Legerdemain witnesses
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Naor_Sarethi
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So i found a lonley fishing Khajiit beggar on the AD southern island (forgot the name) and decided i wanted some Khajiitfur socks, so i killed it. The only living things around were a few mudcrabs and an Alit, yet i got a 200 bounty.
How is that possible? I checked and there could not have been a single witness to the "murder".
Does the presence of witnesses matter at all or is it simply a bug?
How is that possible? I checked and there could not have been a single witness to the "murder".
Does the presence of witnesses matter at all or is it simply a bug?
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Sevalaricgirl✭✭✭✭✭The justice system is not working as it should. No witnesses should mean no bounty. I know in thieving that if there are no witnesses, there is no bounty. It should be the same with assassination.7 -
Rammi✭✭✭I think this is intended behavior given that when you steal and no one sees you don't get a bounty but regardless if i kill someone with witnesses or not I get a bounty.
The Champion System should have rewarded Champion Points based off of achievements and feats earned through excelling at end game content not grinding your life away vs mobs in order to stay competitive. This system is uncreative and is a great example of extremely lazy system design. Yes, you should be embarrassed1 -
MasterSpatula✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I pickpocketed a Veiled Heritance member in a delve and got a bounty. I looked around for what "honorable citizen" there could possibly have been to report me, but all I saw were traitors and necromancers."A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle7 -
jeevin✭✭✭✭✭U NEED MO POWA!!
Actually agree with OP it's kind of frustrating and a step backwards in justice for the Elder Scrolls as a game franchise.3 -
SLy_Kyti✭✭✭✭If there are no witnesses, there is no crime. From the patch notes:
Fixed a rare issue where you could receive bounty for a crime despite no visible witnesses being present.Master Crafter: Almost all motifs
GM~ Blades of Old Tamriel NA/AD
Member~ NZAD
Member~ Blades of Vengeance NA/AD
-Tamriel College -Amazing Deals of Nirn-
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Jaggannath✭✭Definitely if I kill someone with no witnesses, there shouldn't be some divine global bounty placed on my head. And if I kill witnesses it should in theory reduce my bounty as well, if added for being seen. Dead men tell no tales lol.“and so will the world end, I think, a victim of love rather than hate. For love's ever been the more destructive weapon, sure.”
― Stephen King, The Dark TowerVisit the LOOTS R US Guild Trader in Balkarth, Craglorn today! Excellent selection of VR14 gear and premium goods for sale! Largest selection of rare PvP gear!7 -
LIQUID741✭✭✭I just love how my 95%chance to pickpocket fails 50% of the time...
"they've done studies you know...60% of the time it works all the time" Brian FantanaSolid-Nightblade of AD8 -
Vez✭✭✭All Tamriel residents keep homing pigeons and if you attack them, they will quickly write a message detailing your description and the assault you perpetrated then send it to the nearest guard post. If you open with chopping off their hands to prevent their quick little fingers from writing the message, they will invoke a secret Mages Guild spell projecting a psijic likeness of you committing the crime to the nearest guard post. The only way to prevent this is to one shot them from stealth so they can't get a look at you.4
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Nebthet78✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MasterSpatula wrote: »I pickpocketed a Veiled Heritance member in a delve and got a bounty. I looked around for what "honorable citizen" there could possibly have been to report me, but all I saw were traitors and necromancers.
I had the same thing happen in the same delve. I kinda wondered why the heck is there a chance to pickpocket an enemy in the first place. I had no bounty until I actually left the delve.. I was like WTF?
Some thing added for the Justice System make absolutely no sense what so ever.Far too many characters to list any more.2 -
phairdon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Stole items from a house. Was an npc sleeping on a bed right beside me, they kept waking up & sitting up each time I took something. No bounty.
Killed a chicken while completing a quest & received a bounty of 30g. Walked past numerous guards without them questioning me or trying to apprehend me. Was not until interacting with one of the guards, the bounty subject came up.Edited by phairdon on March 23, 2015 10:16PMYour immersion is breaking my entitlement. Buff Sorc's. Darkshroud the cremator Death by furRubeus BlackFluffy knight BladesThe Fat PantherPsijic Fungal SausageFlesheater the VileCaspian Rafferty FernsbyArchfiend Warlock PiersThe Black BishopEvil Wizard Lizard (EU)Neberra Vestige Fajeon (EU)Salanis Deathstick (EU)Blood Mage Alchemist (EU)1 -
Robbmrp✭✭✭✭✭
✭Naor_Sarethi wrote: »So i found a lonley fishing Khajiit beggar on the AD southern island (forgot the name) and decided i wanted some Khajiitfur socks, so i killed it. The only living things around were a few mudcrabs and an Alit, yet i got a 200 bounty.
How is that possible? I checked and there could not have been a single witness to the "murder".
Does the presence of witnesses matter at all or is it simply a bug?
