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I think I've figured out why Camouflaged Hunter appears to stack
Akavir_Sentinel
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I think I've just figured out why Expert/Evil/Camouflaged Hunter appear to stack multiple times.
The Camouflaged Hunter tooltip states that it has a 15% chance to proc against undead/daedra, and a 4% chance on everything else, and does extra damage from stealth against undead/daedra.
Well, it turns out that 15% and 4% chance to proc is from any form of attack damage. For example, I only used two skills and a bow heavy attack in this test against a Frost Atronach.
Camouflaged Hunter
Poison Injection
Dominion's Bow [deals 1090 unresistible damage]
It turned out like this. Now remember, this is the combat damage log from pressing a single button. All I did was stealth, activate Camouflaged Hunter, pull back the bow for a heavy attack, and press the button for Poison Injection to release the attack.
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Heavy Attack
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the Heavy Attack)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Damage Health
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the weapon enchant)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Poison Injection
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by Poison Injection)
Now, admittedly, I got extremely lucky that it proc'd on all three at once, but this shows that it can happen. So, I hit that poor Frost Atronach with 6 attacks in one second.
The Camouflaged Hunter tooltip states that it has a 15% chance to proc against undead/daedra, and a 4% chance on everything else, and does extra damage from stealth against undead/daedra.
Well, it turns out that 15% and 4% chance to proc is from any form of attack damage. For example, I only used two skills and a bow heavy attack in this test against a Frost Atronach.
Camouflaged Hunter
Poison Injection
Dominion's Bow [deals 1090 unresistible damage]
It turned out like this. Now remember, this is the combat damage log from pressing a single button. All I did was stealth, activate Camouflaged Hunter, pull back the bow for a heavy attack, and press the button for Poison Injection to release the attack.
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Heavy Attack
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the Heavy Attack)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Damage Health
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the weapon enchant)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Poison Injection
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by Poison Injection)
Now, admittedly, I got extremely lucky that it proc'd on all three at once, but this shows that it can happen. So, I hit that poor Frost Atronach with 6 attacks in one second.
3
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Akavir_Sentinel✭✭✭✭✭
✭Now, for the solution. Make the proc from Expert/Evil/Camouflaged Hunter only work once every 5 seconds, just like the cooldown on weapon enchants do.0 -
Robbmrp✭✭✭✭✭
✭If Camo Hunter is doing that, who's to say that any other skill similar isn't working the same way. This could explain how it seems that some people can get one shotted in Cyrodil with certain kinds of attacks. It's not a macro, it's a game mechanic flaw..... Unless..... your using macro's
lol Edited by Robbmrp on July 30, 2015 9:06PMNA Server - Kildair1 -
Robbmrp✭✭✭✭✭
✭@ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_JessicaFolsom, @ZOS_BrianWheeler feel free to call @Akavir_Sentinel for any additional debugging help NA Server - Kildair0 -
Xael✭✭✭✭✭Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »I think I've just figured out why Expert/Evil/Camouflaged Hunter appear to stack multiple times.
The Camouflaged Hunter tooltip states that it has a 15% chance to proc against undead/daedra, and a 4% chance on everything else, and does extra damage from stealth against undead/daedra.
Well, it turns out that 15% and 4% chance to proc is from any form of attack damage. For example, I only used two skills and a bow heavy attack in this test against a Frost Atronach.
Camouflaged Hunter
Poison Injection
Dominion's Bow [deals 1090 unresistible damage]
It turned out like this. Now remember, this is the combat damage log from pressing a single button. All I did was stealth, activate Camouflaged Hunter, pull back the bow for a heavy attack, and press the button for Poison Injection to release the attack.
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Heavy Attack
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the Heavy Attack)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Damage Health
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the weapon enchant)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Poison Injection
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by Poison Injection)
Now, admittedly, I got extremely lucky that it proc'd on all three at once, but this shows that it can happen. So, I hit that poor Frost Atronach with 6 attacks in one second.
