Be careful what you wish for.

JD2013 · September 2015

Okay, so it's come to my attention that there's a lot of people on these forums saying that Zenimax do not listen to their player base. I would like to draw your attention to the fact that maybe they listen too much to people.

Firstly, when the game was first announced they announced that all players would be stuck in three alliances and that you would not be able to go to enemy lands and territory. Huge backlash. They added VR to counter this. Now people hate this.

Players said that the game's difficulty was too hard, Zenimax nerfed the difficulty. People hated this.

Players stated that every class was hugely unbalanced. Zenimax tweaked things. People hated this.

Players said they wanted real world holiday things in the game. Items have been datamined for Halloween. People hate this.

Players said they don't like VR levels. They introduced Champion Points to continue levelling after these and as a system to start removal of VR. People now say that they are unbalanced and don't like this.

Players wanted more things to loot. Zenimax introduced hundreds of new (albeit non useful) items with the Justice System to loot and sell. People call it pointless.

Players kept saying that classes are broken. They nerf everything including damage. People don't like this.

Those are just a few instances of the times ZOS listened to the players. So, next time you come up with an idea or something for Zenimax, be careful for what you wish for. Because you just might get it. I love Elder Scrolls Online. I have played for a long time now, and have seen many players come and go. I would like to see Zenimax being allowed to make the game that they want to, rather than listening to every single idea here.

Listening to the fans is both a blessing and a curse. It's great that we have people like Gina (she is the star of the ES community) listening to almost everything. But be careful what you wish for, as Zenimax are listening.

hrothbern · September 2015

JD2013 wrote: »

Okay, so it's come to my attention that there's a lot of people on these forums saying that Zenimax do not listen to their player base. I would like to draw your attention to the fact that maybe they listen too much to people.

Firstly, when the game was first announced they announced that all players would be stuck in three alliances and that you would not be able to go to enemy lands and territory. Huge backlash. They added VR to counter this. Now people hate this.

Players said that the game's difficulty was too hard, Zenimax nerfed the difficulty. People hated this.

Players stated that every class was hugely unbalanced. Zenimax tweaked things. People hated this.

Players said they wanted real world holiday things in the game. Items have been datamined for Halloween. People hate this.

Players said they don't like VR levels. They introduced Champion Points to continue levelling after these and as a system to start removal of VR. People now say that they are unbalanced and don't like this.

Players wanted more things to loot. Zenimax introduced hundreds of new (albeit non useful) items with the Justice System to loot and sell. People call it pointless.

Players kept saying that classes are broken. They nerf everything including damage. People don't like this.

Those are just a few instances of the times ZOS listened to the players. So, next time you come up with an idea or something for Zenimax, be careful for what you wish for. Because you just might get it. I love Elder Scrolls Online. I have played for a long time now, and have seen many players come and go. I would like to see Zenimax being allowed to make the game that they want to, rather than listening to every single idea here.

Listening to the fans is both a blessing and a curse. It's great that we have people like Gina (she is the star of the ES community) listening to almost everything. But be careful what you wish for, as Zenimax are listening.

fully agree !!

It would be a blessing if what we have can settle and focus is directed to removing bugs

SantieClaws · September 2015

They are listening? Really?

Ok this one wants a ball of yarn for Fishmas.

Also a big shiny trailer for the next DLC featuring khajiit with realistic fur physics.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

JD2013 · September 2015

wenxue2222b16_ESO wrote: »

They are listening? Really?

Ok this one wants a ball of yarn for Fishmas.

Also a big shiny trailer for the next DLC featuring khajiit with realistic fur physics.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

Haaaaa. Like it.

Anlaemar · September 2015

Agreed. They do listen too much. At least they've admitted that it's bad to listen to a good majority of whiners on the forums on an ESO Live. Kind of shocked me, really.

Araxleon · September 2015

JD2013 wrote: »

Okay, so it's come to my attention that there's a lot of people on these forums saying that Zenimax do not listen to their player base. I would like to draw your attention to the fact that maybe they listen too much to people.

