AssaultLemming wrote: »

I haven't done trials in weeks because the reward just isn't there for the time it would take. Also I find the fact that it also just comes down to speed to be a very dull style of raiding. Wish it was more about the mechanics of the fights, and I wish that there was more emphasis on crowd control and other support functions and less on dps.

Excellent point. Petrify....Encase...pointless abilities. Where in the game does a 15s stun even matter?
Sap/Stun/Mez....very much a missing aspect in Raid mechanics.

Agree 110%.... End Game was the reason i left the first time...

Patch 1.6 brought me back but not sure how long if some things don't get prioritized... The game has alot of good features but it is currently not designed for long term sustainability.

1. Looking for Group tool needs complete overhaul. Especially before consoles launch as end game will turn into a ghost town being on a console if the 'social' aspects of the game are missing.. (ie. harder to chat and group hunt via chat on console if people don't commit to keyboard, etc.. will be painful. I haven't done ONE trial or ANY quests in Craglorn as group hunting is painful.

2. End game gear needs complete overhaul as well... This is just my opinion but 90%+ of MMO's fail in this category (even WOW etc). Getting a new item just for a few more +1's is not exciting. Every item should have a unique draw to hunt for that item. Unique Cosmetics (required), Unique effects (not just set bonuses, strongly suggested... when i say effects, whether graphical, procs, etc for end game gear should be standard), something that makes the hunt worth it.
a. End game gear provisioning through multiple sources - I am not 100% sold that a "token" system is right for ESO, but different ways to get gear (and unique gear) is DEFINITELY required.... especially with ESO in state it is now that things like Trials really have little draw to run them...

3. Solo play integration - Questing as expected becomes a grind at some point, and gear mostly worthless or too all over the place in the VR levels... crafting becomes more imperitive, but there is A TON of room in the solo experience in VR levels to mix it up... A. Dungeon finding becomes painful and LFG doesnt work (ive tried to use LFG in at least 30-50 cross samples, in at least 92% of each time i tried it took over 15minutes or more to find a group and in 92% of those samples 1 person dropped out of group near instantly (dropping from 4 to 3 people). For whatever reason.... B. If dungeons, delves, etc had a solo mechanic to scale dungeons to be able to solo AND make them challenging AND have a unique set of reward options (whether token based, new gear types, or even a specific augmentation to existing gear that could be gotten via solo... those things would be attractive... I am sadly still at Undaunted 2 because i havent been able to get a dungeon group in months.... As a semi casual (but pasionate about endgame viability) i simply cannot see in chat channel waiting for groups to form that meet me current level needs (VR 8 currently).

For an MMO, designers need to think that content, "Anytime. Anywhere. Anyway." should be the design approach. Finding a way to empower your players to enjoy the content they want, WHEN they want it...

Feel free to agree/disagree. All MMOs are unique ecosystem.... things like EQ2 i think did gear right for most part (unique cosmetics, interesting effects that were not the norm (procs, etc).. something that really drives you wanting to get that item.. (Wow does it wrong for most part mmo...cosmetics are great... getting a few more +++ is boring and complete turn off to the game)... GW2 does crafting right in alot of ways and cosmetics VERY well...

Divinetouch wrote: »

I haven't seen a single answer/post from anyone in Zenimax in those kind of threads about Endgame.
I'm officer in MultiGaming Community but after Update 6 you won't see me to make any advertising from my side, neither to
convince people to start the game or to come back for that matter. And why should I, what I'm suppose to tell them:

- Come play ESO, once you reach high level you maybe can start doing Trials if you have at least 70-90 Champion points. If you working and have only 2-3h gaming time probably will make those points in few months or over a Year.

- Get trash gear or pvp once first to improve your dps and for completing Trials finally can get gear for deconstructing. Yes none of the sets droping from bosses there fits any build.

- Preferable start playing stamina builds, because even if you like magicka range you won't be competitive enough. The difference in result between both is 5-7k (if not more) benefit for stamina. Great balance Zenimax.

- No new content at the moment and don't expect one any time soon. Everything is oriented for consoles.


As a Guild/Raid leader for quite long time, after Update 6 I can't find a single reason to motivate my people to raid. I lost and keep loosing very good members. Yes we still raiding but is most likely as a habit and get some score in Leaderboard, which everyone assuming is mostly time based or if you done Trials in hard mode. There is no exact official explanation from Zenimax about how the score work. Obviously is not because of special tactics.

As many others told you already, don't get me wrong. I love the game and prefer to enjoy it, playing this game at the very beginning. But if all your efforts lately keep going to Crown store/consoles only, our gaming time won't last long, especially subscriptions.
In latest patches i see only fix = nerf, nerf and nerf. What game need is major changes. Stop nerfing only, boost some classes instead for more balance, make Trials gear worthy, clear rules for leaderboard, don't even want start for pvp issues(there is enough threads about).
So lacking Endgame, ESO will be doomed as many other games we saw(play) latest years.

Hope dies last and I still have some faith in Zenimax will bring us back to enjoy the game. Please don't make me/us loos it.

I am a guild leader as well.
Pre 1.6: 100/350 online and 2-3 groups running in Trials. I couldn't run enough Trials to satisfy the members.
Post 1.6: I spend 30-60mins simply trying to form ONE group.

As a guild, we succeeded fairly well pre 1.6. I.E. decent times for weekly and 30-40 guild members getting their weekly reward (with maybe SO week exception). Now-a-days, it would appear that the only true 'end-game' happening is in leaderboard competition with Hard Modes. Leaving relatively few guilds participating.

