Animation cancelling fix ?

Funkopotamus · September 2015

If you ever die and think it was because someone used AC and that was the reason you died...

You are playing the wrong game lol..

Compared to other MMO's that had AC... The very small amount of AC in ESO is Harmless!!

Funkopotamus · September 2015

MrGrimey wrote: »

Stop trying to dumb down the game

Exactly!..
People that cry about the very small amount of AC players can use in ESO are the same people that will not be happy until upon entering CYRO everyone will have 50 hps and every attack deals 1 damage!

Sneaky-Snurr · September 2015

I'm surprised that quite a few of you here aren't aware of the effects and exploits animation cancelling provide. AC can only provide extra DPS so much before it works against you. As a result, lots of exploiters found this opportunity to use MACRO in order to execute 4 abilities in 1 second which is dogpoo if you ask me. AC is never good in any way and @ZOS is extremely incompetent on fixing it. They should have been more careful with combat development. I hate AC simply because it opens up opportunity for cheaters like macro-ers and @ZOS don't give a damn about the exploit. I hate it but I still begrudgingly use AC just to match the competitive level of the game in PvP and PvE to a certain extent.

Also, do you realise how AC rendered Weighted (attack speed increase) trait to be completely useless compared to other weapon traits? The way the mechanic works as of now makes it that only AC dominates as means of achieving greater 'attack speed' which wasn't intended in the first place because that responsibility is supposed to be on attack speed passives/skills/traits. Weapon attack speeds have always been the staple of ALL MMOs. Even during launch, an increase in ~40% attack speed barely showed any effect due to AC and this frustrates me and a lot of players so much. So attack speed has been long forgotten in this game.

But back to topic:
-AC wasn't intended.
-@ZOS won't bother fixing it and they never will (extremely frustrating)
-AC required to be competitive.

QuebraRegra · September 2015

RSram wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

To be honest, combat would be dog slow without it, wrecking blow already feels like it takes ten years.to charge and hit someone, and some other moves would be just plain boring.

Combat has already been slowed down tremendously due to the battle spirit nerf, making every animation play out would make 1v1 last for hours.

Going by your logic, if the combat animation is such a drag on game play, why even have it? Just instantly cast the spell or weapon damage while the player just stands still. Why even have combat animation?

My point(s)?

1) Think of how many man hours when into designing all the animation that is wasted due to animation canceling.

2) By not allowing animation canceling you give the server more time to calculated more combat statistics which helps prevent game lag. Think of full combat animation as a type of cool down to pace the combat between players.

3) Instead of using a bullsh*t excuse to explain why animation canceling is allowed, why not make the combat animations shorter if the intent is to make combat faster?

4) IMO, the combat animation wind up should take longer for the most powerful skills and shorter for the weaker ones.

I agree with this person 100%!

The delay in animation before a skill activates is a matter of BALANCE. To truncate the delay that was selected and designed into the game in the form of an animation is an exploit. By doing so you are changing the dynamic of balance that was originally intended.

Talk about intended or unintended mechanics all you want. It's an exploit to any but a 14yr old who claims MLG. LOL!

AtmaDarkwolf · September 2015

the way i see it, if animations were NOT cancel-able, or rather, to get benefits of a said skill you MUST let the animation complete(as it should be imo) this would separate weak and stronger skills (as the above said, weaker ones having shorter/instant animations while more powerful abilities would have longer animations) one would find REASON to chain them in specific order, or utilize them at proper times. One would use smaller/shorter attacks/skills to help toss his opponent off balance, then once that is achieved(stun, fear, knocked down, off balance, whatever) one would queue up his more powerful attacks for that 'smack-down' - IE a system that would take skill, timing, intelligence, and planning (and cunning) to achieve.

Not this 'L2P NOOB' system where one can become 'awesomesauce' by learning to block for an instant right after 'starting' his most powerful attack.

What I instead see here, is those who claim its 'part of the system' - those who claim 'it takes skill' (IE: the L2P crowd) and those who b!tch and moan about 'thems dammed pvecarebears tryin' to ruins our gamez' are all one and the same.

They do NOT want 'true skill' or 'timing' or any form of 'planning and thought' in the actual game-play. They want their 1(or 2) trick ponies and thier counter-trike kiddee play-style preserved. they DO NOT care about the survival of the game, as a whole, preserved, they simply want 'THEIR' time in this game 'THEIR' way.

I actually think the stam regen nerf while blocking was put in as a (VERY weak and not really thought out well) way to FIX this broken system.

