Are we EVER going to get a patch that actually has CONTENT in it?

LatinLegacy · June 2015

spawn10459 wrote: »

LatinLegacy wrote: »

I know what Marvel Heroes is & that is a god awful comparison. For one, it's an ARPG with MMO features, not an MMORPG. Secondly, that level of design in that game is amateurish compared to the scale that ESO is. Pushing content out on a game like Marvel Heroes is effortless seeing how simplistic it is. That's like comparing Minesweeper to Minecraft.

your joking right.

I guess this is why MH makes more Money then ZOS?

Yeah, because you're comparing a 100% F2P low system requirement game to a B2P game that requires a decent system or a $400 console. Not a fair comparison in any way no matter what kind of dispute you choose to pull out.

Huggernaut · June 2015

Bacongineer wrote: »

Huggernaut wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

Huggernaut wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

The reality of the industry is that the ROI of a content patch is much lower than the ROI of a DLC. Adding new content to a DLC is a much much better investment than adding content to a patch which is transparent to most potential buyers.

You really shouldn't expect too many content patches. A patch in this game is exactly what it is, a patch, fix stuff. If you want more content, wait for DLCs.

You may not like it, but that's how businesses usually work.

and it's that kind of sheeple attitude that allows game companies to gouge us more and more every year.

Thanks!

The industry changes. It might not have been that way 10 years ago, but now it is. The goal is to make money.

Content patches = low ROI, DLC = high ROI

You can argue that this is a sheeple attitude, I call it being realist to the current market situation.

You are proving my point for me, thank you.

It's because people like yourself (sheeple) find ways to justify game companies actions, that they have been able to steadily increase the pace at which they attempt to screw us over, year by year, over the past 10+ years and they continue to grow more bold every year because people like yourself just go (shrug).

If some people actually decided to grow a brain and stopped giving companies that are screwing over their populations, maybe they'd wisen up and actually start acting like proper companies again.

Businesses don't work for free and they certainly don't really care about a customer which brings in low money. You can complain all you want that you are getting screwed over, but that's how the world works, and if you really want to change the gaming industry, then start a company, work for free (content patches) and hope everyone sees you as the savior of gaming and buys your game before you default.

who the hell ever said they had to work for free?

do you have ANY FKN idea at ALL how much money cash shops make?

look at league legends / dota just as a example of EXTREME cash shops they literally make close to a billion dollars a year just from their cash shops alone. Nothing else.

This is exactly why more and more games are going F2P, because they want that cash shop golden goose laying eggs for them.

So you are basically saying it's ok for them to gouge us multiple times,

- first on buying the game (originally sold as a P2P title to sucker people into buying and subbing initially)
- then on the cash shop when it goes free
- then yet again on dlc, because they refuse to release any content whatsoever aside from paid DLC

and you're cool with all that? really?

Sinbaar · June 2015

Huggernaut · June 2015

LatinLegacy wrote: »

spawn10459 wrote: »

LatinLegacy wrote: »

I know what Marvel Heroes is & that is a god awful comparison. For one, it's an ARPG with MMO features, not an MMORPG. Secondly, that level of design in that game is amateurish compared to the scale that ESO is. Pushing content out on a game like Marvel Heroes is effortless seeing how simplistic it is. That's like comparing Minesweeper to Minecraft.

your joking right.

I guess this is why MH makes more Money then ZOS?

Yeah, because you're comparing a 100% F2P low system requirement game to a B2P game that requires a decent system or a $400 console. Not a fair comparison in any way no matter what kind of dispute you choose to pull out.

rofl "low system requirement" you obviously have NOT played marvel heroes.

I can personally assure you, as anyone with 2 brain cells to rub together that actually plays that game and this game, that ESO needs significantly lower system specs to run far more smoothly and I might add, at a much higher graphics quality then marvel heroes does.

It may appear simplistic at face value, but I assure you, it will make your system cry at max settings.

