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[Confirmed Bug] Maelstrom Weps. Huge imbalance between stam/mag, almost 10x more dmg for stam!
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Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭Gilliamtherogue wrote: »Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
Oh no, if the numbers shown in the tooltip are correct, then 2 hand maelstrom will be very useful in PvE, too. You can Wrecking Blow from far enough away to charge and increase the distance again during the next cast time, not to mention not every boss just stands in one place, so this makes Crit Rush actually a useful ability then.
From what I saw, the Maelstrom dagger looks pretty good as well, clearly intended to be used for Flurry spam.
The master 1h's only increase the damage of your next casted Stamina based DoT which is only Rending Slashes, so it forces you to use two skill to utilize a single enchant. Not to mention flurry (and wrecking blow for that matter)is only utilized by stam sorcs since they lack a class abilitiy to spam. No templar, nb, or soon to be DK would use flurry over jabs/surprise/incoming stam whip. It would be a massive DPS loss just to utilize these underwhelming weapons.
And in a DPS situation, using crit rush is extremely lack luster. It locks you into a long winded animation that prevents you from continuing your rotation, and requires you to back away from your target to cast, preventing all damage done again. Maybe it'll be nice in Maelstrom, but I really don't see the point in using an item from a dungeon, that only helps you do that same dungeon better. In trials or other 4 mans, no competitive build is going to use any of these weapons with the exception of the Resto+Destro staff, and *maybe* the bow, if it operates the way I think it does. Obviously I'm speaking mainly from a min max stand point.
thats actaully wrong all channeld abilities are dots - and thus flurry is actually a dot too. so it is affected by the mealstorm weapon.
spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"3 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Teargrants wrote: »
Where in the world did you pull that conclusion from? Surely not from the most recent round of updates w/ IC where ZOS "Fixed an issue where many item set abilities would not trigger against targets with damage shields."?Teargrants wrote: »The pictures are pretty self explanatory.
With GCD taken into account, you can only do 5 light attacks in 5 sec, that means an additional 1,935 dmg w/ the staff. How in the world is that in any way comparable to 14,514 additional dmg in the same time frame from the sword/maul? That doesn't even take into account the fact that the staff proc requires additional actions, while the sword doesn't have to do anything after the initial crit rush.
Is this a joke?
Well that stuff will not proc on Shields, so why care as Magicka user with 123123 shields up
I believe, Zenimax did another hidden nerf to shields with the last update. Seems like all DoTs now proc on shields.
At least when my Dk friend tested it, ALL his DoTs could proc on my shield.
I can be wrong of course. It also seems like all secondary DoTs proc, while only primary dots did prior to the last patch.
That is the opposite of a nerf.0 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭How does this even make it past the tooltip writer?
Apparently ZOS wants everyone to use a two hander now.Edited by Armitas on October 8, 2015 10:47PMRetired.
Nord mDK0 -
dday3six✭✭✭✭✭
✭Reading through this makes me wonder if some people understand the concept of ranged vs melee, or even balance in general.
Range is going to deal less damage per hit because it has greater uptime. Non-confinement to melee range means overall less dodging, and smoother target transition. That is the trade off.
Balance is not making sure every number in the equation is the same. Rather it is making sure that end result is within tolerance to account for gear/stats and player skill. The destination is of greatest importance while the journey is varied.0 -
MisterBigglesworth✭✭✭✭✭
✭Range is going to deal less damage per hit because it has greater uptime. Non-confinement to melee range means overall less dodging, and smoother target transition. That is the trade off.
Oh, I wasn't aware Crit Rush was on a 10 second cooldown.
Can you explain how that works real quick?
Really we do it without like, the musical instruments. This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.4 -
Teargrants✭✭✭✭✭
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EP ※ Teargrants ※
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※ #JustOutOfRenderRange ※
~Teargrants YouTube~
┬┴┬┴┤(･_├┬┴┬┴3 -
Gilliamtherogue✭✭✭✭✭
✭Gilliamtherogue wrote: »Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
Oh no, if the numbers shown in the tooltip are correct, then 2 hand maelstrom will be very useful in PvE, too. You can Wrecking Blow from far enough away to charge and increase the distance again during the next cast time, not to mention not every boss just stands in one place, so this makes Crit Rush actually a useful ability then.
