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CP farmers.. now is the time to hit it.

  • RooBeeO
    RooBeeO
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    PS4 casual player here.

    Capped CP is a good thing I think, for it allows a balance across thr playing field.

    I'm guessing that the first cap will be around the 400 mark, so by the time it comes into play the player might have a pool of 600 to play with.

    Every expansion might increase the cap by 200 - 300 giving the player base enough time to increase thier CP pool to be over capped, until such a time when most of the player base upon raised CP cap levels, won't have enough CP's to be at cap.

    I hope that makes sense.

    What this then does is change how the player sets up thier build , yes people will still copy each others builds, however there will also be many personal builds.

    The balance of the classes / skills should easier to identify also by have capped CP. However I won't hold my breath on that one.

    While the people with crazy amounts of CP might leave the game, if and when they return then the player base might have caught up to them CP wise.

    PvP will change, more personal builds will come into play as will the approach on killing the players. Limiting the amount of CP should define their play styles, yet over time increasing the CP cap, those same builds will change, so will you're approach to them. If you are aware of what each class can do to you're class, then capped CP should be in everyone's intrest, for now.

    Example, when I played the vanilla version of World or Warcraft, I had over 46000 player kills, the main reason for this was, I basically killed the same people who were pvping I got to learn who they were by remembering thier names and perdicting what they would do on each encounter, however when the battle groups came about I had to adapt to each encounter for I didn't thier play styles or who they were.

    On a personal note the CP system should never been put into the game in the first place.

    The system I would of had is the Everquests Alternate Ability point system, better known as AA.

    AA's cater for general skills such as crafting, resists, running etc etc, however more importantly it also inhances class skills.

    Also the xp needed to earn 1 AA is the xp needed to go from lvl 51 - 52 if I remember correctly. EQ is now lvl capped at 100 or so and AA's at 12k or so. Going by that, then the AA system may not be perfect, however is a better system overall.

  • dantator
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    Darlgon wrote: »
    @ZOS_RichLambert announced more details on CP caps on ESO Live today. They will come with Orcsinium and prevent you from spending over the cap they provide. You can still earn them, just cant use them until the next cap raise.

    Thank the dude who soloed Molag Bal, btw.

    Also, we now have 2 guys with over 2K champ points, 15-17 others with over 1400 and.. the rest of us.

    Now, he also said they wont be resetting skill points and attributes, thanks to the whiners who couldnt figure out their build again after the last reset.

    What this means is, IF they play this the way they have other things, and if nothing changes, they wont take away what you have, and it wont be wiped out with a CP reset. So,, get yourself a huge number of CP, blast them into whatever you think is uber, and then sit back, ,with your arm held out holding the head of the dude trying to kill you. Then, laugh and one-shot him, because you are over cap and he is no where near.

    The Campaign System was a bad idea from the start.
    +Divine Force+

    +Divines+
  • Rosveen
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    Darlgon wrote: »
    There doing CP respects when/if the cap comes so every one will be at that cap level so those 2 with 2K plus are no longer gonna be gods. Learn to hear.

    YOU need to learn to hear..

    They are not going to respec, EVER AGAIN attributes or skill points, BECAUSE the players are upset by it.

    SO, the players need to become upset by the proposed CP respec, because they dont remember where they put their CPs before, and ZoS will let it go. Or, have you missed that they have done that.. HOW many times before?
    Now I'm upset. Can someone who watched ESO Live confirm it?
    To everyone who sent tickets about it: please don't *** up my free respec because you're too lazy to remember what skills you're using every day. Take a photo, write them down, you have options.
  • Xendyn
    Xendyn
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    Rosveen wrote: »
    Darlgon wrote: »
    There doing CP respects when/if the cap comes so every one will be at that cap level so those 2 with 2K plus are no longer gonna be gods. Learn to hear.

    YOU need to learn to hear..

    They are not going to respec, EVER AGAIN attributes or skill points, BECAUSE the players are upset by it.