You didn't get extremely lucky. Frost Atronach is considered a Daedra. Camo Hunter did what it was supposed to.I got killed in pvp, nerf everything...1 -
Akavir_Sentinel✭✭✭✭✭
✭Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »I think I've just figured out why Expert/Evil/Camouflaged Hunter appear to stack multiple times.
The Camouflaged Hunter tooltip states that it has a 15% chance to proc against undead/daedra, and a 4% chance on everything else, and does extra damage from stealth against undead/daedra.
Well, it turns out that 15% and 4% chance to proc is from any form of attack damage. For example, I only used two skills and a bow heavy attack in this test against a Frost Atronach.
Camouflaged Hunter
Poison Injection
Dominion's Bow [deals 1090 unresistible damage]
It turned out like this. Now remember, this is the combat damage log from pressing a single button. All I did was stealth, activate Camouflaged Hunter, pull back the bow for a heavy attack, and press the button for Poison Injection to release the attack.
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Heavy Attack
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the Heavy Attack)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Damage Health
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the weapon enchant)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Poison Injection
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by Poison Injection)
Now, admittedly, I got extremely lucky that it proc'd on all three at once, but this shows that it can happen. So, I hit that poor Frost Atronach with 6 attacks in one second.
You didn't get extremely lucky. Frost Atronach is considered a Daedra. Camo Hunter did what it was supposed to.
I know how it works, and how it's supposed to work. I got extremely lucky in that it proc'd on all three hits at once. Each one of those "attacks", heavy, weapon enchant, and poison injection, only have a 15% proc chance each, even against daedra/undead.Edited by Akavir_Sentinel on July 30, 2015 10:43PM0 -
silky_soft✭✭✭✭✭
✭This is nothing new.
That's how I 1 shot people on live. Run DW with at least 1 axe:
Gap close (1 chance)
Heavy attack (2 chances)
+ Enchants (2 chances)
+ 50% chance proc bleed dot (chance on each tic)
Surprise attacks (1 chance)
Used to proc on caltrops. Now it doesn't, same with how it doesn't on bleed. Even further nerf with no one going to run ww or vamp.This recent update has made me sad. Sad for the game. Sad for the community. Sad to pay whatever it is now. I want the previous eso back.0 -
Akavir_Sentinel✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well, at least we know how it's doing it, and it is indeed bugged. It's not supposed to proc that often.0 -
Rune_Relic✭✭✭✭✭
✭So with caltrops + camo stacking...
Its was stacking +15% chance each time to give 100% chance on every single hit DOT etc.
How many other skills work in a similar manner with PROC on hit ?
How many gear sets ?
One of the reasons I left Cyrodiil was two groups would meat up into a melee and our group would all be instantly oneshot (vs the same group).
The whole group.
There was no way we were that bad and they were that good.
This now makes sense.
We walked into a stacked proc on hit trap with caltrops on the floor or some other long duration ground aoe that can be spammed and carpet bombed.
I guess L2Exploit would be the more appropriate term these days
Root + ground aoe + dots + Stacked proc on damage overload = Mass Instagib.
No wonder the lag is strong with some groups.Edited by Rune_Relic on July 30, 2015 11:24PMAnything that can be exploited will be exploited3 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »I think I've just figured out why Expert/Evil/Camouflaged Hunter appear to stack multiple times.
The Camouflaged Hunter tooltip states that it has a 15% chance to proc against undead/daedra, and a 4% chance on everything else, and does extra damage from stealth against undead/daedra.
Well, it turns out that 15% and 4% chance to proc is from any form of attack damage. For example, I only used two skills and a bow heavy attack in this test against a Frost Atronach.
Camouflaged Hunter
Poison Injection
Dominion's Bow [deals 1090 unresistible damage]
It turned out like this. Now remember, this is the combat damage log from pressing a single button. All I did was stealth, activate Camouflaged Hunter, pull back the bow for a heavy attack, and press the button for Poison Injection to release the attack.
