Obligitory KEEP THE 100% LOSS thread.

Machiavelli · July 2015

I really like the dedication of the player base in the game. It really adds to the overall atmosphere of the game. From bloodfiend/werewolf killing in order to control the population of infected, to farming people for stones. The ruthlessness of it all builds a strong player base devoid of entitlement.

Sithisvoid · July 2015

They might as well make it hardcore so i can kill players in my alliance as well. Farm with them an hour then ice him and bounce.

Amsel_McKay · July 2015

Just dont play a healer... and dont expect heals in PvP... 100% to the person who gets killing blow

CP5 · July 2015

Nephys wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Exactly, the IC is trying, rather poorly, to keep pve'ers and pvp'ers in the same area for as long as possible. Pvp players won't get the small scale skirmishes they want since there are npc's everywhere with pve'ers fighting them, and pve players won't be able to fight or explore the space in peace since they are almost defenseless against the better optimized pvp builds. At this rate the IC will please no one by trying to entertain everyone. My own opinion.

I will not be bothering to buy the IC DLC. I am happy for the PvP'ers to have this if they want it, but nothing will entice me to do PvP when I simply don't like it, and don't want to do it. If the Devs think that forcing people is a good idea, they live in a vastly different world to a great number of people.

The funny thing is the IC looks more like a massive Pve public dungeon, that's in a pvp zone, unlocked by pvp means, with pvp enabled. Its almost like ZOS is saying "Pve'ers come here! New mobs to kill and stuff to grind!" just so they can line some easy kills up for the pvp player-base.

mousekime111rwb17_ESO · July 2015

Sithisvoid wrote: »

They might as well make it hardcore so i can kill players in my alliance as well. Farm with them an hour then ice him and bounce.

And what pray-tell would be the point of that.

Sithisvoid · July 2015

mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Sithisvoid wrote: »

They might as well make it hardcore so i can kill players in my alliance as well. Farm with them an hour then ice him and bounce.

And what pray-tell would be the point of that.

Realism

mousekime111rwb17_ESO · July 2015

CP5 wrote: »

Nephys wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Exactly, the IC is trying, rather poorly, to keep pve'ers and pvp'ers in the same area for as long as possible. Pvp players won't get the small scale skirmishes they want since there are npc's everywhere with pve'ers fighting them, and pve players won't be able to fight or explore the space in peace since they are almost defenseless against the better optimized pvp builds. At this rate the IC will please no one by trying to entertain everyone. My own opinion.

I will not be bothering to buy the IC DLC. I am happy for the PvP'ers to have this if they want it, but nothing will entice me to do PvP when I simply don't like it, and don't want to do it. If the Devs think that forcing people is a good idea, they live in a vastly different world to a great number of people.

The funny thing is the IC looks more like a massive Pve public dungeon, that's in a pvp zone, unlocked by pvp means, with pvp enabled. Its almost like ZOS is saying "Pve'ers come here! New mobs to kill and stuff to grind!" just so they can line some easy kills up for the pvp player-base.

I for one have guilds with players who individually like either PVE or PVP and I can tell you right now I could EASILY get 6 people together (one standard PVE group with 2 dedicated PVPers as an escort) to run around and protect us while we farm TV stones, they still get credit for the PVE as part of the group and still get to enjoy a PVP experience, and I get to feel a little bit safer.

Machiavelli · July 2015

mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Sithisvoid wrote: »

They might as well make it hardcore so i can kill players in my alliance as well. Farm with them an hour then ice him and bounce.

And what pray-tell would be the point of that.

More stones.

mousekime111rwb17_ESO · July 2015

Sithisvoid wrote: »

mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Sithisvoid wrote: »

They might as well make it hardcore so i can kill players in my alliance as well. Farm with them an hour then ice him and bounce.

And what pray-tell would be the point of that.

Realism

sure thing so long as there's a 5000 gold bounty on killing other players of your own faction and a bank lock out period.

Etharian · July 2015

snackrat wrote: »

If this were an ideal world where everyone had the same resources maybe that would make sense.

But it isn't, and we don't. Someone who's based in Australia or New Zealand is operating at a significant disadvantage compared to an American in the same state as the US server. Someone using broadband is at a disadvantage over someone using fibre. These differences will be highlighted come the patch, because of the efforts to reduce PvP burst.