From what I saw, the Maelstrom dagger looks pretty good as well, clearly intended to be used for Flurry spam.
The master 1h's only increase the damage of your next casted Stamina based DoT which is only Rending Slashes, so it forces you to use two skill to utilize a single enchant. Not to mention flurry (and wrecking blow for that matter)is only utilized by stam sorcs since they lack a class abilitiy to spam. No templar, nb, or soon to be DK would use flurry over jabs/surprise/incoming stam whip. It would be a massive DPS loss just to utilize these underwhelming weapons.
And in a DPS situation, using crit rush is extremely lack luster. It locks you into a long winded animation that prevents you from continuing your rotation, and requires you to back away from your target to cast, preventing all damage done again. Maybe it'll be nice in Maelstrom, but I really don't see the point in using an item from a dungeon, that only helps you do that same dungeon better. In trials or other 4 mans, no competitive build is going to use any of these weapons with the exception of the Resto+Destro staff, and *maybe* the bow, if it operates the way I think it does. Obviously I'm speaking mainly from a min max stand point.
Well I actually agree with you that it won't be useful for trials and most 4-man dungeons...but I think that's the point. There are no trials or 4-man dungeons in this DLC so the exact perfect use would be in the solo arena where it is very effective doing damage when switching phases and jumping from mob to mob. I don't think most traditional stam DPS builds will be able to be as effective in the arena because of the need to constantly move and switch targets, so the Master weapons will be the best for this particular leaderboard.
I disagree with gill, at least until the dual wield weps have actually been tested. Maybe he forgot that biting jabs is a stam dot, or that dk's embers and breath might end up upping total dps with the enchantment in effect?
Even though the dps is lackluster, I'd be interested in seeing how the enchant affects the dmg for quick cloak and thundering presence. These are classified as melee since they proc ravagers, but I'd be curious to see if the enchant works on them as well. Could also try sneaking in a poison injection. If jabs benefits from this, I can easily stamplars just alternating flurry and jabs. Bottom line, it shouldn't be discarded as quickly as it was until it's actually been tested
For 2hander, meh, I can see it being derpy in pve, but it's also not hard to just walk backwards while wb spamming until you're in range to crit rush.
Yeah I overlooked Flurry being a DoT, but running flurry and jabs would be rather silly to do. More testing needs to be done regardless, if it increases the WD of an entire DoT/channel application it could be used in some niche builds, but if it only increases the damage of the first tick then out the window with that. As it stands I'm not too impressed with any of these master weapons compared to DSA's. The only thing I see being utilized is the Bow/Staves since the builds that use them have their weapon slot open anyways, so might as well make use of the free stats they give for equipping them.Old member of The Order of Mundus, Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. How far we've come!
Have questions? Send me a message on the forums or my other social media. Seeing people learn is my dream and passion.
Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue0 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »Pls ZoS, for the love of all gods, don't nerf the 2h. The 2h is more than fine. The problem lies within the other weapons being way too weak for what they are. Rework those, buff them, but do not start nerfing the 2h. Those weapons should all be so powerful and not less.
But they are not weak at all.
You get 1-piece weapon/spell damage bonus of 189 which is 50% more than you get with any normal set. For example on my Sorc I use 2-piece Torugs (Hat + Staff) for 129 spell if i get this staff I get 60 more spell damage AND free up a slot for another item.
The extra effect is just the cherry on the cake and should be something nice but nothing that pushes the weapon into OP territory, which is what happens with the 2H.
The extra spell damage/weapon damage bonus is really nice. I got the same thing as you with my sorc. But here's the thing: I think the main priority of this weapons should be the ability altering. And fact is, what they do now is seriously weak and/or unnecessary.