Firstly, when the game was first announced they announced that all players would be stuck in three alliances and that you would not be able to go to enemy lands and territory. Huge backlash. They added VR to counter this. Now people hate this.

Players said that the game's difficulty was too hard, Zenimax nerfed the difficulty. People hated this.

Players stated that every class was hugely unbalanced. Zenimax tweaked things. People hated this.

Players said they wanted real world holiday things in the game. Items have been datamined for Halloween. People hate this.

Players said they don't like VR levels. They introduced Champion Points to continue levelling after these and as a system to start removal of VR. People now say that they are unbalanced and don't like this.

Players wanted more things to loot. Zenimax introduced hundreds of new (albeit non useful) items with the Justice System to loot and sell. People call it pointless.

Players kept saying that classes are broken. They nerf everything including damage. People don't like this.

Those are just a few instances of the times ZOS listened to the players. So, next time you come up with an idea or something for Zenimax, be careful for what you wish for. Because you just might get it. I love Elder Scrolls Online. I have played for a long time now, and have seen many players come and go. I would like to see Zenimax being allowed to make the game that they want to, rather than listening to every single idea here.

Listening to the fans is both a blessing and a curse. It's great that we have people like Gina (she is the star of the ES community) listening to almost everything. But be careful what you wish for, as Zenimax are listening.

They do listen to the player base, they just look into the deepest and darkest parts.
Honestly the bolt escape nerf... I dont understand it everyone was complaining about shields and how insanely tanky sorcs were, nobody complained about bolt escape and yet they nerfed it.

We knew TTK was crazy, but most expected a HP increase or slight damage reduction not 50% damage reduction/shields/healing.

But honestly they shouldn't have to listen to player base they should just do proper testing themselves and balance game play on that.

(I would of loved to see how 50% stam regen reduction while blocking would of been, or 30% damage/healing/shield reduction) but they never tried it and saw how community reacted.

Flameheart · September 2015

The socalled "Players" are split into different fractions and therefore you won't ever make it right for every player, if you are lucky then maybe sometimes for the majority.

-There are hardcore players with a lot of playtime
-There are hardcore players which concentrate on one character and build
-There are hardcore players which love to twink
-There are casual gamers
-There are MMO professionals
-There are MMO newbs who play that game, because they loved the TES Games
-There are Roleplayers
-There are PvEers
-There are PvPers
-There are crafters and traders
-There are style and fashion enthusiasts

...etc.

...and there is a company which wants to make it right for all of them, because as more customers as more beefy is the cash cow you wanne milk, so super size your theme park ?

Conclusion -> can't work, or let's say, can't work for everybody or without major compromizes.

Levo18 · September 2015

Sorcerers are still overpowered as hell.

Ommy71 · September 2015

Dear Zos, i want new car for Christmas. Thank You!

P:S. 100 % agreed with OP

Turelus · September 2015

The issue comes from unhappy players being vocal, the happy players just keep playing.

So when the change hits the happy players become unhappy and post about their displeasure of the change.

Honestly I learnt to just roll with the changes and find my fun where I can, lose less hair that way.

Daraugh · September 2015

Thank you for posting this OP! I wish @ZOS would stop listening to the forum warriors and stick to their original plans. So far every change you mentioned has hurt the game, but somehow the people who requested it don't seem to recall it was their ideas.... IC access rules are just one more example of why they should not listen to the gimme crowd.

Wish I could give you more than one agree, but I'm not going to start asking for the option

so /agree /awesome /insightful

JD2013 · September 2015

Turelus wrote: »

The issue comes from unhappy players being vocal, the happy players just keep playing.

So when the change hits the happy players become unhappy and post about their displeasure of the change.

Honestly I learnt to just roll with the changes and find my fun where I can, lose less hair that way.

Thankfully in no danger of losing my hair. I shall definitely go grey though!

I do however agree that these forums represent a small percentage of the players.

