Expansions & Story Continuity

Harlwystyr · April 2015

So, something dawned on me recently when playing the game and reading up on the info that Zenimax Online Studios is releasing. We're all aware that we're getting new DLC adventure areas such as Murkmire and Wrothgar, but to some extent, these areas seem like self-contained entities, and is that what the evolving world of Tamriel in ESO needs?

Spoilers regarding the Main Quest:

As those of us who've played the Main Quest storyline knows, Molag Bal's Planemeld comes to an end, and Meridia sprouts some vagueness concerning the machinations of other powers in Mundus and all that good stuff, and the Alliance War seems to carry on. Still, beyond this, there seems to be little build up for future "main" antagonists, as Molag Bal's invasion seems to have been portrayed as ESO's driving story, and the entire world with all its areas would have to be revisited to update the story. Where does this leave us?

Spoilers end

Those of us who have played World of Warcraft are aware of their patchs-leading-to-expansions system, where content patches evolve the overall world story, develops the iconic characters, and leads to conclusions of one story arc, so that a new expansion can not only give us more lore, but more content to play around with. For these expansions, an antagonist to pose a danger to the world has always been necessary.

But the problem with ESO seems to be that ZoS has no plans (or haven't announced any, anyway) for future expansions, and a continuity of the main story. A further hindrance to an evolving world story and character development is the fact that the iconic characters are all voiced by big celebrity voice actors, who cost cash to bring back for more voice acting every time. Further, a lot of the areas we've already visisted would need to reflect the evolving world, such as the ruins of Camlorn being under reconstruction, the people of Rivenspire rebuilding their lives (and having a clear answer on who is the canon monarch, a question that was hindered by the player's ability to choose, I might add) and so on, et cetera.

What do you think we can expect from ZoS in terms of expansions and story continuity? Will we simply continue to explore the rest of Tamriel in self-contained adventure zones, or are new expansions bound to advance the main story? Will we see more character development to the faction leaders (perhaps even replacements of them?), and will we ever see the current zones revisited?

Rook_Master · April 2015

The problem is that a lot of ESO lore is already established, and since we are playing in the past during the second era, that doesn't give a whole lot of leeway in terms of changing the story.

There are even lore purists that say Molag Bal's invasion never actually happened according to true lore. I think a lot of people would be upset if they did weird stuff, like add dwarves as a playable race, because that clearly never happened.

Harlwystyr · April 2015

Well Rook_Master, to be fair, expansions need not necessarily add new races

As for the current period in the Second Era, from 2E 582, when the game begins, there's at least around 100 (give or tak) more years before anything anything specific happens to the world, so there's plenty of space!

Rook_Master · April 2015

Yeah, that was just an extreme example.

I think there are plenty of other baddies in ES lore for future expansions. Although I'm fine with just exploring new zones and doing cool stuff too.

Bookwyrm · April 2015

I would like to see more Daedric Princes get involved. We get direct contact with Meridia, Molag Bal, and Sheogorath, but what about Clavicus Vile? Sanguine? Mephala is always a good one too. There are plenty to choose from. Of course, they may show up in some of the Vet dungeons, I don't know, I haven't played through them yet (taking it slow...), but connecting them with some big events would be great too.

And what about Tharn's daughter, Septima? Couldn't she be a potential antagonist? All mentions of her in-game seem less than savory...and not all of our antagonists need be beings with phenomenal cosmic powers.

bellanca6561n · April 2015

Perhaps a better comparison would be to Bioware's SWTOR.

It goes on but never achieved the success that was hoped for. EA's stock took a hit, their CEO "left." Plans for regular new content were abandoned, developers were laid off, the subscription model was dropped and so on.

New zones will have their own stories mostly likely with fewer splashy resources - A-list actors as voice actors for instance - devoted to them. Story continuity was already abandoned in Cadwell Silver and Gold.

At least that's my guess.

Selique · April 2015

bellanca6561n wrote: »

Perhaps a better comparison would be to Bioware's SWTOR.

It goes on but never achieved the success that was hoped for. EA's stock took a hit, their CEO "left." Plans for regular new content were abandoned, developers were laid off, the subscription model was dropped and so on.

New zones will have their own stories mostly likely with fewer splashy resources - A-list actors as voice actors for instance - devoted to them. Story continuity was already abandoned in Cadwell Silver and Gold.

