So cloak is to be nerfed, what's next?

BRogueNZ · October 2015

olsborg wrote: »

Contra:
Cloak is very fragile: Templars can reveal stealthed NB, NB can reveal them too with Piercing Mark, Sorcs have Mines/Streak to counter the Cloak, Revealing Flare and Caltrops from the Alliance War skill lines, Radiant Magelight from Mages Guild, any AoE attack can reveal NB too,...

Templar's have a reveal hidden Ninja skill?

gen_reynard2050 · October 2015

Nerf cloaking duration/ increase magicka cost/ reduce magicka regen... and give us one or two below active buff for 5 secs...

protection
evasion
expedition
cc immunity
resolve
ward
empower
intellect
fortitude
endurance

Ohhh....what next? Nerf Sorc's!!.... i hate that class

improvement detection pot...... detection area 40meters + major expedition + major protection for 1 min. See gg cloaker.

Tannakaobi · October 2015

Darnathian wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Still find it funny that ZOS so much as hints at the idea that they may look at cloak to tweak it, and the fireworks are still going off. If they mentioned they were nerfing streak again sorcs would say "why again" for perhaps a day, with maybe a day or two of others justifying the nerf then nothing. But when its about nightblades...

OMG you are so wrong. Go read the 50 threads about streak nerf. And you were in most of them. Wow. Lol

I knew it...

CP5 · October 2015

Darnathian wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Still find it funny that ZOS so much as hints at the idea that they may look at cloak to tweak it, and the fireworks are still going off. If they mentioned they were nerfing streak again sorcs would say "why again" for perhaps a day, with maybe a day or two of others justifying the nerf then nothing. But when its about nightblades...

OMG you are so wrong. Go read the 50 threads about streak nerf. And you were in most of them. Wow. Lol

Yes, my post was exaggerated and I have my own bias. The point was to say that sorc's have gotten plenty of nerfs to the point that seeing another coming isn't an earth shattering event. There will be doom and gloom threads when a nerf rolls around but it seems NB's are always the most vocal in the community.

Aerieth · October 2015

Let's

a bit more, shall we?

As you can see from my signature, I play NB. Played one since beta. Sure, reduce regen while the cloak is active or nerf it in some other way, but also give Nightblades something to work with here. Skill that costs 2.5k Magicka that does absolutely nothing - except removes DoTs - if anyone is casting AoE, using a Detect potion, using Mage Light or has a mark on you isn't very good for the main defensive skill of the class, now is it?

Nerf cloak, remove Agony and replace it with a skill that actually does something. Silence? Damage shield? Heal? I don't care. We need something other than Cloak to keep us afloat if that's thrown out the window.

[sarcasmbutnotreally]
Oh and while they're at it. Make one potion effect that makes all your attacks ignore all damage shields for 12 seconds, one that redirects all enemy heals to you for 12 seconds and one that makes you immune to all fire based effects for 12 seconds, see how non-NB's like that.
[/sarcasmbutnotreally]

Stikato · October 2015

CP5 wrote: »

Darnathian wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Still find it funny that ZOS so much as hints at the idea that they may look at cloak to tweak it, and the fireworks are still going off. If they mentioned they were nerfing streak again sorcs would say "why again" for perhaps a day, with maybe a day or two of others justifying the nerf then nothing. But when its about nightblades...

OMG you are so wrong. Go read the 50 threads about streak nerf. And you were in most of them. Wow. Lol

Yes, my post was exaggerated and I have my own bias. The point was to say that sorc's have gotten plenty of nerfs to the point that seeing another coming isn't an earth shattering event. There will be doom and gloom threads when a nerf rolls around but it seems NB's are always the most vocal in the community.

Yeah cause no one is talking about ShieldBreaker.

Master_Kas · October 2015

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Next on the table for moar nerfs after the cloak nerf; nightblades again.

Probably something like nerf fear/surprise attack/ambush.

Luckily battlefront coming soon, and the people here can go on nerfing everything until its equally useless/boring.
Also just got proxy det on My sorcerer so can toy around with that.

RIP Mana dk
RIP NB soon

Mimimimi #nerfeverything

Nerf Darth VADER

Loool xD Tbagger got rekt

Tryxus · October 2015

BRogueNZ wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

Contra:
Cloak is very fragile: Templars can reveal stealthed NB, NB can reveal them too with Piercing Mark, Sorcs have Mines/Streak to counter the Cloak, Revealing Flare and Caltrops from the Alliance War skill lines, Radiant Magelight from Mages Guild, any AoE attack can reveal NB too,...

Templar's have a reveal hidden Ninja skill?

Luminous Shards (Aedric Spear)

You don't wanna know how many Templars got me in IC with that
Almost made me wanna make a "nerf this skill-thread" xD
(nah, I'm bigger than that

)

ZakuBeta · October 2015

Master_Kas wrote: »

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Next on the table for moar nerfs after the cloak nerf; nightblades again.