Corellon Thromorin · September 2015

1. Remove champion system and veteran rank
2. Add a skyrim-like perk system where you have 100 points to spend (start with two at character creation plus two every level)
3. Make all magic skill lines consume magicka and add martial arts skill lines for classes instead of breaking the lore making people conjure Daedric armor by flexing their muscles.
4. ????
5. Profit

Nermy · September 2015

Agree with OP.

What we end up with when this happens is a game by committee. Never works...

Let ZoS create the game they want to and as @Turelus say, roll with the changes...

SantieClaws · September 2015

Khajiit would also like to add the following seem as how they still seem to be listening ...

A wild looking horsey - though this one still likes her tiger mount Nibbles

The small chance for totally random other goodies during fishing - why should not Santie find a bit of unwanted armour at the bottom of that lake?

The legendary auction horse

A camel to make desert travel easier

Ability to meet up on friendly terms with members of other alliances for guild events etc

Ability to summon one of your own alts as a follower

A saddle that does not pinch the tail

criscal · September 2015

I would love to have some overpowered PvP gear only available by literally fishing for it and a full set taking like 20 hours or so. Just to make a point how much I love the highest gear being in a PvP zone only.

MornaBaine · September 2015

The problem isn't that ZOS doesn't do things based on player requests. The problem is that what they do is almost never what was actually wanted. Players didn't like being faction locked. VR levels and Cadwell's Silver and Gold do NOT do away with the faction locks. You still can't play with players in the other factions. And the implementation of Silver and Gold is HORRIBLE, nonsensical and boring. It was NOT what we were asking for.

a.skelton92 · September 2015

JD2013 wrote: »

Okay, so it's come to my attention that there's a lot of people on these forums saying that Zenimax do not listen to their player base. I would like to draw your attention to the fact that maybe they listen too much to people.

Firstly, when the game was first announced they announced that all players would be stuck in three alliances and that you would not be able to go to enemy lands and territory. Huge backlash. They added VR to counter this. Now people hate this.

Players said that the game's difficulty was too hard, Zenimax nerfed the difficulty. People hated this.

Players stated that every class was hugely unbalanced. Zenimax tweaked things. People hated this.

Players said they wanted real world holiday things in the game. Items have been datamined for Halloween. People hate this.

Players said they don't like VR levels. They introduced Champion Points to continue levelling after these and as a system to start removal of VR. People now say that they are unbalanced and don't like this.

Players wanted more things to loot. Zenimax introduced hundreds of new (albeit non useful) items with the Justice System to loot and sell. People call it pointless.

Players kept saying that classes are broken. They nerf everything including damage. People don't like this.

Those are just a few instances of the times ZOS listened to the players. So, next time you come up with an idea or something for Zenimax, be careful for what you wish for. Because you just might get it. I love Elder Scrolls Online. I have played for a long time now, and have seen many players come and go. I would like to see Zenimax being allowed to make the game that they want to, rather than listening to every single idea here.

Listening to the fans is both a blessing and a curse. It's great that we have people like Gina (she is the star of the ES community) listening to almost everything. But be careful what you wish for, as Zenimax are listening.

It is because they are "gamers". And gamers think they know better than the company developing it, they will moan and protest against anything for the sake of moaning and protesting against anything. Unless ZOS personally sent a hand written letter to each individual player asking for their 'permission' then they will never be happy.

Every bad decision that has EVER been made in a game has always been from "popular demand". Which later becomes a thing of regret.

a.skelton92 · September 2015

There is a reason why they are the gamers and not the ones creating it. Im sure half the ideas sound amazing when they wrote it out in crayon at lunch time but in reality.. GAMERS DONT HAVE A BLOODY CLUE WHAT THEY ARE ON ABOUT. Let them do their bloody job they are paid to do.

FireCowCommando · September 2015

As long as they are listening, can we roll back IC update? PvP was better for it before =/

vamp_emily · September 2015

Just In-case:

I want a Pink Unicorn, with a built in meatbag thrower so i can kill the gankers.