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Heavy Attack
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the Heavy Attack)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Damage Health
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the weapon enchant)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Poison Injection
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by Poison Injection)
Now, admittedly, I got extremely lucky that it proc'd on all three at once, but this shows that it can happen. So, I hit that poor Frost Atronach with 6 attacks in one second.
You didn't get extremely lucky. Frost Atronach is considered a Daedra. Camo Hunter did what it was supposed to.
I know how it works, and how it's supposed to work. I got extremely lucky in that it proc'd on all three hits at once. Each one of those "attacks", heavy, weapon enchant, and poison injection, only have a 15% proc chance each, even against daedra/undead.
What Xael means is that camo hunter has a 100% proc rate when attacking daedra/undead from stealth. You did not get lucky(well except the weapon enchant proc).
Any attack that is initiated while you are in stealth gets the camo hunter proc automatically. If you fire an attack, and manage to fire another before the first one hits(and unstealths you), then both attacks trigger the proc. Heavy attack+poison arrow will do this, as well as snipe+ambush, etc.Edited by Sharee on July 30, 2015 11:27PM0 -
Akavir_Sentinel✭✭✭✭✭
✭Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »I think I've just figured out why Expert/Evil/Camouflaged Hunter appear to stack multiple times.
The Camouflaged Hunter tooltip states that it has a 15% chance to proc against undead/daedra, and a 4% chance on everything else, and does extra damage from stealth against undead/daedra.
Well, it turns out that 15% and 4% chance to proc is from any form of attack damage. For example, I only used two skills and a bow heavy attack in this test against a Frost Atronach.
Camouflaged Hunter
Poison Injection
Dominion's Bow [deals 1090 unresistible damage]
It turned out like this. Now remember, this is the combat damage log from pressing a single button. All I did was stealth, activate Camouflaged Hunter, pull back the bow for a heavy attack, and press the button for Poison Injection to release the attack.
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Heavy Attack
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the Heavy Attack)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Damage Health
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the weapon enchant)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Poison Injection
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by Poison Injection)
Now, admittedly, I got extremely lucky that it proc'd on all three at once, but this shows that it can happen. So, I hit that poor Frost Atronach with 6 attacks in one second.
You didn't get extremely lucky. Frost Atronach is considered a Daedra. Camo Hunter did what it was supposed to.
I know how it works, and how it's supposed to work. I got extremely lucky in that it proc'd on all three hits at once. Each one of those "attacks", heavy, weapon enchant, and poison injection, only have a 15% proc chance each, even against daedra/undead.
What Xael means is that camo hunter has a 100% proc rate when attacking daedra/undead from stealth. You did not get lucky(well except the weapon enchant proc).
Any attack that is initiated while you are in stealth gets the proc automatically. If you fire an attack, and manage to fire another before the first one hits(and unstealths you), then both attacks get the bonus. Heavy attack+poison arrow will do this, as well as snipe+ambush, etc.
Nowhere on the skill tooltip does it say it's a guaranteed proc from stealth, but it's not supposed to work for multiple attacks that hit the target at once. For example, let's say that I stealthed, activated Camouflage Hunter, and hit a daedra/undead target with the DK skill Eruption/Cinder Storm which ticks ~17 times. Should that proc Camouflaged Hunter 17 times on that target? No.
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Akavir_Sentinel✭✭✭✭✭
✭Just did some more testing, and almost every single heavy attack against this Frost Atronach is proc'ing Camouflaged Hunter, even when I'm not in stealth. So much for that 15% chance, it's more like 90% to 95%.1 -
Akavir_Sentinel✭✭✭✭✭
✭SilverMERK wrote: »Did they not fix this on PC? They patched it for consols
It looks like they fixed the duration bug, but it's still proc'ing way more often than it should.0 -
Xeniph✭✭✭✭✭Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »I think I've just figured out why Expert/Evil/Camouflaged Hunter appear to stack multiple times.
