food, that's with imperial racial and mage mundus.

My new breton will have

10% more racial magicka
6% more as I didn't have undaunted passives
6% more as I didn't have Mages guild passives and my main bar has 3 Mages guild skills.

And I'll be using vr16 gold infused gear, that should get me the 45k number I'm hoping for. But still get me 2k health for an extra bonus.

Could even swap 1 kena for 1 more torugs for another 2k spell resist.

Molag_Crow · November 2015

zornyan wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

My personal reasons?

I love the look of it, I've got both dw and sword and board for different situations/play styles.

But basically

38% cost reduction when defensive stance is slotted + passives

Extra armor piece

Extra 1k magicka (near enough)

Better stamina management.

Tbh my damage doesn't change a huge amount anyway, when swapping between a torugs sword/shield or dw my dark flare tooltip loses about 200 damage, because that magicka is worth about 100 spell damage anyway.

So 200 damage is negligible, but the other bonuses are brilliant imo, dw is good for pure raw dps, but my survivability goes right up with a shield.

Worth nothing with dw I use max magicka+ health, when sword and board I use tri stat, with my imperial racials I sit on 15k stam purely for blocking, which goes much much further than with dw etc.

That makes sense and yeah I just checked the differences with damage too, not really noticeable indeed so I may as well stay with it.

What I find annoying is getting used to smart blocking, after spending a month or 2 with dual wield

It does take time, personally I think people get too hooked on certain numbers, a stam build running 6k weapon damage and 30k magicka isnt really any stronger than a magicka build running 3k spell damage and 45k magicka.

I've hit 3800 spell damage as a build so far, but I'm working on a magicka stacked build atm with my breton, using sword and board for the extra magicka, should be able to hit 44-45k magicka using all infused armor pieces.

With around 2800 spell damage. Be interested to see how it plays out

My gear's all messed up at the moment because I'm nowhere near those stats, but I'm not gonna change it until after Orsinium and go for the Julianous and maybe the other set that can make me in to a light armored tank, almost.. I don't know yet. I really prefer sustained resource builds that let me 1vX .. like with just blue drinks, I'm on about 27k magicka, 21k health, 2k spell damage, 2k magicka recovery, 1k+ stamina recovery, now of course that's really low Magicka but it does kinda work out, although I know I'm gonna have to improve it/change stuff in Orsinium

I WAS waiting for julianos, but I'm just going kragneracs now, I actually think it's more beneficial and offers the same level of damage.

Julianos
2% crit
950 magicka
2% crit
300 spell damage

Krag
950 magicka
1000 health
130 recovery
225 spell damage

The total build is

3x torugs
1 spell damage
1 health

5x krag

1x health
1x recovery
1x spell damage
1x health

1x kena
1x spell damage

3x willpower
1x spell power + 2/3 spell damage enchants depending on sustain
1x max magicka

Using the krag and 3x torugs will be an extra 2k health, meaning you can get 3x max magicka enchants on your willpower jewellery.

Using vr14-15 divines gear I was sitting at 36.6k magicka on my templar, using magicka+health food, that's with imperial racial and mage mundus.

My new breton will have

10% more racial magicka
6% more as I didn't have undaunted passives
6% more as I didn't have Mages guild passives and my main bar has 3 Mages guild skills.

And I'll be using vr16 gold infused gear, that should get me the 45k number I'm hoping for. But still get me 2k health for an extra bonus.

Could even swap 1 kena for 1 more torugs for another 2k spell resist.

Oh? well then, thanks.. I'll be sure to have a good think before deciding

Undefwun · November 2015

I had a bit of a sap tank build for a while like 7 months ago (so before the no regen while blocking change).
Prox det, sap sap sap bats, sap sap sap bats... ok when running in a group...

eliisra · November 2015

75 points in the Steed for shield expert, gives a very nice armor boost for sword and board with reinforced. Also cheaper block and extra set bonus.

If you're mele and have enough recovery/sustain to skip staffs, it's not a bad choice. But of course DW or 2-Handet gives more dmg and spell power. I use S&B on one bar when healing, because I attract attention of 569997864400000 stamina NB's as soon as I wave my hand in the air

Scyantific · November 2015

Stoney_McGeee wrote: »

As a Dk magic

1. the extra 1k magic is nice.
2. gap closer is a Super plus. Plus lets me use my whip lash off the bat when you use invasion
3. More resistance (since I'm rocking light)
4. Its a nice animation cancel bonus with that bash dmg .
5. it looks flippen dope, gotta slay in style.

