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Well done ZOS, baby steps to P2W...
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tordr86b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
It's called "moving the goal posts". You may notice OP has done it several times in this thread. It started as a rant about "what happened to only cosmetic items in the Crown store?" (this despite the fact that it was always "cosmetic and convenience items"), until it was pointed out that the consumables he was upset about are worse than crafted ones. Then it became "how come new mounts are Crown store instead of in-game?" (this despite the fact that mount skins are purely cosmetic, and he originally was complaining that only cosmetics should be in the Crown store), until it was pointed out that they are adding various cosmetic items that are obtainable in-game. Then it became "but I don't like the specific way they made a couple of those specific items available in-game". Who knows where the goal posts will be moved to next?tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »
•The Xivkyn Dreadguard, Xivkyn Tormentor, and Xivkyn Augur Polymorphs can very rarely be found in Imperial Reward containers, purchasable from Tel Var Lockbox merchants and Tel Var Greater Lockbox merchants who are found in your alliance’s base in the Imperial City Sewers.
Oh how entertaining, I can sit infront of my screen spamming my left mouse button and hopefully, get lucky with RNG. This is not fun, it's just another boring grind. They should lock costumes or poly's with achievements (aka quests, finishing x dungeons / raids).
I thought the point was they are available in game?
I would be happy if they added more mounts other than horses too the stable master. There is very little choice or flavor, and compared to other MMORPG's, ESO is lacking on that department. We've had 4 (5 with imp edition) choices of mounts since launch outside of the crown store. An update is due if you ask me.
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Lightninvash✭✭✭✭✭tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »
It's called "moving the goal posts". You may notice OP has done it several times in this thread. It started as a rant about "what happened to only cosmetic items in the Crown store?" (this despite the fact that it was always "cosmetic and convenience items"), until it was pointed out that the consumables he was upset about are worse than crafted ones. Then it became "how come new mounts are Crown store instead of in-game?" (this despite the fact that mount skins are purely cosmetic, and he originally was complaining that only cosmetics should be in the Crown store), until it was pointed out that they are adding various cosmetic items that are obtainable in-game. Then it became "but I don't like the specific way they made a couple of those specific items available in-game". Who knows where the goal posts will be moved to next?tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »
•The Xivkyn Dreadguard, Xivkyn Tormentor, and Xivkyn Augur Polymorphs can very rarely be found in Imperial Reward containers, purchasable from Tel Var Lockbox merchants and Tel Var Greater Lockbox merchants who are found in your alliance’s base in the Imperial City Sewers.
Oh how entertaining, I can sit infront of my screen spamming my left mouse button and hopefully, get lucky with RNG. This is not fun, it's just another boring grind. They should lock costumes or poly's with achievements (aka quests, finishing x dungeons / raids).
I thought the point was they are available in game?
I would be happy if they added more mounts other than horses too the stable master. There is very little choice or flavor, and compared to other MMORPG's, ESO is lacking on that department. We've had 4 (5 with imp edition) choices of mounts since launch outside of the crown store. An update is due if you ask me.
what other mmos have mounts u get in game with flavor, serious not sarcasm. all ive played you had to buy for the better ones or nicer ones ect.0 -
Spottswoode✭✭✭✭✭I should request that Tobuscus make a p2w song so I can link it every time this comes up.Proud Player of The Elder Bank Screen Online.
My khajiit loves his moon sugar.
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Libertas est periculosum. Liberum cogitandi est haeresis. Ergo, et ego terroristis.
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Lenikus✭✭✭✭✭Wait, only today OP saw the food and pots in the crow store?
And WHO in stendar's name said that there would be only cosmetic stuff on crown store?
They said, from day one, (earlier than day one, actually) "Convenience and Cosmetic items". Potions and EXP scrolls classify as convenient items. so no surprise there ever.
I for one think this thread only started because you don't have enough in-game gold to buy any of the fancy ponies so you rage at the cool loolking stuff at the cash shop, wich still counts as new content anyway ;3Edited by Lenikus on September 15, 2015 8:22PM... Mai cave. >:31 -
tordr86b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lightninvash wrote: »what other mmos have mounts u get in game with flavor, serious not sarcasm. all ive played you had to buy for the better ones or nicer ones ect.
Achievements:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/achievement.php
Class mounts:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/class.php
From crafting:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/crafted.php
By loot and quests:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/loot.php
PvP:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/pvp.php
Etcetera:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/
Edited by tordr86b16_ESO on September 15, 2015 8:27PM0 -
tordr86b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wait, only today OP saw the food and pots in the crow store?
And WHO in stendar's name said that there would be only cosmetic stuff on crown store?
