PvP Podcast (Episode 7 Uploaded)

Ishammael · October 2015

Ezareth wrote: »

...and that there is no honor among lions and men.

This is (more or less) what I was getting at.

Joy_Division · October 2015

I still don't think the whole 20v1 thing is a big mystery. It happens every night on every server. Hop on to TS and actually listen to the glee in other people's voices as they score easy kills.

I never said those 20 are justified, correct, and acting fairly.

They aren't. Maybe they are tired of being in your 1vX videos and want to feel good about themselves finally adding you to their kill counter. If you want to deem them savages, nubs, pugs, zergers, or whatever derogatory name for how they act in a videogame, I think that is rather excessive. Then again, I don't expect other people who might have been getting Rekt all night to go easy on me.

Derra · October 2015

Joy_Division wrote: »

I still don't think the whole 20v1 thing is a big mystery. It happens every night on every server. Hop on to TS and actually listen to the glee in other people's voices as they score easy kills.

I never said those 20 are justified, correct, and acting fairly.

They aren't. Maybe they are tired of being in your 1vX videos and want to feel good about themselves finally adding you to their kill counter. If you want to deem them savages, nubs, pugs, zergers, or whatever derogatory name for how they act in a videogame, I think that is rather excessive. Then again, I don't expect other people who might have been getting Rekt all night to go easy on me.

Ofc it´s not a big mistery and tbh i don´t care if they just roll over me.

If however a whole grp of people is going out of their way trying to chase me down over several minutes in the middle of nowhere just to teabag me with the whole squad afterwards i don´t think highly of them. Savage is kind of fitting in my opinion (not even meant with a pure negative connotation).

Lava_Croft · October 2015

I think the group that ran you over will just feed on the rage that makes you call them names.

Derra · October 2015

What rage and what names? Savage is just a description of the shown behavior. If i had strong feelings about my opponents that would ultimately lead to making mistakes.

Only time i´ll get strong negative feelings about the game is when it lags or bugs out.

But i get what you mean. I always enjoyed when someone typed me: exploiter after my dawnbreaker of smiting smited their lizzardtail to oblivion

Lava_Croft · October 2015

Derra wrote: »

What rage and what names? Savage is just a description of the shown behavior. If i had strong feelings about my opponents that would ultimately lead to making mistakes.

Only time i´ll get strong negative feelings about the game is when it lags or bugs out.

But i get what you mean. I always enjoyed when someone typed me: exploiter after my dawnbreaker of smiting smited their lizzardtail to oblivion

It's not related to your abilities when it comes to killing Vampires with a broken Dawnbreaker of Smiting. It's more related to why even bother calling them names when it's such a silly situation as being run over by 20 people. By your logic, anyone who runs in a group is a savage, since basically every group I've ever seen in Cyrodiil has ganged up on me (some other loner) at least once.

Derra · October 2015

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

What rage and what names? Savage is just a description of the shown behavior. If i had strong feelings about my opponents that would ultimately lead to making mistakes.

Only time i´ll get strong negative feelings about the game is when it lags or bugs out.

But i get what you mean. I always enjoyed when someone typed me: exploiter after my dawnbreaker of smiting smited their lizzardtail to oblivion

It's not related to your abilities when it comes to killing Vampires with a broken Dawnbreaker of Smiting. It's more related to why even bother calling them names when it's such a silly situation as being run over by 20 people. By your logic, anyone who runs in a group is a savage, since basically every group I've ever seen in Cyrodiil has ganged up on me (some other loner) at least once.

I did specify pretty precicely the situation(s - as it happend on several occasions) what would lead me to think of certain players as savages.
To be even more precise i explicitly stated that just being run over (which is pretty much my fault anyway) did not qualify for that.

Is what i´m writing really that hard to understand or are you a little special in terms of reading comprehension?

LegendaryChef · October 2015

Love you Kris

Joy_Division · October 2015

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

I still don't think the whole 20v1 thing is a big mystery. It happens every night on every server. Hop on to TS and actually listen to the glee in other people's voices as they score easy kills.

I never said those 20 are justified, correct, and acting fairly.

They aren't. Maybe they are tired of being in your 1vX videos and want to feel good about themselves finally adding you to their kill counter. If you want to deem them savages, nubs, pugs, zergers, or whatever derogatory name for how they act in a videogame, I think that is rather excessive. Then again, I don't expect other people who might have been getting Rekt all night to go easy on me.

Ofc it´s not a big mistery and tbh i don´t care if they just roll over me.