At least that's my guess.

Despite all of those things, SWTOR is chugging along nicely, and gets updated with more story content (As story is the whole point of SWTOR).

I don't think ZoS has forgotten about their story, and I believe they have a direction they want to take it. The issue is what else do they have piled on their plate to be working on? Console release is a big one, so was the release of Unlimited.

I think the story will continue in some form as we progress in the life of ESO (Which is in my humble opinion doing well from my IG experiences.)

Just give it some time.

bellanca6561n · April 2015

Selique wrote: »

bellanca6561n wrote: »

Perhaps a better comparison would be to Bioware's SWTOR.

It goes on but never achieved the success that was hoped for. EA's stock took a hit, their CEO "left." Plans for regular new content were abandoned, developers were laid off, the subscription model was dropped and so on.

New zones will have their own stories mostly likely with fewer splashy resources - A-list actors as voice actors for instance - devoted to them. Story continuity was already abandoned in Cadwell Silver and Gold.

At least that's my guess.

Despite all of those things, SWTOR is chugging along nicely, and gets updated with more story content (As story is the whole point of SWTOR).

I don't think ZoS has forgotten about their story, and I believe they have a direction they want to take it. The issue is what else do they have piled on their plate to be working on? Console release is a big one, so was the release of Unlimited.

I think the story will continue in some form as we progress in the life of ESO (Which is in my humble opinion doing well from my IG experiences.)

Just give it some time.

I didn't mean to suggest it was an utter failure but it was perceived as one by the industry, EA shareholders, and was the downfall of the CEO of the largest game publisher in the world.

Objectively it's still doing fine. And it continues to release content albeit on a less ambitious schedule than planned when it was living off hope and speculation.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-05-22-bioware-announces-layoffs-surrounding-star-wars-the-old-republic

But neither it nor this game were important western releases. Ultima Online was, EverQuest was, World of Warcraft was. Each changed the industry. Thus it's hard to compare the trajectory of this game to one of broader significance.

That said, probably the finest and most breathtaking MMO expansion thus far was Lord of the Rings Online's Mines of Moria which came over a year after the game's initial release. It was a close to a work of art as this genre has gotten.

This game has yet to be fully released and may well have its Mines of Moria moment.

And everyone on this forum hopes so

Darkonflare15 · April 2015

Rook_Master wrote: »

The problem is that a lot of ESO lore is already established, and since we are playing in the past during the second era, that doesn't give a whole lot of leeway in terms of changing the story.

There are even lore purists that say Molag Bal's invasion never actually happened according to true lore. I think a lot of people would be upset if they did weird stuff, like add dwarves as a playable race, because that clearly never happened.

Elder scrolls lore always base off of people view and culture instead of esabalished history lore. So because of lore it can be change easily depending on people views.

Example: Frost elves is consider extinct by history or lore standards or turn to falner but we know that a few of them are alive thanks to our player interaction with then in skyrim. So most lore in elder scrolls series is subjective until acuatly proven true.

Xendyn · April 2015

Rook_Master wrote: »

The problem is that a lot of ESO lore is already established, and since we are playing in the past during the second era, that doesn't give a whole lot of leeway in terms of changing the story.

There are even lore purists that say Molag Bal's invasion never actually happened according to true lore. I think a lot of people would be upset if they did weird stuff, like add dwarves as a playable race, because that clearly never happened.

Just as an aside, there are No "Dwarves" in Tamriel.
Dwarven is a material (ore)

DWEMER is the race. Dwe-Mer. Mer as in Altmer, Bosmer, Dunmer. They are elves.

Sorry for the slight derail, carry on

NewBlacksmurf · April 2015

Don't forget to use the spoiler commands hide content.

Great topic....

I think..based on the team members that were a part of DAoC that this games drastically resembles

All DLC zones will feel and to certain extents be completely seperate. To ensure that the payment structure aligns with content it only makes sense (assuming) that any DLC content only requires the base game.

Some DLC will require priori DLC and new DLC but again these will seem to be distinct content based on how at times they seem to talk about scailing some DLC to diff char levels.

Guess we will have to wait and see
I know a lot of upset ppl will follow as DLC roles out because so many are expecting TES instead of Zenimax Online

Gidorick · April 2015

I would expect new stories and some continuation of the main story to give the expansions relevance and context.