They said, from day one, (earlier than day one, actually) "Convenience and Cosmetic items". Potions and EXP scrolls classify as convenient items. so no surprise there ever.
I for one think this thread only started because you don't have enough in-game gold to buy any of the fancy ponies so you rage at the cool loolking stuff at the cash shop, wich still counts as new content anyway ;3
I got 1m gold. I can buy the cash shop stuff which I won't because I don't need 100x iterations of the same model with a different skin. Why am I surprised? Because I thought the tri pots/food were for PTS purposes only. They have gone from green single stat to purple TRI stat. You don't see the slippery slope huh?
Edited by tordr86b16_ESO on September 15, 2015 8:35PM0 -
Kronuxx✭✭✭✭Not sure how selling potions/food are baby steps to winning. Perhaps the better crown experience scroll you could make a case out of, but that just comes down to more experience, which by the way if you have the in game money, you can just buy psijic ambrosia pots. They provide the same amount of exp boost, just a shorter time duration is all. Everything you get at the crown store that increases riding skill, increasing stats through pots, food, etc can all be obtained in game through in game money. Costumes obtained in the Crown Store do not provide one player with superior strength over another. I find the costumes myself, just a waste of money and rather silly, but hey, I guess some people like to dress up in game, and nothing wrong with that if they are willing to dish out the money.
Nothing that they offer currently is P2W. If, let's say, they start to offer a higher CP cap purchasable through the crown store only, or more attribute points, or specific weapons/armor items that are better in the crown store, then yes that would be considered P2W, but as of right now there is nothing in the crown store that makes one player stronger than me (thus making him more likely to beat me and win over me hence the term "P2W").
So basically, this thread is moot.Edited by Kronuxx on September 15, 2015 8:41PM1 -
mklundub17_ESO✭✭✭Of all the things that need improvement in ESO, this is the last thing I could think of to complain about... So a player can use crowns to purchase inferior tripots and xp potions, both of which are available to craft/buy in game and are incredibly cheap?Mass Terror
PS4 | NA | AD
v16 Imperial Templar0 -
Tholian1✭✭✭✭✭
✭The crown store is only selling convenience items. I don't see the big deal about the crown store food. You have the choice of being gouged by other players in the game with fake money, or gouged by ZoS with real money for the items. Or you could just spend the skill points and make your own.PS4 Pro NA1 -
Lightninvash✭✭✭✭✭tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Lightninvash wrote: »what other mmos have mounts u get in game with flavor, serious not sarcasm. all ive played you had to buy for the better ones or nicer ones ect.
Achievements:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/achievement.php
Class mounts:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/class.php
From crafting:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/crafted.php
By loot and quests:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/loot.php
PvP:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/pvp.php
Etcetera:
http://www.warcraftmounts.com/
ah yes wow one of the few yet you pay for sub so it evens out... you don't have to pay for sub here so it evens out0 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't see the problem myself either, if they started selling cp or v16 characters or such then it's a problem.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...0 -
Kobaal✭✭✭✭✭
It's called "moving the goal posts". You may notice OP has done it several times in this thread. It started as a rant about "what happened to only cosmetic items in the Crown store?" (this despite the fact that it was always "cosmetic and convenience items"), until it was pointed out that the consumables he was upset about are worse than crafted ones. Then it became "how come new mounts are Crown store instead of in-game?" (this despite the fact that mount skins are purely cosmetic, and he originally was complaining that only cosmetics should be in the Crown store), until it was pointed out that they are adding various cosmetic items that are obtainable in-game. Then it became "but I don't like the specific way they made a couple of those specific items available in-game". Who knows where the goal posts will be moved to next?tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »
•The Xivkyn Dreadguard, Xivkyn Tormentor, and Xivkyn Augur Polymorphs can very rarely be found in Imperial Reward containers, purchasable from Tel Var Lockbox merchants and Tel Var Greater Lockbox merchants who are found in your alliance’s base in the Imperial City Sewers.
Oh how entertaining, I can sit infront of my screen spamming my left mouse button and hopefully, get lucky with RNG. This is not fun, it's just another boring grind. They should lock costumes or poly's with achievements (aka quests, finishing x dungeons / raids).
I thought the point was they are available in game?
I knew I liked you. Your stock just whent up.Kobaal - VR16 Dragon Knight - PC [NA] Azura Star
Kobaal Shadowborn - VR16 NightBlade - PC [NA] Azura Star
Kobaal Stormborn- VR3 Sorcerer - PC [NA] Azura Star
Fat Old Templar - lvl 19 Templar - PC [NA] BwB1 -
Acrolas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's either a crown store full of items of various usefulness, or begging users for donations.