Gandrhulf_Harbard · June 2015

LatinLegacy wrote: »

[I can be sat down with both games & even with my minimal programming knowledge, since I was a Computer Science minor, I can GUARANTEE I would have a much easier time creating content with the engine that Marvel Heroes uses. So my statement still stands, it's simplistic & I would gladly post it on their forums when directly compared to ESO.

I DON'T have any formal education with computers.

I do have three adventures published within Neverwinter Foundry, one that was "featured" by Cryptic, all three have a 4Star+ rating (out of 5).

All three of them are at least as good as any quest line I have played in ESO; and the final part is way better than anything I have played in ESO.

I have a single room, a library, that alone took 30-40 hours to build, and is not even used for combat, just a location for two dialogues and a couple of books to help set the story.

The effort and difficulty involved in making content is no excuse for bad content.

If the ESO content creation software is clunky and difficult to use the ONLY people to blame for that are Zenimax - they chose it.

So they (and their sycophantic fanbois) can't use it as an excuse as to why we have a game with no new content.

All The Best

Seafoam_hydra · June 2015

Huggernaut wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

Huggernaut wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

Huggernaut wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

The reality of the industry is that the ROI of a content patch is much lower than the ROI of a DLC. Adding new content to a DLC is a much much better investment than adding content to a patch which is transparent to most potential buyers.

You really shouldn't expect too many content patches. A patch in this game is exactly what it is, a patch, fix stuff. If you want more content, wait for DLCs.

You may not like it, but that's how businesses usually work.

and it's that kind of sheeple attitude that allows game companies to gouge us more and more every year.

Thanks!

The industry changes. It might not have been that way 10 years ago, but now it is. The goal is to make money.

Content patches = low ROI, DLC = high ROI

You can argue that this is a sheeple attitude, I call it being realist to the current market situation.

You are proving my point for me, thank you.

It's because people like yourself (sheeple) find ways to justify game companies actions, that they have been able to steadily increase the pace at which they attempt to screw us over, year by year, over the past 10+ years and they continue to grow more bold every year because people like yourself just go (shrug).

If some people actually decided to grow a brain and stopped giving companies that are screwing over their populations, maybe they'd wisen up and actually start acting like proper companies again.

Businesses don't work for free and they certainly don't really care about a customer which brings in low money. You can complain all you want that you are getting screwed over, but that's how the world works, and if you really want to change the gaming industry, then start a company, work for free (content patches) and hope everyone sees you as the savior of gaming and buys your game before you default.

who the hell ever said they had to work for free?

do you have ANY FKN idea at ALL how much money cash shops make?

look at league legends / dota just as a example of EXTREME cash shops they literally make close to a billion dollars a year just from their cash shops alone. Nothing else.

This is exactly why more and more games are going F2P, because they want that cash shop golden goose laying eggs for them.

So you are basically saying it's ok for them to gouge us multiple times,

- first on buying the game (originally sold as a P2P title to sucker people into buying and subbing initially)
- then on the cash shop when it goes free
- then yet again on dlc, because they refuse to release any content whatsoever aside from paid DLC

and you're cool with all that? really?

You seem to think they make more money from the cash shop than new people buying the game, I'd argue otherwise. The best bet is still DLC; you retain players tired of the content, you get a big ROI, and you get new potential buyers. Content patches is only the former since potential buyers most likely won't see the big new content patch you just put out, or at the very least not as much as a DLC, and you make a big whopping 0$ net from the direct release of that patch.

I don't think we are ever going to agree, so let's agree to disagree.

JD2013 · June 2015

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

LatinLegacy wrote: »

[I can be sat down with both games & even with my minimal programming knowledge, since I was a Computer Science minor, I can GUARANTEE I would have a much easier time creating content with the engine that Marvel Heroes uses. So my statement still stands, it's simplistic & I would gladly post it on their forums when directly compared to ESO.

I DON'T have any formal education with computers.

I do have three adventures published within Neverwinter Foundry, one that was "featured" by Cryptic, all three have a 4Star+ rating (out of 5).

All three of them are at least as good as any quest line I have played in ESO; and the final part is way better than anything I have played in ESO.

I have a single room, a library, that alone took 30-40 hours to build, and is not even used for combat, just a location for two dialogues and a couple of books to help set the story.