If however a whole grp of people is going out of their way trying to chase me down over several minutes in the middle of nowhere just to teabag me with the whole squad afterwards i don´t think highly of them. Savage is kind of fitting in my opinion (not even meant with a pure negative connotation).

Then why are we even having this discussion lol? Misunderstanding? Fair enough.

Maulkin asked why how 20v1 could be considered playback. I gave some possible scenarios. Then people tell me that's trash gameplay, like I'm unaware of that, defending them or something.

Now, what you are describing is something different. If someone does chase me with a posse of 20 to kill me and then proceeds to t-bag me, then that behavior is something qualitatively different. It goes beyond competition or just wanting to inflate their egos about having a better Kill-to-Death ratio. It does say something about their character. These are precisely the people I would zerg down 20v1 and feel good about doing it.

I'm pretty sure you, myself, Ezareth, Maulkin, etc., all generally share a similar vision of what we would like Cyrodiil to be as far as fairness and quality of play and at least try to adhere to the same unwritten rulebook as far as PvP goes. It's not easy to get in the head of others who feel differently. Just because I or Lava or someone else tries to do that, does not mean we agree with them or want PvP to like that.

Derra · October 2015

Joy_Division wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

I still don't think the whole 20v1 thing is a big mystery. It happens every night on every server. Hop on to TS and actually listen to the glee in other people's voices as they score easy kills.

I never said those 20 are justified, correct, and acting fairly.

They aren't. Maybe they are tired of being in your 1vX videos and want to feel good about themselves finally adding you to their kill counter. If you want to deem them savages, nubs, pugs, zergers, or whatever derogatory name for how they act in a videogame, I think that is rather excessive. Then again, I don't expect other people who might have been getting Rekt all night to go easy on me.

Ofc it´s not a big mistery and tbh i don´t care if they just roll over me.

If however a whole grp of people is going out of their way trying to chase me down over several minutes in the middle of nowhere just to teabag me with the whole squad afterwards i don´t think highly of them. Savage is kind of fitting in my opinion (not even meant with a pure negative connotation).

Then why are we even having this discussion lol? Misunderstanding? Fair enough.

Maulkin asked why how 20v1 could be considered playback. I gave some possible scenarios. Then people tell me that's trash gameplay, like I'm unaware of that, defending them or something.

Now, what you are describing is something different. If someone does chase me with a posse of 20 to kill me and then proceeds to t-bag me, then that behavior is something qualitatively different. It goes beyond competition or just wanting to inflate their egos about having a better Kill-to-Death ratio. It does say something about their character. These are precisely the people I would zerg down 20v1 and feel good about doing it.

I'm pretty sure you, myself, Ezareth, Maulkin, etc., all generally share a similar vision of what we would like Cyrodiil to be as far as fairness and quality of play and at least try to adhere to the same unwritten rulebook as far as PvP goes. It's not easy to get in the head of others who feel differently. Just because I or Lava or someone else tries to do that, does not mean we agree with them or want PvP to like that.

I´m mainly posting bc zos won´t let me log in.

And about understanding those people:
Beware that, when fighting monsters, you yourself do not become a monster... for when you gaze long into the abyss. The abyss gazes also into you.

Jitterbug · October 2015

remember siege?

Anazasi · October 2015

Removing AOE caps is like this

https://youtube.com/watch?v=gymCpN0Pcsk

Maulkin · October 2015

Anazasi wrote: »

Removing AOE caps is like this

https://youtube.com/watch?v=gymCpN0Pcsk

Nothing like it. But I do miss ol' Murderthumb's vids. They pulled me to PvP in May '14 with a force stronger than the Sun's gravity.

Xeven · October 2015

People tout that guys as if he was really good? First time I've ever seen him, but all I saw in that video was the cc break reaction time of a sloth, talons, gap closer, whip, wings and standard on an absurdly op class...

I don't see anything special or extraordinarily talented about this player. Seriously I don't think he even swapped weapons once in that entire video.

It's hard to watch. I can't believe this is the game we all played for so long, or that people could even be impressed by this crap.

Alcast · October 2015

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Anazasi wrote: »

Removing AOE caps is like this

https://youtube.com/watch?v=gymCpN0Pcsk

Nothing like it. But I do miss ol' Murderthumb's vids. They pulled me to PvP in May '14 with a force stronger than the Sun's gravity.

I love ppl posting stuff when DKs wer RIDICULOUS OP....now aint gonna happen anymore and all QQ.

Anazasi · October 2015

https://youtube.com/watch?v=Cfy_z4DQ3xg

I miss these old days we had a lot of fun.