@Harlwystyr, as someone interested in the future of ESO expansions, you may enjoy this post: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/149340/what-i-hope-tamriel-unlimited-means/p1

UrQuan · April 2015

Xendyn wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

The problem is that a lot of ESO lore is already established, and since we are playing in the past during the second era, that doesn't give a whole lot of leeway in terms of changing the story.

There are even lore purists that say Molag Bal's invasion never actually happened according to true lore. I think a lot of people would be upset if they did weird stuff, like add dwarves as a playable race, because that clearly never happened.

Just as an aside, there are No "Dwarves" in Tamriel.
Dwarven is a material (ore)

DWEMER is the race. Dwe-Mer. Mer as in Altmer, Bosmer, Dunmer. They are elves.

Sorry for the slight derail, carry on

To continue your slight derail, that's not entirely accurate:

Dwarves - The Lost Race of Tamriel Volume I: Architecture and Designs by Calcelmo, Scholar of Markarth A scholarly work on the architecture and metallurgy of Dwemer wrote:

Let me begin by correcting a common misconception. The proper term to use when referencing the ancient lost race of Tamriel is "Dwemer." It is a word whose meaning is roughly translated to "people of the deep" in the common tongue, and whose use has been widely replaced by the more ubiquitous nomenclature, "dwarves." I would like stated that I use the name "dwarves" in lieu of the more accurate term in these books out of sympathy for my readership, whom I can safely assume does not have the breadth of scholarship that 200 years of study has given me.

"Dwarves" is a commonly used name for the Dwemer, and "Dwarven" is a commonly used term for things that the people of Tamriel associate with the Dwemer.

Rook_Master · April 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

Xendyn wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

The problem is that a lot of ESO lore is already established, and since we are playing in the past during the second era, that doesn't give a whole lot of leeway in terms of changing the story.

There are even lore purists that say Molag Bal's invasion never actually happened according to true lore. I think a lot of people would be upset if they did weird stuff, like add dwarves as a playable race, because that clearly never happened.

Just as an aside, there are No "Dwarves" in Tamriel.
Dwarven is a material (ore)

DWEMER is the race. Dwe-Mer. Mer as in Altmer, Bosmer, Dunmer. They are elves.

Sorry for the slight derail, carry on

To continue your slight derail, that's not entirely accurate:

Dwarves - The Lost Race of Tamriel Volume I: Architecture and Designs by Calcelmo, Scholar of Markarth A scholarly work on the architecture and metallurgy of Dwemer wrote:

Let me begin by correcting a common misconception. The proper term to use when referencing the ancient lost race of Tamriel is "Dwemer." It is a word whose meaning is roughly translated to "people of the deep" in the common tongue, and whose use has been widely replaced by the more ubiquitous nomenclature, "dwarves." I would like stated that I use the name "dwarves" in lieu of the more accurate term in these books out of sympathy for my readership, whom I can safely assume does not have the breadth of scholarship that 200 years of study has given me.

"Dwarves" is a commonly used name for the Dwemer, and "Dwarven" is a commonly used term for things that the people of Tamriel associate with the Dwemer.

Thank you.

They are definitely referred to as dwarves by many sources in the Elder Scrolls.

I am, of course, aware of their origins as elves.

minfaer · April 2015

To return to the topic, I think there is the possibility of adding new historical events in expansions lorefriendly, they just have to invest time and care into a big coverup-story in the end that doesn't seem to constructed. Something like the Alessian's did with the recors of Ayleid history.

There has been sort of a coverup once already, you know, if you take a look at the Warp in the West... I think that was well done.

UrQuan · April 2015

Note: I started typing this up immediately after my post at 11:23 above, but got distracted by having to do work... So by the time this actually posts, other people may have already said the same thing. I'll find out as soon as I hit Post Reply I guess

Harlwystyr wrote: »

So, something dawned on me recently when playing the game and reading up on the info that Zenimax Online Studios is releasing. We're all aware that we're getting new DLC adventure areas such as Murkmire and Wrothgar, but to some extent, these areas seem like self-contained entities, and is that what the evolving world of Tamriel in ESO needs?

