Siege Damage Intended to hit for 24k?
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RedTalon✭✭✭✭✭
✭nm please delete just over joyed about my favorite part of pvp getting a boostEdited by RedTalon on March 23, 2015 6:41PM1 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭When this game launched, siege mattered, you charged a breech under defensive siege fire and oil you were dead.
I'm glad we will nowAbout time!
Wow this makes me smile. I can't wait to try it out.
Exactly what I'd expect from someone who wants a linear, point and click experience with no differentiation between players who put time into optimization builds, skills, whatever. Just identical performance, for all players, COD style. You asked for this.
That's the furthest thing I want, this will spread things out a bit, get more good fights going.
I do all those things with my build too, but I have always thought its stupid a player skill does more damage then a piece of field artillery.
Siege has cons to like being a sitting duck if your flanked.
Just charging in now through siege fire wont be viable anymore, you will either have to flank them on the open field or kill them in the keep.
Smaller groups will now be able to use choke points and tactical position to fight back against superior numbers, this is a good thing.
This change adds strategic elements more then anything.
Folks are tired of the zerg, folks will still zerg, but now siege will be a viable counter at position of tactical advantage which before it wasn't now it is.
Yes raids will have to adjust we all will, but the game will be better off because if it
Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak13 -
mananull✭
It is not more effective than anything else.
- Siege weapons must be placed, you cant place them anywhere. It takes time.
- You cant move or heal yourself while shooting. Easy targets for any sniper.
- It is easy to evade a siegeweapon attack
Yes siegeweapons are very effective now, but only under the right circumstances.
If you have a good build you still have a big advantage overall.Edited by mananull on March 23, 2015 6:45PM4 -
Snit✭✭✭✭✭
✭Let's see how this plays out over a few days. It will definitely change some behaviors. It might help.Snit AD Sorc
Ratbag AD Warden Tank
Goblins AD Stamblade3 -
Huntler✭✭✭✭✭
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It is hardly more effective than anything else.
- Siege weapons must be placed, you cant place them anywhere. It takes time.
- You cant move or heal yourself while shooting. Easy targets for any sniper.
- It is easy to evade a siegeweapon attack
Yes siegeweapons are very effective now, but only under the right circumstances.
1. Virtually everywhere in Cyrodiil I can take advantage of siege, even in towers, cubbies, open field. There are very limited places where I can not take advantage of siege.
2. Yes I can move and heal myself while shooting, only terrible players sit on a siege when its reloading. It takes about 1 second to activate your siege, fire it, then drop it and return to evading attacks, healing, etc. This is a terrible point only useful against bad players.
3. It is easy to evade siege weapon attack once again in only certain situations where you shouldn't be using siege anyway. I'll see you guys tonight where I get guaranteed siege hits, this whole point of "oh just don't get hit by siege" is laughable. When there is enough siege you cannot avoid it all and in many of the strongest cases it cannot be avoided, such as keep takes.
As for @woodsro we both want the same thing, but have very clearly different ideas on what this change will do. I give you that siege will make defending a keep easier with smaller numbers, no doubt about that. However, the zerg will overall benefit more from this change is my point as detailed in the other thread we commented on (and I created). Time will tell for sure, but I am highly skeptical of siege being the answer to zergs in keeps too since a big enough zerg makes siege not work.0 -
sirston✭✭✭✭✭
for once in a blue moon Im going to have to agree with youWhitestakes Revenge
WoodElf Mag-Warden
Sirston
Magickia Dragonknight
T0XIC
Pride Of The Pact
Vehemence
The Crimson Order
victoria aut mors0 -
Huntler✭✭✭✭✭
✭xDOVAHKIINx wrote: »
@ Everyone Sorry i did not add a screen shot to my original post.
@Huntler My problem is not so much "bad players" given a tool thats more effective than anything els in the game. Its more along the lines of, why should anyone use anything els in the game? when you can have 24k unmitigated damage by placing down a fire ballista. Its absurd, but i do agree with you agree with you 100%.