Pretty much this.

Armitas · November 2015

I use it for the defense and block cost reduction to casually block. I suppose before the changes to weapon power us DKs mainly used it for the gap closer in a magicka build. Since our class closer hasn't worked for over a year and spell power wasn't effected by the weapon type.

Molag_Crow · November 2015

Indeed.. I used to use the stam charge from it too but these days I just toppling. I don't even use defensive stance though, I'm thinking that I should, instead of healing ward.

myrrrorb14_ESO · November 2015

I like the look, but is is useful.

Extra set piece / armor / resist / magicka

I do use the reflect. It's fun. See the incoming projectile, then charge right after the bounce.

Block bonus is nice, but situational. I have my defensive abilities on that bar.

contact.opiumb16_ESO · November 2015

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Indeed.. I used to use the stam charge from it too but these days I just toppling. I don't even use defensive stance though, I'm thinking that I should, instead of healing ward.

defensive stance is nice for magicka builds because you reflact the projectile, 4s stun and the damage scales off your spell dmg/max magicka. Tested it, it hits harder with my magicka build than my stam build

contact.opiumb16_ESO · November 2015

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Why do players still use a Sword & Shield as a Magicka user? I'd like to know the reasons to why you use it.
To Reflect single spells with defensive stance? (Or don't you slot it)

To Block certain spells/abilities? (If your combat awareness is THAT pro as well as your stamina management, in the heat of a 1vX situation, without draining your whole Stam bar)

To have the extra trait and stat like for example, 1k Magicka? (Legendary shield)

To look cool? (I love the AD Willpower Shield's design...)

To Bash/Interrupt more effectively?

To just move quickly while blocking and moving out of line of sight, etc?

Since us Magicka Templar's cannot hold block for more than 2 seconds when 1+ players are hitting us, I'm trying to find the purpose of even using it, rather than my dual wield for extra spell damage. I've been using a sword & shield for a few weeks now and I have to admit, I barely ever block, even with like 20 CP in Block Expertise.

I have tested a magicka based tank templar with 5HA/2LA, worked well but with 5LA it just don't work

Ezareth · November 2015

I use sword and board on my Sorc because a sorc's primary weakness is the fact the majority of his direct damage spells are reflectable....plus a ton of players love to cast meteor in the game. By using double reflect I'm able to both proc my rune prison my targets plus if a DK is using the right morph of wings my attacks will get his bonus 20% damage which often ends up with me 2 shotting my targets with overload.

I put my hardened ward on my sword and board bar because I have the extra magicka and set bonus from the shield. It's actually very powerful for a Sorc if you can learn to survive without a resto staff (or a destro if you're willing to sacrifice some damage utility).

Cryhavoc · November 2015

As a Templar, I find that the passives when using a shield outclass the need for a Resto staff. With enough CP's and decent gear your regen is enough in PvP to avoid the need to heavy attack with a resto staff. Building ultimate from range is the downfall imo.

Besides, most of the time I need to turtle up, and the BoL hand waving attracts alot of attention. Thus, block, block, reflect is a normal routine.

SneaK · November 2015

You can always try out a DW bar and a S/B bar.

As a Temp, you have the range and the heals, don't necessarily need the resto/destro.

Molag_Crow · November 2015

Hmmm interesting comments ... I don't even like healing ward tbh so I might indeed replace it with reflect since I used to always use reflect before IC patch, but that was mixed with mist form (when mist form was working) and stuff like that so thanks guys

Molag_Crow · November 2015

Cryhavoc wrote: »

As a Templar, I find that the passives when using a shield outclass the need for a Resto staff. With enough CP's and decent gear your regen is enough in PvP to avoid the need to heavy attack with a resto staff. Building ultimate from range is the downfall imo.

Besides, most of the time I need to turtle up, and the BoL hand waving attracts alot of attention. Thus, block, block, reflect is a normal routine.

Good point. I can't believe I've never even considered getting rid of the resto staff because like you said, there's not much need to heavy attack with it these days lol.

I guess sword & board and instead of a resto staff, dual wield? I think I've got 3 willpower swords that'll do the trick

zornyan · November 2015

I do find healing ward really really useful though, not the heal, but since shields aren't crittable, and bleeds etc don't effect them (nor does other templar jabs

)

That if you've being attacked by either a stamina build or a templar, a quick pop of the shield at lower health prevents most of their dps, since most stam builds run shadow mundus stone, with higher crit chances, and that shield will negate all those benefits for a few seconds for more breathing space.