Maulkin · October 2015

Xeven wrote: »

People tout that guys as if he was really good? First time I've ever seen him, but all I saw in that video was the cc break reaction time of a sloth, talons, gap closer, whip and standard on an absurdly op class...

I don't see anything special or extraordinarily talented in that video.

That footage is from barely a month into the game. If that is bad what does it make everyone else? You can only beat what's in front of you, anyway.

Murderthumps nailed the light armor - s&b meta before people had even finished levelling their chars.There's something to be said about someone who can so early into the game put together such a strong build. That build remained unchanged as the DK meta for over a year after.

I don't how good he would be now, it's not foreseeable by this vid. And yes DK was obviously OP on release. Again does not say much. He wrecked other DKs right, left and centre

Xeven · October 2015

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Nothing like it. But I do miss ol' Murderthumb's vids. They pulled me to PvP in May '14 with a force stronger than the Sun's gravity.

Lol that dude is terrible. He didnt even weapon swap once.

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

I don't how good he would be now, it's not foreseeable by this vid. And yes DK was obviously OP on release. Again does not say much. He wrecked other DKs right, left and centre

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

Anazasi · October 2015

Xeven wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Nothing like it. But I do miss ol' Murderthumb's vids. They pulled me to PvP in May '14 with a force stronger than the Sun's gravity.

Lol that dude is terrible.

lol it was fun times back then but when they added the AOE cap he left game. Yeah by today's standards and mechanics I don't know how good he would be but April and May 2014 if was a blast. I miss that guy though and I had many great times with the group.

Maulkin · October 2015

Xeven wrote: »

Lol that dude is terrible. He didnt even weapon swap once.

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

He still wrecked most of the other DKs, so what's your point?

And I think DK was mostly fine during 1.5, minus the resource sustain thanks to a combination of Bats, Battler Roar and dynamic ult gen. All the rest of the skills and passives were balanced after under-going nerfs.

But, they kept nerfing and we have DKs where they are now.

Xeven · October 2015

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Lol that dude is terrible. He didnt even weapon swap once.

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

He still wrecked most of the other DKs, so what's your point?

And I think DK was mostly fine during 1.5, minus the resource sustain thanks to a combination of Bats, Battler Roar and dynamic ult gen. All the rest of the skills and passives were balanced after under-going nerfs.

But, they kept nerfing and we have DKs where they are now.

I'm not trying to be a d***. I'm just sayin'. Player skill has definitely evolved orders of magnitude over what I just watched.

Rylana · October 2015

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

People tout that guys as if he was really good? First time I've ever seen him, but all I saw in that video was the cc break reaction time of a sloth, talons, gap closer, whip and standard on an absurdly op class...

I don't see anything special or extraordinarily talented in that video.

That footage is from barely a month into the game. If that is bad what does it make everyone else? You can only beat what's in front of you, anyway.

Murderthumps nailed the light armor - s&b meta before people had even finished levelling their chars.There's something to be said about someone who can so early into the game put together such a strong build. That build remained unchanged as the DK meta for over a year after.

I don't how good he would be now, it's not foreseeable by this vid. And yes DK was obviously OP on release. Again does not say much. He wrecked other DKs right, left and centre

Some of us were already doing it in beta, js. Its not like he invented the thing. it was pretty obvious from skill lines and passives that a good chunk of EP players at launch were going to be DK Dunmer firemages, sword and shield become obvious as a defensive route without sacrificing anything.

Then they decided last minute to offer up "any alliance any race" and suddenly you had an abundance in every faction for the longest time.

The guy was only famous because he made a video. Honest truth, but he did play the build well.

Derra · October 2015

Xeven wrote: »

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

Still no excuse for the pathetic state they´re in currently

Atleast give them a 100% vaible magica gapcloser.

Wings should have gotten the bolt escape treatment with unlimeted reflect but 50% increased cost for 4s after the effect ends.

Anazasi · October 2015

Rylana wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

People tout that guys as if he was really good? First time I've ever seen him, but all I saw in that video was the cc break reaction time of a sloth, talons, gap closer, whip and standard on an absurdly op class...

I don't see anything special or extraordinarily talented in that video.

That footage is from barely a month into the game. If that is bad what does it make everyone else? You can only beat what's in front of you, anyway.

Murderthumps nailed the light armor - s&b meta before people had even finished levelling their chars.There's something to be said about someone who can so early into the game put together such a strong build. That build remained unchanged as the DK meta for over a year after.