The effort and difficulty involved in making content is no excuse for bad content.

If the ESO content creation software is clunky and difficult to use the ONLY people to blame for that are Zenimax - they chose it.

So they (and their sycophantic fanbois) can't use it as an excuse as to why we have a game with no new content.

All The Best

It's amazing how everyone who enjoys the fame is a fanboi to you.

I mean, I am as ready as anyone for new content. But also I can not play great amounts at the moment due to work commitments. I guess other things in life are far more of a priority to me than a video game.

spawn10459 · June 2015

LatinLegacy wrote: »

spawn10459 wrote: »

LatinLegacy wrote: »

I know what Marvel Heroes is & that is a god awful comparison. For one, it's an ARPG with MMO features, not an MMORPG. Secondly, that level of design in that game is amateurish compared to the scale that ESO is. Pushing content out on a game like Marvel Heroes is effortless seeing how simplistic it is. That's like comparing Minesweeper to Minecraft.

your joking right.

I guess this is why MH makes more Money then ZOS?

Yeah, because you're comparing a 100% F2P low system requirement game to a B2P game that requires a decent system or a $400 console. Not a fair comparison in any way no matter what kind of dispute you choose to pull out.

Money is money. a 20$ bill is still worth 20$. Ok then lets compare ESO to WOW. Yeah ESO still blows.

How many subscribers did WOW have after 1 year some thing like 5 mill? ESO couldnt even last a year with paid subs.

Gandrhulf_Harbard · June 2015

Bacongineer wrote: »

You seem to think they make more money from the cash shop than new people buying the game, I'd argue otherwise.

You'd be wrong.

When LOTRO moved from Subscription to F2P with a cash shop they more than doubled their revenue stream, almost overnight.

But then they had things in their cash shop that people actually wanted to buy - like more bag/bank space for example.

All The Best

ElricFrancis · June 2015

Well hate to say it but the game was pure poo when it came out for PC last year.
(Thank you PC testers for debugging the game an entire year we WUV JOO!!! )
Now out for consoles and thanks to PC gamers console gamers got a fairly working game to play with.
( Sans the pre 2K LFG system currently in use. Dear god why....)
So content meant for last year's horrid PC game will be forthcoming for PC and console users who can actually play it? GOOD!

I mean could have been worse look at heists for GTAV yeesh...

LatinLegacy · June 2015

Just for the laughs, I will download this MH game & run it on the system my wife uses currently. Which is my old build from 2010. I'm willing to bet that it will run it flawlessly at max settings without the system pushing anywhere near full load. That system sports an i7 - 930 @ 3.86 ghz, 6 gigs of DDR 3 ram & a single GTX 470. Since she only really plays the sims, I didn't feel the need to upgrade it. That system could not run ES0 at max settings @ 1920 x 1080. I had to scale a few things back for it to run well. Especially in PvP.

ElricFrancis · June 2015

Bacongineer wrote: »

Huggernaut wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

Huggernaut wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

The reality of the industry is that the ROI of a content patch is much lower than the ROI of a DLC. Adding new content to a DLC is a much much better investment than adding content to a patch which is transparent to most potential buyers.

You really shouldn't expect too many content patches. A patch in this game is exactly what it is, a patch, fix stuff. If you want more content, wait for DLCs.

You may not like it, but that's how businesses usually work.

and it's that kind of sheeple attitude that allows game companies to gouge us more and more every year.

Thanks!

The industry changes. It might not have been that way 10 years ago, but now it is. The goal is to make money.

Content patches = low ROI, DLC = high ROI

You can argue that this is a sheeple attitude, I call it being realist to the current market situation.

You are proving my point for me, thank you.

It's because people like yourself (sheeple) find ways to justify game companies actions, that they have been able to steadily increase the pace at which they attempt to screw us over, year by year, over the past 10+ years and they continue to grow more bold every year because people like yourself just go (shrug).

If some people actually decided to grow a brain and stopped giving companies that are screwing over their populations, maybe they'd wisen up and actually start acting like proper companies again.