    SO, the players need to become upset by the proposed CP respec, because they dont remember where they put their CPs before, and ZoS will let it go. Or, have you missed that they have done that.. HOW many times before?
    Now I'm upset. Can someone who watched ESO Live confirm it?
    To everyone who sent tickets about it: please don't *** up my free respec because you're too lazy to remember what skills you're using every day. Take a photo, write them down, you have options.

    The respec, yes. Attributes weren't mentioned.
    When they cap CP, Those with more than the cap will have to reassign their points within the cap is all. Nothing is being taken away, it's just being tucked in this closet over here>>>until the next cap raise.
    Edited by Xendyn on September 26, 2015 8:01AM
    Lag is ruinin' my 'mershun!
    A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in.
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    Member of the Old Guard, keepers of the game's history

    PC/NA
  • ItsRejectz
    ItsRejectz
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    Brrrofski wrote: »
    This cap thing is a stupid idea.

    Just make a campaogn or two with no cps.

    Problem solved. That easy.

    Yeah let's separate the community even more than it already is, that sounds like a great idea.......not!
    Xbox EU - GT: o69 Woody 69o

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  • Van_0S
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    Darlgon wrote: »
    You guys HAVE all figured out this is yet ANOTHER reason for vet players to STOP playing the game, right? Progression stops at the cap..

    Actually, its opposite of what you said and even others. The veteran will grind more to reach the cap and the noob will quit (pvp)due to the cap. But if they give 10 cp every month then it would be great.
  • Egonieser
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    Ommamar wrote: »
    Legoless wrote: »
    He said they'll be resetting CP if you're over the cap once Orsinium hits.

    So does that mean you will lose the CP you earned or will they sit there ready to use for the next cap advance? Either way it is a bad decision. On one hand you will have the why can't I use what I have earned slant?! On the other hand you will just have bursts of power from the people who are already far ahead on CP.

    If people in fact lose their earned CP I would see an exodus occurring.

    No problems with that. Less farmers, more pleasant atmosphere all around. Farmers don't contribute much to community apart from fulfilling their either OCD or Power maniac needs, people like that can freely leave.

    Will be funny to read all the farmers coming here and complaining about it. Good stuff ZoS!
    Edited by Egonieser on September 26, 2015 8:22AM
    Sometimes, I dream about...cheese...

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    (CP 830+)

    PC - EU
  • hrothbern
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    Very good action of ZOS to introduce a moving over time cap for CP that can be employed, without taking away hard earned CP's by grinding. :)

    I would like to add a consideration to the discussion on CP that pops up directly and indirectly in some threads, but would like to outline it here to the point:

    "as long as the CP's we can employ are a fraction of total CP now 3600 (I guess up to approx 50% of total CP), the CP system will ADD to the diversity of builds"

    To put it in another way: "if all endgame people have max CP, the CP system ONLY AMPLIFIES the diversity of the builds coming from the diversity in gear, race, class, and abilities chosen in the class"

    Because I favor a high diversity in builds between the players, I would favor that the max CP points that can be employed at any time in the game never exceeds approx 50% of the total CP.
    I would recommend that if this would be implemented, that ZOS adds some perks to the CP tree for a total pool of 7200 during the coming years.

    For more diversity and freedom of choice of builds :)
    Edited by hrothbern on September 26, 2015 8:16AM
    "I still do not understand why I followed the advice of Captain Rana to bring the villagers of Bleakrock into safety. We should have fought for our village and not have backed down, with our tail between our legs. Now my home village is in shambles, the houses burning, the invaders feasting.I swear every day to Shor that after Molag Bal has been defeated, I will hunt down the invaders and restore peace in Bleakrock and drink my mead with my friends at the market place".PC-EU
  • FireCowCommando
    FireCowCommando
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    Granted this may not effect the majority of the players who dont spend a lot of time playing, but a system that discourages those of us who play for hours on the daily is a slippery slope.

