Combat effectiveness of stamina builds due to the changes.

Mr_Koh · August 2015

What are the options of survivability for stamina builds? They have to roll or block, both of which have suffered a pretty hefty nerf. Managing your stamina pool has gotten so much more difficult which is OK, but I think it may have been overdone. There should be some tweaking on both the dodgeroll and block nerfs. The combat effectiveness of stamina builds have been nerfed from both sides, but for magicka this is not the case (shields are going to be critable so we'll have to see how that effects the game once the time comes) . Even with that change though spamming your survivability tool is not punished on magicka builds, but for stamina builds it is SEVERELY punished. I'm OK with there being a difference between magicka and stam and understand that they should be different play styles, all I'm saying is that the punishment for survivability on stamina builds is too harsh atm. Please share your thoughts on this.

olemanwinter · August 2015

1v1 or 2v2 as a stamina build is still fine. The problem is the TTK is so high now that when you encounter a magica build spec'd for defense with their high resource pools....inevitably more people will show up and kill you before you can complete the fight.

Attack magica player......magica player bounces up and down confidently waiting on friends to come......15 seconds later as they come......decide to flee or die.

sabresandiego_ESO · August 2015

Block and roll dodge have gotten the adjustments that they have needed for a long time. Unfortunately damage shielding is still overpowered but is being adjusted as well. PTS isn't over yet.

Mr_Koh · August 2015

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Block and roll dodge have gotten the adjustments that they have needed for a long time. Unfortunately damage shielding is still overpowered but is being adjusted as well. PTS isn't over yet.

Yeah they needed a nerf, but not one this large. They need to think about nerfing block and Dodge the same way they nerf magicka shields, carefully

Ace_SiN · August 2015

I haven't add any issues on my stam builds. Just don't spam roll mindlessly and LOS more. Going full turtle is suicide now, so you have to work in your burst in between to get your opponent to back off some. My only problem with magicka builds is healing ward being bugged(which makes it stronger than it is in live atm).

eliisra · August 2015

olemanwinter wrote: »

1v1 or 2v2 as a stamina build is still fine. The problem is the TTK is so high now that when you encounter a magica build spec'd for defense with their high resource pools....inevitably more people will show up and kill you before you can complete the fight.

Attack magica player......magica player bounces up and down confidently waiting on friends to come......15 seconds later as they come......decide to flee or die.

So stamina players have no friends of their own or what?

Topic: The block penalty affects block/tank builds, not stamina dps. Only a complete *** would run around perma-blocking with a stamina build, when your main synergy is with dodge roll. Tanks in PvP are pretty much always magicka builds, using stamina exclusive for utility and block. So no, you're not getting some double nerf compared to magicka builds. They need block just as much as you do, even more if DK or templar since 0 mobility.

I also believe many shields and a few heals haven't been nerfed or reduced properly on PTS, while the dmg reduction is in full place. That what's causing disparity and some builds having over tuned survivability, such as shield stack sorc. Will hopefully be adjusted. Just as how 1 shot with Flying Blade, Biting Jabs, 30k+ armor penetration and so on will be fixed.

Mr_Koh · August 2015

eliisra wrote: »

olemanwinter wrote: »

1v1 or 2v2 as a stamina build is still fine. The problem is the TTK is so high now that when you encounter a magica build spec'd for defense with their high resource pools....inevitably more people will show up and kill you before you can complete the fight.

Attack magica player......magica player bounces up and down confidently waiting on friends to come......15 seconds later as they come......decide to flee or die.

So stamina players have no friends of their own or what?

Topic: The block penalty affects block/tank builds, not stamina dps. Only a complete *** would run around perma-blocking with a stamina build, when your main synergy is with dodge roll. Tanks in PvP are pretty much always magicka builds, using stamina exclusive for utility and block. So no, you're not getting some double nerf compared to magicka builds. They need block just as much as you do, even more if DK or templar since 0 mobility.

I also believe many shields and a few heals haven't been nerfed or reduced properly on PTS, while the dmg reduction is in full place. That what's causing disparity and some builds having over tuned survivability, such as shield stack sorc. Will hopefully be adjusted. Just as how 1 shot with Flying Blade, Biting Jabs, 30k+ armor penetration and so on will be fixed.

Yes it is from both sides because block and roll are mechanics available for all classes, and tanks are usually stam, any magicka tank build is getting rolled in the PTS currently. You need to be able to both block and roll as a stam build especially since there are abilities that go through Dodge roll. They are both meant to be used by all stam builds since blocking also works on many weapon attack cc's as well. So it is a double nerf and should be toned down. Not a huge buff is needed for it but some adjustment yes.

ColtPython · August 2015

I completely agree. Blocking for a magic build is far less of an opportunity cost because they are still regenerating their primary resource. Blocking as a stamina build drops my stamina regeneration and a lose stamina due to the attack. Currently, I am much better off stacking defense such as Immovable and just taking everything to the face and hope I can kill them first. Dodge rolling was the primary way for a medium armor build to defend themselves. While I think the perpetual rolling is not good for anyone, the new change makes me too scared to roll as my stamina is under too much demand as is.
I hope they will be addressing the magic/stamina balance issue soon as I am losing faith. Even if the shields can be crit on and the healing ward is applied the proper battle nerf, I think the magic builds will have far superior defensive capabilities to the stamina build. For example, my magic NB can roll 3-4 times, block a few, then put up a harness magic shield, a healing ward, double take, fear, and enter perma-cloak. My stamina NB on the PTS can roll 4-5 times and block a few but then be in serious stamina jeopardy. At which point he can fear and cloak about 3 times.
I sat through the first year of this game where everyone rolled a magic build. I am not sure I can sit through it again.

Solanum · August 2015

Well... We got Vigor at a somewhat reasonable level at least.

DDuke · August 2015

Stamina builds will be fine.. just use other defensive skills you have at your disposal in between roll dodges/blocking

This is what I do on live with my NB (not playing a rollerblade) and it works more than fine.

I do understand people used to roll dodging / blocking forever can have difficulties adjusting however.

silky_soft · August 2015

100 points in mooncalf rest in stam cost reduction, 3 stam regen glyphs, mag/stam drink or just stam drink.

Dyride · August 2015

Solanum wrote: »

Well... We got Vigor at a somewhat reasonable level at least.

Are you serious?

Stamina builds are hit also on the healing front as well. My Rally can heal for 7-8k after 12 secs in IC. Unless I keep Rally and Vigor up constantly, there is little chance to survive 1v1 against a magicka build. Granted this is with a bugged healing ward but I have seen players heal thru most damage just with Rapid Regen.

And this is as a stamplar with "OP" biting jabs. I wish.