Should PvPers be rewarded for killing other players? Yes, absolutely. But connecting one players loss to another players gain directly makes every act in PvP no long 'just a game'. It's personal. You are actively and deliberately preventing their progression for the sake of your own enjoyment.

that my friend is called HIGH RISK VS REWARD. if you dont like pvp you have the option not to, you are not forced to do anything. You can complain all you want but im happy its 100% of tokens and hope it stays that way for the excitement of pvp

CP5 · July 2015

mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Nephys wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Exactly, the IC is trying, rather poorly, to keep pve'ers and pvp'ers in the same area for as long as possible. Pvp players won't get the small scale skirmishes they want since there are npc's everywhere with pve'ers fighting them, and pve players won't be able to fight or explore the space in peace since they are almost defenseless against the better optimized pvp builds. At this rate the IC will please no one by trying to entertain everyone. My own opinion.

I will not be bothering to buy the IC DLC. I am happy for the PvP'ers to have this if they want it, but nothing will entice me to do PvP when I simply don't like it, and don't want to do it. If the Devs think that forcing people is a good idea, they live in a vastly different world to a great number of people.

The funny thing is the IC looks more like a massive Pve public dungeon, that's in a pvp zone, unlocked by pvp means, with pvp enabled. Its almost like ZOS is saying "Pve'ers come here! New mobs to kill and stuff to grind!" just so they can line some easy kills up for the pvp player-base.

I for one have guilds with players who individually like either PVE or PVP and I can tell you right now I could EASILY get 6 people together (one standard PVE group with 2 dedicated PVPers as an escort) to run around and protect us while we farm TV stones, they still get credit for the PVE as part of the group and still get to enjoy a PVP experience, and I get to feel a little bit safer.

It'll be interesting to see if that will be enough, or just how groups are built in general. See how people react when baited by the stones.

Zershar_Vemod · July 2015

This thread sure is going places..

mousekime111rwb17_ESO · July 2015

Etharian wrote: »

snackrat wrote: »

If this were an ideal world where everyone had the same resources maybe that would make sense.

But it isn't, and we don't. Someone who's based in Australia or New Zealand is operating at a significant disadvantage compared to an American in the same state as the US server. Someone using broadband is at a disadvantage over someone using fibre. These differences will be highlighted come the patch, because of the efforts to reduce PvP burst.

Should PvPers be rewarded for killing other players? Yes, absolutely. But connecting one players loss to another players gain directly makes every act in PvP no long 'just a game'. It's personal. You are actively and deliberately preventing their progression for the sake of your own enjoyment.

that my friend is called HIGH RISK VS REWARD. if you dont like pvp you have the option not to, you are not forced to do anything. You can complain all you want but im happy its 100% of tokens and hope it stays that way for the excitement of pvp

Now ZoS will be able to REALLY market their game as having EXCITING PvP right?!

Etharian · July 2015

Sithisvoid wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

100% is too harsh if you get disconnected. I get DC every 1-2 hour or so in Cyrodil atm.

Right? And it's going to make everyone run in stealth zergs and exploit loading screens more than they are now. Prepare for constant lag

srry but your logic is fail, EACH ZONE in IC is a seperate server technically and they tested the spill over from one zone to the next to see if there was lag and there wasnt. If this is the case then these loading screens wont happen. your doom and gloom assumptions are just that.[/i]

Etharian · July 2015

Merlight wrote: »

snackrat wrote: »

Should PvPers be rewarded for killing other players? Yes, absolutely. But connecting one players loss to another players gain directly makes every act in PvP no long 'just a game'. It's personal. You are actively and deliberately preventing their progression for the sake of your own enjoyment.

That's the nature of competition. I read about people running trials with all their 8 characters, filling the leaderboards and thus preventing other players' progression (if by progression you mean gear rewards).

People who can't stand being killed simply won't be satisfied, it's irrelevant how many stones they gain or lose, they will only go there to do their chore, and leave as soon as possible.

All of those people scared of losing their rewards tend to think that reducing the loot to 50% will somehow improve their situation. It will not. Look, the guy who just killed you and robbed you of all your stones, can now lose them to someone else. If you reduced the loot to 50%, he would have 25% of your stones safe in his pocket, because his killer would only take 50% of his loot. So in effect, reducing loot to 50% gives the ganker a guaranteed reward for killing you. A system with lower risk will attract more gankers, not less.