I love this game as an Elder Scrolls longtime fan. The game is absolutely beautiful. The mechanics are decent and have potential in the long haul. But there simply doesn't seem to be anyone in the Dev House that gets end-game. Not even sure if they care.

Clues:
- Launch did not have any endgame included.
- First endgame introduced was done within 10mins of time after less than a month.
- Second endgame patch had a huge steel door in terms of first boss. To this day, the average player struggles on Mantikora. Healers and Tanks in particular need to be in top form. Big no no on the front door of your content.
- And that has been it. 3 Trials in a year. Zero gear chase patches except for the game change redirecting peoples needs.
- They dont understand gear priority. The system currently has Power > Resourse > Crit and none of the gear reflects this dynamic except for PvP gear.

So in the Dev House know about endgame PvE? Any of these people play EQ/WoW? New game....sure, new concepts....sure, but show me an endgame carrot or your "new" only show ignorance in the MMO world.

Without an addressing to this issue, I am led to believe that their intentions are for PvP, RP, and Casuals. A recipe for a short life span. "Money is in the comeback". Cater to endgamers or die. Period.

Makkir wrote: »

i didn't really want to sub to yet another MMO that is centered around gear progression...

What do you do at endgame then? Reroll an alt? That can only go on for so long.....

New Trial or Gear Optimization, endgame needs a boost.

So...we definitely need an up vote - down vote system. My thread gets buried in seconds to relatively unimportant topics. Things like 'vote on best class poll' which has pages of comments.

I feel we are not being recognized here, at all. It would appear endgame has zero to no value to ZoS. Between the lack of acknowledgement on this subject, and the complete dismissal of our attempts to understand the scoring system, I believe they are telling us "f**k off, we have console and new players to worry about first".

Recap:
-same old one year old trials
-pointless gear in trials
-50k xp in trials which does not compare to ANY other gains in game.
-no dev response
-no dev response
-no dev response
-no dev response

As a guild leader, I set out to build a guild with training runs/speed runs/progression runs on a nightly basis. That dream was real right on up to 1.6. Now, I cant get a group together because there is simply no point. My players are content with alt play after there daily pledge, and/or pvp. THAT IS ALL. Large scale PVE grouping has been abandoned by both the majority of player base AND by the devs.

We need more people who care to respond. To comment. Get the real problems in the fore front, instead of 20pages conversations about a horse stutter........

Anoteros wrote: »

ZOS will never acknowledge the shortcomings of endgame nor admit they *** up with the veteran system.

I dont even want a "I f'd up acknowledgement", I simply want...."this is our plans to make endgame interesting", a "what is the future of endgame", a "oh, let us at the very least, optimize the endgame gear for you", a "here is the point system, have fun guys", a "our gear now has spell/wpn damage on it in trials, feel free to stop pvp if you didnt want to in the first place."......

for [snip] sake, my patience is just getting shorter

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

"This is endgame material right? Then it should be the optimal way to progress. "

Endgame and progression seem to be opposing concepts...

Let me reword it then. "This is endgame material right? Then it should be the optimal way to HORIZONTALLY progress."

better?

Endless wave survival mode, please.

Small arena VS mode.

Kallipsoe wrote: »

Yes, completely agree. Trials, Vet DSA and Vet Dungeons need to be more rewarding. Each Trial and Vet DSA should have a set piece that each type of player would shoot for and want "Tank, Healer, Magic DPS, Stam DPS". Other options like special enchants that you can add to Armor/Weapons would also be a good idea. Just more and better incentives to run them.

Special enchants would great! Just another viable "carrot on a stick" to chase

Well, all this is moot point for me. I want to see SOLO end game content. This is main priority for me. I hope Murkmire will be the one and eagerly awaiting for that.

vovus69 wrote: »

Well, all this is moot point for me. I want to see SOLO end game content. This is main priority for me. I hope Murkmire will be the one and eagerly awaiting for that.

Agree. I too enjoy the option to solo play at any given time and hope that Murkmire will provide this. However, this is an endgame concerning thread in terms of Trials.

DDuke wrote: »

Fissh wrote: »

Zorrashi wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

i didn't really want to sub to yet another MMO that is centered around gear progression...

Same here. It was their lack of gear progression that attracted me here in the first place in addition to the lack of 'traditional' raids.

But despite that, even I think that endgame rewards need to be more improved for trials. Not so that are inherently better than crafted armor, but at least equal to epic/legendary tiers in base stats. Preferably with unique enchants that cannot be replicated. Not all of them have be offensive enchants either, but can be something really unique like an enchant where your sword levels with you or maybe boots that increase your jumping ability. But even the typical elemental enchants would be appreciated if they give the said gear piece a decent 'umpf' to them. Making some of them look more unique in appearance would be nice too.

Good points.
Just a FYI though: the Trial gear does in fact have unique appearance, so that part is covered

If only...

Same appearance:
Vicious Ophidian
Way of the Air

Infallible Aether
Martial Knowledge

Eternal Yokeda
Way of the Fire


As you can see, they didn't even bother to give trials gear unique appearance (they share it with common green sets you can farm in Craglorn or Cyrodiil).

Best part?
The "noob gear" is actually even better for PvE in case of Martial Knowledge, and Air is better for the current stam regen meta in PvP .

I stand corrected. There goes the one thing I held as a good point.....