One class should be able to learn the other class skill lines.

Didgerion · April 2015

Hello folks.

The idea is simple:
I as a master magician of one class should be able to learn other class' magical tricks.

And here is the story behind this:
I'm a VR14 NightBlade now and I like to DPS and it works perfectly well.
But I like to heal as well and healing with a NightBlade is a bit tricky.
If compared with templars for example the nightblade healing is more proactive than reactive and you need a better team that understands you healing mechanism.

So I'd put the idea of night-blade healer on the shelf, and started re-rolling a Templar just to have that skill line for reactive healing.

Now here were it gets frustrating: I have to start everything from beginning: quests lines, pvp leveling, guilds lines leveling etc. It is repetitive, non challenging, and time consuming.

Why not offer a class the ability to learn a different's class skill line instead?. Why wouldn't it be implemented in the Champion system mechanism?
A class is just a set of knowledge than anyone should be able to learn if interested.

ZOS would solve many problems with it:
1. a player would truly be able to play any style she wants.
2. balancing class's skills will not bring so many frustrations to players. (like it did to sorcerers in 1.6 release)
3. It will bring a better player satisfaction which will help to keep them interested in the game longer. (spending 2 weeks for re-rolling a class is much less rewarding than spending the same time on the main character and getting a different class' skill line.
4. balancing would be easier, because it will be oriented to balance skills and not classes.

So let the class truly be just the starting point of your character and let her evolve any direction she wants.

PS. The same goes for racial passives, why only the nords have the frost resistance for example, my Khajit has fur and he was raised in a nord's family. He is as good with cold as nords are but somehow he did not got that passive. My Breton Templar was also raised in the same nord's family, she had really big problems with cold at the beginning but she managed to go over it by using tricks like applying oils on her body to reduce the effect of cold; now her body is used to cold and she doesn't need this oil anymore.

ShadowMage · April 2015

This might not be a bad idea, provided that EACH skill line is locked behind a UNIQUE and DIFFICULT quest that only becomes available once reaching a certain point in your character progression. For example, at level 50, or once each of your own class's skill lines is mastered. The quests should be very difficult and solo-only. They should also be at least somewhat related to the skill you're attempting to learn.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · April 2015

Just say NO to homogenisation!

If we take this idea to the logical conclusion let's delete all classes and all races .. 'cos, you know, everyone should be able to learn everyone else's skills, right?

jluceyub17_ESO · April 2015

Because there will eventually one dominate PvP build and that will either: (1) get super old super fast, or (2) ZoS will counter the FoTM PvP build with balance changes that could wreak havoc on the PvE builds.

Also, it's nice in PvP to see what class you're fighting and have some idea of what you need to counter and what weaknesses to pounce on.

Flaminir · April 2015

No.

Just no.

What you are asking for is the removal of classes... making everybody the same.... leading to exactly the same cookie cutter builds.

We already have a little of that, but the class system allows for some diversity & the whole game is built around this.

Over simplification leads to a very dull game.... & that's the direction this idea is taking the game.

Sorry..... don't agree with the idea at all, but hats off to you on a decent well worded post.

Aett_Thorn · April 2015

I would much rather they just get rid of classes, and let you choose any three skill lines when you start a new character. That way we could mix and match better, but we'd still be locked in to three class skill lines.

MorHawk · April 2015

Spellcrafting. It's in the pipeline, honest.

skarvika · April 2015

That would be the traditional Elder Scrolls method. I concur OP, there's no point to classes anymore...it's become too cookie cutter and there's huge imbalances that seem to get more and more obvious as time goes on. Classes are becoming as redundant as the veteran rank system at this point. It would be cool to be able to mix up our playstyles more.

Cagro · April 2015

I do not have time for alts. I will love to fully develop my character the way I want. I will definitely vote for this. +1+1+1...

ShadowMage · April 2015

I can also agree with the others here who are against the "homogenization" of the classes. I also fear it would lead to more FOTM builds with everyone picking the "best" skills. It would also destroy the theme of the existing classes. But then it would allow you to create your own theme for a class that is uniquely yours.

I guess you could say I'm firmly on the fence with this one.

golfer.dub17_ESO · April 2015

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

Just say NO to homogenisation!

If we take this idea to the logical conclusion let's delete all classes and all races .. 'cos, you know, everyone should be able to learn everyone else's skills, right?

I have to wonder how some people in this thread were able to stomach playing Skyrim if they hate the concept of being able to do anything so much.

Garion · April 2015

No no no no no no no no

Garion · April 2015

golfer.dub17_ESO wrote: »

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

Just say NO to homogenisation!

If we take this idea to the logical conclusion let's delete all classes and all races .. 'cos, you know, everyone should be able to learn everyone else's skills, right?

I have to wonder how some people in this thread were able to stomach playing Skyrim if they hate the concept of being able to do anything so much.

That's entirely different. Skyrim is a single player game. This game has PvP and group oriented PvE. It would make it SO boring.

Victus · April 2015

Yeah no thanks, stopped reading after the first bolded sentence. Classes exist for a reason, to give some other distinction besides race. If this were a traditional Elder Scrolls single player game, then so be it.