Yes and no. I think having a number of expansions as self-contained entities is a good thing, but expansions continuing the main story would also be a good thing - especially if they gave us a reason to re-visit our original faction zones.

Here's how I think it could work (keeping in mind that I never played WoW or any other MMO that had to deal with this type of thing, so I don't know how they handled it):

When you get the DLC, the first time you log in with a given character, as long as you have completed the main story with that character, you are approached by an NPC who gives you a quest to go and talk to your faction leader, or the prophet, or whoever about some new problem that they need you help with.

When you go to talk to that person, you are given a red option to start the DLC main story quest - when you click the option to start it, you get a second red dialogue option that says something along the lines of "Are you sure you wish to start this now? Starting this quest will make changes to NPCs, terrain, and objects in the following zones *insert list of affected zones from your faction*. This may put you out of phase with other players in those zones who have not started this quest, and may make you unable to play with them in those zones." Then, depending on whether they implement a way to abandon the DLC main story quest or otherwise create a way to go back to the previous version of those zones, a warning about whether this decision is reversible or not.

Once you confirm the option to start the quest, going back to the affected zones you find many things the same (less development work needs to be done when you're reusing most of the assets), but other things different. Old quest givers are gone, but there are new ones. Some towns, ruins, and buildings may have been changed (rebuilt or destroyed), while others remain the same. Different enemies are present, and at a different level.

There are new side quests as well (probably not as many as those zones originally had), but the new main questline is the star attraction. It should have a new main antagonist rather than Molag Bal (one of the other Daedric Princes would naturally be a good choice - especially given the hints that Molag Bal and Meridia both gave you at the end of the main story), and the dolmens are now either inactive, or a reason is given in the introduction to the quest as to why they are still in use, even though the plane meld has been halted (maybe they are being used in a slightly different way now, so that their purpose has changed, and maybe the Daedric Prince who you're now fighting against has essentially stolen them from Molag Bal and is using them for his own nefarious purposes).

If and when needed, choices you made on playing through your faction's questline, or the main questline can be dealt with through various literary devices to get you to the "right" canon choice that they need for the new questline. You picked one monarch for Rivenspire, but the new questline requires the other? Well, while you weren't there there was a daedric invasion, and the monarch you picked was one of the casualties. Different explanations for different cases, of course.

Shunravi · April 2015

minfaer wrote: »

To return to the topic, I think there is the possibility of adding new historical events in expansions lorefriendly, they just have to invest time and care into a big coverup-story in the end that doesn't seem to constructed. Something like the Alessian's did with the recors of Ayleid history.

There has been sort of a coverup once already, you know, if you take a look at the Warp in the West... I think that was well done.

Good point. well, here's a bit of my perspective on what's currently happening

Shunravi wrote: »

as for the whole dragonbreak thing, there is ample evidence we are currently experiencing one.

Exhibit A; I am the soul shriven who assisted in the formation of my alliance, and defeated Molag Bal. And so are you.

Exhibit B; Despite having defeated Molag Bal, dark anchors still spawn, and there is still the massive anchor over the imperial city.

Exhibit C; the entire premise of Cadwell's silver and gold suggests that time is not under control.

Exhibit D; the nature of balancing and adding and taking away content in an mmo makes for a very 'loose time' situation.

Exhibit E; the premise behind the soulburst suggests a loss of control.

if my theory is true, then the soulburst is a dragonbreak like the warp in the west.

Woolenthreads · April 2015

There's no reason to have the Daedric Princes take a more active role in an evolving storyline. Molag Bal may have been the Primary Villain in the Plane Meld but let's face it the real Villain for most of the story was Mannimarco and his Worm Cult. We know that the bassid gets away and fights Galerion and the Mages Guild in the future. There's no reason why he can't be made into the Primary Villain in Expansions.

Lets say a different Daedric Prince makes an attempt while Tamriel is recovering and you break Mannimarco out to give aid in the next expansion. Afterwards he escapes your custody and you have to defeat his schemes in future expansions.

Enodoc · April 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

Note: I started typing this up immediately after my post at 11:23 above, but got distracted by having to do work... So by the time this actually posts, other people may have already said the same thing. I'll find out as soon as I hit Post Reply I guess

Harlwystyr wrote: »

So, something dawned on me recently when playing the game and reading up on the info that Zenimax Online Studios is releasing. We're all aware that we're getting new DLC adventure areas such as Murkmire and Wrothgar, but to some extent, these areas seem like self-contained entities, and is that what the evolving world of Tamriel in ESO needs?