    The content does not come fast enough to keep us interested as it is, taking it a step further and placing limitations on a system that qualified as a content update in of itself is a mistake.

    I believe most of the less frequent players are going to be amazed how empty Tamriel is going to be without the serious PvP/PvE guilds around. Its already been feeling empty for a while and IC didnt do us any favors.
  • Van_0S
    Van_0S
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    1) CP promote excessive power creep.

    2) Adding a catchup mechanic does nothing to prevent #1 and, in fact, encourages it.

    3) #'s 1 & 2 do nothing to address the power gap for new players and continue to discourage them from ever playing.

    4) Adding a CP cap is a temporary fix that does not address #'s 1-3.

    5) CP need to be entirely reworked to offer players a choice in playing style, not a straight buff across multiple areas.

    6) Non-CP campaigns will continue to be requested until #'s 1-5 are solved since players want a fair environment based on player skill and build strength, not time spent grinding/exploiting.

    7) CP negatively affect PvE areas and the newest dungeons are proof of that as high CP groups are burning through the content while low CP groups are still struggling to clear them. See also #1.

    tl;dr: CP are ruining the balance of the game and need to be changed in order to keep ESO attractive to both veteran and new players alike.

    What this guy says is right.
    Edited by Van_0S on September 26, 2015 8:48AM
  • Minsc
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    oSemaj wrote: »
    I have one question, during the stream he said the dude that soloed Molag Bal had 70k resources. How is that possible? I don't see any CP tree that increases your max resources.

    It is not. Simply it seems that the fact that these resource pools were so high because the player was an Emperor, escaped from the game's Creative director. If this is truly the case, then a lack of knowledge, at such a high level, for basic mechanics of this game, explains many other issues....
    Edited by Minsc on September 26, 2015 9:03AM
  • Mojmir
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    it still baffles me how these developers don't know what is in their own game, its like a chef not tasting his food.
  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    Xeven wrote: »
    If you are one of the few people with 600 or more CP, what makes you think that you shouldnt be on the same playing field as everyone else? Because you kiilled more NPCs? People have jobs, families, social lives.

    Just because you can play 10 more games of chess than I can each day, doesnt mean that you should be able to start each game with 4 queens.

    Excellent analogy. I agree.

    Problem is, very good / high playtime players (which is not the same by the way but let's put them together in this case) need PROGRESSION, progression with milestones and things they can show and prove to others. They need numbers, titles, achievements, leaderboards. The fun of playing the game and replaying the same content over and over again and doing it better each time is not enough, there must be something quantified AND exhibitable (not sure the word exists in english) to be a valid goal for them.

    That would apply to chess too. If someone is so passionate about chess that he would play 10, 20 or 200 games of chess every day, this person will seek new goals, new opponents, tournaments. He will not stay at home playing against himself or against the same opponent over and over again, even if that alone makes him better.

    People need measurements. People need progression. People need milestones. Otherwise they feel their time is wasted even if, in reality, it's not. If you're making efforts to lose weight, it's not the weight scale that makes you lose weight, it's your efforts. But you will need a scale to measure those efforts.

    Setting milestones is one of the roles of champion points. The other one is reward. People need to be rewarded for their effort, and obviously in an MMO the reward must come in form of more power for your character. Maybe champion points should not give extra power but rather some exclusive stuff like costumes, dyes or titles. But would that be enough of a reward for hardcore players ? I doubt that.

    IMHO there is no solution, it's like squaring the circle. People with lots of time will want endless progression because they feel that any playtime beyond the cap is "wasted". People with little time will want limits, because they feel that any playtime with no hope to ever catch up is "wasted".



    Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on September 26, 2015 9:17AM
  • Muizer
    Muizer
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    Master_Kas wrote: »
    Any idea what the first cap will be ?

    Not announced, but I think we can give some figures.

    1) A player who had 70 points at start of CP and since only recouped his daily enlightenment will be around 300 right now. That's going to be considered a perfectly normal thing, so you can bet your life the cap will be significantly higher than that.

