Block builds are way to gimp now

cmabouaf · August 2015

I know zenimax probably didn't think of this, but those of us who wanted to do a medium armor sword and board build are now losing the one benefit we got from our medium armor which was stam recovery. Now we are required to choose heavy armor for damage mitigation or drop sword and board all together. There are now hardly any perks of running medium armor as a potential damage mitigator. This nerf is creating a huge dichotomy between unique builds in this game. I suggest nerf stam recovery by 50% while blocking, or have an increased block cost, or have no changes.
In addition, many of us do not have the ping to block single attacks on time. I suggest zenimax, that you do some game tests 5000+ miles away from your servers and see how easy it is.

Xeniph · August 2015

The whole idea of this nerf is targeted at block builds. They want to see less holding RMB and casting. Though I can say it's still possible and these builds aren't dead. You will just have to find ways to adapt.

Overall it's healthier for the game with less of these builds.

Wing · August 2015

Xeniph wrote: »

The whole idea of this nerf is targeted at block builds. They want to see less holding RMB and casting. Though I can say it's still possible and these builds aren't dead. You will just have to find ways to adapt.

Overall it's healthier for the game with less of these builds.

but 1 shot full ret@rd dps is fine and healthy, cause you know, there rare right.

Mawgusta · August 2015

Wing wrote: »

Xeniph wrote: »

The whole idea of this nerf is targeted at block builds. They want to see less holding RMB and casting. Though I can say it's still possible and these builds aren't dead. You will just have to find ways to adapt.

Overall it's healthier for the game with less of these builds.

but 1 shot full ret@rd dps is fine and healthy, cause you know, there rare right.

Sustain builds are on the chopping block by zergers, by my guild group is so good against random players, and by gankers.. Any thing that gives them a hard time.. They run to the forums and cry nerf.

Halfwitte · August 2015

Wing wrote: »

...

This ^^^.

If they gave it even a passing thought they would realize how unnecessary this nerf is or they would at least comment on the multitude of forums where the feed back is against this change.

They only seem to be commenting on the positive feed back and ignoring anything that is negative or against the changes.

This is a change ZOS is going to regret.

Don't get me wrong I am excited about the new dungeons and scenery, but all of the new changes are really ruining it for me especially how they're implementing the changes, the nerfs, the grief and ganking, door camping, ambushing players killing mobs, suicide by mob to not lose all your stones while being ambushed, trying to make death meaningful like hardcore Diablo or something akin to Dark Souls. They're going about the Eric Wrobel "Fun" the wrong way. Any time you step on the what's "fun" for players slippery slope it usually ends with lots of apologies from the publisher. No one wants to be told that what they enjoy isn't fun and then have it wrecked in the name of making it "fun".

[Moderator Note: Removed moderated quote]

Cinbri · August 2015

Another change to make small groups less viable vs zergs

DDuke · August 2015

cmabouaf wrote: »

I know zenimax probably didn't think of this, but those of us who wanted to do a medium armor sword and board build are now losing the one benefit we got from our medium armor which was stam recovery. Now we are required to choose heavy armor for damage mitigation or drop sword and board all together. There are now hardly any perks of running medium armor as a potential damage mitigator. This nerf is creating a huge dichotomy between unique builds in this game. I suggest nerf stam recovery by 50% while blocking, or have an increased block cost, or have no changes.
In addition, many of us do not have the ping to block single attacks on time. I suggest zenimax, that you do some game tests 5000+ miles away from your servers and see how easy it is.

Because you should totally be tanking in medium armour... right...

Why not just bring back the light armour tank meta from Launch->1.5 while we're at it?

If you want to tank with S&B, equip heavy armour. If you want to deal dmg with S&B, equip medium armour.

You can't do both, and that's just as it should be.

Kupoking · August 2015

Guys isnt it pretty clear to you guy yet?

Permablocking as long as stam regen holds and spamming instant abikities... it is NOT working as intended for how ZoS licture their combat system.

The day you guys put this in your head once and for all, that blocking should be reactive and NOT passive, we can all go forward.

RoamingRiverElk · August 2015

This stamina regen nerf to blocking is just making outnumbered fights even harder. Cyrodiil is just more and more about numbers, or few specific builds. And with shields getting crit soon, nightblades are the only thing that haven't been nerfed since their cloak will work even better now.

Saturn · August 2015

houimetub17_ESO wrote: »

Guys isnt it pretty clear to you guy yet?

Permablocking as long as stam regen holds and spamming instant abikities... it is NOT working as intended for how ZoS licture their combat system.

The day you guys put this in your head once and for all, that blocking should be reactive and NOT passive, we can all go forward.

I'm playing from Europe with a constant ping of 200 at least, how the *** can I be reactive in blocking when everything I do is delayed -.-'

Not to mention that 1h/shield builds are intended to give you more blocking, yet with 0% stam regen while blocking across the board that pretty much ruins it, also why the *** would they nerf PvE too if they are tweaking PvP .. It's just all around a REALLY bad decision and I hope they will make it 50% stam regen while blocking instead, it's a fair change and will still mean that most people won't be able to permablock.