Probably something like nerf fear/surprise attack/ambush.

Luckily battlefront coming soon, and the people here can go on nerfing everything until its equally useless/boring.
Also just got proxy det on My sorcerer so can toy around with that.

RIP Mana dk
RIP NB soon

Mimimimi #nerfeverything

Nerf Darth VADER

Loool xD Tbagger got rekt

My question is.....Why is the Rebel alliance guy Tbagging a friendly? Did he think he was working for the imperials? Is it a Tbag Fail? I mean seriously, he is Tbagging Luke Skywalker.

Dakrana_Thrazvoth · October 2015

Every day, there is another QQ thread for ask nerfs, I'm sick to read this forum sometimes...

Turelus · October 2015

I just wish we had an official answer on what is going to happen (as we know something will) so these threads go away and I can start planning how to play a Magicka Nightblade without cloak and with nerfed healing ward.

Junkogen · October 2015

They fix things only to break them again with overzealous nerfs.

Tryxus · October 2015

Here's a thought:

How about leaving Cloak untouched and in exchange give the other 3 classes several buffs?

Van_0S · October 2015

gen_reynard2050 wrote: »

Nerf cloaking duration/ increase magicka cost/ reduce magicka regen... and give us one or two below active buff for 5 secs...
protection

evasion

expedition

cc immunity

resolve

ward

empower

intellect

fortitude

endurance

Ohhh....what next? Nerf Sorc's!!.... i hate that class
improvement detection pot...... detection area 40meters + major expedition + major protection for 1 min. See gg cloaker.

Godmode

kevlarto_ESO · October 2015

Tannakaobi wrote: »

So now that the unskilled have got there way with yet another character nerf, this time the magic based Nightblade. Soon to be nerfed beyond recognition, there is only one question. What's next? I'm going to take a wild stab in the dark and suggest it will be the Templar. I have already seen the tremors.

I have played as a Nightblade since launch, I fought against the DK's being nerfed, I fought against the Sorcerer being nerfed, and obviously I fought against the Nightblade being nerfed. For one thing, I don't see how you can possibly nerf one character when another is not even working correctly. Soon every character will be the same as every other character. I saw the exact same thing happen to WoW over the years.

It's funny really as it serves no one. People that are good at PVP will remain good at PVP and those that are not will find other reasons to cry nerf. In the end it is only the standard of the game that sufferers. ESO will become another generic MMO where everyone is the same as everyone else, every skill will be the same reskinned skill.

Anyway, get ready Templars, you're up next.

Do you have a link to the patch notes that show this nerf ?

CP5 · October 2015

Tryxus wrote: »

Here's a thought:

How about leaving Cloak untouched and in exchange give the other 3 classes several buffs?

Sadly that doesn't seem to be the direction ZOS goes with these kind of changes, despite how much they say that they prefer smaller balance tweaks to buff under used skills.

gen_reynard2050 · October 2015

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Do you have a link to the patch notes that show this nerf ?

crazy-monkey-emoticon-029.gif?1292792386

community cry..is the best patch notes....soon or later will happen...

Hawco10 · October 2015

Seems to be a vocal minority on these forums who have an agenda of constant bombardment of nerfs and changes.
The first time I noticed this was in the magelight change, the vocal minority swung into action ad made sure that radiant magelight got the orb going round in circles. Then the came the pvp nerfs, the skill line nerfs, the DK nerfs and now the nightbalde cloak nerfs.
All started by the same vocal minority. Why not just create a skill line called " Nobody can ever kill me except Molag Bal and then only on a Friday between 9 and 3" skill line? Save a lot of changes and the same vocal minority can go back to slaying those evil daedra while wearing their 10M stone special armor and leave the silent majority to actually play the game.
Why not mail every player for ideas instead of just counting the thread count in a forum that's not used by every player?
Glad I kept all my chars and ships in EVE online now.

vamp_emily · October 2015

What is next?

After the cloak nerf I can see one of the 3 being toned down

Sorcerer ( yes I know u were nerfed before, but doesn't mean you won't be again )
One of the bow skills
Werewolf

I really think the game makers main goal is to prevent/reduce Lag; so nerfing a skill makes sense. If we have less scripts being thrown around, I think the game would run smoother.

In the end, the game will be less exciting and we will be walking around like zombies with no skills. At that point, some new game will come out and we will be there doing the same thing.

a.skelton92 · October 2015

Nifty2g wrote: »

It's called class and skill rebalancing, you shouldn't be able to permanently stay in cloak just like sorcerers can't permanently streak away. Same diff really

You have clearly NEVER played another MMO have you. Fresh outa CoD. Rogues have always been able to perma stealth. In any MMO. On WoW a rogue would only EVER be seen if he chose to be and he did not have to spam it.. I never thought I would find a community more whiney than WoWs until now.