And after the plug.dj email today begging for donations, I definitely would rather have a store full of things that are both fun and useful, that people actually want to buy. Things that keep me in the game longer. Things that help me feel unique in an open world.
Or you can beg 10% of your community to donate a dollar so you can still work from home after you sold your office space and laid people off. That's not fun for anybody.
There's going to be stuff in the crown store that people don't like. But if they sell, if they make somebody happy, and if they keep the game running... bring them on. Your life isn't over because somebody wants to be a scarecrow riding a skeletal guar into battle. So your life definitely isn't over if somebody buys some food with crowns because they ran out in the Imperial City.signing off1 -
Lightninvash✭✭✭✭✭It's either a crown store full of items of various usefulness, or begging users for donations.
And after the plug.dj email today begging for donations, I definitely would rather have a store full of things that are both fun and useful, that people actually want to buy. Things that keep me in the game longer. Things that help me feel unique in an open world.
Or you can beg 10% of your community to donate a dollar so you can still work from home after you sold your office space and laid people off. That's not fun for anybody.
There's going to be stuff in the crown store that people don't like. But if they sell, if they make somebody happy, and if they keep the game running... bring them on. Your life isn't over because somebody wants to be a scarecrow riding a skeletal guar into battle. So your life definitely isn't over if somebody buys some food with crowns because they ran out in the Imperial City.
i like your view on life lol
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Scyantific✭✭✭✭✭
✭tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »I got 1m gold. I can buy the cash shop stuff which I won't because I don't need 100x iterations of the same model with a different skin. Why am I surprised? Because I thought the tri pots/food were for PTS purposes only. They have gone from green single stat to purple TRI stat. You don't see the slippery slope huh?
Ok, show me proof that Crown tri-stat pots and tri-stat boosting drink and food are superior to crafted, in-game potions and food.
Oh wait, you can't.
Now please go find something legitimate to complain about.2 -
exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is a little annoying to me tbh, is this a newer generation of online gamers that have twisted and bastardized the actual meaning of P2W in how the term is used nowdays? Seriously wtf.
Once upon a time before f2p online games were a thing outside of Korea, p2w had a simple, easily identifiable meaning completely absent of any kind of ambiguity. P2w has always been the process of selling character /player power on a given game's real money shop. It is the practice of giving players that chose to spend money a clear cut power / competitive advantage over those that do not chose to spend money, an advantage that CAN NOT be obtained by regular game play methods. An advantage only accessible via real money, Period.
Paying real money :
To circumvent a grind or otherwise time gate
To obtain vanity or cosmetic social gear items
To obtain consumables or other convenience items easily obtained in game via in game currency
None of the above is pay to win
what constitutes "wining" to one player doesn't not mean it's wining to another. Eg. Getting to level cap is wining for player A, player B decides to use exp pots / scrolls to speed up the process, Player A views that as p2w.
Regardless of what one players deems is p2w, it is entirely subjective.
P2w has a very simply definition and nothing in eso's crown store comes close to it.
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Tiebearion✭✭This is a curb of P2W I have seen in many games, the steeper it gets the more people drop off.Glory to the Pact!0 -
Lightninvash✭✭✭✭✭Tiebearion wrote: »This is a curb of P2W I have seen in many games, the steeper it gets the more people drop off.
yes some ppl drop off then the ppl with money come to spend money and lots of it0 -
Tiebearion✭✭Lightninvash wrote: »Tiebearion wrote: »This is a curb of P2W I have seen in many games, the steeper it gets the more people drop off.
yes some ppl drop off then the ppl with money come to spend money and lots of it
And then leave because there is no one around.Glory to the Pact!0 -
Lightninvash✭✭✭✭✭Tiebearion wrote: »Lightninvash wrote: »Tiebearion wrote: »This is a curb of P2W I have seen in many games, the steeper it gets the more people drop off.
yes some ppl drop off then the ppl with money come to spend money and lots of it
And then leave because there is no one around.
that's not true the last mmo ive played was very p2w and there were always ppl around haha especially for the pvp weekends yes pvp was only during weekends for 3 hrs a time other than that you had to open world pk haha and that was not very fun. it was very pve based however ppl only did pve to gear up for the pvp event haha. and people are still playing. my char still after not playing for 7+months has the best gear you can get most was through grinding for it because you could grind and take longer to get it or buy it in money. took me 3 years to get the best gear in the game but i did it and it makes games last longer in the sence that people are still dumping money in it. and idont mean like oh 25 here and there i mean you want best iitems in game go dump 1k rl money iv spent maybe 2k irl money on random cosmetic crap in the game or these packs with random chance for very rare items. and i was a very low spending cash shopper in game one guy spent over 25k rl money on his guys and he still plays and dumps money. he speds so much the game creators send him holiday cards....0 -
Forestd16b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭How is potions and foods a P2W ? You can craft tri food that is much better than that store bought junk. There really just for newbi players who just want some boost like the new VR15 food is way better than the crown food.0 -
Recremen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭They only offer tri-pots and tri-food, no detect/immovable/spellpower or whatever pots, no duo-food that the PvE crowd goes nuts for, and they're numerically worse to boot. It's not Buy-To-Win, it's Buy-To-Avoid-The-In-Game-Economy-And-Scoot-By-With-Underperforming-Consumables.