Yes and no. I think having a number of expansions as self-contained entities is a good thing, but expansions continuing the main story would also be a good thing - especially if they gave us a reason to re-visit our original faction zones.

Here's how I think it could work (keeping in mind that I never played WoW or any other MMO that had to deal with this type of thing, so I don't know how they handled it):

When you get the DLC, the first time you log in with a given character, as long as you have completed the main story with that character, you are approached by an NPC who gives you a quest to go and talk to your faction leader, or the prophet, or whoever about some new problem that they need you help with.

[...]

Nice setup

This would be a great way to implement more content, and would fit with once of my suggestions about reusing old zones (assume VRs are gone by this time). The suggestion is based on the fact that hitting Level 50 unlocks the "Normal/Veteran" toggle in the Group Finder. That toggle can be expanded to include your home territory, whereby choosing "Normal" puts you in the Lvl 1-43 version, and choosing "Veteran" puts you in the Veteran/Lvl 50 version. My suggestion for this basically just included Veteran mobs and repeatable quests in the zones, but could easily encompass your Main Story 2 as well.

Lionxoft · April 2015

One man... Abnur Tharn. He' the only consistent character remaining from the 5 companions and he fled with the Amulet. What is he up to? No one knows.

nimander99 · April 2015

Xendyn wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

The problem is that a lot of ESO lore is already established, and since we are playing in the past during the second era, that doesn't give a whole lot of leeway in terms of changing the story.

There are even lore purists that say Molag Bal's invasion never actually happened according to true lore. I think a lot of people would be upset if they did weird stuff, like add dwarves as a playable race, because that clearly never happened.

Just as an aside, there are No "Dwarves" in Tamriel.
Dwarven is a material (ore)

DWEMER is the race. Dwe-Mer. Mer as in Altmer, Bosmer, Dunmer. They are elves.

Sorry for the slight derail, carry on

Actually the Dwemer are referred to as dwarves and called such based on the mythic race of small people who lived under ground in the Merethic Era.

LadyNerevar · April 2015

nimander99 wrote: »

Actually the Dwemer are referred to as dwarves and called such based on the mythic race of small people who lived under ground in the Merethic Era.

The Dwemer are called "dwarves" because they were named such by giants. To whom all men are dwarves.

UrQuan · April 2015

Woolenthreads wrote: »

There's no reason to have the Daedric Princes take a more active role in an evolving storyline. Molag Bal may have been the Primary Villain in the Plane Meld but let's face it the real Villain for most of the story was Mannimarco and his Worm Cult. We know that the bassid gets away and fights Galerion and the Mages Guild in the future. There's no reason why he can't be made into the Primary Villain in Expansions.

Lets say a different Daedric Prince makes an attempt while Tamriel is recovering and you break Mannimarco out to give aid in the next expansion. Afterwards he escapes your custody and you have to defeat his schemes in future expansions.

Good point. I really liked the Daedric Prince-related quests in previous TES games, so my natural thought was that a different Daedric Prince should be the next big villain, but Mannimarco is possibly a better choice, for the reasons you list.

Having you be forced to go and break Mannimarco out might be problematic, though, because you were already given an option to release him in the main quest, so for some players he's already free. Given that possibility, it's probably better to have someone inform you that "some fool released Mannimarco" before you go off on whatever quest first involves him. If that fool happened to be you, then you just keep quiet about it! After all, you don't want to admit to it...

UrQuan · April 2015

Enodoc wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Note: I started typing this up immediately after my post at 11:23 above, but got distracted by having to do work... So by the time this actually posts, other people may have already said the same thing. I'll find out as soon as I hit Post Reply I guess

Harlwystyr wrote: »

So, something dawned on me recently when playing the game and reading up on the info that Zenimax Online Studios is releasing. We're all aware that we're getting new DLC adventure areas such as Murkmire and Wrothgar, but to some extent, these areas seem like self-contained entities, and is that what the evolving world of Tamriel in ESO needs?

Yes and no. I think having a number of expansions as self-contained entities is a good thing, but expansions continuing the main story would also be a good thing - especially if they gave us a reason to re-visit our original faction zones.