Give this smart man a MONSTER COOKIE! he knows what hes talking about.

mousekime111rwb17_ESO · July 2015

Merlight wrote: »

snackrat wrote: »

Should PvPers be rewarded for killing other players? Yes, absolutely. But connecting one players loss to another players gain directly makes every act in PvP no long 'just a game'. It's personal. You are actively and deliberately preventing their progression for the sake of your own enjoyment.

That's the nature of competition. I read about people running trials with all their 8 characters, filling the leaderboards and thus preventing other players' progression (if by progression you mean gear rewards).

People who can't stand being killed simply won't be satisfied, it's irrelevant how many stones they gain or lose, they will only go there to do their chore, and leave as soon as possible.

All of those people scared of losing their rewards tend to think that reducing the loot to 50% will somehow improve their situation. It will not. Look, the guy who just killed you and robbed you of all your stones, can now lose them to someone else. If you reduced the loot to 50%, he would have 25% of your stones safe in his pocket, because his killer would only take 50% of his loot. So in effect, reducing loot to 50% gives the ganker a guaranteed reward for killing you. A system with lower risk will attract more gankers, not less.

Couldn't have put it better myself.
My main concern though is the total removal of the death penalty as it will turn that area into 'just another grind zone'

Etharian · July 2015

dday3six wrote: »

I'd think something like 70-50% for player death and 35-25% for monster death. At 100 for player and 10 for monster seems like players would just rabbit for the nearest pack and let it kill them.

and whats wrong with that? seems like a decent way to avoid getting ganked/ losing stones on top of multipple other ways of keeping your stones safe.

Too many PVers and carebears want everything for free, and casuals.. remember .. this is a PVP Expansion. Your option to OPT OUT is always there. You already get free TV stones from DAILYS and the QUESTLINE that are in boxes safe until you open them. Cant have your cake and eat it too.

mousekime111rwb17_ESO · July 2015

Etharian wrote: »

dday3six wrote: »

I'd think something like 70-50% for player death and 35-25% for monster death. At 100 for player and 10 for monster seems like players would just rabbit for the nearest pack and let it kill them.

and whats wrong with that? seems like a decent way to avoid getting ganked/ losing stones on top of multipple other ways of keeping your stones safe.

Too many PVers and carebears want everything for free, and casuals.. remember .. this is a PVP Expansion. Your option to OPT OUT is always there. You already get free TV stones from DAILYS and the QUESTLINE that are in boxes safe until you open them. Cant have your cake and eat it too.

SOOO many carebears - don't make me bring up Doshia again...

Attorneyatlawl · July 2015

CP5 wrote: »

I hope more people will see the major flaw in this system, least one of the major flaws I noticed. Pve builds are good at killing mobs, and mobs drop a lot of stones. Pvp builds can't kill mobs that well, but can easily kill poorly prepared players. If two players run into eachother, one with a pvp build and one with a pve build, but both with equal skill, who would win? This system is designed for players to farm each other, nothing more. Pve players simply loose all their progress and pvp players don't get the fair and engaging fights they are looking for.

Mobs are extremely easy to kill in any case. PVP'ers run with PVP builds. At most you might see someone swapping a single skill out for an easy AOE to clear packs as they move, but that's not even a need in most good PVPers' setups in the first place.

Recremen · July 2015

I'd prefer 50% losses myself, since it seems looting is automatic and I have no option to just... not do that to people, apparently. All the fussing over pandering to PvEers is equivalent to all the fussing over it pandering to PvP zergs and gankers. I think 50% losses still gives significant risk without dipping too far into pro PvP predation. And I'd like to keep my reputation of not being a jerk in PvP, which probably would be an untenable goal if and when my group accidentally targets a PvE team and nabs all their stones in a few scant seconds.

Rylana · July 2015

You know what this thread really tells me

There are an awful lot of super elitist smug pve players that know the moment a PvP player is involved, their unwarranted sense of self importance gets kicked down the crapper and they finally get to see just how much they actually suck at the game and knowledge of mechanics.

Get used to it, your days of getting best in slot gear from easy/predictable mechanics are over.

Perhaps your attitudes will kick down a peg now.

AFrostWolf · July 2015

DARK SOULS. This game needs more DARK SOULS.

technohic · July 2015

Etharian wrote: »

dday3six wrote: »

I'd think something like 70-50% for player death and 35-25% for monster death. At 100 for player and 10 for monster seems like players would just rabbit for the nearest pack and let it kill them.

and whats wrong with that? seems like a decent way to avoid getting ganked/ losing stones on top of multipple other ways of keeping your stones safe.