See my "nightmare" thread about this and you'll see we agree 100% on what you mentioned and that siege will be more important than builds, how you play, your gear, your skills, etc. Basically your goal will be siege siege siege, not build planning, group coordination of abilities, supportive skills, position, etc.
for once in a blue moon Im going to have to agree with you
It had to happen eventually my friend.Edited by Huntler on March 23, 2015 6:48PM1 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Those complaining are blowing this out of proportion. Better builds and such still have an advantage.
Its not like someone ganks me and I'm gonna have time to place a fire ballusta and shoot him in the face.
I am putting siege shield on my. Bar, that's for sure though. Everyone has siege shield, far cry from the COD comparisons.Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak3 -
ThyIronFist✭✭✭✭✭I have an idea.
Move out of the red circle on the ground.
You had 12 months to practice it.
This patch will be good. People will learn to spread out and people that have been doing nothing but zergballing will cry on the forums. Bring it on.Edited by ThyIronFist on March 23, 2015 6:49PMThe Elder Zergs Online
Sainur Ironfist - DK - EU - Ebonheart Pact
Retired5 -
eliisra✭✭✭✭✭
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Yeah, but players like that(clueless and bad build) usually dont know how to use siege tbh. They attack postern door with fire ballista or meat bag, they try to break walls with a ram. That is, if they even have siege on them, because they tend to save their AP for more important stuff like blue boxes. We should probably worry more about players that actually knows what they're doing.4 -
Observant✭✭✭✭
You're opposing this as if you stand in the red circles!
Give it a week to play out before preaching I told you so, lets see what it does in the larger scheme of things shall we?
This is going to be a great learning experience to those who need it, and a damn good time for us privileged enough to be part of a AAA Grade PVP guild.Vehemence4 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
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those brainless tools are also available to people with good builds.
what's the problem?August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber3 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ThyIronFist wrote: »I have an idea.
Move out of the red circle on the ground.
You had 12 months to practice it.
This patch will be good. People will learn to spread out and people that have been doing nothing but zergballing will cry on the forums. Bring it on.
^This.
If someone can not avoid being hit by siege he is a terrible player, over time to get some practice.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU7 -
Huntler✭✭✭✭✭
✭ThyIronFist wrote: »I have an idea.
Move out of the red circle on the ground.
You had 12 months to practice it.
This patch will be good. People will learn to spread out and people that have been doing nothing but zergballing will cry on the forums. Bring it on.
^This.
If someone can not avoid being hit by siege he is a terrible player, over time to get some practice.
This... is... exhausting... I just shake my head at you.
those brainless tools are also available to people with good builds.
what's the problem?
Ugh. You just don't get it do you.0 -
NukeAllTheThings✭✭✭✭✭About time!
Wow this makes me smile. I can't wait to try it out.
Exactly what I'd expect from someone who wants a linear, point and click experience with no differentiation between players who put time into optimization builds, skills, whatever. Just identical performance, for all players, COD style. You asked for this.
Those player's builds are "optimized" to completely ignore and disregard any and all siege. Now siege matters....get optimized to account for that."it's important to state that our decision to go with subscriptions is not a referendum on online game revenue models. F2P, B2P, etc. are valid, proven business models - but subscription is the one that fits ESO the best, given our commitment to freedom of gameplay, quality and long-term content delivery. Plus, players will appreciate not having to worry about being "monetized" in the middle of playing the game, which is definitely a problem that is cropping up more and more in online gaming these days." - Matt Firor1 -
LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
The game went B2P last week and is marching towards P2W and yet you ask the above question. Tell me you were being rhetorical.1 -
Huntler✭✭✭✭✭
✭LonePirate wrote: »
The game went B2P last week and is marching towards P2W and yet you ask the above question. Tell me you were being rhetorical.
I was.... but I also still try for some reason....0 -
mananull✭
It is hardly more effective than anything else.
- Siege weapons must be placed, you cant place them anywhere. It takes time.
- You cant move or heal yourself while shooting. Easy targets for any sniper.
- It is easy to evade a siegeweapon attack
Yes siegeweapons are very effective now, but only under the right circumstances.
1. Virtually everywhere in Cyrodiil I can take advantage of siege, even in towers, cubbies, open field. There are very limited places where I can not take advantage of siege.
