Farorin wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

This is worst thing from all the IC announcement.

ZOS starts encouraging leeching and parasytying of other players. Because thats what its called, someone spends hour-two playing and getting stones and then he gets ganked by some PVP *** and dies because of him and/or cyriodiil lags losing it.

Anyone who finds that "exciting" and "fun" that he will be able to leech and parasyte on others work, WOW, your parents must be proud of you for having such moral compass.

By that logic, a game of poker or blackjack, hell, any game where there is risk of loss and incentive of reward, must be the devil's doing.

In poker, most people aren't stupid enough to play against a guy who automatically gets 10 aces at every draw because he's been farming aces 24/7 for the last year (and has three friends beside him who do also). We're not talking fair fights here. If groups of VR 16's are ganking stones, no one is going to be able to go into IC unless they bring an army too.

Pallmor wrote: »

Farorin wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

This is worst thing from all the IC announcement.

ZOS starts encouraging leeching and parasytying of other players. Because thats what its called, someone spends hour-two playing and getting stones and then he gets ganked by some PVP *** and dies because of him and/or cyriodiil lags losing it.

Anyone who finds that "exciting" and "fun" that he will be able to leech and parasyte on others work, WOW, your parents must be proud of you for having such moral compass.

By that logic, a game of poker or blackjack, hell, any game where there is risk of loss and incentive of reward, must be the devil's doing.

In poker, most people aren't stupid enough to play against a guy who automatically gets 10 aces at every draw because he's been farming aces 24/7 for the last year (and has three friends beside him who do also). We're not talking fair fights here. If groups of VR 16's are ganking stones, no one is going to be able to go into IC unless they bring an army too.

Which is exactly the point of IC, creating PvP encounters...

There really is a lot to this game. I enjoy the PvE immensely and I've enjoyed learning various skills to make myself more effective. There were times as a Nightblade when I was unable to live through pulling 3 mobs at once and could not solo world bosses or dolmens at level. After learning more about the skills available to me this became simple. I now can solo Craglorn delves and most overworld content. It wasn't about CP (which I have about 130), it was about learning my class and adjusting my skills to what I wanted to accomplish.

When I started to PvP I ran into similar issues. I've read and talked with others who offered advice and have again adjusted my play style and utilized new skills to become proficient. Because of what I learned during PvP, I'm a much better PvE player as well.

I really hate that so many PVE players will hardly give PvP a shot and when they do, it's usually very brief. Get out there and learn what works and how you can contribute. Even a low level player who does nothing but travel to keeps that are being attacked and sets up siege equipment on the walls to defend can contribute and earn lots of AP. And when you die? What have you lost? There isn't even a repair cost!

How much easier could they make this for you? I'm playing with a group in Cyrodiil nightly who never thought they would want to PvP and it's getting to the point this is all they want to do now because it's so much fun.

I think the reaction to the Tel Var stones is very similar. Over reaction by players who have yet to even give it a try. My reccomendation is to give it a solid try and then give feedback if it isn't working well. To me this sounds like a fantastic system.

I personally think APs are used to store the Stones, so it gives more purpose for APs what this game is sorely lacking, bigger coward you're, more APs you need to spend, wildies goes without. It cant be that harsh this is mainstream game anyway.

Did you see the Dev post about the changes to Cyrodiil and removal of duplicate line of sight checks ( among other things to improve performance?

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

There are improvements being made to the LOS checks and AE abilities in general that should help with the performance issues we pointed out in the ESO PVP 2015 update thread. Also just watched 120 bots fighting each other in Imperial City in 1 district (with 3 other districts loaded with 120 bots too) and any abilities shot off just fine.

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

The bots were casting a variety of abilities including AE's, also while fighting sweepers, base-pop and each other. They were clustered tightly so all of the combat resolutions had to be done in a single server cell which is the most strenuous. Now we aren't saying "huzzah! It's cured!" because this is just a single test and as we've stated, isn't a silver bullet as there are plenty of other scenarios we still need testing on.

So let me get this straight...

Most PvE'rs already hate encountering others, and now that there is finally going to be new content, they decided "well, we haven't released any PvP content since launch, so.... why not make it both?"

I'm sorry, but being forced to PvP to experience "new content" unless we want to grind the same couple of dungeons (like we have been doing for months) is unacceptable.

I, like many others, don't really care about the alliance war. I want to fight daedra, not other players.

Call me a PvE care bear if you want, but this is how I want to play my game, and I don't begrudge you for liking PvP.

I am sick of all "max-level" content being in a PvP zone.

I see both sides to this:

asteldian wrote: »

For all we know a death in IC means you lose one or 5 stones. It is unlikely to be uncapped where one death loses all 200 or whatever you have. I think people are worrying a bit prematurely.

@asteldian, if you're lingering in a hostile area with 200 stones, you should absolutely lose them all.

