First of all no one should get telvar stones from kills where less than 50% of the damage sustained in the target were from pvp damage. The ability to sit and watch someone fight a mob and then hit with an execute to rob them as they fight mobs is a BAD BAD BAD game design. It makes the game even more attractive to sociopaths.

Second the entire player robbing system does not add any fun to the majority of the player base and it doubt it even is fun for the majority of he pvp'ers. The ONLY people who enjoy this kind of think are people who get enjoyment from hurting other people and do you REALLY want to cater to those kind of players because they destroy any game they infest if there are enough of them.

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I am not a fan of losing Tel Var Stones. There are going to be players who just sit on spawn points and farm TV stones from people. Maybe they just take a certain percentage from you instead of all of them.

Or maybe an RNG drop rate, everything else is RNG why should this be any different?

Was having fun up until I fought a grievous twilight hit some lag didn't see any attacks and then had all the damage happen within a second and killed by a templar that I didn't even see attack me.

The area is fun... but lost all my TVS all the time, thats about 500, and I don't like to loose them and to have to repair my armour everytime I died...It's a loose-loose situation.
Too many players ganking sewers entrances, spawn areas, and like others said, using npcs to attack you and then they just wait to make the killing blow and get the stones.
I like IC but not the TVS looting from players....a possible solution, imho:
- no TVS multiplier
- when you kill a player, you get 2x their TVS, but they don't loose any of them
- if you are killled by npcs, you loose 10-20% of your TVS 0

Got about 1000 stones banked after 2-3 hours of play, just killing mobs in the DC area of sewers in an ad-hoc group of three players. No enemy players encountered there, and the area was full of friendlies cleaning the place out. Mob respawn is fast enough, thankfully.

I expect on live the area will be very hard to gank players in since it is so close to the base - they just respawn there and overwhelm you eventually.

I have a suggestion

Owing to the problem of zerging and farming people I suggest a variation of mechanics in loss and gain of Tel Var stones based on your actions.

For example, If a player or a 4 man group is killing only monsters in IC, he has a green mark on him. An enemy player attacking and killing him just results in him spawning at the home base with half or even lesser stones lost. However, the enemy player starts getting a red meter that increases as he kills or damages more people, kind of like the justice system. This person will lose Tel Var stones on a percentage basis increasing with the increase of red meter.
To make this fair for players to take the chance of pvp and get into the risk-reward system, the multiplier shall be different in many ways for people with green mark and those with red meter.

Like, the pvers not engaging in any pvp activity should have a limit to their multiplier say x2
while the pvpers shall have a greater multiplier limit bar. In addition, the increase in the red meter could increase the rate, a little only, at which the multiplier gains points for more reward.

There will have to be certain points considered like
-killing a pvper with a larger red meter should give you an even greater meter increase, otherwise a green person could just pretend for a while and kill the biggest target. the damage should be significant however
-the meter could be dependent upon the number of Tel Var stones you have snatched from people, but not grinded from mobs... so like even a low red bar person could be hiding a lot of stones he has earned from killing mobs, and if attacked the person will die sure but lost stones will be equal to percentage of snatched tel var stones lost on basis of red bar + a fixed respectable small percentage lost from the pool of stones grinded out of mobs
-there could be milestones in the meter, with risks of getting caught increased by passing each one. This could include increased enemies' range of detection for you, blinking on the map once a minute, increased vulnerability to AOE abilities to discourage zergs and such
-to make it interesting, the milestones could provide a little boost to your stats encouraging more killing rather than hiding
-for pvers, to prevent other players from stealing boss kills, the tel var stone distribution can be based upon dps to the boss, nonetheless who killed him. The tank and healer should be considered as well by taking in account to the HPS and damage taken per second only in regards of players killing the boss, not other players
-and a player, no matter who, should never lose ALL the stones... cause that could be utterly discouraging; so like there should be always a minimum safe amount as a consolation reward i think

i am sure this is much more complicated than writing it here, to actually apply in game but i just wanted to give my two cents cause this could be really exciting!

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom Hi Jessica. Was playing with PvP guilds yesterday and we're all impressed! Some of these comments worry me if I'm honest - remember peopl share negative experiences 10 times more than positive.
We love this. We love this.