I don't how good he would be now, it's not foreseeable by this vid. And yes DK was obviously OP on release. Again does not say much. He wrecked other DKs right, left and centre

Some of us were already doing it in beta, js. Its not like he invented the thing. it was pretty obvious from skill lines and passives that a good chunk of EP players at launch were going to be DK Dunmer firemages, sword and shield become obvious as a defensive route without sacrificing anything.

Then they decided last minute to offer up "any alliance any race" and suddenly you had an abundance in every faction for the longest time.

The guy was only famous because he made a video. Honest truth, but he did play the build well.

lol still no "barrel rider" in the sig.....

Xeven · October 2015

Derra wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

Still no excuse for the pathetic state they´re in currently
Atleast give them a 100% vaible magica gapcloser.

Wings should have gotten the bolt escape treatment with unlimeted reflect but 50% increased cost for 4s after the effect ends.

Meh I won't say that DKs dont need some love but, stam DK is very competitive in the right hands.

Rylana · October 2015

Xeven wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Lol that dude is terrible. He didnt even weapon swap once.

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

He still wrecked most of the other DKs, so what's your point?

And I think DK was mostly fine during 1.5, minus the resource sustain thanks to a combination of Bats, Battler Roar and dynamic ult gen. All the rest of the skills and passives were balanced after under-going nerfs.

But, they kept nerfing and we have DKs where they are now.

I'm not trying to be a d***. I'm just sayin'. Player skill has definitely evolved orders of magnitude over what I just watched.

Especially among the triple shield stacking trollsorcs still trying to force the max magicka bolt away build from 1.6 amirite?

ToRelax · October 2015

.

Xeven wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

I don't how good he would be now, it's not foreseeable by this vid. And yes DK was obviously OP on release. Again does not say much. He wrecked other DKs right, left and centre

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

Not at all. Most good players considered NB the top class at that time actually. Templars being the best healers and stam builds. Sorcs being "Negate monkeys".
All classes had some nice things going for them. Largest problem I had was that Sorcs had no spammable AoE like the other classes, and Volatile Familiar was like the buggiest skill overall, couldn't crit for one, so no Surge heals.

Derra · October 2015

Xeven wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

Still no excuse for the pathetic state they´re in currently
Atleast give them a 100% vaible magica gapcloser.

Wings should have gotten the bolt escape treatment with unlimeted reflect but 50% increased cost for 4s after the effect ends.

Meh I won't say that DKs dont need some love but, stam DK is very competitive in the right hands.

Yeh - playing with @yuke and his snowflake builds and even he´s a competetive stam DK

But i was thinking a bit about those magica fellas. They´re in a sad state

ToRelax wrote: »

.

Xeven wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

I don't how good he would be now, it's not foreseeable by this vid. And yes DK was obviously OP on release. Again does not say much. He wrecked other DKs right, left and centre

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

Not at all. Most good players considered NB the top class at that time actually. Templars being the best healers and stam builds. Sorcs being "Negate monkeys".
All classes had some nice things going for them. Largest problem I had was that Sorcs had no spammable AoE like the other classes, and Volatile Familiar was like the buggiest skill overall, couldn't crit for one, so no Surge heals.

My main problem with sorc was and still is the lack of a pvp vaible class aoe (pretty please can we just get one morph for lightning flood that´s got the animation of the synergy and works like templar spears instant dmg???) and no class specific spam dps (this has actually become worse since curse and finisher became blockable).

Rylana · October 2015

Derra wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

DK was absurd op all the way through 1.5...

Still no excuse for the pathetic state they´re in currently
Atleast give them a 100% vaible magica gapcloser.

Wings should have gotten the bolt escape treatment with unlimeted reflect but 50% increased cost for 4s after the effect ends.

Meh I won't say that DKs dont need some love but, stam DK is very competitive in the right hands.

Yeh - playing with @yuke and his snowflake builds and even he´s a competetive stam DK

But i was thinking a bit about those magica fellas. They´re in a sad state

Playing my magicka specced DK makes me more frustrated every time i do. The stam one is fine where its at, though i might as well just play the stamblade instead.

They really gotta fix a few things.

Maulkin · October 2015

Rylana wrote: »

Some of us were already doing it in beta, js.

Dunno at which phase you joined in Beta but when I joined around December you could not progress past the first zone. Also when you had hit level 15 and had outgrown the first zone, mobs would not give you any XP. PvP was mostly dead apart from certain pre-planned events.

The reason why I'm saying this is because from where I was it was impossible to level the skills and passives to put this build together in beta. And I bet the same applies to the majority of players.

Again, I'm not saying he would be a great player now. I'm just saying you can only beat what's in front of you and he did that. Calling him terrible when he was in many ways ahead of his time seems weird to me.