By going B2P ESO has REALLY increased their competition

Gidorick · January 2015

ESO being a subscription MMO required gamers to make a commitment up front. By doing this, ZOS was creating a history with players. Players that subscribed not only felt a sense of ownership and pride, they also felt a sense of belonging and kinship because the people they were playing with had also made that commitment.

Each month that passed, many players renewed their subscription and that sense of pride, belonging, and history grew. There weren't many choices for players who preferred subscription MMOs and the fact that ESO was one of them made it feel special. There seemed to be a sense of exclusivity that players felt by being an ESO player.

These are the factors that lead many players to overlook some of the glaring issues that ESO had and remain subscribed to the game as an investment in its future. We wanted to be part of what ZOS was building. We were hoping that in 10 years we could look back and say: "I was there at the beginning".

NOTE: By overlook, I mean that we stayed subscribed, not that we stayed silent about the issues.

While ESO going Buy to Play doesn't have to change a player's feelings of belonging and dedication, it does remove the sense of exclusivity. It also opens ESO up to be compared to a LOT of other B2P/F2P MMOs out there.

As a P2P MMO there were very FEW MMOs for ESO to be compared to. WOW, Wildstar, FFXIV, Mortal Online and Darkfall Unholy Wars (which looks pretty impressive, actually!) are some of the few.

By becoming B2P ESO has to now hold its own against a THRONG of B2P & F2P MMOS... I genuinely hope the B2P model allows ESO to add the things that would truly make it an MMO to contend with. Things like:

A LFG tool that works
Advanced (some might say basic) Guild tools
Underwater environments
Player created content
NPC "heros"
Player housing
Interactive furniture
Interactive, buildable, ownable boats
More, and meaningful world skills (lockpicking/treasure hunting/animal hunting)
Expanded character creation

This is a VERY small list but these are the types of enhancements that would give ESO the types of systems that other B2P and F2P MMOs ALREADY have. These are almost a must for ESO to be competitive.

Keep in mind, ESO has to compete with more than the already released MMOs, the MMO landscape is an ever-filling cup of new and fresh ideas. There isn't that subscriber dedication keeping players coming back to "get something for their money".

In 2015 there will be quire a few MMOs coming out...

Games with similar "themes" as ESO

Everquest Next

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dh_0neHhR0k

Shroud of the Avatar

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mgrzQHU6eE

Black Desert Online

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNtB5DoJ6OI

And one that looks a LOT like ESO Stylistically... Bless

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3uuQWb6rjA

And then there's the Sci-Fi MMOS

Skyforge:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yG1UXkfa7xA

Star Citizen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJJ9TcGxhNY

The Repopulation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdOUvIZ5-MI

And as simple as it looks... Firefly Online

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8y98otfH9X8

while ESO not requiring a subscription will free me up to allow me to try some of these other MMOs (That Darkfall looks pretty good) it will also give me the freedom to play ESO as much or as little as I like. I am choosing to remain hopeful. ESO has a LOT of competition now... I still believe it can be something unique amongst its peers.

Here's to hoping this new revenue model will allow ESO to become the MMO that so many of us believed it could be, and still believe it can be.

/drink

Ahdora · January 2015

Thanks!

Now I have some others to look into playing, since I've already unsubbed.

+1

Amsel_McKay · January 2015

Star Citizen looks good...

jkirchner71ub17_ESO2 · January 2015

Very nice thread - not full of the gloom and doom many of us feel right now but it does put things in perspective and what ESO now has to contend with. I also liked the subscription system and that sense of exclusivity but that carpet was pulled out from under my feet like most of us this week. I also remain hopeful but I am a MUCH more reserved optimist now after this fiasco they dumped on us.

WraithAzraiel · January 2015

Yea, ESO. Step up your game, homie. We don't want you to get "served" when all the B2P games have their annual dance-off.

eisberg · January 2015

ESO was already in competition to all other MMOs (with or without subscriptions) The subscription model is dying, the subscription model is in competition to the B2P/F2P model. To put it short, they were not getting the expected income based in part because of the B2P/F2P competition.

This change will most likely make them more money than the subscription model is doing for them.

Ommamar · January 2015

I am not sure how B2P changes things competition wise if anything I think more people are likely to at least give ESO a try who might not have with the subscription in place. But always been strong competition in both the MMO and single player RPGs, after all we only have so much time. Some less then others.
Of the trailers you have posted I am looking forward most to Black Desert Online and EQ next. As for Bless I don't really see the stylistic similarities.

Gidorick · January 2015

eisberg wrote: »

This change will most likely make them more money than the subscription model is doing for them.

I hope it does! I REALLY do! I want ESO to be the MMO that gamers are looking at in 10 years saying "no other game will ever be as good as that". More money means more resources to improve this game.

DeLindsay · January 2015

ALL MMO's will be B2P/F2P + P2P option or some mix thereof probably within 2 years. It simply makes game companies FAR more money. Sorry to disappoint all the P2P fanbois but Micro transactions and DLC is here to stay and will grow considerably over the coming years.