Next time kill the mudcrabs first! ZOS never said that a "witness" was only in human form..... lolNA Server - Kildair3 -
twev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭If there are no witnesses, there is no crime. From the patch notes:
Fixed a rare issue where you could receive bounty for a crime despite no visible witnesses being present.
I had an issue whereby I had witnesses in an 'empty room', until I killed the rats.
I figured it was a bug they had to iron out, and haven't bothered trying since.The problem with society these days is that no one drinks from the skulls of their enemies anymore.1 -
Faugaun✭✭✭✭✭
Next time kill the mudcrabs first! ZOS never said that a "witness" was only in human form..... lol
Killing mudcrabs gives bounty thoughMy new startup social network for Theorycrafting
Champion Point Calculators
Sharable samples:
http://asolutionaday.com/test/Warrior.htm?ba=5&bl=&e=12&ha=10&he=&l=&m=&n=5&q=20&r=15&s=15&t=18
http://asolutionaday.com/test/Thief.htm?a=5&b=22&d=2&e=18&h=8&ma=0&mo=5&sh=9&sp=19&te=12&tu=13&w=1
http://asolutionaday.com/test/Mage.htm?bla=5&ble=1&bo=6&ele=2&elf=3&h=7&m=9&pi=10&pr=20&sp=4&st=8&t=401 -
Shehriazad✭✭There isn't even such a thing as proper calls for guards. You aren't given any chance to react on anything.
Im in a city and break open a lock, random dude sees me and says "Too bad, you got a bounty now"....he was just some motherflippin' beggar.
He didn't even call the guards...he telepathically alarmed them and then taunted me. That's just horrible.
And even if you kill a group of people...why does the guard know about it if you kill them all..and there isn't any guard in sight OR earshot. NPCs need to be given a proper alarm AI.
Let's say you kill a dude, someone else sees this, he runs into range of a guard to alarm them. Now you have the chance to just leg it before your bounty is set or to try and kill him unseen before he gets near a guard.
THAT is how it should work.
Same for thievery. Someone sees you and he could call you out on it or leg it to call the guards...you should be given an option to bribe or intimidate him. And in case of pickpocketing..killing him if he is out of earshot/view of guards...because somehow the guards will still know no matter what...so weird.Edited by Shehriazad on March 23, 2015 10:16PM3 -
Bookwyrm✭✭✭✭MasterSpatula wrote: »I pickpocketed a Veiled Heritance member in a delve and got a bounty. I looked around for what "honorable citizen" there could possibly have been to report me, but all I saw were traitors and necromancers.
Ah, I think I know which delve you speak of, and I submitted a bug report on that whole place, because there are tons of "civilian" Heritance members laying around "ill" on the ground. They aren't hostile, which is fine, but this seems to mark them as "civilians" so that when they get hit with an AOE or even a regular attack because you're moving around and attacking their hostile comrades, you get a bounty for assault...and then another for murder when you inevitably kill them because they're trying to kill you. I think it's called Naril Nagaia or something like that.
To me that says "not working as intended." But of course, I'm being optimistic in this instance.
Bookwyrm - The Thread KillerDon't talk to me! I'm a shrub. - Frozen Man1 -
Remag_Div✭✭✭✭✭Sevalaricgirl wrote: »The justice system is not working as it should. No witnesses should mean no bounty. I know in thieving that if there are no witnesses, there is no bounty. It should be the same with assassination.
Yeah, it seems a little buggy.
I was in a house with 2 NPC's and attacked one so I gained a bounty, but then I killed the other NPC who witnessed the crime so my bounty should have been erased but I still had it.1 -
Elder_III✭✭✭✭If you play a stamina heavy dps you can almost always sneak attack one shot civilians, even at VR levels. For Tank/Healer, or even Magicak based DPS it's going to be harder.
I would like to see a system where you can attack any NPC and as long as no other NPC is within Xm in any direction when they die you do not get any bounty. If you attack someone in town and they scream it would likely be heard by other NPCs, but random, solo NPCs out in the wilderness should not be able to give you a bounty of any kind. imoSemi retired from the trading aspects of the game.1 -
Remag_Div✭✭✭✭✭Wait, so even if the NPC is completely alone and you don't one shot, you get a bounty?
That's pretty lame.4 -
Naor_Sarethi✭✭✭I found the issue. It was a Khajiit loving lowlife mudcrab that rat me out.
Needless to say i had a delicious dinner. And new socks.1 -
MasterSpatula✭✭✭✭✭
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Ah, I think I know which delve you speak of, and I submitted a bug report on that whole place, because there are tons of "civilian" Heritance members laying around "ill" on the ground. They aren't hostile, which is fine, but this seems to mark them as "civilians" so that when they get hit with an AOE or even a regular attack because you're moving around and attacking their hostile comrades, you get a bounty for assault...and then another for murder when you inevitably kill them because they're trying to kill you. I think it's called Naril Nagaia or something like that.