The only good thing to share about TV stones is like what? "I can steal stones someone earned with hard work while killing very difficult boss and i gain them with 0 effort like that" which is quite the opposite of something good. Unless your sense of morality is twisted in dark and weird way.

DDuke wrote: »

pikey2112b14a_ESO wrote: »

IWannaBeATiger wrote: »

No the good part is that they added a gambling system @MaximusDargus like everyone wanted except instead of taverns they added it to IC. Am I gonna hit a lag spike or is my opponent. Will I even see the spells hitting me or will I just fall on the ground and have the recap tell me what class killed me?

Be careful with that word,last time I checked gambling didn't involve ganking.some of us came to this game to escape that kind nonsense.

You can still escape it to the world of PvE grp dungeons/Trials & normal Cyrodiil (well, not the ganking part...)

Only now players that do enjoy risk/reward type PvP can finally enjoy it.

Options are good.


That said, there are many ways this system could improved, and since this is a feedback thread, I will go through a couple of points here:

Loading Screens

Getting ganked by 20-30 people while in loading screen, or right after loading screen is no fun.
There's no real way of avoiding that encounter, and you'll be lucky if you manage to escape it.

To fix this, I would give players who exit loading screen a 10-15 second invisibility & invulnerability that gets removed when attacking/healing another player or NPC.

That should discourage camping these locations, and perhaps even allow players to relocate safely & gank these campers instead.

Spawn Locations

Are these really necessary? I think the running distance isn't that long that just having people respawn at the Sewers base after dying couldn't work. It'd also add slightly more consequence to deaths and would help with creating an adrenaline filled experience. At the moment, you die & you're just straight back to the action.

Kind of the same problem Forward Camps had back in the days.

I agree at the loading screens. The difficult part is in determining if player still have loading screen or not? I think even if a player sees loading screen, his character might be in game already and game may think that he is playing already. Invisibility is good. A good idea would be to make small areas around those entry points with loading screen be non-pvp. A player inside cant attack anyone outside this small area. Also if player is in fight or attacked someone, he cant retreat back to that area.

Spawn location are necessary to prevent district entrance camping. If not that, players killed in imperial district would be send back all the way to the faction base just to find enemy camping sewer entrance on imperial districts side.

DDuke wrote: »

That said, there are many ways this system could improved, and since this is a feedback thread, I will go through a couple of points here:

Loading Screens

Getting ganked by 20-30 people while in loading screen, or right after loading screen is no fun.
There's no real way of avoiding that encounter, and you'll be lucky if you manage to escape it.

To fix this, I would give players who exit loading screen a 10-15 second invisibility & invulnerability that gets removed when attacking/healing another player or NPC.

That should discourage camping these locations, and perhaps even allow players to relocate safely & gank these campers instead.

Spawn Locations

Are these really necessary? I think the running distance isn't that long that just having people respawn at the Sewers base after dying couldn't work. It'd also add slightly more consequence to deaths and would help with creating an adrenaline filled experience. At the moment, you die & you're just straight back to the action.

Kind of the same problem Forward Camps had back in the days.

I would imagine it's a bug if someone still has a loading screen and can be killed. If there is a loading screen, the toon hasn't yet loaded into the world. If the toon is in the world, then there shouldn't be any more loading screen.

No, I don't think spawn points in the districts are necessary, particularly considering every base has direct access to every district anyway. The only benefit to them is that it cuts out one loading screen.

So my feedback as far as the TV stone system goes is that it is a boring, boring PvE grind of dumb mobs over and over and over. The mobs have no real AI, they just stand there waiting for you to kill them, and so you do for hours until someone kills you and you lose your stones, or else spend half your life travelling to and from the bank.

The only bright spot is that the gear you can buy with them is so underwhelming that I won't need to farm a single piece. I cant see a single gear set that is an improvement on what i'm currently wearing (hundings, morag tong and shadow walker on my stam toon and martial, healers, torugs on my magicka toon)..the only sad thing is the rise to vr16 means I now have to replace my gear with the same exact gear only 2 levels higher. Commence another boring grind.

The gear for this expansion should have been powerful gear sets designed specifically for PvP, and you can see in a way they tried to do that with the Assault/Support gear, but they haven't really succeeded, and even if they did succeed they would create a game where everyone wore the same two sets, another problem.