Amsel_McKay · January 2015

I thought that was WOW not EQ next... what a disappointment...

Amsel_McKay · January 2015

F2P gone wrong (Star Citizen) $15,000 pack: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Combos/The-Completionist-Digital

jkirchner71ub17_ESO2 · January 2015

eisberg wrote: »

This change will most likely make them more money than the subscription model is doing for them.

At least they hope it will. We know they made a BOATLOAD of poor decisions in the development side of things which had to have affected the business side of things without a doubt. Like many of us, I can see correlations between the attrition of my guild and contacts list in relation to updates or when players began VR content or when the frame rate and unbearable lag overtook Cyrodiil. I don't buy that the subscription model is dying, it is DEAD for the most part in the landscape of MMOs. But I do think had this all been handled differently we may have seen the subscription model hold out longer in ESO but they made this bed and now we have to sleep in it. The attrition rate of subscriptions from my guild and contacts list had me worried this was inevitable. While I remain hopeful as a subscriber and ES fan, only time will tell whether or not ESO will weather this change but history is not on their side in terms being able to maintain B2P and remain a "unique" model versus falling in-line with the rest of the F2P landscape.

Rodario · January 2015

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

F2P gone wrong (Star Citizen) $15,000 pack: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Combos/The-Completionist-Digital

That's not "F2P gone wrong". SC is crowd funded and still under development. The example you gave is not an ingame cash shop item, but the most expensive backer's package.

If you are going to offer different kinds of packages for early backers, why wouldn't you include one for rich completionists? Don't forget: All the ships and junk you get for financing the game's development will be attainable ingame with ingame currency.

NotSo · January 2015

I'm currently subbed to star citizen because I can play two MMOs d*** it

Jice · January 2015

The interesting thing about this post, is that in the fantasy category, none of them look interesting to me compared with ESO. But all the Sci-fi ones do..humm.

Bloodfang · January 2015

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

I thought that was WOW not EQ next... what a disappointment...

Yeah I've seen the art style a few months ago, I couldn't stop laughing. EQ Next will be aimed at kids just like WoW...

ESO was never a threat to WoW, it was simply aimed at a more mature playerbase. However EQ Next could potentially steal at least half the people from WoW..

Forestd16b14_ESO · January 2015

Um... You do know that half of the MMO in the list have been out for like a few years now..... ESO isn't even a year old yet it's birthday is 4-4-14 and it's 1st birthday will be 4-4-15.... You asking ZoS to put in all this stuff when ESO isn't a year old. You think all those other MMOs had all there "wow" stuff in before they turned 1 ? Yes ESO will get all those wonderful goodies but ZoS isn't gonna put it all in at once just cause other MMOs that are way older than ESO have them. That's what we have to remember the game is still new to the MMO world. Look at WoW sure it has had its better days but now over like what 10 years old it has a lot of content when it first started it was what? You with some leather armor and a iron sword? What I'm saying is have control and wait for the goodies and don't bite at ZoS heels for them right now. Cause the housing plans alone would take them awhile to figure out cause there's a lot of players doute Skyrim be able to fit all our houses in herself without spewing some of us into Morrowind or Cyrodiil. :-p

Mettaricana · January 2015

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

F2P gone wrong (Star Citizen) $15,000 pack: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Combos/The-Completionist-Digital

who the f*** has that much money to throw at their computer screen? 15k $ what the hell...that money could supply me with gaming from now til im dead...

Gidorick · January 2015

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Um... You do know that half of the MMO in the list have been out for like a few years now..... ESO isn't even a year old yet it's birthday is 4-4-14 and it's 1st birthday will be 4-4-15.... You asking ZoS to put in all this stuff when ESO isn't a year old. You think all those other MMOs had all there "wow" stuff in before they turned 1 ? Yes ESO will get all those wonderful goodies but ZoS isn't gonna put it all in at once just cause other MMOs that are way older than ESO have them. That's what we have to remember the game is still new to the MMO world. Look at WoW sure it has had its better days but now over like what 10 years old it has a lot of content when it first started it was what? You with some leather armor and a iron sword? What I'm saying is have control and wait for the goodies and don't bite at ZoS heels for them right now. Cause the housing plans alone would take them awhile to figure out cause there's a lot of players doute Skyrim be able to fit all our houses in herself without spewing some of us into Morrowind or Cyrodiil. :-p

You know, I've heard this argument a lot... but I disagree with this line of thought. Just as every other genre, MMOs should be developed with core mechanics that learn and grow from those that have come before.

Things like... the ability to sit in chairs or underwater environments show not only a lack of forethought on design but a fundamental misunderstanding of their customers and these misunderstandings will be more work to fix than if they had just done it "right" the first time.

Couple that with the fact there ARE MMOs that debut with these features. This shows the industry that these sort of features don't HAVE to be "wait and get it later" type features. Not EVERY MMO needs to look at WOW's or EQ's feature list and think "yea... we can do that." They need to look at their feature list and think "yea... we can do better."