The 2h we saw first had 25% increase through the CPs. The damage is more at around 11k. But let's go with those 14kish. In PVP it will be halfed by the battle spirit reduction. Left with a 7k damage over 5 seconds. And we haven't even brought in armor reduction or other stuff like maim and whatever. And let's not forget that DoTs aren't really what you'd call op in PVP, as they are purgable through cleanse, efficient purge and cloak plus shields prevent any crit.
I really really do not think the 2h is too OP in PVP, I think the others are too weak. But that also comes from the fact that they improve the second abilities of the skill trees, which is a very good skill on the 2h (crit rush) and on the 1h (deep slash, but the sword bonus is garbage..) and on the other weapons it affects skills which aren't really used that much.
Have you looked at how much dmg DK DoTs do? Their bread and butter skills do less dmg than a DoT you get for free by using this weapon. Its way overpowered. In fact, this DoT is so good that magicka builds will run it in PvP even w/o mighty passive.
I main a DK, I know. Which is why I also know that DoTs aren't the most useful thing in PVP (except for Duels).
And no, 99 of the magicka builds won't run crit rush for a simple reason: It costs a lot of stamina and with the upcoming CP-cap no one will be able to reduce its cost. Not for a DoT that can be countered classskillwise by 3/4 classes (cleanse, cloak, shields to some extent).
.mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »Pls ZoS, for the love of all gods, don't nerf the 2h. The 2h is more than fine. The problem lies within the other weapons being way too weak for what they are. Rework those, buff them, but do not start nerfing the 2h. Those weapons should all be so powerful and not less.
But they are not weak at all.
You get 1-piece weapon/spell damage bonus of 189 which is 50% more than you get with any normal set. For example on my Sorc I use 2-piece Torugs (Hat + Staff) for 129 spell if i get this staff I get 60 more spell damage AND free up a slot for another item.
The extra effect is just the cherry on the cake and should be something nice but nothing that pushes the weapon into OP territory, which is what happens with the 2H.
The extra spell damage/weapon damage bonus is really nice. I got the same thing as you with my sorc. But here's the thing: I think the main priority of this weapons should be the ability altering. And fact is, what they do now is seriously weak and/or unnecessary.
The 2h we saw first had 25% increase through the CPs. The damage is more at around 11k. But let's go with those 14kish. In PVP it will be halfed by the battle spirit reduction. Left with a 7k damage over 5 seconds. And we haven't even brought in armor reduction or other stuff like maim and whatever. And let's not forget that DoTs aren't really what you'd call op in PVP, as they are purgable through cleanse, efficient purge and cloak plus shields prevent any crit.
I really really do not think the 2h is too OP in PVP, I think the others are too weak. But that also comes from the fact that they improve the second abilities of the skill trees, which is a very good skill on the 2h (crit rush) and on the 1h (deep slash, but the sword bonus is garbage..) and on the other weapons it affects skills which aren't really used that much.
Invalid, because dual wield again gets it's normal superior damage boost+ extra weapon damage on both daggers.it's status quo, nothing changes.
What are you trying to tell me? Dual wield gives by default more spell/weapondamage than any other weapon. If it's fair? Topic to discuss. But that has nothing to do at all with the Maelstrom weapons. The Maelstrom daggers get 94 weapondamage bonus instead of the 189 bonus on the twohanded weapons. So it's pretty much fair in that regard I'd say.
2 Maelstrom daggers = 188 weapondamage.
Maelstrom Staff = 189 spelldamage.
Because 2 handed sword has a much higher base spell/weapon damage than staves either. Still no big difference after all. You get a 94 damage bonus per dagger, what are you even trying to tell me ?
Please don't tell me, that 1 single spell damage difference makes the staff strong in your opinion. Please tell me you don't
When did I ever mention the staff being good? The spelldamage you get from it is nice yes. But that shouldn't be the main point of the weapon. The main point should be the ability altering and the one the destro staff has is just garbage and needs a rework or a buff. That's what I said and nothing else. Still no idea why my point was invalid in your opinion.
Now you suddenly agree ? I don't know.....