    2) This poll shows the distribution as it was a month ago or so as sampled on the forum. In statistical terms, the extremer 5% at the ends of a normal distribution are considered to be outside of the norm. Going by the poll data that would be no less than 400.

    To both you have to add at least the number of days until the introduction of the cap, because they're not going to punish people for recouping their enlightenment,

    In other words, it's never going to be any less than 350. 500 would still have to be considered surprisingly low. I'm thinking something in the 500-1000 range.



    Please stop making requests for game features. ZOS have enough bad ideas as it is!
  • zornyan
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    I can see many players leaving with this solution, say there are 50,000 players above 500cp, now if the cap is set at say 300, they will quite literially have less a huge reason less to play. They won't be gaining exp or anything, that's why the CP system was implemented because once people hit max vr rank they were bored.

    Infact THIS COMMUNITY demanded the CP system, they demanded something from zos. Zos even said it wasn't ready and people still demanded it. That's your own fault people.

    It will lose a huge chunk of players, they will have no endgame rewards anymore, no more reason to go and grind some mobs or do some daily quests.

    All because a bunch of moaning children blame CP for them getting g their butts kicked in pvp

    Just so you know guys, even with CP free campaigns, and CP caps, you will still get your asses kicked.
  • Sausage
    Sausage
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    Master_Kas wrote: »
    Any idea what the first cap will be ?

    I think they said 400 is first. It makes sense too. Its good but not too good.
  • Treasure_Goblin
    Treasure_Goblin
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    I have 87. But it's okay, I just need to L2P
  • melodeath
    melodeath
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    they might aswell just give everyone the full 3600 cp whos at v16..
    every level in vet gives a bunch of cp a so that at v16 you have the full thing unlocked.

    if they dont want to remove it yet than people will keep complaining..
    if they want a bandaid fix than people will keep complaining..
    if after every damn class gets a certain amount of cp and certain abbilities become over the top than we end up with skills changing every damn week..

    cant we just get the actual solution instead of wondering every day what the change is going to be so that people can finally start planning their builds instead of having to throw millions of gold away for a build that might be useless a week later.
  • Gidorick
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    Band-aids don't fix the design flaws. The problems run deeper than "how many CPs a person has right now". While this is an effective short-term solution, the problems that Champion System has will eventually come back and be just as bad as they are now. There needs to be a different fix than this... I hope ZOS realizes this.

    And I agree with @zornyan. All they are essentially doing here is punishing those who have played the grind and earned a bunch of CPs. This is by no means an even handed or fair-to-all solution.
    Edited by Gidorick on September 26, 2015 10:34AM
    What ESO really needs is an Auction Horse.
    That's right... Horse.
    Click HERE to discuss.

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  • silky_soft
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    Wait a second here.

    They will let you continue to make cp so you can max out soon as new cap is out. But pvp players can't use ap to max gear on day one?

    If you're going to duck us around, at least keep it consistent.
    This recent update has made me sad. Sad for the game. Sad for the community. Sad to pay whatever it is now. I want the previous eso back.
  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    Gidorick wrote: »
    There needs to be a different fix than this... I hope ZOS realizes this.

    Like... what ?
    Gidorick wrote: »
    This is by no means an even handed or fair-to-all solution.

    Because imho there is no such thing as an even and fair-to-all solution. And that does not lie within the CP system.

    Some people want endless progression because they feel any time played beyond cap is "wasted".
    Some people want limitations because they feel any time played with no hope to catch up is "wasted".

    I don't see ANY even and fair-to-all solution to that. You cannot expect ZOS nor anyone to solve such a contradictory equation.



    Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on September 26, 2015 11:00AM
  • Muizer
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    zornyan wrote: »
    I can see many players leaving with this solution, say there are 50,000 players above 500cp, now if the cap is set at say 300, they will quite literially have less a huge reason less to play.

