Great observation! I missed it when I read the patch notes. I have been saying for almost a year now, that they need to leave PVE alone when adjusting for PVP. Now we know for a fact that they can do it. It also reinforces the fact that they do not listen to feedback. They are making the game they want to make, not the game that we want to play.

While I wouldn't have been as sarcastic I do think it's silly when developers become obsessed with both PVE and PVP stuff being the same. They are different environments, things will just work differently.

Diablo 3 devs gave up on a balanced PVP because they couldn't get it to work with having abilities be the same as the normal game.

I get irritated in Halo when the reserve ammo for a lot of weapons is the same in SP as the MP because usually the weapons become too useless for dealing with AI enemies because they don't hold enough ammo in reserve.

I understand they don't want to confuse the player but stuff like this, an across the board change to something everyone can use is simple. Individual class changes I could see becoming too complex to follow.

This game has an easier time with it IMO because the number (and sometimes stats) of enemies and allies can be around the same so stuff can still work in either. The major differences come from players making different decisions than AI as well as having their own unique skills and abilities.

Folkd wrote: »

ugh, great now they're separating abilities. Games that do that just create a bigger mess later as they keep on piling up the abilities that are different from PVE to PVP.

Lazy way out IMO.

And what's your solution ?

Until you come up with a better one, you're complaining about nothing.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

maybe they dont want us to be gods in pve either

THIS! is wonderful!!
I would like to hope that in some small way they have been listening to the PVE players who have dealt with nerf after nerf over PVP.....and it will be expanded to other skills down the line.

Valen_Byte wrote: »

PVE and PVP are played completely differently. The builds are completely different. Therefore, they should be balanced separately. The lazy way, is to keep them the same. Obviously it would be more work to adjust PVE and PVP separately.

^^ and THIS...Anyone that takes PVP seriously is built completely different from anyone that takes PVE seriously. Having the skills equal hurts more than helps.

It`s nothing new or unheard of , Everquest wayyy back in 2000 15 years ago had spells, and melee ablities work different in pvp than they did in pve .

pve spells and ablities were unchanged, but in pvp they did less damage. or some like charm, didn`t work. fear stuned you instead of making you run uncontrolable off a cliff etc.

If they could figure it out 15 years ago surely game Developers today can as well.

DeLindsay wrote: »

wafcatb14_ESO wrote: »

It`s nothing new or unheard of , Everquest wayyy back in 2000 15 years ago had spells, and melee ablities work different in pvp than they did in pve .

pve spells and ablities were unchanged, but in pvp they did less damage. or some like charm, didn`t work. fear stuned you instead of making you run uncontrolable off a cliff etc.

If they could figure it out 15 years ago surely game Developers today can as well.

It's nothing more than efficiency for a for-profit Company. It's cheaper to spend the coding time to make 1 ability do 1 thing instead of 1 thing in 2 situations, that or laziness. We all know it's possible and has been possible to separate PvE from PvP so why do MOST MMO's today still balance around PvP which ends up screwing PvE? He who can properly answer that question gets a cookie.

Personally I have always felt the reason is because few developers want to give up the potential to grab a lion's share of the market by making a PvP only or conversely PvE only game, which is in my book the biggest problem.

These types of gameplay are simply completely different animals and nether the twain shall meet, yet developers keep insisting on making both of these elements in one game. Not a good recipe and I think a large reason why this genre on the whole is failing.

Give me a totally PvP focused game without traditional PvE, or the other way around, and provide the players richly layered experiences that do not have to be compromised for the sake of the other, and I think you would have a very successful game over the long term, even if more modest in profits. How much is enough anyway?

dharbert wrote: »

From the 1.6.3 patch notes:

• Reduced all damage shields cast in Cyrodiil by 15%. This will not affect damage shields outside of Cyrodiil.

It IS possible to adjust skills, passives, and sets between Cyrodiil and the PvE zones. You just did it. So why do you keep nerfing and adjusting skills and sets across the board because of PvP whines?

You CAN make skills, passives, and set bonuses different between Cyrodiil and the PvE zones.

Seems like a stopgap and the system should be able to be designed such that this kind of thing isn't needed. It's a complex interaction, sure, but I think they can approach this in other ways.

dharbert wrote: »

...
It IS possible to adjust skills, passives, and sets between Cyrodiil and the PvE zones. You just did it. ...

They also did it a while ago when nerfing the damage of Sneak Attacks in Cyrodiil while leaving PvE unaffected.