Once again, Those who claim over and over how its 'part of the intended system' please, prove it, post a link of a dev actually saying this, get a dev to come join the discussion, or make an official statement. Please. Any of them even if its some random post on some random discussion on some far off random website. I challenge anyone to come up with any actual 'official' dev statement. At any time(before or after launch) of the games development. It was an oversite, a mistake, and its a bug/unintended result of making it so that players can have their 'Oh fudge' moment/save button and NOT get pancaked because they were stuck casting when the big red lands on their heads. NOT an official 'we want u to have instant cast anything'

Sneaky-Snurr · September 2015

AtmaDarkwolf wrote: »

the way i see it, if animations were NOT cancel-able, or rather, to get benefits of a said skill you MUST let the animation complete(as it should be imo) this would separate weak and stronger skills (as the above said, weaker ones having shorter/instant animations while more powerful abilities would have longer animations) one would find REASON to chain them in specific order, or utilize them at proper times. One would use smaller/shorter attacks/skills to help toss his opponent off balance, then once that is achieved(stun, fear, knocked down, off balance, whatever) one would queue up his more powerful attacks for that 'smack-down' - IE a system that would take skill, timing, intelligence, and planning (and cunning) to achieve.

Not this 'L2P NOOB' system where one can become 'awesomesauce' by learning to block for an instant right after 'starting' his most powerful attack.

What I instead see here, is those who claim its 'part of the system' - those who claim 'it takes skill' (IE: the L2P crowd) and those who b!tch and moan about 'thems dammed pvecarebears tryin' to ruins our gamez' are all one and the same.

They do NOT want 'true skill' or 'timing' or any form of 'planning and thought' in the actual game-play. They want their 1(or 2) trick ponies and thier counter-trike kiddee play-style preserved. they DO NOT care about the survival of the game, as a whole, preserved, they simply want 'THEIR' time in this game 'THEIR' way.

I actually think the stam regen nerf while blocking was put in as a (VERY weak and not really thought out well) way to FIX this broken system.

Once again, Those who claim over and over how its 'part of the intended system' please, prove it, post a link of a dev actually saying this, get a dev to come join the discussion, or make an official statement. Please. Any of them even if its some random post on some random discussion on some far off random website. I challenge anyone to come up with any actual 'official' dev statement. At any time(before or after launch) of the games development. It was an oversite, a mistake, and its a bug/unintended result of making it so that players can have their 'Oh fudge' moment/save button and NOT get pancaked because they were stuck casting when the big red lands on their heads. NOT an official 'we want u to have instant cast anything'

I couldn't have said it any better than how you've put it out.

uberowob16_ESO · September 2015

Appreciate all the responses.

If they haven't fixed animation cancelling after all this time I'm gonna have to assume they never will. Meaning ESO is stuck with fundamentally broken combat mechanics. Unfortunately that means it's not something I am likely to revisit, despite the many other appealing changes they seem to have been making.

I guess it's time to let this one go.

wraith808 · September 2015

uberowob16_ESO wrote: »

Appreciate all the responses.

If they haven't fixed animation cancelling after all this time I'm gonna have to assume they never will. Meaning ESO is stuck with fundamentally broken combat mechanics. Unfortunately that means it's not something I am likely to revisit, despite the many other appealing changes they seem to have been making.

I guess it's time to let this one go.

They've already said it was an unintentional side-effect, but one that they like and encourage. More than once. And as long as you don't macro it, it's part of the system.

Kova · September 2015

I...don't understand. I've had the whole "Animations are there for a reason" card pulled on me before, but I still don't get the actual problem. A medium staff attack can be cast at the same time as a light attack with proper timing. No extra buttons, just clicking and letting go at a certain time. Is this any different cancelling a heal with a weapon swap? The only AC skill that was killing people was Dawnbreaker, and only because of the 1.6 insta DoT.

AC is no where near a problem and doesn't "break" anything. Instead of just stating that it isn't broken, I'm going to back up that claim with the reasoning that everyone is able to do it. Choosing not to and disliking when someone else does isn't a global issue, but a local problem. That's like choosing not to wear armour and complaining that wearing it is OP. It takes little "skill", no more than learning to line up skills in succession, and the only defense I've seen against doing it is Macroing. To which I say that Macroing is a problem on its own. If AC was removed, there would still be macros that use precise timing to get the edge over others.

And as other's have stated in this thread, AC can be harmful as well, so it's discretionary, as:

-Cancelling with block can drain your stamina unintentionally.

-Trying to AC and weave skills with high lag can cause skills to not activate

-Sometimes it just doesn't work due to a skills cast time. Cancelling a frag still causes you to wait till the timer is over before getting to use another skill. Same thing with eclipse and snipe and etc...

Vangy · September 2015

@Kova u said it man. Don't think anyone has articulated why AC isn't a problem as well as this before. Also making Zeni fix something that is completely fine without any reason is like opening pandoras box....

FriedEggSandwich · September 2015

The recent nerfs to block and dodge mean that now it's not really worth animation cancelling properly in pvp. Sure cancelling a heavy attack with a skill still works, but tapping block to cancel a skill will just drain your stamina under fire.

FluffyMeowington · September 2015

This thread is Source players complaining about bunnyhopping (NSFW-ish link) all over again.
Well, this makes less sense really as bhopping takes practice.

Mitchblue · September 2015

If it's part of the game.. How do you actually do animation canceling?

Vangy · September 2015

Mitchblue wrote: »

If it's part of the game.. How do you actually do animation canceling?

Go to google/safari/Firefox etc and type in "animation cancelling eso". Profit

wraith808 · September 2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTb2YpuRsP4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLZzGoPp9Ug