I actually miss wow sometimes atleast rogues were allowed to be rogues.. You did not get some wizard moaning at why he cant do what a rogue can do or why a warlock could not turn into a bear. I think ZoS listens TOO MUCH sometimes, they just need to learn to say "p**s off you cheeky bast**ds".

No I am not a NB.

Malmai · October 2015

Aerieth wrote: »

Let's

a bit more, shall we?

As you can see from my signature, I play NB. Played one since beta. Sure, reduce regen while the cloak is active or nerf it in some other way, but also give Nightblades something to work with here. Skill that costs 2.5k Magicka that does absolutely nothing - except removes DoTs - if anyone is casting AoE, using a Detect potion, using Mage Light or has a mark on you isn't very good for the main defensive skill of the class, now is it?

Nerf cloak, remove Agony and replace it with a skill that actually does something. Silence? Damage shield? Heal? I don't care. We need something other than Cloak to keep us afloat if that's thrown out the window.

[sarcasmbutnotreally]
Oh and while they're at it. Make one potion effect that makes all your attacks ignore all damage shields for 12 seconds, one that redirects all enemy heals to you for 12 seconds and one that makes you immune to all fire based effects for 12 seconds, see how non-NB's like that.
[/sarcasmbutnotreally]

For me Cloak costs 3.7k and yes im stamina build and i have 9.5k Magicka now tell me if they nerf this how rtrded this will be ? BTW you can counter cloak in many ways so i dont know wtf is this nerf about...

tennant94 · October 2015

Rioht wrote: »

I don't see the issue.

I find it ridiculous that while fighting a nb he can cloak while 1ft in front of my face. I aoe/streak to reveal, they instantly cloak. Repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat....

Then I just leave. Its a horrible abused mechanic in PvP.

Used* i think you mean used.

Korah_Eaglecry · October 2015

a.skelton92 wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

It's called class and skill rebalancing, you shouldn't be able to permanently stay in cloak just like sorcerers can't permanently streak away. Same diff really

You have clearly NEVER played another MMO have you. Fresh outa CoD. Rogues have always been able to perma stealth. In any MMO. On WoW a rogue would only EVER be seen if he chose to be and he did not have to spam it.. I never thought I would find a community more whiney than WoWs until now.

I actually miss wow sometimes atleast rogues were allowed to be rogues.. You did not get some wizard moaning at why he cant do what a rogue can do or why a warlock could not turn into a bear. I think ZoS listens TOO MUCH sometimes, they just need to learn to say "p**s off you cheeky bast**ds".

No I am not a NB.

Pretty much this.

The idea that players knowingly chose a class. And that class had a primary focus while being allowed to do quite a lot more than that should of been happy to have that at the very least. But no, they want more. They want to be a Templar sneaking around the shadows like a NB. They want to be a Sorcerer that can tank like a DK.

So many other MMOs Ive played would force you into a class and that was it. You wanted to do damage? Okay, youre a Rogue but you had absolutely nothing in the way of real heals and you went splat after just a few hits. You wanted to be able to take a lot of damage? Okay, youre a Tank now. But youll be unable to do much more than call all sorts of attention on yoruself and itll take forever to defeat anything. There were consequences for your class and role choices.

But no, we have the Skyrim kiddies here that think that because they were the OP Gods in single player. That they should be OP Gods here. Forget balance, forget fair play, forget that someone sacrificed quite a bit to be very good in a very narrow field. Its 'want want want want want'. And if they cant have what you have theyll cry and *** and moan til ZOS gives them what they want. One of the biggest reasons for the last year and a half of sweeping balance passes wasnt because the game needed it. It was because people pissed and moaned and exaggerated on experiences so they could get the changes they demanded. I honestly hope ZOS wakes up and realizes that they cant keep approaching balancing the game the way they have been.

tennant94 · October 2015

Waffennacht wrote: »

To the people screaming you can't perma cloak...

You don't need to he in cloak 24/7, in deed, most NB only use cloak in combat, not to run but to attack.

You spam you're attacks, cloak to counter any targets, Dots, etc and to boost the next attack, which comes in a matter of seconds.

Typically a Vet 16 stam NB will only cloak a few times (2 or 3) before their opponent is dead.

Stop acting like you use cloak to sneak around or are in it for any true amount of time.

In example, it's a way of protecting yourself while you cast WB.

Ieave cloak alone

tennant94 · October 2015

k2blader wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

k2blader wrote: »

Junkogen wrote: »

I don't understand why people think roll dodge and cloak should be treated the same as streak. Streak not only teleports sorcs, it also stuns and damages. Neither dodge nor cloak have that much utility. They're purely defensive and have counters. There are no abilities that counter streak. I just don't think ZOS thinks this stuff through. It just doesn't make sense to treat roll dodge and cloak the same as streak.

