Legerdemain witnesses

Greevir

Nothing compares to Skyrims chicken issue. For a while, if you killed a chicken in Riverwood, everyone in the world hated you. It was awesome.

kurstein

hey I got no info on this post can you give sum info on it? @ZOS_MandiParker

nerevarine1138

kurstein wrote: »

hey I got no info on this post can you give sum info on it? @ZOS_MandiParker

The mods are not more likely to comment if you just keep spamming their names.

dodgehopper_ESO

There are a few delves (particularly in Cyrodiil) I've run into where you can rob the bandit/necromancer/undead camps, and oddly enough, you can get a bounty for stealing from them, but not from places like Cheydinhal, Bruma, etc. I can recollect humorously also robbing an enemy General or Captain or something in one mission, and getting a bounty from my own people. It really didn't make sense, as that General was leading an assault against the people I was fighting for.

Zershar_Vemod

They should also fix the issue with killing witnesses eliminating bounties.

nerevarine1138

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

They should also fix the issue with killing witnesses eliminating bounties.

That's not an issue. They may change things in the future, but that's working as intended.

Carde

My favorite witness was an Imperial general I was killing that had taken over a Covenant city who narced on me for stealing from a dresser.

ZOS_MandiParker

@Naor_Sarethi, you are being reported for the assault, not the murder. As a VR4 character in Khenarthi’s Roost, assault will land you about 227g. Murder would have cost almost 800g if reported. Our NPCs do report their own assaults (for now) as a mechanic to ensure that solitary NPCs like this are not farmed without consequence. When we have alternate methods of presenting risk for players who would like to attack these sorts of isolated NPCs, we will revisit the way that they report their own assault.

Sylveria_Relden

@ZOS_MandiParker Thanks for the clarification on the OP's issue.

I'm a little confused as to how an NPC that was "murdered" by a player can report their own assault- but that's something I'll need to research, I suppose. When the NPC's re-spawn, do they retain history with a player? Or does this get cleared with each re-spawn? (reset NPC's "hate" status, etc.)

Is there an in-depth text we can review somewhere detailing the mechanics- or is it always dependent on the individual situation? (Since the system was introduced, I've seen a few fragmented introductory threads, but not a lot of concrete information)

With Bethsoft's previous games, it was always somewhat speculative- (as I detailed in my last comment in this thread) because oftentimes even if you weren't "witnessed" you still had to deal with the consequences- which without witnesses logic would dictate there really wouldn't be a "victim" to report it was a crime, no?

michael_bimson

silvernightscape wrote: »

I'm not even sure how I just murdered someone. I was at the last part of a quest (Under Siege) talking to the Captain when I saw lots of red coming at me, which I assumed where the bad guys, so I killed them. All of a sudden I got a murderer achievement. I have it turned on that I can't hurt innocents. Then it said I stole something too. I looked in my inventory and there it was... a horn there I don't even recall taking. I am confused as to how that happened lol

Tricked into killing an innocent and someone slipped a stolen horn into your pocket? Sheogorath must have a grudge against you for some reason? Did you save Valaste?

Moonshadow66

Often I'm having a very similar problem, but with stealing things, not killing NPCs (this option is turned off on my end).
While I can understand the explanation from @ZOS_MandiParker (how reporting works for NPCs), I can not understand how this would work for stealing without witnesses.

When there's absolutely no one around, mostly outside, but I still get detected (on/off/on/off/etc), something is wrong. Who or what detects me all the time? The container? My panther? Or is it the torchbug hanging out nearby? I sometimes get a bounty for absolutely no reason. Ok, the "reason" was the stealing, but when there's no witness, no stealing should be reported, I suppose, and my character should remain in stealth mode.

The best part was yesterday where I found myself killed after I was NOT detected stealing something. This guard was not even in the room or anywhere nearby, nor have I seen him before in that building when I was looting stuff (which I often do), he suddenly appeared and confronted me with the two choices, pay up or die. Before my shock was gone, he was attacking me already since I missed the moment to pick one option. In this case, the "hidden" mode did NOT change to "detected".

Most of the time, it works fine stealing stuff, but it still happens pretty much everyday somewhere that it's buggy.

Shogunami

ZOS_MandiParker wrote: »

@Naor_Sarethi, you are being reported for the assault, not the murder. As a VR4 character in Khenarthi’s Roost, assault will land you about 227g. Murder would have cost almost 800g if reported. Our NPCs do report their own assaults (for now) as a mechanic to ensure that solitary NPCs like this are not farmed without consequence. When we have alternate methods of presenting risk for players who would like to attack these sorts of isolated NPCs, we will revisit the way that they report their own assault.

You do have alternate methods - just make legerdemain not silly. A lonesome/solitary NPC SHOULDN'T have security, just like in real life.

Legerdemain is such a great concept, but it's just silly. I hope this gets fixed sooner rather than later, and at the latest for Thieves Guild DLC.