    We don't even have to consider such a scenario. To avoid this, the cap will affect a small portion of the player base, and as I pointed out in the post right above yours, that means the cap will be quite a bit higher than 300. 500 would still be low. Could be as high as 1000.

    I fear a lot of people may be disappointed, so perhaps It helps for them to know what they can expect: When the cap comes, only the few CP grinders in the top 5 percent of the distribution (those getting nerfed) will notice the difference. The other 95% won't notice a thing, especially those at the bottom of the pile.

    If you have few CP and hope for a way to catch up, you will have to wait. Because a catch-up system will have to narrow the disrtibution. A cap cannot do that. It can only remove the outliers.

    Oh, and it would in general be great if people in general wouldn't propose totally ridiculous scenario's. We may not always agree with the motivations behind what ZoS is doing, but you can bet they aren't stupid.

    Edited by Muizer on September 26, 2015 12:07PM
    Please stop making requests for game features. ZOS have enough bad ideas as it is!
  • sadownik
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    Muizer wrote: »
    zornyan wrote: »
    I can see many players leaving with this solution, say there are 50,000 players above 500cp, now if the cap is set at say 300, they will quite literially have less a huge reason less to play.

    We don't even have to consider such a scenario. To avoid this, the cap will affect a small portion of the player base, and as I pointed out in the post right above yours, that means the cap will be quite a bit higher than 300. 500 would still be low. Could be as high as 1000.

    I'll tell you what the tragedy will be of this system: Only the few CP grinders in the top 5 percent of the distribution (those getting nerfed) will notice the difference. The other 95% won't notice a thing, especially those at the bottom of the pile.

    If you have few CP and think you need them to catch up, you will have to wait until they introduce the catch-up system. Because that will be the method they will use to sort of narrow the disrtibution and reduce relative differences across the board. A cap cannot do that. It can only remove the outliers.

    Oh, and it would in general be great if people in general wouldn't propose totally ridiculous scenario's. We may not always agree with the motivations behind what ZoS is doing, but you can bet they aren't stupid.

    As someone on the bottom of the pile (98 cp) i couldnt say it better. Cp system is one of main things that caused my mounts to get hungry for over a month now.
  • Draxys
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    Darlgon wrote: »
    Legoless wrote: »
    He said they'll be resetting CP if you're over the cap once Orsinium hits.

    Jump up and down.
    Beat metal pans.
    Cry
    Scream
    Moan.
    Threaten lawsuits about being locked out of content you paid for because you already had them before the caps took effect.

    ZoS WILL back down. They have proven it time and again.

    Let's do this but ask for 1.5 with some good balance changes instead.
    2013

    rip decibel
  • iliatha
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    Tectonaut wrote: »
    Some people want endless progression because they feel any time played beyond cap is "wasted".
    Some people want limitations because they feel any time played with no hope to catch up is "wasted".

    I don't see ANY even and fair-to-all solution to that. You cannot expect ZOS nor anyone to solve such a contradictory equation.

    Of course people want endless progression, its like the core of every mmo and you cant punish those who did it best. Just my opinion as 1 of the "grinders". In my eyes a fair solution would be to reduce the amount of benefits you get for having many CPs OR at least make a "low" cap on CPs that can be earned during a given period of time. Like 20 CP / week for those who have many CPs + catchup-mechanic for those with not so many CPs.

    The "solution" they announced yesterday means that they just take away the chance to progress further on. So what you wanna do now playing this MMO ? Getting more gold ? Equip toons you dont wanna even play ?

    Dont know what it will do to guilds and player base in generell when some of the most active persons gonna quit because they feel fooled. AND it IS weird to put potions for more experience into crown shop and make everyone go fishing for exp-pots, before announcing this type of cap.
    Edited by iliatha on September 26, 2015 12:38PM
  • Erudition
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    Lol this is actually quite funny watching the way they think. The problem of people being op from CP is not going to go away by capping available for use CP. Their actual problem is new players and (because they have trouble keeping existing players) their dependence on those new players.