Here's how I think it could work (keeping in mind that I never played WoW or any other MMO that had to deal with this type of thing, so I don't know how they handled it):

When you get the DLC, the first time you log in with a given character, as long as you have completed the main story with that character, you are approached by an NPC who gives you a quest to go and talk to your faction leader, or the prophet, or whoever about some new problem that they need you help with.

[...]

Nice setup
This would be a great way to implement more content, and would fit with once of my suggestions about reusing old zones (assume VRs are gone by this time). The suggestion is based on the fact that hitting Level 50 unlocks the "Normal/Veteran" toggle in the Group Finder. That toggle can be expanded to include your home territory, whereby choosing "Normal" puts you in the Lvl 1-43 version, and choosing "Veteran" puts you in the Veteran/Lvl 50 version. My suggestion for this basically just included Veteran mobs and repeatable quests in the zones, but could easily encompass your Main Story 2 as well.

A toggle between the original and "veteran" versions of your zones would probably work pretty well.

TheShadowScout · April 2015

Well, the final scene after kicking ol' Molag in his B... well, winning the final fight in the main story anyhow, that conversation does hint at other daedric princes now likely to come and take their turn at nirn. One way or another.

And the established lore is kinda sketchy on exactly what kind of stuff happened during the interregnum until Tiber Septim reformed the empire properly, something they likely considered when they choose to set ESO in this time - its rather likely that things happen during this time that due to the confusion of warring fractions were never properly documented for people in later games to find in the lore, which gives them some leeway in spinning plots for expansions...

Of course, as has been mentioned, not all expansions really need to "trump" the initial plot - its a mistake some writers make, both for games and other stories, trying to always make the new threat worse then the old, which can lead to entering the realms of ridiculous ideas and strained immersion...
Sometimes it doesn't have to be a bigger threat, when a smaller one trying to take advantage of the weakened state after the struggle against the bigger one might suffice.
Some of the Tharns likely will feature somewhere, as might imperial controlled lands (nibenay, colovian highlands, etc.) - either in PvE, or in a combination of PvP and PvE regions.
Adventures in other planes to forestall daedric plots are always a possibility (Did I not hear talk of them working on something involving a trip to mephalas realm?).
Other threats are still around too, and might recover from being beaten back here or there (Reachmen, Maormer...), requiring a visit to their homelands for some questing.
Ambitious schemers might see the time ripe for playing a round of "game of thrones", start a little rebellion or try a coup here or there in yet undisclosed lands of the various alliances... (Veiled Heritage is still around, while the other two alliances will always have some people who'd like to ride to the crown with the good old "ourselves alone" spiel... more then enough resentment between orcs and bretons, dunmer and argonians, etc.; and that doesn't even cover the internal divisions some races occasionally have... breton noble houses scheming against each other when there is no greater threat uniting them, or ashlander "heretics" facing off against the tribunals faithful, or Bosmer still not entirely happy with the idea of the dominion).
And who knows what might stir in far off places, in the wake of the narrowly averted planemeld?

And then there are always more threat-independent ideas they could work on, since not everything needs a dire adversery to drive the plot. I for one would love to see a huge dwemer ruin, not dwelve or dungeon-sized, but a whole map-sized underground city to solo-explore and complete dozends of quests in, trying to track down the secret of the dwemers dissapearance... or maybe someday see some DLC involving an expedition to an akaviri outpost over the sea... or some pirate island... or some forgotten city deep in the desert... or swamp, though I guess we'll be getting some of that with Murkmire someday in the forseeable future...

But in the end, there are too many "blank" spaces on the map yet to be filled with regions that can be visited. Not all need to draw a character in with promise of a big quest, if they were suddenly just there, people would wander in to find the quests all on their own I presume... (one of the more enjoyable things I always liked about TES games - you could wander around and find adventure if you liked, instead of having a set of invisible walls railroad you down a predetermined questline...)

So, I am not worried they might run out of things to do in the months to come...

UrQuan · April 2015

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Of course, as has been mentioned, not all expansions really need to "trump" the initial plot - its a mistake some writers make, both for games and other stories, trying to always make the new threat worse then the old, which can lead to entering the realms of ridiculous ideas and strained immersion...