The Camouflaged Hunter tooltip states that it has a 15% chance to proc against undead/daedra, and a 4% chance on everything else, and does extra damage from stealth against undead/daedra.
Well, it turns out that 15% and 4% chance to proc is from any form of attack damage. For example, I only used two skills and a bow heavy attack in this test against a Frost Atronach.
Camouflaged Hunter
Poison Injection
Dominion's Bow [deals 1090 unresistible damage]
It turned out like this. Now remember, this is the combat damage log from pressing a single button. All I did was stealth, activate Camouflaged Hunter, pull back the bow for a heavy attack, and press the button for Poison Injection to release the attack.
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Heavy Attack
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the Heavy Attack)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Damage Health
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by the weapon enchant)
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Poison Injection
You hit Frost Atronach for (x) damage with Camouflaged Hunter (proc'd by Poison Injection)
Now, admittedly, I got extremely lucky that it proc'd on all three at once, but this shows that it can happen. So, I hit that poor Frost Atronach with 6 attacks in one second.
You didn't get extremely lucky. Frost Atronach is considered a Daedra. Camo Hunter did what it was supposed to.
I know how it works, and how it's supposed to work. I got extremely lucky in that it proc'd on all three hits at once. Each one of those "attacks", heavy, weapon enchant, and poison injection, only have a 15% proc chance each, even against daedra/undead.
What Xael means is that camo hunter has a 100% proc rate when attacking daedra/undead from stealth. You did not get lucky(well except the weapon enchant proc).
Any attack that is initiated while you are in stealth gets the proc automatically. If you fire an attack, and manage to fire another before the first one hits(and unstealths you), then both attacks get the bonus. Heavy attack+poison arrow will do this, as well as snipe+ambush, etc.
Nowhere on the skill tooltip does it say it's a guaranteed proc from stealth, but it's not supposed to work for multiple attacks that hit the target at once. For example, let's say that I stealthed, activated Camouflage Hunter, and hit a daedra/undead target with the DK skill Eruption/Cinder Storm which ticks ~17 times. Should that proc Camouflaged Hunter 17 times on that target? No.
Camo hunters proc rate from stealth is 100% for daedra and undead. That's what the other posters are trying to point out.
It's the whole reason for the morph. Now I haven't tested the non stealth proc rate (15%/4%) as of yet on the pts, so I can't speak to that.
But to clarify- What your results from you first post were, are quite common of a rotation for gankers.Here since Beta.
Characters: All of them, both Stamina and Magicka.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »Nowhere on the skill tooltip does it say it's a guaranteed proc from stealth
It is a bit confusing i guess.
The current tooltip saysGives your attacks a 15% chance to cause an additional [x] Magic Damage against undead and Daedra and a 4% chance against all other enemies for 15 seconds.
If in stealth, attacks deal an extra [x] Magic Damage to undead and Daedra.
Notice that it does not say 'if in stealth, attacks have a chance to deal extra damage'. It says if in stealth, characters deal extra damage. But the wording of the whole tooltip can confuse the reader to think the 15% from the first line also applies to the 'when i stealth' line. It does not.
The old tooltip for camo hunter was much clearer(http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Fighters_Guild):Always hits Undead or Daedra for [33 / 34 / 35 / 36] Magic Damage when stealthed.
(the functionality of the guaranteed proc has not changed between the old and the new camo hunter, only the tooltip wording)Edited by Sharee on July 31, 2015 8:10AM0 -
AlcastClass RepresentativeAkavir_Sentinel wrote: »Well, at least we know how it's doing it, and it is indeed bugged. It's not supposed to proc that often.
lol? it says 15% chance, so why should it NOT be working on ANY attack you do?
btw, eruption or shockarmor(sorcskills) dont proc it for examplehttps://alcasthq.com - Alcasthq.com Builds & Guides
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