Maybe we misunderstood each other ? Ahhhh this is too complicated right now
Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
dday3six✭✭✭✭✭
✭MisterBigglesworth wrote: »Range is going to deal less damage per hit because it has greater uptime. Non-confinement to melee range means overall less dodging, and smoother target transition. That is the trade off.
Oh, I wasn't aware Crit Rush was on a 10 second cooldown.
Can you explain how that works real quick?
I won't be quick since you clearly missed the point...but...
For starters that wasn't directed toward crit rush. It was about people who don't understand why DW and 2H have greater base damage. It's because they are melee weapons.
You want to talk about Crit Rush with the Maelstrom 2H. Well, clipping dots on the same target is a waste of time and resources. It's not going to stack in multiple instances, it's going to overwrite. So effectively it's on a 5 second cd against the same target. In addition Crit Rush is based on range from the target for max damage, and requires a nearly flat terrain path to travel along. So it's not a really 'spam-able' skill. What has happened is some people are freaking out over a seeing a large number (14k is with 100 points in Mighty, btw) without actually taking time to think about how it will play out in the game.
Gap Closers are hardly used in PVE outside of solo play. Many PVP builds have filtered out Crit Rush, if they use 2H at all, because it's not actually that good of a skill. Currently Stam builds of Sorc, DK, and Templar lack an on class gap closer, so they have to run 2H or 1H&S to get one. The Maelstrom 2H gives those builds better gap closer options, by making a lackluster skill better. That really all there is to it.Edited by dday3six on October 9, 2015 2:00AM1 -
MisterBigglesworth✭✭✭✭✭
✭MisterBigglesworth wrote: »Range is going to deal less damage per hit because it has greater uptime. Non-confinement to melee range means overall less dodging, and smoother target transition. That is the trade off.
Oh, I wasn't aware Crit Rush was on a 10 second cooldown.
Can you explain how that works real quick?
I won't be quick since you clearly missed the point...but...
STAM SORC
Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak
That is the point.Really we do it without like, the musical instruments. This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.5 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Who ever though 8 damage stacking over the duration of volley was enough is a complete idiot...
8 DAMAGE ARE YOU SERIOUS
then 11000 for 2h? That hit's more then freaking Flurry and is an enchant!
Is this game a joke?
THESE BETTER BE TYPO'SEdited by GreenSoup2HoT on October 9, 2015 3:50AMPS4 NA DC3 -
Lava_Croft✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Everytime I read one of these threads, I visualize ZOS' approach to game development:2 -
Domander✭✭✭✭✭
✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.0 -
Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
it doesent matter its 100x more dmg than any other weapon offers and thus not warranted.spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"2 -
Xantaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭Im voting for typo. 1,4k seems reasonable for an enchant.Xantaria - Lead of Chimaira
Hardcore Progress PvE Player - Livestream - Youtube
World First Dro-m'Athra Destroyer
World First Tick-Tock Tormentor
Proud Member of the Council of Exploiters.2 -
Domander✭✭✭✭✭
✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
it doesent matter its 100x more dmg than any other weapon offers and thus not warranted.
Crit charge isn't a spammable dps ability.Edited by Domander on October 9, 2015 8:31AM0 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
it doesent matter its 100x more dmg than any other weapon offers and thus not warranted.
Crit charge isn't a spammable dps ability.
What has that got to do with anything? Still overpowered. Even if you land all the light attacks on targets that sit inside your effects, the bow and the destro staff still have 1/10th of the damage of 2H. Sounds legitEU | PC | AD3 -
Domander✭✭✭✭✭
✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
it doesent matter its 100x more dmg than any other weapon offers and thus not warranted.mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
it doesent matter its 100x more dmg than any other weapon offers and thus not warranted.
Crit charge isn't a spammable dps ability.
What has that got to do with anything? Still overpowered. Even if you land all the light attacks on targets that sit inside your effects, the bow and the destro staff still have 1/10th of the damage of 2H. Sounds legit
Think about it.0 -
NativeJoe✭✭✭✭✭Reading through this makes me wonder if some people understand the concept of ranged vs melee, or even balance in general.