^Here is a prime example of why I have no sympathy if cloak gets nerfed. Far too many like this. Gonna guess (s)he mains an NB.

And Im gonna guess you main as a Sorc.

Yep I main a sorc, and my class got nerfed pretty hard thanks to folks like the one quoted who basically needs to L2P.

So why should I have any sympathy for NBs getting a nerf?

You don't need sympathy, just a brain.

Tryxus · October 2015

Like I said be4:

Tryxus wrote: »

Set the Magicka Recovery rate to 90% of the Cloak's Magicka Cost should the player's Mag Recovery be higher than the Cloak's Cost

It would prevent infinite cloaking without crippling the class.

And if ZOS would be so kind to give the other classes some needed buffs (looking at all the DK and Templars out there) or even undo certain changes from the past, it would be a huge step into balancing the classes

tennant94 · October 2015

tennant94 wrote: »

Rioht wrote: »

I don't see the issue.

I find it ridiculous that while fighting a nb he can cloak while 1ft in front of my face. I aoe/streak to reveal, they instantly cloak. Repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat....

Then I just leave. Its a horrible abused mechanic in PvP.

Used* i think you mean used.

If the nb cloaks 1ft from your face use an aoe ability, lol. Streak is a stun leaving nb's with the impossible task of 'instantly cloaking'. 'I aoe/streak to reveal, they instantly cloak repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat...' sounds like you've got them on the run, nice work.

nilldax · October 2015

Putting my two cents:

Any kind of nerf (ie values, maths into it, some sorcery or witchcraft) wasnt spread all over patch notes, nor i missed something - on PTS atm it works like it was.
So... invisiblity skill, espeicaly Dark Cloak morph is on table: for NB is "The-Only-One" tactical play skill and nerfing (mechanic like Bolt Escape/reduced regen) that would smashes into face Mageblades, forces Stamblades to drop that AND almost completely kills hybrids (due to spreading stats). To add for list of "breakers": Burning Embers, Flame Lash, Velocouis Curse, (metioned?) Biting Jabs, Shadow Image (even Heavy Attacks)... So yeah its quite common set-up for majority of PvP builds. Even some mobs are "detectors" - bosses or freshy&smelly Mealstorm Arena inhabitants. Comparing Cloak to Streak/Reflecting Scale looks like for me seeking something more in common with windmill and cake - excluding flour.
From observation and cionversation with some PvP'ing NBs: Aoe Spam/Piercing Mark basicaly is death sentence to Mageblade, while typical Stamblade (2H/Bow) can dodge roll and run for life, but... Magblade can affort for some tricks like Shades/Root/Fear when staminer can only buff at the beggining and/or cloak.
Those pop-up-nerf-alike discussion went popular with IC released - someone that died to NB has added to summary gear/builds/(exploits used)/CPs and time spent with that char? - hope that you know answer.
So far "best" assasins hunter since launch was sooooo powerful Sorcerer, even now its really hard or "imposiburu" kill that without build all-or-nothing. As example Deadric Mines excludes cqc fight (exceptoin to sorc that alows that). Going further with other skills or tactics, would waste precious evening giving exactly nothing.
If, but only if, Cloak needs some changes - little tweaks to duration, fixes (random reveals), and CW counted as buff or something

PS. Have never seen such toxic and degenerated community, waiting to bite or eat alive anyone who enters its swamp - personaly? totaly love it (tyical 'Umies)

tmh3593 · October 2015

You're kidding right? Right? Nerf the ability that still doesn't even work correctly in the first place. So now nbs have no heals and now are nerfing the only thing helping nightblades stay alive? Lmao so templars heal like crazy, dks have an insta full health ability and sorcs have crazy ass shields they can pop in a second but you're going to take away the only way nightblades dont die in two seconds hmmm ok. If they do this in done with this game. What a joke.

catalyst10e · October 2015

tmh3593 wrote: »

You're kidding right? Right? Nerf the ability that still doesn't even work correctly in the first place. So now nbs have no heals and now are nerfing the only thing helping nightblades stay alive? Lmao so templars heal like crazy, dks have an insta full health ability and sorcs have crazy ass shields they can pop in a second but you're going to take away the only way nightblades dont die in two seconds hmmm ok. If they do this in done with this game. What a joke.

Harness magicka, healing ward, immovable brute, all defensive abilities. Restoration staff has healing options, and just last night in IC I saw an amazing NB who kept cloaking and using a dwarven sphere to heal, essentially giving him tons of resources to work with, and was good enough to fend off most of the 3-4+ people who tried to kill him. So you can't tell me you don't have other options. Cloak was a HUGE part of his defensive strategy but if it was nerfed even a little bit, like removing magicka regen or increased cost, it wouldn't have effected the build all that much. (which is how it should be, you shouldn't base SOOO much of your build off 1 move)