BaldusMageezack · September 2015

Yeah but they aren't actually listening. They are making dumb radical changes that make the problems we have worse. Not enough to loot mean we want USEFUL ITEMS to loot. Things we can use. They give us vendor trash. We want class balance, they nerf everything. No where did anyone say everything being nerfed provided balance it does not it shifts balance around to more unbalance. Players don't like VR levels because they are a huge grind and creates a gap between players. so they Make an even huger grind that creates even more imbalance. The problem is they aren't actually listening they are making things worse. Don't blame the gamer who wants things to make sense blame the developer who can't figure out what sense is

MrGrimey · September 2015

They listen when it comes to nerfs and band aid fixes...

But they don't listen when it comes to things that need some actual coding into the game. Such as; dueling, arenas, battlegrounds, barbershop, race changes, console text chat, etc....

OGLezard · September 2015

criscal wrote: »

I would love to have some overpowered PvP gear only available by literally fishing for it and a full set taking like 20 hours or so. Just to make a point how much I love the highest gear being in a PvP zone only.

so wrong...... the dungeons can be accessed WITHOUT stepping foot inside PVP. The PVE gear TRUMPS the new pvp gear.

cant figure out if trolling or not though.......

BuggeX · September 2015

MrGrimey wrote: »

They listen when it comes to nerfs and band aid fixes...

But they don't listen when it comes to things that need some actual coding into the game. Such as; dueling, arenas, battlegrounds, barbershop, race changes, etc....

mby because there are more ppl which dont like bgs, Arenas, race changes.

barber shop will come, duno about duelling

cjthibs · September 2015

FireCowCommando wrote: »

As long as they are listening, can we roll back IC update? PvP was better for it before =/

Only if you were a one-shotting ganker.
For everyone else it was frustrating as hell.

PvP is far more fun for the average player and those that play defensively.

Chieve · September 2015

MornaBaine wrote: »

The problem isn't that ZOS doesn't do things based on player requests. The problem is that what they do is almost never what was actually wanted. Players didn't like being faction locked. VR levels and Cadwell's Silver and Gold do NOT do away with the faction locks. You still can't play with players in the other factions. And the implementation of Silver and Gold is HORRIBLE, nonsensical and boring. It was NOT what we were asking for.

I agree and disagree...

ZOS has to make a comprimise. And lore is also a big defining factor, if you can twist a game to match lore for what you want, then they may go with it.

Opposite factions being able to quest and help each other get rid of lore and the point of factions. They do give an option in the crown store where you can play any race in any faction, but like I said, working with another the enemy faction makes no sense...and again goes against lore

Darlgon · September 2015

Some say this is a rambling thread.. but.. related.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/212433/congratulations-esotu-players-you-got-what-you-wanted-an-open-imperial-city/p1

Callous2208 · September 2015

Dearest OP,

I bequeath to thee all of my agrees for the day. Spend them wisely.

Rikal · September 2015

I'm not sure what the point of this thread is. ZOS is a business, and businesses have customers. They take forum feedback from customers as one input to their decision making process. As it should be. By no means is it the only input, and by no means do they choose to make changes based solely on what people say in forums. Trying to stifle people on the forums, or suggesting ZOS ignore customer feedback. These just aren't helpful ideas.

CGPsaint · September 2015

They darn well should listen to the players. I mean after all, this forum alone is filled to the gills with game designers with loads of experience...

Hmmm, where's the formatting button for sarcasm?

On topic, I would prefer to see them implement a more Rock-Paper-Scissors approach when it comes to balance. Everything should have pros/cons and most importantly counters. The game should not boil down to what is the best, so much as knowing your build and how to utilize it to counter the build that you are competing against. Anyone remember Shadowrun? It wasn't exactly perfect, but I loved playing it because a well balanced team that properly utilized the skills at their disposal would always crush a team that didn't understand the game mechanics and how to counter what the opposing team was throwing at you.