Range is going to deal less damage per hit because it has greater uptime. Non-confinement to melee range means overall less dodging, and smoother target transition. That is the trade off.
Balance is not making sure every number in the equation is the same. Rather it is making sure that end result is within tolerance to account for gear/stats and player skill. The destination is of greatest importance while the journey is varied.
okay. my sorc can get in melee range of just about anything. that doesn't mean I'm doing 100 k dps like many nightblades are achieving right now. I even use dual wield because for some reason its far more magical and enhancing then any staff could be. Getting close, even tanking the boss for several hits isn't the issue. there is no risk for me. I just want to be able to actually look like a freaking mage and be effective. MY ENTIRE group in pledges now runs Dual Wield. why? because it's the most stackable for sets, most effective for attack power AND spell power. it just looks stupid and ugly. idk what else to say about it. but many bosses randomly launch a ranged attack against others, pull people in etc, its not like a ranged person is ANY SAFER then a melee person. so I don't get your risk reward argument. it just forces us all into one build. one idea. are you attack power or spell power... okay wear this. and that is it.>.<Edited by NativeJoe on October 9, 2015 9:01AM650cp+ Sorcerer 100+ days /played
Broken'Stick North American Server
https://www.twitch.tv/trixytricks4 -
Faulgor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I won't be quick since you clearly missed the point...but...
For starters that wasn't directed toward crit rush. It was about people who don't understand why DW and 2H have greater base damage. It's because they are melee weapons.
The issue is that melee range has nothing to do with spells. My Crystal Frag doesn't become melee range when I use DW. So why should DW have more spell damage than staves of all things? Even if spell damage was equal, DW would still be preferable because it offers an extra set slot.
In fact, because the weapon range only affects the range of basic attacks, there is no reason to have differing weapon/spell damage across weapon types at all. Instead, abilities and spells should be balanced individually with their range in mind.Alandrol Sul: He's making another Numidium?!?
Vivec: Worse, buddy. They're buying it.0 -
Xsorus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I won't be quick since you clearly missed the point...but...
For starters that wasn't directed toward crit rush. It was about people who don't understand why DW and 2H have greater base damage. It's because they are melee weapons.
The issue is that melee range has nothing to do with spells. My Crystal Frag doesn't become melee range when I use DW. So why should DW have more spell damage than staves of all things? Even if spell damage was equal, DW would still be preferable because it offers an extra set slot.
In fact, because the weapon range only affects the range of basic attacks, there is no reason to have differing weapon/spell damage across weapon types at all. Instead, abilities and spells should be balanced individually with their range in mind.
The very fact you can't weave light or heavy attacks with melee weapons at range is why they have more weapon damage and spell damage, hence why bow for example has the same damage as staves do on the weapon.
Why this point is lost on so many of you I'll never guess.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXpX7JMwRXtczc5GTrIYRIw
ESO and GW2 PvP videos2 -
Xsorus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Also to clear something up, the staves are a dps increase, even though I hate the approach they took itd be a dps increase using that attack and weaving. Plus the spell power bonus makes it the best staff in the game
Two hander is same way, zero reason not to use it.
Bow will be used for the weapon damage, the volley buff might not be worth anything.
DW, again will be used for the weapon damage, not sure if the enchant will make flurry out damage surprise attack. Probably not....
The worst weapon out of the bunch is the 1 handed mace and sword... The bonus is *** and the passive increase is *** since you can easily cap both of those with a tank build.. Basically zero reason to run that weapon.https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXpX7JMwRXtczc5GTrIYRIw
ESO and GW2 PvP videos0 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
it doesent matter its 100x more dmg than any other weapon offers and thus not warranted.mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
it doesent matter its 100x more dmg than any other weapon offers and thus not warranted.
Crit charge isn't a spammable dps ability.
What has that got to do with anything? Still overpowered. Even if you land all the light attacks on targets that sit inside your effects, the bow and the destro staff still have 1/10th of the damage of 2H. Sounds legit
Think about it.