Businesses don't work for free and they certainly don't really care about a customer which brings in low money. You can complain all you want that you are getting screwed over, but that's how the world works, and if you really want to change the gaming industry, then start a company, work for free (content patches) and hope everyone sees you as the savior of gaming and buys your game before you default.

Don't feed the trolls logic! They might get sick! Like feeding a dog Chocolate.

spawn10459 · June 2015

LatinLegacy wrote: »

Just for the laughs, I will download this MH game & run it on the system my wife uses currently. Which is my old build from 2010. I'm willing to bet that it will run it flawlessly at max settings without the system pushing anywhere near full load. That system sports an i7 - 930 @ 3.86 ghz, 6 gigs of DDR 3 ram & a single GTX 470. Since she only really plays the sims, I didn't feel the need to upgrade it. That system could not run ES0 at max settings @ 1920 x 1080. I had to scale a few things back for it to run well. Especially in PvP.

I bet you it wont.

Seafoam_hydra · June 2015

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

You seem to think they make more money from the cash shop than new people buying the game, I'd argue otherwise.

You'd be wrong.

When LOTRO moved from Subscription to F2P with a cash shop they more than doubled their revenue stream, almost overnight.

But then they had things in their cash shop that people actually wanted to buy - like more bag/bank space for example.

All The Best

Different situation, we are talking about a B2P game with cash shop. Not a F2P game. It still begs the question : Would ZOS make more money going F2P? You can be certain that if their conclusion is yes, the game is going F2P in due time.

Joy_Division · June 2015

LatinLegacy wrote: »

You will just need to learn how to be more patient.

LOL dude. Last content released was October 2014. And the Imperial City was showcased at last year's E3.

FelixTheCatt · June 2015

I completely understand pc players frustration. You can have the patience of a saint but no new content in how long? No way I'd still be around that long with nothing new but cosmetic changing in the game. Especially with todays gamers , you promise something , you had best deliver. Being successful with an mmorpg is tough enough as it is , you don't do yourself any favors by failing to keep things fresh. We see standalone games that release dlc faster.

spawn10459 · June 2015

spawn10459 wrote: »

LatinLegacy wrote: »

Just for the laughs, I will download this MH game & run it on the system my wife uses currently. Which is my old build from 2010. I'm willing to bet that it will run it flawlessly at max settings without the system pushing anywhere near full load. That system sports an i7 - 930 @ 3.86 ghz, 6 gigs of DDR 3 ram & a single GTX 470. Since she only really plays the sims, I didn't feel the need to upgrade it. That system could not run ES0 at max settings @ 1920 x 1080. I had to scale a few things back for it to run well. Especially in PvP.

I bet you it wont.

Marvel Heroes

Current Minimum System Requirements for Marvel Heroes:

The current minimum system requirements are below. Please keep in mind that if your system doesn't meet these specifications, it is unlikely that the game will perform well for you and we will not be able to assist you with performance related issues.

CPU: Core 2 DUO 2.1 GHz / AMD Athlon X2 2.1 GHZ or better
Graphics Card: DirectX10 Compatible ATI Radeon 3870 / NVIDIA 8800 GT / Intel HD 3000 Integrated Graphics with 512 MB VRAM or higher that fully supports Shader Model 3.0.
System RAM: 2Gb or higher
Hard disk space: 10Gb or higher
OS: Windows Vista 32/64, Windows 7 32/64, Windows 8 32/64

Current Recommended System Requirements for Marvel Heroes:

CPU: Quad Core Processor
Graphics Card: DirectX11 Compatible, AMD Radeon HD 6850 / NVIDIA GeForce GTX 550 with 1024 MB VRAM
System RAM: 4Gb or higherHard disk space: 10Gb or higher
OS: Windows 7 or higher

Rev Rielle · June 2015

Patches are just that; they fix things.
These patches are doing what they should be, and we all know a new version of the game is coming, once the console version of the game is up and running properly.

Garion · June 2015

Lol at everyone saying "be patient" and "you can't expect new content all the time".

Erm, at launch when we all paid for the game and then continued paying a subscription we were promised new content every 6 weeks. In one year plus, what have we got? Craglorn. That's literally it.