Too many PVers and carebears want everything for free, and casuals.. remember .. this is a PVP Expansion. Your option to OPT OUT is always there. You already get free TV stones from DAILYS and the QUESTLINE that are in boxes safe until you open them. Cant have your cake and eat it too.

Take it easy with the casual talk. I'm pretty casual and I love the idea. Gives us something to really fight over. Adds something to lose other than time of a long horse ride or some buffs that mean more to PvE players than to me. And as a casual player, fighting for someone else to be/stay emporer? All find and good but stones will be much more direct.

leepalmer95 · July 2015

technohic wrote: »

Etharian wrote: »

dday3six wrote: »

I'd think something like 70-50% for player death and 35-25% for monster death. At 100 for player and 10 for monster seems like players would just rabbit for the nearest pack and let it kill them.

and whats wrong with that? seems like a decent way to avoid getting ganked/ losing stones on top of multipple other ways of keeping your stones safe.

Too many PVers and carebears want everything for free, and casuals.. remember .. this is a PVP Expansion. Your option to OPT OUT is always there. You already get free TV stones from DAILYS and the QUESTLINE that are in boxes safe until you open them. Cant have your cake and eat it too.

Take it easy with the casual talk. I'm pretty casual and I love the idea. Gives us something to really fight over. Adds something to lose other than time of a long horse ride or some buffs that mean more to PvE players than to me. And as a casual player, fighting for someone else to be/stay emporer? All find and good but stones will be much more direct.

i'm more bothered about the elitist pvp zergers/gankers which are likely having a party as zos just told them there literally designing a dlc for their particular needs.

Etharian · July 2015

Keep the bumps going, this needs to stay! 100% ! SPARTA!

Acrolas · July 2015

So how many stones do you actually need for each piece of new armor? If it's one million, I don't even care if it's 100% loss rate. At that rate, there will be VR 17 armor out and a new pony show by the time anyone farms enough for a full set.

It would be like a time sink disguised as another time sink disguised as yet another time sink disguised as a reward system.

Emma_Overload · July 2015

Machiavelli wrote: »

I really like the dedication of the player base in the game. It really adds to the overall atmosphere of the game. From bloodfiend/werewolf killing in order to control the population of infected, to farming people for stones. The ruthlessness of it all builds a strong player base devoid of entitlement.

You have the best match between a comment and a username I've ever seen in this forum

Acrolas · July 2015

Machiavelli didn't favor cruelty over the long-term goodwill of the people. Only when it preserved the safety of leadership or state. Machiavelli condemned gratuitous cruelty.

Etharian · July 2015

mousekime111rwb17_ESO wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Nephys wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Exactly, the IC is trying, rather poorly, to keep pve'ers and pvp'ers in the same area for as long as possible. Pvp players won't get the small scale skirmishes they want since there are npc's everywhere with pve'ers fighting them, and pve players won't be able to fight or explore the space in peace since they are almost defenseless against the better optimized pvp builds. At this rate the IC will please no one by trying to entertain everyone. My own opinion.

I will not be bothering to buy the IC DLC. I am happy for the PvP'ers to have this if they want it, but nothing will entice me to do PvP when I simply don't like it, and don't want to do it. If the Devs think that forcing people is a good idea, they live in a vastly different world to a great number of people.

The funny thing is the IC looks more like a massive Pve public dungeon, that's in a pvp zone, unlocked by pvp means, with pvp enabled. Its almost like ZOS is saying "Pve'ers come here! New mobs to kill and stuff to grind!" just so they can line some easy kills up for the pvp player-base.

I for one have guilds with players who individually like either PVE or PVP and I can tell you right now I could EASILY get 6 people together (one standard PVE group with 2 dedicated PVPers as an escort) to run around and protect us while we farm TV stones, they still get credit for the PVE as part of the group and still get to enjoy a PVP experience, and I get to feel a little bit safer.

See someone with brains , instead of crying NO I WANT FREEZ WARES EVYWHERE I GO AS A PVER... he actually took the time to brainstorm and come up with a viable solution that makes IC more exciting/safer for him.

LEGENDARYYY · July 2015

I'm gonna play so much Imperial City that when I leave the place I'll have sunglasses ready IRL.

From what I saw in ESO Live the system seems fantastic!