I am. Are you?
EU | PC | AD1 -
IxskullzxI✭✭✭✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
So then the enchant on the staff? 300 reduced to 150 reduced further by armor.... More like 100 damage in pvp. Such wow. Best in slot man. That op 100 damage is stronk as fack. ZOS plz nerf maelstrom staff too op.#HowDoYouLikeYourDK?1 -
Ishammael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
it doesent matter its 100x more dmg than any other weapon offers and thus not warranted.
Crit charge isn't a spammable dps ability.
You dont spam DoTs anyway, that is the point.
Go look at how much dmg DK DoTs do, and tell me this is balanced.0 -
BuggeX✭✭✭✭✭
✭Hahaha! My guess is a decimal place gone awry. At least it better be. Otherwise crit charge just became the strongest spammable DoT in the game for 3000 damage per second!
Not only that, with a *** initial dmg from 10k+#makemagickadkgreataigan
#givemeaexecute
#ineedheal
#betterhotfixgrindspots0 -
BuggeX✭✭✭✭✭
✭Teargrants wrote: »
So you're ok with it adding an almost 3k dot in PvP that can be kept up constantly and is basically free given normal circumstances in PvP? That's more damage than fighting a DK in his standard. Am I to understand that PvP balance issues are not important because you do not PvP?Gilliamtherogue wrote: »You're joking right? What PvE build in their right mind would use crit rush as a source of DPS? Meanwhile Blockade of Elements is one of the best AoE DoT's in game, it does great damage and now gives free weaving damage. The Maelstrom 2h weapons will only ever be used in PvP or by shoddy PvE quest builds. All of the stamina weapons are looking to be insanely weak in PvE with the exception of MAYBE the bow. All in all, all of the new unique weapons are extremely lack luster, as well as most of the unique armor sets that drop from them. There are simply better sets that already exist in game for the most part. Truly disappointing.
14k reduced to 7k reduced further by armor..... more like 1k dot in pvp.
beeing a DK with corrosive armor and CPs in Physical DMG = 10k Dot#makemagickadkgreataigan
#givemeaexecute
#ineedheal
#betterhotfixgrindspots0 -
dday3six✭✭✭✭✭
✭MisterBigglesworth wrote: »MisterBigglesworth wrote: »Range is going to deal less damage per hit because it has greater uptime. Non-confinement to melee range means overall less dodging, and smoother target transition. That is the trade off.
Oh, I wasn't aware Crit Rush was on a 10 second cooldown.
Can you explain how that works real quick?
I won't be quick since you clearly missed the point...but...
STAM SORC
Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak, Crit Rush, Wrecking Blow, Streak
That is the point.
Why would a Stam Sorc waste time and resources on this ineffective rotation? Streak cannot be spammed first of all. So why waste your best CC/movement skill setting up a haphazard combo when Stampede (you know the version of Critical Charge many have swapped to beacause of it's CC) into Wreaking Blow + weave finishing with Executioner would work much better.
This was exactly my point. The rotation you have detailed doesn't even fit into how that game functions, yet your up in arms about it.
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Savos_Saren✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Soooo... I hate to say this but:
Stam NB that dual wields Master's Dagger and Maelstrom Dagger.
Open with Ambush, hit Rapid Strikes, and finish with Twin Slashes.
Rinse and repeat?Want to enjoy the game more? Try both PvP (crybabies) and PvE (carebears). You'll get a better perspective on everyone's opinion.
PC NA AD
Savos Saren0 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭This was exactly my point. The rotation you have detailed doesn't even fit into how that game functions, yet your up in arms about it.
The rotation he posted was indeed rubbish. The DoT won't change the optimal rotation, which is crit rush->wrecking blow / suprise attack spam->executioner.
My point is why does this rotation need a 1.4k DoT (in PvP) as a buff, when it's already very very strong? And why is the bonus, when compared to other weapons a) so easy to get b) 10 times higher in total damage value?
Riddle me that.
Edited by Maulkin on October 9, 2015 4:18PMEU | PC | AD3