ESO when it came out encouraged uniqueness, why would they stray away from it now? This isn't Cookie Cutter Simulator 2000..

Ace_SiN · August 2015

It's simple.. STOP MINDLESSLY HOLDING BLOCK. The game is finally starting to become skillful. Permablocking, 1 shots, and all the other extremes only serve to create a skill ceiling lower than WoW PvP.

Faulgor · August 2015

I don't see how this affects medium armor tanks specifically. You still get more stamina regeneration while you don't hold block, at the trade off for having less armor. Nothing has changed there.
Unless the changes to block make you say that stamina regeneration is totally irrelevant, which I wouldn't agree is the case.

Besides, the new 9-trait crafting set "Armor Master" seems like a good choice for medium armor tanks.

Darnathian · August 2015

Dude. Those of us that block damage and try to be the focal point so others can deal damage are the problem with this game.

Not the master class sorc's.

Not the one shot from stealth from nb's.

You need to stop standing your ground because you don't have an escape and die properly in 2 seconds instead of 10-15. You are really cutting down on the sorc's and nb's AP per hour and ruining the game for others. /sarcasm

sabresandiego_ESO · August 2015

Anyone who thinks that holding down the right mouse button forever, and blocking forever, is good gameplay needs to get their head examined. The change to block is the best thing in this patch.

Alcast · August 2015

Permablock still possible. Just less dmg output now hahaha. Finally

ryanmjmcevoy_ESO · August 2015

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Anyone who thinks that holding down the right mouse button forever, and blocking forever, is good gameplay needs to get their head examined. The change to block is the best thing in this patch.

And anyone who thinks thats the only tanks do should probably follow suit

cmabouaf · August 2015

DDuke wrote: »

cmabouaf wrote: »

I know zenimax probably didn't think of this, but those of us who wanted to do a medium armor sword and board build are now losing the one benefit we got from our medium armor which was stam recovery. Now we are required to choose heavy armor for damage mitigation or drop sword and board all together. There are now hardly any perks of running medium armor as a potential damage mitigator. This nerf is creating a huge dichotomy between unique builds in this game. I suggest nerf stam recovery by 50% while blocking, or have an increased block cost, or have no changes.
In addition, many of us do not have the ping to block single attacks on time. I suggest zenimax, that you do some game tests 5000+ miles away from your servers and see how easy it is.

Because you should totally be tanking in medium armour... right...

Why not just bring back the light armour tank meta from Launch->1.5 while we're at it?

If you want to tank with S&B, equip heavy armour. If you want to deal dmg with S&B, equip medium armour.

You can't do both, and that's just as it should be.

you havent tried the pts have you? i tried medium armor sword and board, its completely useless now. medium armor gives stamina benefits heavy armor gives damage mitigation, medium armor no longer helps blocking with sword and board because we dont get stamina bonuses while bloking. light armor should have nothing to do with block and recieve 0 bonuses from it

cmabouaf · August 2015

Faulgor wrote: »

I don't see how this affects medium armor tanks specifically. You still get more stamina regeneration while you don't hold block, at the trade off for having less armor. Nothing has changed there.
Unless the changes to block make you say that stamina regeneration is totally irrelevant, which I wouldn't agree is the case.

Besides, the new 9-trait crafting set "Armor Master" seems like a good choice for medium armor tanks.

well so far in pts, blocking has a delay on the stam recovery hold off, if you miss the 2 second tick, you dont get it for a whole extra 2 seconds, so you could be just blocking just some attacks, and still get 0% stamina recovery. they would need to make recovery ticks every second to compensate the stamina recovery from potential block builds. still its super ***. anyone using sword and board in pts is getting *** when i use dual weild

cmabouaf · August 2015

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Anyone who thinks that holding down the right mouse button forever, and blocking forever, is good gameplay needs to get their head examined. The change to block is the best thing in this patch.

let me guess you are a sorc, or a stealthy nb who plays a cookie cutter build and gets upset when a person can actually survive without doing your exact build. every class could use sword and board and perma block if they wanted to, it wasnt an OP class, everyone had access to it, and still most people didnt do it because they had a better set up not blocking. It was a completely unneccessary nerf

Forestd16b14_ESO · August 2015

Block casting shouldn't have been in the game to begin with..... Just saying

SeptimusDova · August 2015

Shields should be Deflectors of Incoming damage. They should be directors of incoming focus. They say "Hey dummy hit me" ! They historically protected your left and your compatriots right. It was not for defense of self but for defense of others. My shield had your back and your shield had someone else's. Someone else s shield had my right, and front and back and over head. Shields ,Scutums, Aspis , Targe , Buckler and so forth each with a different intention and usage.

Take these designs for their intentions and assign traits to them These traits either add or detract stamina based on weight and intention. No need to Nerf the regen if you have negative trait balance on equipment. Max protect no regen. Buckler High Regen low protection. Round Shield mid tier protection mid level regen. Roman shield 0 regen max protection. And so forth.