I like to call that Kevin J. Anderson Syndrome. "What's that? There's already been a nearly invulnerable battle station that can blow up entire planets? Well then my story will have a spaceship that can't be damaged by anything and that blows up whole solar systems!"

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Sometimes it doesn't have to be a bigger threat, when a smaller one trying to take advantage of the weakened state after the struggle against the bigger one might suffice.

Very true, and I like your examples of possible ways to go with this theme.

TheShadowScout wrote: »

And then there are always more threat-independent ideas they could work on, since not everything needs a dire adversery to drive the plot. I for one would love to see a huge dwemer ruin, not dwelve or dungeon-sized, but a whole map-sized underground city to solo-explore and complete dozends of quests in, trying to track down the secret of the dwemers dissapearance...

Like Blackreach in Skyrim? That may have been my favorite part of that entire game... It reminded me so much of the old AD&D Vault of the Drow module.

TheShadowScout wrote: »

or maybe someday see some DLC involving an expedition to an akaviri outpost over the sea...

Eventually (and I mean a long way off, after most of the areas of Tamriel are in the game) I'd like to see a full-sized expansion that sends players to Akavir. There can be a small outpost created by an expedition that serves as a home base to start exploring the continent from, and most of the residents can be hostile, but you can be trying to find potential allies and trading partners there.

TheShadowScout · April 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

I like to call that Kevin J. Anderson Syndrome. "What's that? There's already been a nearly invulnerable battle station that can blow up entire planets? Well then my story will have a spaceship that can't be damaged by anything and that blows up whole solar systems!"

Its kindergarden thinking... "my villain can beat up your viallain!" - "my doomsday device is doom-ier then your doomsday device!"
And of course the attempt to make any sequel "better" then the initial installment. And often some people think "better" has to mean "more epic", and "more epic" has to mean "defeating a yet bigger threat". When sometimes picking up the pieces after winning the initial big battle, putting out all the smaller fires started by it and trying to rebuild can be just as much of a challenge for a story to work with...

UrQuan wrote: »

It reminded me so much of the old AD&D Vault of the Drow module.

I admit I have been thinking of all the fun I had ages ago with roleplaying through the underdark in times long past... now Tamriel doesn't really have underground drow (since the dunmer live aboveground) or druergar (anymore), but... all those small dwemer ruins may be one thing, but there likely are quite a few much, much larger ones. Some will be properly inhabited, not by the original residents, but by some other group, and not all of those would be hostile to a adventurer... and of course, there still are some underground creatures around. We know some falmer survive till centuries later, despite being considered a mere myth, so... who knows what they might be like in this era? And the search for the dwemers secrets is a compelling plot to use...

Snowstrider · April 2015

I hope we get a proper huge expansion one day which expands on the alliance war story+the main quest and changes alot of things.
I want the world to be more alive

Woolenthreads · April 2015

Snowstrider wrote: »

I hope we get a proper huge expansion one day which expands on the alliance war story+the main quest and changes alot of things.

My impression is the Imperial City Expansion covers that desire but I can understand a desire for even more. With the factional conflict, it makes it difficult to add other types of expansions like factional rebellions.

Another way to do storyline is for a powerful character to declare a State independant and neutral. Or use mindbending magic to alter players perceptions in a new area (A possible way of introducing the new Magic Discovery).

tinythinker · April 2015

Harlwystyr wrote: »

What do you think we can expect from ZoS in terms of expansions and story continuity? Will we simply continue to explore the rest of Tamriel in self-contained adventure zones, or are new expansions bound to advance the main story? Will we see more character development to the faction leaders (perhaps even replacements of them?), and will we ever see the current zones revisited?

I hope so.

Bookwyrm wrote: »

I would like to see more Daedric Princes get involved. We get direct contact with Meridia, Molag Bal, and Sheogorath, but what about Clavicus Vile? Sanguine? Mephala is always a good one too. There are plenty to choose from. Of course, they may show up in some of the Vet dungeons, I don't know, I haven't played through them yet (taking it slow...), but connecting them with some big events would be great too.

And what about Tharn's daughter, Septima? Couldn't she be a potential antagonist? All mentions of her in-game seem less than savory...and not all of our antagonists need be beings with phenomenal cosmic powers.

I agree.