We have been patient, incredibly patient in fact. We've waited and waited and we've forgiven broken promise after broken promise and here we are still waiting. It's about time people actually started getting angry and demanding ZOS give us what we have been paying for for so long. Polite and civil feedback does not seem to get them moving at all.

spawn10459 · June 2015

Also look at Guild Wars 2. They have a very very very health population and are about to release a new expansion and have already added more features and content in that game then this game has in 1 year.

Gandrhulf_Harbard · June 2015

Garion wrote: »

It's about time people actually started getting angry and demanding ZOS give us what we have been paying for for so long. Polite and civil feedback does not seem to get them moving at all.

Complaining here isn't going to work.

This is their yard, they control it.

If you want to hit them head out in to the rest of the net and start writing bad reviews of the game, highlighting a years of lies and failed promises. Once that starts generating interest they'll soon get focused on what they should have been focused on all along.

All The Best

Seafoam_hydra · June 2015

spawn10459 wrote: »

Also look at Guild Wars 2. They have a very very very health population and are about to release a new expansion and have already added more features and content in that game then this game has in 1 year.

Maybe because it was released in August 2012. It's also a very different game and it's definitely not a true comparison.

spawn10459 · June 2015

Bacongineer wrote: »

spawn10459 wrote: »

Also look at Guild Wars 2. They have a very very very health population and are about to release a new expansion and have already added more features and content in that game then this game has in 1 year.

Maybe because it was released in August 2012. It's also a very different game and it's definitely not a true comparison.

so wait now your saying B2P is not the same as another B2P game.

So if i am not allowed to compare B2P games to F2P games and i cant compare b2P to B2P then what can i compare it too?

Look at the improvements and content that was added by GW2 in 1 year vs the no content released for ESO.

BigM · June 2015

I understand you guys want content, heck me too. But really we need more bugs fixed than anything else. we should of had them 6 months ago.

Gandrhulf_Harbard · June 2015

Bacongineer wrote: »

It's also a very different game and it's definitely not a true comparison.

Is this going to be your usual weak fanboi response?

Oh, no, that doesn't count its not a true comparison.

Is this really the best you can do to defend Zeni?
They must really be indefensible.

All The Best

Sallington · June 2015

The people arguing "ZOS needs to make money somehow, they are a business" are what is wrong with the gaming industry. That mindset is why companies get away with crappy releases with pre-orders, half-baked DLC that should have been in the initial release, freaking paid DLC in general.

"Grow up and get a job kid, they are a business and need to make money." Worst argument for crappy game development I've ever heard.

Seafoam_hydra · June 2015

spawn10459 wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

spawn10459 wrote: »

Also look at Guild Wars 2. They have a very very very health population and are about to release a new expansion and have already added more features and content in that game then this game has in 1 year.

Maybe because it was released in August 2012. It's also a very different game and it's definitely not a true comparison.

so wait now your saying B2P is not the same as another B2P game.

So if i am not allowed to compare B2P games to F2P games and i cant compare b2P to B2P then what can i compare it too?

Look at the improvements and content that was added by GW2 in 1 year vs the no content released for ESO.

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

It's also a very different game and it's definitely not a true comparison.

Is this going to be your usual weak fanboi response?

Oh, no, that doesn't count its not a true comparison.

Is this really the best you can do to defend Zeni?
They must really be indefensible.

All The Best

I'm not sure we are playing the same game anymore? The complexity of the world in Guild Wars is low. Empty landscape, empty houses, empty caves. It feels like an old F2P game. I am most certainly not a developer of Guild Wars 2, but I've done my share of programming and I'm fairly sure that GW2 is easier to add content to than ESO.

Also, I am not a "fanboy" by any means, I am merely being realist and comparating MMOs, even if they both are B2P MMOs, is not a fair comparison, every game is very different, and the development process for each is also going to be very different.

Sallington wrote: »

The people arguing "ZOS needs to make money somehow, they are a business" are what is wrong with the gaming industry. That mindset is why companies get away with crappy releases with pre-orders, half-baked DLC that should have been in the initial release, freaking paid DLC in general.