2. Yes I can move and heal myself while shooting, only terrible players sit on a siege when its reloading. It takes about 1 second to activate your siege, fire it, then drop it and return to evading attacks, healing, etc. This is a terrible point only useful against bad players.
3. It is easy to evade siege weapon attack once again in only certain situations where you shouldn't be using siege anyway. I'll see you guys tonight where I get guaranteed siege hits, this whole point of "oh just don't get hit by siege" is laughable. When there is enough siege you cannot avoid it all and in many of the strongest cases it cannot be avoided, such as keep takes.
1. It still take time to pace and is very infexible, a open fight will probalbly move to fast to get a got position and it easy to flank these guys.
2. This second can be enough, i bet there are snipers lurking in the shadows just waiting for someone using a siege weapon. And one second without dodge roll -> dead. At least if you have a "bad build"
3. I dont think we come to an agreement
. You say there are just certain situations where you can not use siege, I say there are just certain situations where you can use siege.
Anyway my point still stands. Yes siege weapons are a very powerful tool now, especially in siege battles, but it does not make "good builds" unimportant.Edited by mananull on March 23, 2015 7:10PM1 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
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those brainless tools are also available to people with good builds.
what's the problem?
Ugh. You just don't get it do you.
i do. i just don't think it's a big deal. like i said in my previous post, we just gotta wait n see how people adapt.
August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber3 -
McDoogs✭✭✭✭About time!
Wow this makes me smile. I can't wait to try it out.
Exactly what I'd expect from someone who wants a linear, point and click experience with no differentiation between players who put time into optimization builds, skills, whatever. Just identical performance, for all players, COD style. You asked for this.
Scale of 1 to 10, how mad are you? Seems like 6-7 mads, bro. You should probably chill out, this is just a stupid video game.Edited by McDoogs on March 23, 2015 7:14PM3 -
ScruffyWhiskers✭✭✭✭✭Need some new siege rules if this type of damage is going to stay.
1) Set up time for siege should be increased greatly
2) Can only carry a limited number of siege engines
3) Can't pack it back up after use. You use it, you lose it.4 -
exiledtyrant✭✭✭I'm guessing siege shield from the support line will be more popular nowIf all are brethren
How could my hands not tremble
As breath fled my prey?
What blinds my vision?
My hands are tools; it must be
The haze of blossoms
-Salous the Penitent2 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »Need some new siege rules if this type of damage is going to stay.
1) Set up time for siege should be increased greatly
2) Can only carry a limited number of siege engines
3) Can't pack it back up after use. You use it, you lose it.
1) Great idea!
2) Even better!
3) no.
How about making it a LOT more expensive? Increase it with the factor of its damage increase with today's patch.August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber1 -
Pchela✭✭✭✭✭Oh my god the tears in zone chat right now are raining down like the fire from my fire trebs. I love it.11 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭#What did I say.
So let me get this straight.
When someone whines on the forums about getting hit with a ridiculous number by Radiant Destruction or some other flavor of the month ability, you are quick to question the poster's competence and detail to him how is is oversimplifying things or just isn't a very good player.
But when someone whines on the forum about getting hit with a ridiculous number by a siege weapon - providing ZERO details or evidence - you are quick to agree with the poster and brag "I told you so."
You are a paradigm of objectivity.Make Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.12 -
WebBull✭✭✭✭✭
✭ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »Need some new siege rules if this type of damage is going to stay.
1) Set up time for siege should be increased greatly
2) Can only carry a limited number of siege engines
3) Can't pack it back up after use. You use it, you lose it.
1) no
2) no
3) no
Bastion of the Heartland cuts damage by 20%. Siege Shield cuts damage by another 20%. Avoiding red circles cuts damage by 100%. Now go play.6 -
Glurin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »Need some new siege rules if this type of damage is going to stay.
1) Set up time for siege should be increased greatly
2) Can only carry a limited number of siege engines
3) Can't pack it back up after use. You use it, you lose it.
Why? The only change in the meta that really took place is that siege is actually useful now as opposed to just being a door knocker. They are still slow, still immobile, still vulnerable, still have a limited number that can be placed in an area at any given time and still almost no help whatsoever on the open field in small scale battles. The difference is that keep sieges will actually be keep sieges instead of just another fight."He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you..."5