The closest thing to Buy-To-Win we have are the XP scrolls, except you can craft those also and it still only gives you a small boost for grinding out champion points. You still need to actually go do the grinding, which is something people who would want to buy them don't have the time to do to begin with. Honestly I'm not even sure what kind of market there is for those goods, other than if people are buying them using the crowns they got from subbed time when the game launched.Men'Do PC NA AD Khajiit
Grand High Illustrious Mid-Tier PvP/PvE Bussmunster1 -
sagitter✭✭✭✭✭Welcome back to Eso, because it has been a while since you can find these items on store, and they aren't stronger than crafted one, so stop qquing for nothing for now.0 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
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Almost as boring as motifs and costumes are in general.tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »
•The Xivkyn Dreadguard, Xivkyn Tormentor, and Xivkyn Augur Polymorphs can very rarely be found in Imperial Reward containers, purchasable from Tel Var Lockbox merchants and Tel Var Greater Lockbox merchants who are found in your alliance’s base in the Imperial City Sewers.
Oh how entertaining, I can sit infront of my screen spamming my left mouse button and hopefully, get lucky with RNG. This is not fun, it's just another boring grind. They should lock costumes or poly's with achievements (aka quests, finishing x dungeons / raids).
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Valrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭exeeter702 wrote: »This is a little annoying to me tbh, is this a newer generation of online gamers that have twisted and bastardized the actual meaning of P2W in how the term is used nowdays? Seriously wtf.
Once upon a time before f2p online games were a thing outside of Korea, p2w had a simple, easily identifiable meaning completely absent of any kind of ambiguity. P2w has always been the process of selling character /player power on a given game's real money shop. It is the practice of giving players that chose to spend money a clear cut power / competitive advantage over those that do not chose to spend money, an advantage that CAN NOT be obtained by regular game play methods. An advantage only accessible via real money, Period.
Paying real money :
To circumvent a grind or otherwise time gate
To obtain vanity or cosmetic social gear items
To obtain consumables or other convenience items easily obtained in game via in game currency
None of the above is pay to win
what constitutes "wining" to one player doesn't not mean it's wining to another. Eg. Getting to level cap is wining for player A, player B decides to use exp pots / scrolls to speed up the process, Player A views that as p2w.
Regardless of what one players deems is p2w, it is entirely subjective.
P2w has a very simply definition and nothing in eso's crown store comes close to it.
You. I like you.Valrien Dravic -- Level 50 Dunmeri Sorcerer (EP)
Garahel Dravic -- Level 50 Bosmeri Nightblade (EP)Tamriel Unlimited was a mistake. One Tamriel was a bigger mistake0 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FlounderOG wrote: »tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Really? I can't believe you're selling Tri-pots and tri-foods on the crown store... So much for "only cosmetics" huh?
How exactly is that "winning"?
Most serious pvpers run food and pots to begin with, so why would me buying a few for myself be unfair? Its not like everyone doesnt have the same access, and in PVE it literally doesnt even matter.
Especially since using inferior food or potions is foregoing better stats.
I will never buy those in the store, but I think it is great if people can buy them in Cyrodiil without having to go back to the bank to get their crafted (and better) consumables.0 -
FlounderOG✭✭✭I cant wait until I can get champion points from the crown store.-Daggerfall Covenant (Xbox NA)-
Haderus Main
Tavia Guest0 -
briandivisionb16_ESO✭✭✭✭Shoddycast hit the nail on the head with their story of the boiling frog:
Place a frog in boiling water it will jump out.
Place a frog in cold water and heat it up slowly over time and it will stay there until it dies.
*claps slowly* you're killing us slowly, Zenimax...If your group is bigger than 6 members gain 75% damage reduction.
Write this on the back of your box and see how many sales you get!
You won't get any new PvP players until this archaic AoE crap is fixed.
I for one won't resub until:
1.) You fix lag.
2.) You remove AOE caps we voted against.
3.) 12 months have passed (this is how long we've waited for you to 'get with it')[/b]0