"Grow up and get a job kid, they are a business and need to make money." Worst argument for crappy game development I've ever heard.

It might be the worst argument you've ever heard, but it certainly is the current modus operandi of most companies.

So, in internet forum culture I guess we call that chickening out, but I've had my share of arguing for this morning and so I am out of this conversation.
Like I said in an earlier post, let's just agree to disagree.

technohic · June 2015

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

It's about time people actually started getting angry and demanding ZOS give us what we have been paying for for so long. Polite and civil feedback does not seem to get them moving at all.

Complaining here isn't going to work.

This is their yard, they control it.

If you want to hit them head out in to the rest of the net and start writing bad reviews of the game, highlighting a years of lies and failed promises. Once that starts generating interest they'll soon get focused on what they should have been focused on all along.

All The Best

They pretty much get hammered wherever they come up as far as I have seen. Of course; I have lost about all interest so its usually when I see a news article talking about the game on sites like Massively.

It's not even about content along in a sense of content being new zones, quests, or other activities. They dropped sweeping changes to abilities and soft caps and added a new progression system and just left it as is, as if it were perfect. No balancing. No tweaks. Not even fixing some things that they even said are broken as it keeps waiting for the "next major update" for months and still no sign of when that actually may be.

sadownik · June 2015

JD2013 wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

LatinLegacy wrote: »

[I can be sat down with both games & even with my minimal programming knowledge, since I was a Computer Science minor, I can GUARANTEE I would have a much easier time creating content with the engine that Marvel Heroes uses. So my statement still stands, it's simplistic & I would gladly post it on their forums when directly compared to ESO.

I DON'T have any formal education with computers.

I do have three adventures published within Neverwinter Foundry, one that was "featured" by Cryptic, all three have a 4Star+ rating (out of 5).

All three of them are at least as good as any quest line I have played in ESO; and the final part is way better than anything I have played in ESO.

I have a single room, a library, that alone took 30-40 hours to build, and is not even used for combat, just a location for two dialogues and a couple of books to help set the story.

The effort and difficulty involved in making content is no excuse for bad content.

If the ESO content creation software is clunky and difficult to use the ONLY people to blame for that are Zenimax - they chose it.

So they (and their sycophantic fanbois) can't use it as an excuse as to why we have a game with no new content.

All The Best

It's amazing how everyone who enjoys the fame is a fanboi to you.

I mean, I am as ready as anyone for new content. But also I can not play great amounts at the moment due to work commitments. I guess other things in life are far more of a priority to me than a video game.

Lol "when in need use 'get a life' card" - well played.

sadownik · June 2015

Bacongineer wrote: »

spawn10459 wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

spawn10459 wrote: »

Also look at Guild Wars 2. They have a very very very health population and are about to release a new expansion and have already added more features and content in that game then this game has in 1 year.

Maybe because it was released in August 2012. It's also a very different game and it's definitely not a true comparison.

so wait now your saying B2P is not the same as another B2P game.

So if i am not allowed to compare B2P games to F2P games and i cant compare b2P to B2P then what can i compare it too?

Look at the improvements and content that was added by GW2 in 1 year vs the no content released for ESO.

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Bacongineer wrote: »

It's also a very different game and it's definitely not a true comparison.

Is this going to be your usual weak fanboi response?

Oh, no, that doesn't count its not a true comparison.

Is this really the best you can do to defend Zeni?
They must really be indefensible.

All The Best

I'm not sure we are playing the same game anymore? The complexity of the world in Guild Wars is low. Empty landscape, empty houses, empty caves. It feels like an old F2P game. I am most certainly not a developer of Guild Wars 2, but I've done my share of programming and I'm fairly sure that GW2 is easier to add content to than ESO.

We sure do play different games then. Full vivd world with lots of dynamic often massive events, hudrets of QA improvements. World chaniging due to ongoing living story (proveinces ruined, hell main city completly destroyed and then rebuild in different form). But go on compare one game that was well designed and build and other which feels like great improvisation all over.