Molag_Crow · November 2015

zornyan wrote: »

I do find healing ward really really useful though, not the heal, but since shields aren't crittable, and bleeds etc don't effect them (nor does other templar jabs )

That if you've being attacked by either a stamina build or a templar, a quick pop of the shield at lower health prevents most of their dps, since most stam builds run shadow mundus stone, with higher crit chances, and that shield will negate all those benefits for a few seconds for more breathing space.

True that... like it has saved me a few times I will admit

Hiero_Glyph · November 2015

zornyan wrote: »

I do find healing ward really really useful though, not the heal, but since shields aren't crittable, and bleeds etc don't effect them (nor does other templar jabs )

That if you've being attacked by either a stamina build or a templar, a quick pop of the shield at lower health prevents most of their dps, since most stam builds run shadow mundus stone, with higher crit chances, and that shield will negate all those benefits for a few seconds for more breathing space.

Yeah, damage shields are poorly designed overall. Shield stacking is just another issue but the no-crit damage on shields is pretty significant. I understand that shields have no mitigation against damage but the way they work curently definitely needs to be reworked. It is worth noting that Shield Breaker is just as poorly designed so at least ZOS is consistent.

DanTeales_Inferno · November 2015

Deleted

Cryhavoc · November 2015

Blazing shield is a good example of a relatively useless shield that can be used on a sword and board bar

SneaK · November 2015

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Hmmm interesting comments ... I don't even like healing ward tbh so I might indeed replace it with reflect since I used to always use reflect before IC patch, but that was mixed with mist form (when mist form was working) and stuff like that so thanks guys

You're DW bar could be your damage bar, and your sw/b bar could be your healing/turtle/buff bar.

I'm actually going to switch my temp to run something like this.

Molag_Crow · November 2015

SneaK wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Hmmm interesting comments ... I don't even like healing ward tbh so I might indeed replace it with reflect since I used to always use reflect before IC patch, but that was mixed with mist form (when mist form was working) and stuff like that so thanks guys

You're DW bar could be your damage bar, and your sw/b bar could be your healing/turtle/buff bar.

I'm actually going to switch my temp to run something like this.

Yeah, it's great

Hiero_Glyph · November 2015

SneaK wrote: »

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Hmmm interesting comments ... I don't even like healing ward tbh so I might indeed replace it with reflect since I used to always use reflect before IC patch, but that was mixed with mist form (when mist form was working) and stuff like that so thanks guys

You're DW bar could be your damage bar, and your sw/b bar could be your healing/turtle/buff bar.

I'm actually going to switch my temp to run something like this.

I actually theorycrafted a light armor Templar tank using 5x Armor Master (3 armor, 2 1h/s) and 5x Lich (4 armor, 1 resto) as the 5-piece buffs remain constant even after weapon swapping. So the idea is to tank/buff on your 1H/S bar and heal/buff on your Resto bar. Since I'm still hunting for Lich pieces I suggested using Kagrenac's as an alternative but you would need regen on your Willpower jewelry (at least 2) to compensate for the Lich regen loss. The only advantage to Kagrenacs is that you could DPS a bit on your Resto bar. I haven't tested the alternate build yet as v16 mats are tedious to acquire and I'm currently focussed on another build.

Currenty in PvP my Templar uses DW and 1H/S and it works well but mobility is still an issue (and Vamp is a liability). Using Bow gives some mobility and allows for ranged weaving but has very little synergy. Resto is great for sustain and getting a little more from your heals but I find my survivability to be better with a 1H/S. For now though, I'm happy with DW and 1H/S (I also get a reflect out of the deal).

SneaK · November 2015

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Currenty in PvP my Templar uses DW and 1H/S and it works well but mobility is still an issue (and Vamp is a liability). Using Bow gives some mobility and allows for ranged weaving but has very little synergy. Resto is great for sustain and getting a little more from your heals but I find my survivability to be better with a 1H/S. For now though, I'm happy with DW and 1H/S (I also get a reflect out of the deal).

Yea, I switched over to SW/B awhile ago for the block perks, and learned quickly how much I like the reflect.

ScarecrowBoat · November 2015

I do it cause me being a s/b sorc is a key part of my RP guild's storyline

The Elder Scrolls Online

Why Use 'Sword & Board' As Magicka?

Best Answers

Why Use 'Sword &amp; Board' As Magicka?

Best Answers

Why Use 'Sword & Board' As Magicka?