To me that says "not working as intended." But of course, I'm being optimistic in this instance.
That's the one."A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle0 -
Sylveria_Relden✭✭✭✭Reminds me of stolen items in Oblivion, Skyrim, F:NV, etc... if no one witnesses the crime, how do they know it was *you* to begin with? Still didn't stop you from getting bounty or bad karma. Seems like it's a residual problem with most of the Bethsoft-based games.
LOS/range incorporation into the bounty system could easily fix this- but I wouldn't expect it anytime soon.TL;DR - If you got this far without reading the entire post you're either too lazy or suck at reading comprehension and probably don't belong in a public forum anyway. Just move along, you wouldn't understand.0 -
kurstein✭✭✭@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno please look at the post it is not the first time player having problem with this and I think you need to look in to it.
I got a vr14 nightblad and can 1 shoot up to 20k hp npc but other classes cant 1 shoot npc so the justice system need to be look at if you are going to add the dark brotherhood where you need to do "clean" kills and it will brake the game for most class that cant make a 1shoot hit
please I hope to here from 1 of you"Sweet Mother, sweet Mother, send your child unto me, for the sins of the unworthy must be baptized in blood and fear" all hail the night mother0 -
I'm not even sure how I just murdered someone. I was at the last part of a quest (Under Siege) talking to the Captain when I saw lots of red coming at me, which I assumed where the bad guys, so I killed them. All of a sudden I got a murderer achievement. I have it turned on that I can't hurt innocents. Then it said I stole something too. I looked in my inventory and there it was... a horn there I don't even recall taking. I am confused as to how that happened lolEdited by silvernightscape on March 24, 2015 1:21AM0 -
SteveCampsOut✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Welcome to Tamriel Justice.Where the deities you can't see are the witnesses against you.@ֆȶɛʋɛƈǟʍքֆօʊȶ⍟
Sanguine & Psijic Group Beta Tester.
NA Server:EU Server:SpoilerSteforax Soulstrong CH782 Sorcerer AD
Grumpy Kahjiti CH782 Dragonknight AD
Rheticia Le Drakisius CH782 Nightblade DC
Razmuzan Thrasmas CH782 Templar EP
Sheenara Soulstrong CH782 Dragonknight DC
Erik Ramzey CH782 Nightblade AD
Growling Kahjiti CH782 Nightblade EP
One of Many Faces CH782 Sorcerer DC
Grumpasaurus Rex CH782 Warden DCSpoilerGuildmaster of Pacrooti's Hirelings AD Based LGBT Friendly Guild.
Stefrex Souliss CH701 Sorcerer AD
Grumpy Kahjiti CH701 Dragonknight DC
Slithisi Ksissi CH701 Nightblade EP
Pokes-With-Fire CH701 Dragonknight AD
Josie-The-Pussi-Cat CH701 Templar AD
Stug-Grog M'God CH701 Templar DC
One With Many Faces CH701 Nightblade DC
Trixie Truskan CH701 Sorcerer EP
Grumpetasaurus Rex CH701 Warden EP1 -
Elder_III✭✭✭✭@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno please look at the post it is not the first time player having problem with this and I think you need to look in to it.
I got a vr14 nightblad and can 1 shoot up to 20k hp npc but other classes cant 1 shoot npc so the justice system need to be look at if you are going to add the dark brotherhood where you need to do "clean" kills and it will brake the game for most class that cant make a 1shoot hit
please I hope to here from 1 of you
I completely agree with you. I did want to point out that the right build can one hit NPCs out of stealth as any class. A VR14 (or even lower) half Health and Half Stamina can OneShot for 25K+ with Uppercut (2Hander) out of Stealth. So it's doable in the right scenario.... not saying that's the way it should be, but maybe that will help some folks out that are trying to avoid bounties.Semi retired from the trading aspects of the game.1 -
kurstein✭✭✭If you play a stamina heavy dps you can almost always sneak attack one shot civilians, even at VR levels. For Tank/Healer, or even Magicak based DPS it's going to be harder.
I would like to see a system where you can attack any NPC and as long as no other NPC is within Xm in any direction when they die you do not get any bounty. If you attack someone in town and they scream it would likely be heard by other NPCs, but random, solo NPCs out in the wilderness should not be able to give you a bounty of any kind. imo
yes and stunned npc cant scream but now you still get bounty on you even in a house with only one npc
"Sweet Mother, sweet Mother, send your child unto me, for the sins of the unworthy must be baptized in blood and fear" all hail the night mother0 -
kurstein✭✭✭dam still no feedback from @ZOS_JessicaFolsom or @ZOS_GinaBruno"Sweet Mother, sweet Mother, send your child unto me, for the sins of the unworthy must be baptized in blood and fear" all hail the night mother0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIPAEoRr9JA