You can bank them, and I'm sure there will be bank access of some kind in safe zone IC. It's that or they should be on cooldown - you hang onto them for so long, they are no longer lootable.

If you grind just for stones, and you never take time to "check your six," then you are taking your own chances the more you acquire.

I don't carry around my entire paycheck in my wallet for the very same reason.

NDwarf wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

"Fight Molag Bal's personal guard, the elite Xivkyn, and other invaders from Coldharbour to win Tel Var Stones, the currency used to trade for mighty Veteran Rank 16 armor sets."

If you read that carefully, stones drop from PVE monsters. So first thing is to kill enemy players, then you can start farming stones, its up to you how long you want to do it, but if enemy gets back and kill you, you lose it. So basically IC is stone farming place, but enemy can come and screw up your day.

Think about the positives, when no-lifers and HC guys get them, they are the very first to get the best gear, so they dont probably care so much, so casuals and new players can get them quite easily from them. This also prevents ganking, guy go to gank and steal tons of stones, but eventually he dies, so its not smart, no griefing.

I know I'd stealth gank with my nb, collect stones, then use the unstuck command to teleport me to the shrine and use the bank near the shrine. Run back, rinse and repeat.

Or mail them if that works...

If they are sellable on traders then hot damn $$$$$ here I come. So glad my first and main character is a stealthy, ganky, bow NB muhahaha.

No need for 1 shot kills, just hang back at a red vs yellow fight with my DC character, wait for a player's health to drop to 30%, snipe shot from shadows for the kill steal, drop back into stealth, and profit.

@NDwarf , Again, they're bankable. They should not be mailable, and you shouldn't have the option of using /stuck to the wayshrine while you have stones on your person, or you have the option to forfeit the stones if you do.

Sucks for the legitimate stuck situations, but after a gank, of all things, you shouldn't have the option of cowarding out to the nearest wayshrine to secure your 'winnings.' You should have to run them, just like scrolls, same as everyone else.

When you're 10 feet from freedom and someone ganks the ganker, we'll see if you still feel the same way.

There should be hostile patrols (Like Imperials are in open world Cyrodiil) that actually patrol. This BS of hiding like a little schoolgirl in one spot waiting for someone to walk by is a stretch to be called "skilled play," especially when you want to run for the hills the moment you've gotten what you wanted.

You want to stealth kill, fine, but you should be obligated to watch out for your own safety at the same time, not camp and press 2 buttons.

Adding a little risk is OK, adding a liitle consequence for dying is new for ESO but could work.

But if it is done in such a way that you can spend hours playing PvE, PvP and doing dungeons to earn enough of these stones only to get zerged on your way out by some l33t guild who then run off with all your loot then this game just became everything I hate about MMos.

Reality check, the world is full of a-holes, some of them play this game and they will take pleasure in spoiling other people's gaming fun and honestly believe they are cool while doing it. If ZOS feed them then I suspect they will quietly lose a lot more players than those who will vocally support this.

Yinmaigao wrote: »

So let me get this straight...

Most PvE'rs already hate encountering others, and now that there is finally going to be new content, they decided "well, we haven't released any PvP content since launch, so.... why not make it both?"

I'm sorry, but being forced to PvP to experience "new content" unless we want to grind the same couple of dungeons (like we have been doing for months) is unacceptable.

I, like many others, don't really care about the alliance war. I want to fight daedra, not other players.

Call me a PvE care bear if you want, but this is how I want to play my game, and I don't begrudge you for liking PvP.

I am sick of all "max-level" content being in a PvP zone.

You do begrudge PvPers for liking PvP. Because you and many others like you decided at some point you wanted to force developers to make MMOs centered around PVE. Can you explain to me why you dont just play single player games or games allowing you to group with friends to fight mindless and non challenging AI?

All the crying here because some of you might have to interact with other players and that sometimes that interaction might not go your way blows my mind. This is supposed to be an MMO and its 99% geared towards the care bear mentality you want let us have a 1% risk factor to pvp without getting all pissy.

Elitetownie wrote: »

Dru1076 wrote: »

Elitetownie wrote: »

Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »

Tholian1 wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

IMO, PVEers should travel in groups of 10 or more and have a tank with guard on while questing. Make it require more than a solo ganker oneshot combo to take their stones.

Why bother trying to get an army together to protect you from gankers so you can PvE? Hardly seems worth the hassle.

Why bother sitting in a corner stealthed waiting for a lone PvE straggler so you can gank him and take a stone? Hardly seems worth the hassle.

Because its fun? Games are designed for mindless pvers and its nice to spoil the party for them every once in a while and force them to actually think on their feet. A pvp player dies and shrugs it off and moves on but a PVEr cries, posts for nerfs on the forums an campaigns for the removal of all player conflict in every aspect of an mmo.