Hiero_Glyph · August 2015

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Block casting shouldn't have been in the game to begin with..... Just saying

Agreed. Block casting is the real issue here. Besides, magicka builds can still attack and regen while blocking.

kkampaseb17_ESO · August 2015

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Block casting shouldn't have been in the game to begin with..... Just saying

Agreed. Block casting is the real issue here. Besides, magicka builds can still attack and regen while blocking.

Really? If these are the cries after the 0 stamina while blocking nerf I want to see the river of cries if they introduce blocking to the list of GCD abilities. GG.

Also, magicka builds cannot block animation cancel anymore. A few CCs and they are dead if they do in a PvP environment. So this is a good change.

BuggeX · August 2015

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Block casting shouldn't have been in the game to begin with..... Just saying

the same goes for animation cancalling

Wing · August 2015

lol my post got removed.

just so everyone knows is said "they reeeaaallly don't care" im not naming names or talking about anyone in particular, im using vague and unspecific terminology, like "problem" and "not fun", I could be talking about aliens for all anyone knows.

ill be more specific in my responses when "they" are ^_^

kaorunandrak · August 2015

Posted this in another thread, as long as magika is free to block cast this change just isn't right or fair. this effects all Stamina builds not just tanks. It is possible to keep your self in a constant state of no regen by "smart blocking" multiple heavy attacks in quick succession in pve and pvp. In pve at least you have other counter measures or at the very least your not fighting a group of sorcs chain fragging you until your stamina is gone from blocking, break freeing, roll dodging, sprinting, or counter attacking. This is a multi class/multi arena issue not just pve and not just tanks. there are plenty of other suggestions out there, and again what ever change they do better effect magika users too.

blabafat · August 2015

I agree with sabre. You shouldn't be able to hold block permanently and still be able to dish out damage, while you are taking like 50% less. Or whatever the mitigation is 50 or 60 something like that.

ZoS wants blocking and rolling to be something that you use when you need to. Not something you spam. If you see a sorc with a frag proc, you block it. If you see someone uppercutting you, you block it or dodge it, then move out of the way. That's how ZoS wants you to play.

Joy_Division · August 2015

cmabouaf wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Anyone who thinks that holding down the right mouse button forever, and blocking forever, is good gameplay needs to get their head examined. The change to block is the best thing in this patch.

let me guess you are a sorc, or a stealthy nb who plays a cookie cutter build and gets upset when a person can actually survive without doing your exact build. every class could use sword and board and perma block if they wanted to, it wasnt an OP class, everyone had access to it, and still most people didnt do it because they had a better set up not blocking. It was a completely unneccessary nerf

Sabre does not play a cookie-cutter build by any means. I saw him on the PTS the last three times I have been on. He is right. I play a DK and I mindlessly held block because I could. Note your bold: that's a problem. And it very well CAN be OP, which is why ZoS is trying to get rid of it.

Igawotch · August 2015

Keep them rage tells coming please.

cmabouaf · August 2015

blabafat wrote: »

I agree with sabre. You shouldn't be able to hold block permanently and still be able to dish out damage, while you are taking like 50% less. Or whatever the mitigation is 50 or 60 something like that.

ZoS wants blocking and rolling to be something that you use when you need to. Not something you spam. If you see a sorc with a frag proc, you block it. If you see someone uppercutting you, you block it or dodge it, then move out of the way. That's how ZoS wants you to play.

well blab, you as a templar have self heals, you have a class based shield despite how *** it is. Us nbs? cloak that is still fucken broken and swallow soul which is the shittiest self heal in the game. yes we deal dmg, but god, i excepted classes to be even. nbs are only good because the dmg we dish out, not because of our sustains at all. You shouldn't be so biased and one sided, im preety sure ive never seen you on a nb. Not all of us wanna play like complete ***

cmabouaf · August 2015

Joy_Division wrote: »

cmabouaf wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Anyone who thinks that holding down the right mouse button forever, and blocking forever, is good gameplay needs to get their head examined. The change to block is the best thing in this patch.

let me guess you are a sorc, or a stealthy nb who plays a cookie cutter build and gets upset when a person can actually survive without doing your exact build. every class could use sword and board and perma block if they wanted to, it wasnt an OP class, everyone had access to it, and still most people didnt do it because they had a better set up not blocking. It was a completely unneccessary nerf

Sabre does not play a cookie-cutter build by any means. I saw him on the PTS the last three times I have been on. He is right. I play a DK and I mindlessly held block because I could. Note your bold: that's a problem. And it very well CAN be OP, which is why ZoS is trying to get rid of it.

yes, it can be OP but... it can also be the one form of defense a class has without relying on a class abilities such as cloak. i dont want to be forced to dual weild/bow as a nightblade, i wanted a unique build, mostly everyone is forced to now take their defensive abilities from their own classline. Zeni should be nerfing the combinations that are OP, not just every one in general, that creates a huge inbalance in the game.

I love how you, zenimax don't even respond to us, you just cower behind your bed sheets at your corporate slumber party, saying oh no we woke up the boogie monster. You guys change the game too much too fast, many of us don't want to deal with the huge fast changes that you provoke upon us, so we quit. Learn how to host a game.