It's important to note I'm talking about features with add FUNCTION, not content.

Some of the broken or missing functions (LFG tool and Guild tools) actually make the ESO experience WORSE. Couple that with simple things like not being able to see quests that we complete and the list of things that seem missing from ESO starts to get pretty long.

I'm not asking for throngs of content right out the gate. I'm ok with ESO being opened up over time. But really... we should be able to climb ladders... really.

Vis · January 2015

OP said it well. Overall, I am less mad about b2p (as I am now free to try Star Citizen) than I am about not refunding those of us who will have months left on our subs after March.

Roechacca · January 2015

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

F2P gone wrong (Star Citizen) $15,000 pack: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Combos/The-Completionist-Digital

Now that's a paywall . ! If anyone buys that I'd like to fill out a guild / job application

Gidorick · January 2015

Vis wrote: »

OP said it well. Overall, I am less mad about b2p (as I am now free to try Star Citizen) than I am about not refunding those of us who will have months left on our subs after March.

Hey @Vis,‌ I just signed up at Roberts Space Industries. Have you done the same?

Vis · January 2015

Gidorick wrote: »

Vis wrote: »

OP said it well. Overall, I am less mad about b2p (as I am now free to try Star Citizen) than I am about not refunding those of us who will have months left on our subs after March.

Hey @Vis,‌ I just signed up at Roberts Space Industries. Have you done the same?

Not yet. I am still reeling from the b2p announcement and have been spending too much time arguing about refunds. But I will take a look at them this weekend. Thanks!

Aevric · January 2015

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Star Citizen looks good...

I bought a ship pack over a year ago, having played and loved all of the Wing Commander and Privateer games. If they can pull off the merging of space combat/capital ship crewing/first person ground combat/boarding parties plus the walking around and socializing MMO style on planets/stations... let's just say that they'd have set a new high bar for gaming.

MrGhosty · January 2015

Aevric wrote: »

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Star Citizen looks good...

I bought a ship pack over a year ago, having played and loved all of the Wing Commander and Privateer games. If they can pull off the merging of space combat/capital ship crewing/first person ground combat/boarding parties plus the walking around and socializing MMO style on planets/stations... let's just say that they'd have set a new high bar for gaming.

Have you seen the zero G presentation yet? I have to admit that made me drool a little bit.

Wreuntzylla · January 2015

What have they done to my beloved Firefly? :'(

Gidorick · January 2015

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

What have they done to my beloved Firefly? :'(

Necromancy... filthy, stinky, rotting necromancy.

DDuke · January 2015

I don't trust any of these companies or MMOs coming out. In fact, most of them share the same B2P/F2P payment model ESO will.

I think this describes how I'm feeling:

What was to be my home for years to come has been burned to cinders, and only hobos are going to populate it now.
I'm left in the middle of a desert of burning wreckages & creaking hovels that scream of danger, trying to find a new place to stay, but there is nothing in the horizon.

Faugaun · January 2015

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

F2P gone wrong (Star Citizen) $15,000 pack: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Combos/The-Completionist-Digital

That's scary and even worse I bet they sold a hundred of them...

Gidorick · January 2015

DDuke wrote: »

I don't trust any of these companies or MMOs coming out. In fact, most of them share the same B2P/F2P payment model ESO will.

I think this describes how I'm feeling:

What was to be my home for years to come has been burned to cinders, and only hobos are going to populate it now.
I'm left in the middle of a desert of burning wreckages & creaking hovels that scream of danger, trying to find a new place to stay, but there is nothing in the horizon.

You could always try Darkfall Unholy Wars. It looks a lot like ESO in terms of design and its (still) subscription based.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO-ubExGedw

But I completely feel you. For me it's not the MMO I wanted it was a living, growing, breathing Tamriel. Not a theme park with tickets, tokens and lines.

Jennifur_Vultee · January 2015

Mettaricana wrote: »

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

F2P gone wrong (Star Citizen) $15,000 pack: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Combos/The-Completionist-Digital

who the f*** has that much money to throw at their computer screen? 15k $ what the hell...that money could supply me with gaming from now til im dead...

The last MMO I played before ESO was Scarlet Blade, people were easily dropping $15k US a year to get the best gear "free" from the tiered spender...you spend $350 US and get a unique quality piece of armor "free" as a reward. They would do that month after month until they had all seven pieces of unique armor, all five pieces of unique jewelry, unique armored mech and the latest hot bike. Then the level cap would raise and they do it all over again. For a free to play game it was too expensive for me to keep playing so as soon as ESO went live I dropped Scarlet Blade like hot potato.

A quick look at the Scarlet Blade web site shows their current tiered spender for the top tier shows you spend 149999 AP to get the latest hot bike (20% faster than the standard bike, in PVP that's a clear advantage allowing you to chase down the other players more easily) OR two items that will change rare gear to unique gear and two perfect enhancement stones that guarantee a successful enhancement attempt. 149999 AP = $1499.99 US you don't get a lot for the money but I guarantee you people are spending that much to get those items "free".