Interesting. it is statements like this that remind me why I am very proud to say I am not an MMO guy. What kind of person enjoys ruining anyone's party? That so many put an awesome on this post makes me sad. If your idea of fun is making people unhappy, I hope Karma finds you before you have too high a bill.

There are many words I like to use to describe people. Words like "kind" and "trustworthy" and "pleasant". The only words I could use in relation to a person with this idea of a good time would get me a lifetime ban.

Unless this a deliberate troll post... In which case: Well done. One the best I have ever seen.

You are playing a game first and foremost. You have a plethora of choices when it comes to games both single player and multiplayer that you can choose from that include 0 contact with other players or highly restricted contact/interactions. Its people like you who cry because you cant have all games built to suit your easily discouraged mentality that destroys games particularly the MMOs which should revolve around player interaction both good and bad.

You are the exact person i hope to gank while your farming because you take the game to seriosly which ruins it for a lot of mature people that can keep things in perspective. When someone takes your cookie you cry and scream instead of shrugging it off and moving forward. The fact that you would make some kind of judgement on my personal character based on how a play a VIDEO GAME also says a lot.

You are the RPer that plays an MMO centered around conflict but refuses to engage in conflict. I have seen you since the days of UO screaming for a Trammel and i will never agree with you or understand the logic behind that play style.

And youre a snobby PvPer that gives the rest of us PvPers a bad name. You claim that PvEers cry for nerfs but the truth is PvEers are very much less likely to call for a nerf...Theyre more likely to call for a buff. Its the Snobby, I know it all and everyone should play my way PvPer nimrods that call for nerfs because they couldnt get an easy kill with their Uber Flavor of the Month Build.

Elitetownie wrote: »

Akavir_Sentinel wrote: »

Tholian1 wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

IMO, PVEers should travel in groups of 10 or more and have a tank with guard on while questing. Make it require more than a solo ganker oneshot combo to take their stones.

Why bother trying to get an army together to protect you from gankers so you can PvE? Hardly seems worth the hassle.

Why bother sitting in a corner stealthed waiting for a lone PvE straggler so you can gank him and take a stone? Hardly seems worth the hassle.

Because its fun? Games are designed for mindless pvers and its nice to spoil the party for them every once in a while and force them to actually think on their feet. A pvp player dies and shrugs it off and moves on but a PVEr cries, posts for nerfs on the forums and campaigns for the removal of all player conflict in every aspect of an mmo.

Wait... did a PvPer actually accuse PvEers of running to the forums to beg for nerfs?

Pangnirtung wrote: »

Elitetownie wrote: »

You are the exact person i hope to gank while your farming because you take the game to seriosly which ruins it for a lot of mature people that can keep things in perspective. When someone takes your cookie you cry and scream instead of shrugging it off and moving forward.

It sounds to me that it is you that is taking the game too seriously. LOL

You might want to shrug this off like you advise others to do and move forward. Teapot? Kettle?

What are you even talking about?

Elitetownie wrote: »

Yinmaigao wrote: »

So let me get this straight...

Most PvE'rs already hate encountering others, and now that there is finally going to be new content, they decided "well, we haven't released any PvP content since launch, so.... why not make it both?"

I'm sorry, but being forced to PvP to experience "new content" unless we want to grind the same couple of dungeons (like we have been doing for months) is unacceptable.

I, like many others, don't really care about the alliance war. I want to fight daedra, not other players.

Call me a PvE care bear if you want, but this is how I want to play my game, and I don't begrudge you for liking PvP.

I am sick of all "max-level" content being in a PvP zone.

You do begrudge PvPers for liking PvP. Because you and many others like you decided at some point you wanted to force developers to make MMOs centered around PVE. Can you explain to me why you dont just play single player games or games allowing you to group with friends to fight mindless and non challenging AI?

All the crying here because some of you might have to interact with other players and that sometimes that interaction might not go your way blows my mind. This is supposed to be an MMO and its 99% geared towards the care bear mentality you want let us have a 1% risk factor to pvp without getting all pissy.

@Elitetownie

Simplly because I don't want to have to endure one aspect of a game to enjoy another does not make me begrudge the player, it makes me displeased with the design.

If you ask most PvE players, they want to have reasons to group up with other players and do things. Unfortunately, the way the system is designed, it is more beneficial to play solo. On the other side of this coin, I am not "forcing developers to make an MMO centred around PvE". That has been the way they are for a long time.

As I stated in my post, I would have rather had IC be a strictly PvP zone, not a mish-mash of both. I can certainly recognize that PvP needs some love, and regularly occurring small scale battles would do the trick.

Make no mistake, I am not a fan of PvP, but I would never hate another player for liking it.

I like this game and want to support it, but don't want to just be fodder for gankers in order to make their game play "more fun".