In fact this whole expansion suffers from the same problem...there isn't any point to it. I played 4 hours tonight, in which I explored the sewers, and found them to be extremely dull. I explored the entire City, and found it to be filled with drab, gothic scenery, static mobs, a depressing atmosphere and a sense of grind, grind grind. There are no objectives, its just basically a big arena filled with a mixture of mobs and players endlessly fighting with no actual objective. Dull and pointless.

Perhaps my view will change once its live, or once I play more, but for me personally without some real character progression I just don't see the point. Its a shame they didnt incorporate Spellcrafting into the whole thing somehow, now that would have given it a point...

What it really needs is some sort of 24 hour campaign, where you fight the other factions for control of the districts, and controlling the majority of districts opens up the imperial palace which contains...I don't know, something exciting. A new trial perhaps? Giant raid mobs who drop a truckload of stones...something, anything, would be more than we have right now, which is nothing but the grind...

DDuke wrote: »

pikey2112b14a_ESO wrote: »

IWannaBeATiger wrote: »

No the good part is that they added a gambling system @MaximusDargus like everyone wanted except instead of taverns they added it to IC. Am I gonna hit a lag spike or is my opponent. Will I even see the spells hitting me or will I just fall on the ground and have the recap tell me what class killed me?

Be careful with that word,last time I checked gambling didn't involve ganking.some of us came to this game to escape that kind nonsense.

You can still escape it to the world of PvE grp dungeons/Trials & normal Cyrodiil (well, not the ganking part...)

Only now players that do enjoy risk/reward type PvP can finally enjoy it.

Options are good.


That said, there are many ways this system could improved, and since this is a feedback thread, I will go through a couple of points here:

Loading Screens

Getting ganked by 20-30 people while in loading screen, or right after loading screen is no fun.
There's no real way of avoiding that encounter, and you'll be lucky if you manage to escape it.

To fix this, I would give players who exit loading screen a 10-15 second invisibility & invulnerability that gets removed when attacking/healing another player or NPC.

That should discourage camping these locations, and perhaps even allow players to relocate safely & gank these campers instead.

Spawn Locations

Are these really necessary? I think the running distance isn't that long that just having people respawn at the Sewers base after dying couldn't work. It'd also add slightly more consequence to deaths and would help with creating an adrenaline filled experience. At the moment, you die & you're just straight back to the action.

Kind of the same problem Forward Camps had back in the days.

completely agree!

Two things I didn't like.

1) I don't like the insta-aquistion of Tel Var stones. I had no idea how many I got from a mob, a boss, or a player. I know there is the counter on the bottom right, but without actually seeing them in a loot screen, it was not easy to get a general sense of how many I had or how fast I was acquiring them. Especially is a fast paced and frenetic environment of the IC.

2) I think players should actually have to loot defeated players to acquire the Tel Var stones. As it is, one of the most infuriating ways to die is to be sniped by someone who stays at maximum range and targets you when you are not in a position to fight back. I get it this is legit in war, but there is a reason why in the Middle Ages, archers prisoners had their hands cut off (if not outright killed) and snipers are often put up against a wall and shot in contravention of the Geneva Codes. People should not just automatically get a windfall of hundreds or thousands of Tel Var stones from just getting a kill, but they should have to at least approach the corpse and fight for the reward.

Joy_Division wrote: »

Two things I didn't like.

1) I don't like the insta-aquistion of Tel Var stones. I had no idea how many I got from a mob, a boss, or a player. I know there is the counter on the bottom right, but without actually seeing them in a loot screen, it was not easy to get a general sense of how many I had or how fast I was acquiring them. Especially is a fast paced and frenetic environment of the IC.

2) I think players should actually have to loot defeated players to acquire the Tel Var stones. As it is, one of the most infuriating ways to die is to be sniped by someone who stays at maximum range and targets you when you are not in a position to fight back. I get it this is legit in war, but there is a reason why in the Middle Ages, archers prisoners had their hands cut off (if not outright killed) and snipers are often put up against a wall and shot in contravention of the Geneva Codes. People should not just automatically get a windfall of hundreds or thousands of Tel Var stones from just getting a kill, but they should have to at least approach the corpse and fight for the reward.

Absolutely #2!!!!