    When a new player comes in a year's time and they raise they cap to 2k the new player will insta-quit anyway if they can't handle the imbalance.

    The solution is not to cap but to create zones for different players. An open zone with awesome pvp rewards for players of any level with ambition and talent. A (let's say) sub 800 CP pvp world with pretty good pvp rewards and a sub 300 CP campaign for noobs with pretty average pvp rewards. The imbalance is real and it should be dealt with fairly (especially since this is their system in the first place).

    Then and they should have done this a while ago anyway, they should slightly tilt the game in favor of gear over CP so that CP are important but good gear is more important.

    Why they have to come up with a (dumb anyway) solution that shows the rest of how little they care for their most diligent players is beyond me. It's like they want you not to trust them with your time and effort.

    So silly its funny.

  • eliisra
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    Not sure how that cap is going to swing really, considering the difference between PC and console.

    PC players are hundreds of CP ahead, we even got 70+CP if we had a max leveled char when Tamriel Unlimited came out. Most of us that's been playing say since than, sit on 350-450 CP today from playing the game normally, no grinding. By the time Orsinium comes out, that number will be even higher.

    So either the cap wont make any difference for console at all, because 99% of the population aren't even close. Or a loads of PC players will be really upset.

    I'm really happy their doing something about the CP imbalance of course. I know so many returning PvP'ers that left after a few days, because of it. I meet so many new players that just sort of gave up and quit, because the disparity in CP felt to overwhelming.

    But I rather they work hard on a catch up system, than punish people to harshly for being loyal to the game and playing it every day. Again, not talking about 1000-1500+ CP monsters living in CWC, but all of us on PC that just played normally since the system came out. Will we loose access to like half out points, because console is behind in progression?
    Edited by eliisra on September 26, 2015 1:10PM
  • NeoBeastX
    NeoBeastX
    So this is the results that comes beforth us in any game when more hardcore players who put more time, effort and dedication into things than that of a casual player get hindered and screwed because casual players feel like everything should be even or handed to them just because the cant put the same effort and dedication into something. The real world doesn't work like this so why should a video game world work like this. Person A who drops out of school and is working at Mc Donald making 8 dollars a hour is making that 8 dollars a hour at a fast food restaurant because the made their choice in life and decided not to put much effort into their life. Yet person B who is a lawyer making 25 dollars a hour finished high school, finished 4-8 years of college and put much effort into their life. What's next should we treat everyone equal and everyone should get exactly the same no matter what they have done?

    To those of you with near max capped cp, I feel your pain right now even if it's only a delayed use it isn't fair that you should be having to deal with such a cap just because others don't feel the need to work as hard.
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    Xbox Live GT: NeoBeastX

  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    Erudition wrote: »
    The solution is not to cap but to create zones for different players. An open zone with awesome pvp rewards for players of any level with ambition and talent. A (let's say) sub 800 CP pvp world with pretty good pvp rewards and a sub 300 CP campaign for noobs with pretty average pvp rewards. The imbalance is real and it should be dealt with fairly (especially since this is their system in the first place).

    ... and the TWO players above 2000 CP get a whole instance of Cyrodiil just for duelling each other ? :D
    (oh but wait... do they actually know how to play apart from steel tornadoing goblins ?)

    (sorry I'm not making a fool of your post, just the idea of those two CP-heroes running for each other in the whole of Cyro makes me laugh :D )

  • Kuroinu
    Kuroinu
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    The real problem here is how they introduced the system initially, we were given the option to get everything right off the bat. Which ultimately lead us to learning the hard way, in that we should have never had the option to apply all these points we obtained. There should have been a point allotment per category, similar to how the perk system in Skyrim worked.

    Now this cap is coming and a new "generation" of players will know no different. But, it's almost like they don't like having gaps between player power? There will always be this with the system we are in now. In fact, its in almost every MMO to some extent lol.
    Edited by Kuroinu on September 26, 2015 1:29PM
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