Haqikah · April 2015

Being able to do anything is fantastic in a single player RPG (like Skyrim) or for non-competitive players in TESO (like myself). However for competitive players - both PvP and PvE - this will lead to either major balancing issues or to generalization as most players will choose the FOTM build for whatever roll they play.

skarvika · April 2015

shadowmage016b14_ESO wrote: »

I can also agree with the others here who are against the "homogenization" of the classes. I also fear it would lead to more FOTM builds with everyone picking the "best" skills. It would also destroy the theme of the existing classes. But then it would allow you to create your own theme for a class that is uniquely yours.

I guess you could say I'm firmly on the fence with this one.

Well let's think of it this way...as it stands now, we have players who have the "best" skills while others don't. This is causing a huge rift in the game. Were the classes removed, if there was still a "best" build, at least everyone would be able to be on equal ground, as they would have access to the skills used in that build as well. There also wouldn't be anything stopping the devs from just nerfing all the "best" stuff or completely balancing skills altogether to eliminate the possibility of one superior build...or at least make it much less obvious.

Flaminir · April 2015

golfer.dub17_ESO wrote: »

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

Just say NO to homogenisation!

If we take this idea to the logical conclusion let's delete all classes and all races .. 'cos, you know, everyone should be able to learn everyone else's skills, right?

I have to wonder how some people in this thread were able to stomach playing Skyrim if they hate the concept of being able to do anything so much.

That's not really relevant.

Skyrim was a single player game..... you weren't playing with or against others so it made no difference what your character was like.

Homogenisation in an MMO will be horrid... everybody will be SO similar!

TheShadowScout · April 2015

Eh... this idea again. I guess it will be around until the end of ESO, but... it still doesn't get better. Multiplayer games need class differences, or everyone will eventually end up with just a selection of the most effective skilsl, and think how boring that would be, all people being too similar in effect...

Just learn to take enjoyment in your differences instead of wanting to do it all in one character. (class balance on the other hand, that is debatable...

)

RazzPitazz · April 2015

Sorry but no way.

Flaminir · April 2015

skarvika wrote: »

shadowmage016b14_ESO wrote: »

I can also agree with the others here who are against the "homogenization" of the classes. I also fear it would lead to more FOTM builds with everyone picking the "best" skills. It would also destroy the theme of the existing classes. But then it would allow you to create your own theme for a class that is uniquely yours.

I guess you could say I'm firmly on the fence with this one.

Well let's think of it this way...as it stands now, we have players who have the "best" skills while others don't. This is causing a huge rift in the game. Were the classes removed, if there was still a "best" build, at least everyone would be able to be on equal ground, as they would have access to the skills used in that build as well. There also wouldn't be anything stopping the devs from just nerfing all the "best" stuff or completely balancing skills altogether to eliminate the possibility of one superior build...or at least make it much less obvious.

Every class has some 'best' skills that makes them useful.

& that diversity makes it more interesting & makes the group side of things work... people have roles & different things they can do due to the differences.

WraithAzraiel · April 2015

No

NewBlacksmurf · April 2015

no...next thing you know the silver and gold quests will require re classing.

No thanks and i do not believe this is a good idea in any way shape or form

WraithAzraiel · April 2015

If they opened up the skill lines to everybody there would be absolutely NO diversity. Class builds would give way to 1 super build for each of the roles of the Holy Trinity.

That's not "play how you want" that'd be "Play how you need to play to be efficient, anything else...is just a toy"

Rook_Master · April 2015

Scales + BE + Dark Cloak LOL the possibilities are endless!!

Farsh · April 2015

How about a new jack-of-all trades class that has all class skills, WITHOUT ulti's, from the different classes but the skills cant be morphed.

joshisanonymous · April 2015

I do not like this idea.

Jules · April 2015

In theory I get where you're coming from.
In practice I think it would lead to even further class balance issues. Can't even imagine....

Perhaps a compromise would be to come out with a new skill line with desirable skills in it, similar to those that the classes have but weakened versions. Survivability skill line that is accessible to all, similar to the mages/fighters guild. Some self heal, similar to GDB. Something similar to BE, ect.

That might also lead to imbalance issues though, who knows. Plus I guess in a way it does cheapen the uniqueness of the classes.

I_killed_Vivec · April 2015

In ES games they make it so that your initial class indicates how capable you are, but it doesn't stop you from being silly. I once leveled a magica based Orc in Morrowind - he was hopelessly thick but managed to progress because while slow at learning magic he could revert to bashing if required

I can see something like that happening here, but instead of your starting point and how quickly you learn why not put in a limit? You can level your own class skills up to 50, how about just 40 for another class?

It might not be a practical suggestion in terms of balancing (spellcrafting...), but I do wonder about people who say we'd all end up the same. Is there any proof of this (I'm not saying there isn't, I'd really like to know why people seem so sure)?

And would it be any different from what we've already seen with vampires, DK in skirts, and now people spamming wreaking blow? Do they think they have already reached the pinnacle in their class and just don't want to have to rebuild?

Nestor · April 2015

golfer.dub17_ESO wrote: »

I have to wonder how some people in this thread were able to stomach playing Skyrim if they hate the concept of being able to do anything so much.

Its simple really. Just because we could become a Jack of All Skills does not mean we did. In this game, we would be forced to learn everything and do everything just to have parity.

Shunravi · April 2015

I'm one of the guys who keep bringing this up in threads, and even I say no.

Keep the classes.

AlnilamE · April 2015

No.

Nightblades are perfectly good healers. Learn how to do it.